tseugnekillib Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 imo, the biggest difference (at this point in the pre-season) between last year's team and the current squad is the lack of senior leadership, particularly from a defensive stand point. again imo, Fish and Sloan were great senior leaders because they were very good defensive players. Varner, while limited athletically, lead with everyday effort and intensity. All three knew defense was critical and willingly worked hard at it. the current seniors, RB-IO-TF, are good guys, good players, and all three will earn college degrees; however, none of them qualify as team leaders in my book and may never reach that point. Team leaders play both ends of the court with equal mental and physical effort. RB is a terrific offensive player, but thinks primary about scoring. IO is also primarily an offensive minded player. IO is strong and athletic, but he doesn't head to West Pine thinking about or looking forward to playing defense. Unfortunately for TF, you can't lead being injuried or out ill. If TF can stay on the court for 60-90 consecutive days he has a chance to contribute some leadership as Tom is tough enough and is an agressive rebounder. imo, the player most likely to develop into this year's team leader is VN, as he works both ends of the court with equal effort. Time will tell! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 I'd say the 2nd biggest difference is that the bench is significantly stronger, decreasing the likelihood of those six minute droughts we have become so accustomed to. Hopefully that will cancel out the lack of senior leadership. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACE Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 I think we'll be quicker, more athletic and have more depth. On the downside, we'll probably turn the ball over more. I'm not that worried about leadership. I think Tom and from what others are saying VN will emerge as vocal/emotional leaders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 my concern is that the defense will give up about 10 more points per game and i am not sure if our offense will match that. at the last billiken club meeting, anthony beane lead numerous answers to questions with a line about if our defense...... i.e. the coaches are agreeing with tseugnekillib. i know some of you dont want to face it, but the more i hear this stuff, the more important anthony drejaj will be to being on the floor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLUBandTBone Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 While we may not have the senior leadership that we had in Sloan and Fish I think that Tom will be able to fill in that spot. We talked all last year about how much intensity he brought to the court when he was in and the fire it gave the other players. I mean, how can a guy playing with a separated shoulder not make you want to rise to the challenge? You do raise a good point about being a little short on defense, I can believe that. But Brad has always been able to inspire defensive production. All the way back to his days at Wisconsin his teams have been very strong defensively. I don't think that is because he had to because his players weren't as athletic as the current team. You have to be smart and athletic to play D, it's just an over looked part of the game. The other thing that I think will be a difference this year is the speed that we will be able to play the game. Brad keeps saying that he wants to be more of a fast break team and with his players finally starting to imerge we (hopefully) will be seeing a more high-octane offense. I'm pumped about this year and I just can't wait for out big games against UMSL and Truman in the next couple of weeks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted October 27, 2004 Author Share Posted October 27, 2004 ACE, vocal/emotional leaders won't keep the other team from scoring. Only rock solid defenders, playing a team defense, will keep the other team from scoring. We aren't there as yet, and may never get there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonwich Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 I predict that you've underestimated RB. I think that the combination of transfer-student status, last year's team chemistry and his own basic personality held his leadership potential from view last year. Based on some of brehms13's personal insights, I think we've got a team leader just waiting to emerge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quality Is Job 1 Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 ...by example on defense? Will he take pride in shutting down the opposing guard? Will he take it personally if the other team scores? That's the mindset we need Reg to have. Marque Perry became a strong defensive player as a senior, and we'll need Bryant to do it if the Billikens are going to go to the NCAA Tournament in Reggie's last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mobile-iken Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 Let's not forget about the leadership that Anthony Drejaj brings to the table night in and night out...I think he will emerge as the leader of this team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 Well, the other team's small forward and sometimes their point guard tend to have big games against us. Maybe VN can help us with that first problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brehms13 Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 Well I doubt if Tom will emerge as the leader. His separated shoulder doesn't make me believe in him any more than usual, especially since it was last season that he got that injury and still is injured now. I feel that the person who will be leader will be one that the team respects, that the team see's first hand of his ability to play as hard as possible even with injuries, that's vocal, that's encouraging, that is busting their butts on defense and offense. So of course, I can say, I want it to be "Reg", but It still remains to be seen. I know he's already the leader has far as vocally, encouraging, scoring etc........I'm optimistic I feel that he has improved on defense and that he'll be more intense this season, whether he leads or someone else, I know that it's still gonna take a TEAM EFFORT to get to the NCAA TOURNAMENT........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brehms13 Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 I think u'll eat your words by the end of the season, or at least I hope so....... I felt that Josh and Chris wouldn't have been as productive on offense if it weren't for Reg getting them the ball....so all the players have their weak points. Reg's weakness happens to be defense.......just because he isn't as good as u would like him to be doesn't mean that he is not mentally or physically trying to put forth effort to better his skills. It just means he's not there yet... Of course they all will get their degrees, but don't count any of them out as far as basketball. As for Reg, it's just beginning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheltiedave Posted October 27, 2004 Share Posted October 27, 2004 As much as we want, Drejaj will not be a team leader, especially on defense. Fast PGs lit him up last year off the dribble, because Anthony is slow afoot and cannot stay squared up defensively. Polk is much, much faster, and Reg easily fools him frequently in practice with his left handed hesitation left spin move. Not a knock on Dwayne, but his speed and square up positioning is absolutely a key to keep guards from blowing by, or shouldering past him. Reggie has to bring twice as much energy on defense as he did last year, when he often saved himself energy-wise for the offensive half of the game. The fact that the "scrub" team with Newborne toasted the potential "starters" in a scrimmage, and scored at will, really scares me. The Big 10 moment I gleaned was when Brad mentioned last year we averaged 0.84 points per possession, third highest in the conference, BUT I'm sure our margin between the offensive and defensive ppp was minute. We are going to double our turnovers this year, and our defensive ability is substantially reduced with the loss of our two primary stoppers, so we MUST rebound much more aggressively. The coaching staff already realizes this year (as always) is going to be a real dogfight to survive, let alone prosper in CUSA. When we can't hold our opponent to less than 10 offensive boards a game, we risk getting clobbered. Why? Last year we were in the top three in the conference in turnover margin; this year we will be in the bottom third. The staff is telling the team what they need to do(play DEFENSE at all times,) hopefully the light will come on soon... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheltiedave Posted October 28, 2004 Share Posted October 28, 2004 Brehms, don't get too worked up over any criticisms I throw out. I'm not ripping to rip, just being overly observant and not saying anything about positives OR letting my diehard support for the Bills come out. Like Brad, I can (and sometimes will) slam the pxxx out of people, not because I'm a hater, but because of the confidence and ability to see what they can do with their talent. Sometimes being the devil's advocate and pushing hard can help. Brad is going to rail harder on Reggie this year than anyone else, because Reggie is THE ONE with enough talent to get them to the NCAAs. The plain fact is noone else has shown they have 2/3 of what it takes individually to drive the team like Reggie can. As far as eating my words, the post I made was after two practices seen, and concentrating on only three or four things. I know at least five bballers in Peoria that would be NBA all-stars based on five individual criteria, but the whole package is what gets teams in the Dance and players in the league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted October 28, 2004 Share Posted October 28, 2004 The one practice I saw ... RB jumped on his team after losing, then went over and put his arm around BH and talked to him. I saw a difference in Reg right there. The additional offensive options we have will help Reg put more energy into defense this year also. VN also was very vocal and will obviously be a leader just by his intensity ... I guarantee you he will leave it all on the floor every night. I know most everyone will disagree ... but VN will be a much better defender than CS who was imho over rated on both ends of the floor. He was a 6th man who had to start for lack of options. At the end of the year he was constantly pouting and whining about every call made against him. Josh's defense will be the one that we will have trouble replacing. I think we have 2 people that may be able to take on that role. DC and DB. DC looks like an entirely different player. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brehms13 Posted October 28, 2004 Share Posted October 28, 2004 Not getting upset, U've misunderstood.......I'm basically putting out my responses as sort of like "a bet" without the bet, if u can feel what I'm saying. I just hope your analysis is wrong, I feel confident that Reg has improved defensively, maybe not to where "we" (the board) may want him to....but better and I think right now since he still has swelling etc in his foot, his defense may look even worse , but do feel this too will pass and in the end I'll say....what do u think now? It's just like getting satisfaction from critics who think that SLU won't make it to the NCAA's.......if they do it's like "i told u so", so as for me.....people that say Reg's defense this or that......when he's busting "a#*", I'll be like " u were sleepin" , now I may eat my words in the end, but I doubt it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted October 28, 2004 Share Posted October 28, 2004 reggie bryant is going to light up any team that is "brave" enough to try to guard him straight up. no knock on young mr polk at all. it is like a baby playing chess with bobby fisher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted October 28, 2004 Share Posted October 28, 2004 skip, you underestimate chris sloan and what he did. that said, i am fast becoming a newborne convert. now if izik can put out.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheltiedave Posted October 28, 2004 Share Posted October 28, 2004 Gotcha, Brehms. Sometimes it is a pain talking through a computer, where you can't hear tone and nuance. I'll be extremely happy to eat lots of crow, but I'll only be doing it if our defense gels a LOT faster than what I expect. We are replacing two players totalling nine years in CUSA with a decent JUCO and a committee of underclass players. There will be bumps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted October 28, 2004 Share Posted October 28, 2004 Roy ... we've been through this one before. You think I underestimate CS and I think you over estimate him. We just disagree. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted October 28, 2004 Share Posted October 28, 2004 This is the 2nd time I've seen someone post that we're going to "double our turnovers". I'm sorry, we're not going to go from 13 turnovers a game to 26 turnovers a game. If you meant that Polk will have twice as many turnovers as Fisher, I still don't see that as a major issue. That means we go from 13 turnovers as a team to 15 turnovers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quality Is Job 1 Posted October 28, 2004 Share Posted October 28, 2004 >This is the 2nd time I've seen someone post that we're going >to "double our turnovers". I'm sorry, we're not going to go >from 13 turnovers a game to 26 turnovers a game. If you >meant that Polk will have twice as many turnovers as Fisher, >I still don't see that as a major issue. That means we go >from 13 turnovers as a team to 15 turnovers. I don't think it will even be that bad. While Dwayne Polk may commit a couple of more turnovers than Josh Fisher did, Vas'shun Newborne will probably commit fewer turnovers than Chris Sloan did (not that I'm saying he committed many), and Izik Ohanon, Tom Frericks, and Reggie Bryant will probably all cut down on their turnovers from last year, with more familiarity with the system and each other, so I don't think the team will commit many, if any, more turnovers this year than they did last year. I think they may also create a few more opponent turnovers than before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted October 28, 2004 Share Posted October 28, 2004 chris sloan averaged just over 1 turnover per game. izik had more turnovers and played an average of 10 minutes less per game than sloan. fisher and bryant averaged over 2 turnovers per game. which is pretty good considering how much they had the ball in their hands. if dwayne only averages 3 turnovers per game and newborne is less than one, i will be overjoyed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted October 28, 2004 Share Posted October 28, 2004 Sloan also didn't do much with the ball other than pass it back to a guard or take the rare bull rush charge into the lane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted October 28, 2004 Author Share Posted October 28, 2004 Help me understand why it is so difficult to play defense! Think about the superior athleticism and bball skills needed to play a two-guard in a high D1 conference. A player needs great(high speed)ball handling skills. A player needs great hands-strong hands, great hand-to-eye coordination to make 20 footers, 15 footers, 10 footers, etc. A player needs foot speed, dribbling skills, strength and guts to slash from the wing, drive into the post area (filled with big bodies) and then gently lay the ball off-the-glass or uses his strength to slam dunk the ball while getting hammered from all sides. Terrific athletes indeed! That same terrific athlete then takes all of his many skills to the defensive end of the court. He definitely has the necessary quick feet and body strength and smarts to defend very well.....but doesn't. Why not? This post isn't solely about Billiken players, but it is refering to all one-way basketball players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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