OT: Georgia Observation

[kevinfootes]

Georgia is now 3-0 including two 2-point wins. They have 3 wins by a total of 13 points. We are 0-2 (in games that count) with two 2-point losses. It's amazing what a difference a basket or two can make! We are now staring at a must win game in November.

[slubilliken09]

Georgia is now 3-0 including two 2-point wins. They have 3 wins by a total of 13 points. We are 0-2 (in games that count) with two 2-point losses. It's amazing what a difference a basket or two can make! We are now staring at a must win game in November.

One of the areas in which I feel we're really going to miss KM and WR. Close games.

Last year, we were 7-3 in games decided by 5 pts or fewer. I feel like that stat is going to swing the other way this year (already has with AP and GA.)

[ACE]

This is where Kwamain was so good. The young guards don't quite know how to finish off close games yet in the final minutes, although it was encouraging that Jett wasn't afraid to take the big shot to tie the game up. I think McCall and Jett will figure it out with more experience.

[Pistol]

Georgia is now 3-0 including two 2-point wins. They have 3 wins by a total of 13 points. We are 0-2 (in games that count) with two 2-point losses. It's amazing what a difference a basket or two can make! We are now staring at a must win game in November.

How so?

[kevinfootes]

How so?

IMO, if we want to salvage something out of this season we can't really lose to TN State.

[Box and Won]

IMO, if we want to salvage something out of this season we can't really lose to TN State.

Another observation: Last year vs Georgia we had Matt Dickey. This year, no Dickey.

[HusakAttack]

IMO, if we want to salvage something out of this season we can't really lose to TN State.

just what exactly are you thinking we can salvage this year?

[Pistol]

IMO, if we want to salvage something out of this season we can't really lose to TN State.

I'm going to have to agree with HusakAttack here. The outcomes of the rest of our non-conference games are largely irrelevant, other than the mental and emotional effects on the players. We kissed our at-large chances goodbye with a loss to Austin Peay and removed all doubt by losing to Georgia. The RPI and any other statistical measures make no difference to us at this point. The only 'must win' games are the minimum wins required to finish above Fordham and one other team in the A10, and then those in the conference tournament.

[NashvilleBilliken]

I'm going to have to agree with HusakAttack here. The outcomes of the rest of our non-conference games are largely irrelevant, other than the mental and emotional effects on the players. We kissed our at-large chances goodbye with a loss to Austin Peay and removed all doubt by losing to Georgia. The RPI and any other statistical measures make no difference to us at this point. The only 'must win' games are the minimum wins required to finish above Fordham and one other team in the A10, and then those in the conference tournament.

Damn, you guys are pessimistic! We lost to a team we should have beat, dominated a team we were supposed to, then lost at the buzzer to a team we should have lost to. All is not lost. We've only lost two games! This isn't college football. We somehow win out the rest of our non-con (minus Duke) and we are right there in contention. Yes, this is wishful thinking...but it's not like we haven't seen significant improvement since the exhibition opener. And, we have significantly more talent than in many of the years past. I admit i'm the eternal optimist, but it's too early to mail this one in!

[HusakAttack]

Damn, you guys are pessimistic! We lost to a team we should have beat, dominated a team we were supposed to, then lost at the buzzer to a team we should have lost to. All is not lost. We've only lost two games! This isn't college football. We somehow win out the rest of our non-con (minus Duke) and we are right there in contention. Yes, this is wishful thinking...but it's not like we haven't seen significant improvement since the exhibition opener. And, we have significantly more talent than in many of the years past. I admit i'm the eternal optimist, but it's too early to mail this one in!

I appreciate your optimism and wouldnt characterize our attitudes as pessimistic, more realistic. I would bet that this tem will not be above .500 in its non-conference schedule. I see a lot of talent but its very raw and nobody wants the ball yet when it matters.

TSU tonight will start 3 forwards who avg 10 points a game. It will be interesting to see who matches up on them.

[Pistol]

Damn, you guys are pessimistic! We lost to a team we should have beat, dominated a team we were supposed to, then lost at the buzzer to a team we should have lost to. All is not lost. We've only lost two games! This isn't college football. We somehow win out the rest of our non-con (minus Duke) and we are right there in contention. Yes, this is wishful thinking...but it's not like we haven't seen significant improvement since the exhibition opener. And, we have significantly more talent than in many of the years past. I admit i'm the eternal optimist, but it's too early to mail this one in!

What indications have you seen that this team can win all but the Duke game in the remainder of non-conference play? We were talking about how sweet it would be to run the non-con slate except Duke before we found out our two best players were gone, and it's clear this isn't close to the same team without them. We've blown leads, gone obscene stretches without scoring, committed turnovers in the last minute of the game, been outrebounded on our home floor, and shown we have no floor leader. I'm waiting for a win against a D-I team (tonight, perhaps?) and you're talking about losing only one more non-conference game. We have to go to Portland, to Missouri State, to Cancun for three games- none of these are givens, nor are any home games for this team.

