Beat X and SLU is in the Dance

[slcute]

It's simple. If SLU beats Xavier on Tuesday it will have sole possession of second place in the A-10 with an RPI in the mid to high 30s (even with a loss at Duquesne and in the first game of the tournament). That would give SLU a 23-8 overall record, with sole possession of second place in the A-10 (with the first place team being a legitimate top 15 team). There is no way, with the A-10 being the sixth or seventh best conference in the country, that it gets one bid. And there is no way you can take Xavier, Dayton, or Saint Joe's over SLU when it will have finished two games ahead of each of those teams in the standings, swept Xavier, won at Saint Joe's and split with Dayton. Also, SLU will finish with at least a 12-5 record against the RPI top 150. When you compare that to the rest of the field, SLU is easily a ten seed (maybe lower).

SLU's fans need to show up on Tuesday and make life hell of Xavier. You want to win the league, win tournament games, etc. you need to sell out the arena and make it impossible for teams to win there. Rick lost 13 times at home over almost 14 years at Utah, with half of those losses coming in one year when he went 14 and 14 because he lost his two best players to injuries and suspensions (sound familiar?). Oh yeah, after that year he went round of 32 (losing barely to Miss St. with Eric Dampier who went to the final four), round of 16 (losing to arguable Kentucky's best team ever), round of 8 (losing again to one of Kentucky's best teams) and championship game (losing, yet again, to Kentucky).

Saturday was a bad loss. But it happens. Look at Florida State (at BC), New Mexico (neutral to Santa Clara), Gonzaga (at San Francisco) etc. Suck it up and come out to the game on Tuesday. The dumbass who blamed Rick for this loss ought to be shot. SLU came out strong, had a good game plan and had open look after open look in the second half and simply could not hit shots. They played solid defense (holding Rhode Island to 64 points at home). Conklin, Mitchell or someone else needs to take ownership of tight games down the stretch. This game was just like at Dayton - SLU had no business losing the game. I think SLU is trying to learn how to become a winning program. The difference between it and Temple this year is razor thin. Temple found a way to win one more close game (arguable, at LaSalle). That's the difference between being a 4th or 5th seed and being an 11th seed.

Go Billikens!

[sonoma bob]

Look no further than Allen Field House in Lawrence yesterday to see what the fans can do to bring their team back from the abysse. Please lets not hear any more smack about how we can beat Mizzou this year either. We still have something to prove to the world how great the Billiken is. I like your thinking slcute, welcome to the board.

[Billboy1]

Real problem is Bills have been exposed. Good teams beat the teams they should. RM better figure out how to handle zones because he's going to see alot more of them.

[moytoy12]

Real problem is Bills have been exposed. Good teams beat the teams they should. RM better figure out how to handle zones because he's going to see alot more of them.

Completely agree. I'm surprised anyone would play us man-to-man a majority of the time. The 2-3 zone has bogged us down all year (we've dominated the 1-3-1 zone).

[BBall Fan]

Real problem is Bills have been exposed. Good teams beat the teams they should. RM better figure out how to handle zones because he's going to see alot more of them.

EXPOSED?????? Really?????? Do you not watch Billiken games. Almost every team we have played this year has at one time or another gone to a zone. Richmond played almost exclusively zone. Washington played quite a bit of zone. When teams have zoned us this year, we have had them out of it before most fans knew they were in it. Last year was a completely different story. This year has not. The RI zone yesterday did a good job with bunching and limiting the post but we had more than enough open looks that we did not make to win yesterday by 15. We just didn't make shots yesterday. It happens. What was exposed was the fact that we weren't ready to play yesterday and got outhustled. The desire was not there.

[Prairie Bill]

The dumbass who blamed Rick for this loss ought to be shot ... Conklin, Mitchell or someone else needs to take ownership of tight games down the stretch. This game was just like at Dayton - SLU had no business losing the game.

Its not good form for us to pick on individual players when it was a team failure to do routine business. The head coach is paid to take the heat in these situations, and have that "someone" on the floor to take charge the next time this happens (as it will).

[Billboy1]

EXPOSED?????? Really?????? Do you not watch Billiken games. Almost every team we have played this year has at one time or another gone to a zone. Richmond played almost exclusively zone. Washington played quite a bit of zone. When teams have zoned us this year, we have had them out of it before most fans knew they were in it. Last year was a completely different story. This year has not. The RI zone yesterday did a good job with bunching and limiting the post but we had more than enough open looks that we did not make to win yesterday by 15. We just didn't make shots yesterday. It happens. What was exposed was the fact that we weren't ready to play yesterday and got outhustled. The desire was not there.

i have watched every game and no team has used a zone for any great length of time-can guarantee you'll see it in every game from her on out unless RM can figure how to beat it early in the game.

[showthebill]

i have watched every game and no team has used a zone for any great length of time-can guarantee you'll see it in every game from her on out unless RM can figure how to beat it early in the game.

Sorry, but you're wrong. I don't think you're watching close enough because SLU sees zone quite a bit... it sometimes takes people a few possessions to realize the other team is running a zone and often times the team will have switched out by the time.

I've been watching basketball a long time and I still sometimes don't catch the defense is in a zone, but rather I notice the play we are running and therefore know the other team is in some form of a zone. It was just very obvious against Rhode Island because of the way we were playing offense against it.

[moytoy12]

Sorry, but you're wrong. I don't think you're watching close enough because SLU sees zone quite a bit... it sometimes takes people a few possessions to realize the other team is running a zone and often times the team will have switched out by the time.

I've been watching basketball a long time and I still sometimes don't catch the defense is in a zone, but rather I notice the play we are running and therefore know the other team is in some form of a zone. It was just very obvious against Rhode Island because of the way we were playing offense against it.

I'm not sure about the other zones, but Fordham was running a 1-3-1 zone according to Rammer and we tore it to shreds. That same 1-3-1 has been run against us in the past and we've torn it up. However, we haven't been as effective against the 2-3 zone and it seems to cause our team the most trouble. I'm not basketball genius, but we can handle the 1-3-1 with relative ease, but I can't say the same thing about the 2-3 zone.

I understand that we got some good looks against the zone yesterday, but we also had a lot more 2010-2011 Billiken shot attempts, especially in the last 2 minutes. Either our coaches were ok with settling for the jumpers and/or the players didn't execute properly (or maybe a mix of both), but I wish JJ, KM and MM would have been more aggressive with the ball.

[Billboy1]

Sorry, but you're wrong. I don't think you're watching close enough because SLU sees zone quite a bit... it sometimes takes people a few possessions to realize the other team is running a zone and often times the team will have switched out by the time.

I've been watching basketball a long time and I still sometimes don't catch the defense is in a zone, but rather I notice the play we are running and therefore know the other team is in some form of a zone. It was just very obvious against Rhode Island because of the way we were playing offense against it.

Yesterday was the most a zone was used against us-why because RM couldn't figure a way to break it. Other teams would employ the zone periodically but not as much as yesterday. It will be seen again until it is rendered useless by RM

[Bay Area Billiken]

I'm not sure about the other zones, but Fordham was running a 1-3-1 zone according to Rammer and we tore it to shreds. That same 1-3-1 has been run against us in the past and we've torn it up. However, we haven't been as effective against the 2-3 zone and it seems to cause our team the most trouble. I'm not basketball genius, but we can handle the 1-3-1 with relative ease, but I can't say the same thing about the 2-3 zone.

I understand that we got some good looks against the zone yesterday, but we also had a lot more 2010-2011 Billiken shot attempts, especially in the last 2 minutes. Either our coaches were ok with settling for the jumpers and/or the players didn't execute properly (or maybe a mix of both), but I wish JJ, KM and MM would have been more aggressive with the ball.

Cody Ellis torched Fordham's 1-3-1 zone by hitting 3's from the corners, where no one was. I think Fordham switched between the 1-3-1 and 2-3, but the 1-3-1 was particularly ineffective against SLU.

Yesterday, SLU was again open and hit some big 3's against what looked like a 2-3 URI zone, but SLU missed 3 3's at crunch time. I thought the SLU ball movement was not as crisp against URI, and that the SLU 4 and 5 had trouble getting off good shots in the block and lane, especially in the 2nd Half. Of course, they were 3 and 4 inches shorter in height.

[slufan13]

Sorry, but you're wrong. I don't think you're watching close enough because SLU sees zone quite a bit... it sometimes takes people a few possessions to realize the other team is running a zone and often times the team will have switched out by the time.

I've been watching basketball a long time and I still sometimes don't catch the defense is in a zone, but rather I notice the play we are running and therefore know the other team is in some form of a zone. It was just very obvious against Rhode Island because of the way we were playing offense against it.

You're absolutely right. We've seen a lot of zone this season so far.

I say we're in with 2 more wins. Let's go ahead and get 5 more though.

[SLU7881]

^{--The only caveat is if we lose the first game in the tournament, and some upstart wins,lets hope they'll take 3 from the A-10.}

^{--I wonder who's our go to guy these days, if we've had one at all.I'd prefer it be a guard as getting the ball to the low post can be difficult. KM will take the shot but.. . Maybe its time MM takes control}

[Taj79]

Ever notice how much easier it is to shoot against a zone at home?

[BBall Fan]

i have watched every game and no team has used a zone for any great length of time-can guarantee you'll see it in every game from her on out unless RM can figure how to beat it early in the game.