I hate to be a pessimist but I grew up a SLU fan.

And yes, mathematically, we're looking at a near impossibility to still be relevant for the postseason after losing these two games and substituting Rockhurst for a D-I opponent. Our schedule simply is not strong enough to absorb 3 or more non-conference losses without running the table in Atlantic City. I can't believe we're even talking about the NCAA Tournament at all; the term 'must win' means nothing right now, and if you disagree, please feel free to show me a scenario that demonstrates otherwise.

[bonwich]

What indications have you seen that this team can win all but the Duke game in the remainder of non-conference play?

Because none of the teams we play for the rest of n-c are significantly better than Georgia.

It says can, not will. Because of our typically Billiken circumstances, we again have a typically Billiken team, which can win against just about anyone we play. It's also going to be the typical "get to know each other and the system" team of the past few years, which tended to get incrementally better as the year went on.

We also, by the way, can lose any given game.

[kevinfootes]

just what exactly are you thinking we can salvage this year?

I'd like to have a winning season for one thing. Are you ready to punt in November? I don't think this is a final four team, but I'm a little surprised by the negativity here.

[kevinfootes]

What indications have you seen that this team can win all but the Duke game in the remainder of non-conference play? We were talking about how sweet it would be to run the non-con slate except Duke before we found out our two best players were gone, and it's clear this isn't close to the same team without them. We've blown leads, gone obscene stretches without scoring, committed turnovers in the last minute of the game, been outrebounded on our home floor, and shown we have no floor leader. I'm waiting for a win against a D-I team (tonight, perhaps?) and you're talking about losing only one more non-conference game. We have to go to Portland, to Missouri State, to Cancun for three games- none of these are givens, nor are any home games for this team.

I hate to be a pessimist but I grew up a SLU fan.

And yes, mathematically, we're looking at a near impossibility to still be relevant for the postseason after losing these two games and substituting Rockhurst for a D-I opponent. Our schedule simply is not strong enough to absorb 3 or more non-conference losses without running the table in Atlantic City. I can't believe we're even talking about the NCAA Tournament at all; the term 'must win' means nothing right now, and if you disagree, please feel free to show me a scenario that demonstrates otherwise.

As I've posted already, I'd like to have a winning season. Why have you essentially given up on this team after two, 2-point losses? I'm willing to bet that this team will have better results as the season goes on. They're very raw, but they're also pretty talented.

[Bizziken]

This year any quality and surprising wins will be offset by an equally surprising loss...that is the nature of a young and inexperienced team...

[Pistol]

As I've posted already, I'd like to have a winning season. Why have you essentially given up on this team after two, 2-point losses? I'm willing to bet that this team will have better results as the season goes on. They're very raw, but they're also pretty talented.

Oh, I want to win. And I'm not giving up on them, as I still have my season tickets and go to the games and plan on doing the same next season.

But wanting to win and have a respectable record is a totally different thing than facing 'must win' games; the term 'must win' implies that this team is in the hunt for something, which is not the case.

[Box and Won]

I hate to be a pessimist but I grew up a SLU fan.

This.

I tend to be optimistic in just about every other area of my life besides my Billiken fandom. This program has beaten me down.

I'm afraid the biggest highlight of this season will be the Planet Sub coupons that came with my tickets.

[Pistol]

I'm afraid the biggest highlight of this season will be the Planet Sub coupons that came with my tickets.

Big time. I plan on using another one of these tomorrow.

[bonwich]

I'm afraid the biggest highlight of this season will be the Planet Sub coupons that came with my tickets.

There's always Snooki. (And the GGuy Phil-lips Phlub List.)

[ACE]

This.

I tend to be optimistic in just about every other area of my life besides my Billiken fandom. This program has beaten me down.

I'm afraid the biggest highlight of this season will be the Planet Sub coupons that came with my tickets.

My fandom began in the Spoonball era. I naively thought that NCAA Tournament appearances would occur at least on a semi-regular basis. It looked like we were heading back in that direction until the KM/WR situation delivered a swift kick to the gut.

[Cowboy]

My fandom began in the Spoonball era. I naively thought that NCAA Tournament appearances would occur at least on a semi-regular basis. It looked like we were heading back in that direction until the KM/WR situation delivered a swift kick to the gut.

-almost like getting run over by a train....

[NashvilleBilliken]

What indications have you seen that this team can win all but the Duke game in the remainder of non-conference play? We were talking about how sweet it would be to run the non-con slate except Duke before we found out our two best players were gone, and it's clear this isn't close to the same team without them. We've blown leads, gone obscene stretches without scoring, committed turnovers in the last minute of the game, been outrebounded on our home floor, and shown we have no floor leader. I'm waiting for a win against a D-I team (tonight, perhaps?) and you're talking about losing only one more non-conference game. We have to go to Portland, to Missouri State, to Cancun for three games- none of these are givens, nor are any home games for this team.