Yesterday was the most a zone was used against us-why because RM couldn't figure a way to break it. Other teams would employ the zone periodically but not as much as yesterday. It will be seen again until it is rendered useless by RM

I have been to every home game and watched every game that has been on TV or had a live stream and promise you that we have seen more zone looks than you want to believe. Most teams are like SLU when it comes to playing defense. Most are man to man based schemes. If the zone is not practiced and played properly, it will kill you. We have killed most of the zones we have seen this year and that is why when teams have tried, they have ditched it very quickly. The teams like Fordham and Richmond play a lot of zone and therefor get pretty good at it. The teams that are predominantly man to man have tried to play zone against us and paid in 6 or 8 point runs that pulled them out of it faster than they got in it. We recognize these zone looks quicker and don't have the deer in the headlights look anymore when confronted. We have run a lot of High low offense this year and that is pretty much what our zone offense looks like. Just think about how many times our guys have caught the ball at the top of the free throw line and looked low or opposite to distribute. That is the soft spot of the ZONE not the man to man. CE, MM and KM ended the thought of many teams trying to zone us consistently. If our guys shoot it better yesterday, RI suffers the same fate as the other teams that tried to zone us. It wasn't that RM couldn't figure out a way to break it, It was that we shot poorly and seemed to lack intensity and desire. I guess when we shot poorly against NM it was because RM couldn't figure out a way to break their man to man also. When the 2-3 zone is played properly it is a tough defense to play against. Ask anyone who plays Syracuse or anyone who had to play John Cheneys old Matchup 2-3 at Temple. RI was very effective clogging the middle and contesting the inside yesterday but we had plenty of open looks that we didn't hit. Yet we still had numerous chances to get the W and fell to a fallaway jumper with 4.5 seconds on the clock.

[BBall Fan]

Ever notice how much easier it is to shoot against a zone at home?

+1........Every team in the nation feels this way.

[slufan13]

Lunardi has SLU at a 9 in his bracket today

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/bracketology

[Billboy1]

Rick better have the boys ready because he'll see a lot of that zone in the remaining games

[Westy03]

I hope we do see a lot of zone the rest of the way, it just means that teams are forcing to adjust to us. If a team has played man to man all year and switches to zone just for one game, I think we would have an advantage.

[Bizziken]

I think we are still in the Tournament regardless of the Xavier game...however, we would be on less stable footing if we were to lose. It would also make the Duquesne game a must win...

X is on he cusp of the RPI top 50, an extremely important 'Committee Metric'...if they do beat us, our Top 50 record would actually improve to 2-3, which is at least respectable...

[Billboy1]

I hope we do see a lot of zone the rest of the way, it just means that teams are forcing to adjust to us. If a team has played man to man all year and switches to zone just for one game, I think we would have an advantage.

And we have to adjust to them-a zone is easy to put in place and a good coach can make it work

[wgstl]

if st bona wins out, and we loose to X and then when the next, and X wins out, do we miss the dance? it would make SLU finish fourth.

[BBall Fan]

i have watched every game and no team has used a zone for any great length of time-can guarantee you'll see it in every game from her on out unless RM can figure how to beat it early in the game.

Care to critique the zone played by X tonight and why they didn't stay in it the entire game? The zone slowed us a bit in the first half because again we didn't make shots but we absolutely torched it in the second half and where did it go? Like almost every team before them X abandoned the zone when we started making shots. It has been the same all year.

[Billsrmajic]

Care to critique the zone played by X tonight and why they didn't stay in it the entire game? The zone slowed us a bit in the first half because again we didn't make shots but we absolutely torched it in the second half and where did it go? Like almost every team before them X abandoned the zone when we started making shots. It has been the same all year.

Yep

[Taj79]

Not surprisingly, the key to any zone is making shots. Making shots busts a zone and force the defense to something else. I thought we were a little tight in the first half or maybe that basket is smaller. I'm going with smaller --- with further proof demonstarted by X in the second half. They missed a DUNK!!!!

What changed last night is they had to come out further in the zone to cover our gunners, opening up the middle for Conklin. Conk stopped and popped a few 14-footers, making his arsenal all the more deadly. Once those seams are exposed and exploited, the other dominoes start to fall in place. You knew we were going to be better than 2-of-12 from three point land in the second half. We coulnd't be much worse. The issue to me is one has to support the other ---- drawing the bigs out to open it up for Conk and Conk knowing when to feed it out when the bigs collapse back in.

As I said earlier inthe year, we have enough options on the perimeter that finding two per night who are "on" shoudl be no problem. And even justthe threat of that opens it up for Conklin unless things are so bad they dare you to keep shooting the three.

I like changing defenses every now and then just to shake it up.