I hate to be a pessimist but I grew up a SLU fan.

And yes, mathematically, we're looking at a near impossibility to still be relevant for the postseason after losing these two games and substituting Rockhurst for a D-I opponent. Our schedule simply is not strong enough to absorb 3 or more non-conference losses without running the table in Atlantic City. I can't believe we're even talking about the NCAA Tournament at all; the term 'must win' means nothing right now, and if you disagree, please feel free to show me a scenario that demonstrates otherwise.

As somebody already alluded to, what game is there on the schedule that you feel we can't win (minus Duke)? The Cancun tourney was widely accepted as a crap tourney this year and the rest are a bunch of teams on SLU's level or below. What have I seen? Well, i have seen a tremendous improvement by this bunch over 5 games. Tremendous improvement. And we will get better. The talent is better than in most years (even without KM and WR) and the coaching is superb. To say we have no shot at an at large, IMO, is incorrect. Sure, the room for error is low, but at this point, we have 1 bad loss. How many at large teams come in with more than one bad loss? And, by the looks of things, will APSU really be a bad loss by season's end? We shall see.

Please don't confuse the above with me being naive or having some sort of delusions of graduer. The odds of this happening are low, I agree. We aren't winning a national championship this year any way you cut it. An NIT will probably be an accomplishment for this bunch. But, I sense a hint of doom and gloom and some are ready to chalk this up to another failed season with hope for the future. I'm just trying to bring some reality to the discussion. We've lost to a good OVC team and a good SEC team. I wager both will finish better than 150 in the RPI. All is not lost.

[Pistol]

As somebody already alluded to, what game is there on the schedule that you feel we can't win (minus Duke)?

I don't feel there are any that we can't win, but I feel there are some we won't win. I felt we could beat Austin Peay or Georgia and we didn't beat either.

The Cancun tourney was widely accepted as a crap tourney this year and the rest are a bunch of teams on SLU's level or below. What have I seen? Well, i have seen a tremendous improvement by this bunch over 5 games. Tremendous improvement. And we will get better. The talent is better than in most years (even without KM and WR) and the coaching is superb. To say we have no shot at an at large, IMO, is incorrect. Sure, the room for error is low, but at this point, we have 1 bad loss. How many at large teams come in with more than one bad loss? And, by the looks of things, will APSU really be a bad loss by season's end? We shall see.

Some at-large teams come in with a bad loss or two. Some. Most at-large teams have losses to stronger teams than Austin Peay and overall schedules much stronger than the one we face, not to mention multiple signature wins and strong conference showings. In another season, with a better non-conference schedule, maybe that one doesn't do too much to hurt us. We all agreed before this season and before we lost our best players that this schedule left us very little margin for error, and we have busted right through that and don't have the comfort of two potential all-conference players to dig us out.

As I said before, please give me a scenario in which we get an at-large bid this year. Win out?

Please don't confuse the above with me being naive or having some sort of delusions of graduer. The odds of this happening are low, I agree. We aren't winning a national championship this year any way you cut it. An NIT will probably be an accomplishment for this bunch. But, I sense a hint of doom and gloom and some are ready to chalk this up to another failed season with hope for the future. I'm just trying to bring some reality to the discussion. We've lost to a good OVC team and a good SEC team. I wager both will finish better than 150 in the RPI. All is not lost.

Reality is the opposite of what you're bringing to the discussion. Reality is that we've stumbled out of the gate and lack our two best players. Reality is that we play 6 games outside of Chaifetz before starting the conference season vs. Dayton. Reality is that we have a soft non-conference schedule and have yet to beat a D-I opponent.

Should I be more optimistic if we win tonight? Maybe I'll feel a little better if we win the next three, but that includes a road game at Portland, which I thought was a trap game even before our personnel losses.

We're NIT long shots at best as far as I'm concerned, and I wouldn't count on the CBI, either.

[NashvilleBilliken]

As I said before, please give me a scenario in which we get an at-large bid this year. Win out?

Sure....as well as any other number of scenarios. Top two in A10. Beating Duke and finishing strong. I think there are a few options.

I'm not trying to argue with you. I think we just approach things very different. I'd have a hard time enjoying the season if I had your outlook.

[slu72]

This is where Kwamain was so good. The young guards don't quite know how to finish off close games yet in the final minutes, although it was encouraging that Jett wasn't afraid to take the big shot to tie the game up. I think McCall and Jett will figure it out with more experience.

If we just had KM for this game, we win. The other thing KM excelled at was stopping the long droughts with a key basket. Right now, we haven't found that player. For anyone who's ever played hoops when a team hits you with an 11 pt run and you can't hit the ocean for over 7+ minutes, you feel like the bottom's dropping out fast. Very disheartening, and why every team needs a go to guy who stop the bleeding. I think KC and RL right now have the best shot at developing into a go to guy. Maybe even CE when he feels healthy again.