jjray Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 Willie Reed's father has been quoted as saying that if the semester suspension is not overturned that Willie shall "transfer" or "won't be back at SLU". It's stupid to transfer to another school when Willie doesn't intend to play 4 years of college ball. Is he going to sit out an entire year in order to play just one year at another NCAA school then declare for the draft? I think not. So that really leaves Willie with two options: (a) sit out 8 weeks and finish out his three months of college basketball at SLU or b ) go to Europe to play professionally for a few months. The ultimate goal should be the NBA. It comes down to what positions Willie best for the draft. Obviously, missing the national TV game against Duke against forwards who are NBA bound (i.e., the Plumlee brothers) hurts. But really, the semester suspension hurts the SLU bball program more than Willie. He will be judged on points per game, rebounds per game, how he plays against top tier forwards. The conference season and the A10 tourney will give Willie the showcase he needs to make his case to the scouts, so long as he plays well starting in December. Playing in Europe puts Willie on a much smaller stage with much less exposure. And it will be especially hard for Willie to latch on to a top tier European team when they know he is a short timer. If Willie plays 2nd tier in Europe, it will hurt his draft status this coming May. It is in Willie's best long term interest to return to SLU in mid-December and tear it up for three months. I understand the anger and frustration but the issue is what can be salvaged from the mess. Reconsider suing the university because of the perception that internal policies were not followed in the discipline process. Get a second legal opinion if someone is telling you that your son has a case against the university for this. Under what legal theory? A tort? What cause of action? Can't think of a tort cause of action that fits this scenario but maybe someone more creative has a wild hair coming out his ass. You are probably looking at an equity action which means no jury. Just my very much uninformed opinion but the case won't rest on whether SLU violated it's internal policies but whether the student manual allowed the university to suspend the students in question for one semester based upon the full body of violations documented on each student. It won't just be about the incident in May but every little complaint the university has in it's files. I've been there as a student. You'll be amazed all the stuff they can accumulate in these files. Good luck with that lawsuit. It's a loser. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikendave Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 Willie Reed's father has been quoted as saying that if the semester suspension is not overturned that Willie shall "transfer" or "won't be back at SLU". It's stupid to transfer to another school when Willie doesn't intend to play 4 years of college ball. Is he going to sit out an entire year in order to play just one year at another NCAA school then declare for the draft? I think not. So that really leaves Willie with two options: (a) sit out 8 weeks and finish out his three months of college basketball at SLU or b ) go to Europe to play professionally for a few months. The ultimate goal should be the NBA. It comes down to what positions Willie best for the draft. Obviously, missing the national TV game against Duke against forwards who are NBA bound (i.e., the Plumlee brothers) hurts. But really, the semester suspension hurts the SLU bball program more than Willie. He will be judged on points per game, rebounds per game, how he plays against top tier forwards. The conference season and the A10 tourney will give Willie the showcase he needs to make his case to the scouts, so long as he plays well starting in December. Playing in Europe puts Willie on a much smaller stage with much less exposure. And it will be especially hard for Willie to latch on to a top tier European team when they know he is a short timer. If Willie plays 2nd tier in Europe, it will hurt his draft status this coming May. It is in Willie's best long term interest to return to SLU in mid-December and tear it up for three months. I understand the anger and frustration but the issue is what can be salvaged from the mess. Reconsider suing the university because of the perception that internal policies were not followed in the discipline process. Get a second legal opinion if someone is telling you that your son has a case against the university for this. Under what legal theory? A tort? For what? Can't think of a tort cause of action that fits this scenario but maybe someone more creative has a wild hair coming out his ass. You are probably looking at an equity action which means no jury. Just my very much uninformed opinion but the case won't rest on whether SLU violated it's internal policies but whether the student manual allowed the university to suspend the students in question for one semester based upon the full body of violations documented on each student. It won't just be about the incident in May but every little complaint the university has in it's files. I've been there as a student. You'll be amazed all the stuff they can accumulate in these files. Good luck with that lawsuit. It's a loser. According to KSDK, they have to completely apologize. This tees them up for a civil lawsuit. As far as law suit against SLU, it may ultimately be a loser but I guarantee SLU will look completely incompetent. Emails and memos from competing interests in the school. The secrecy that has ruled the day would be gone. Bad press all around. It would also keep the deep wound that exists over this wide open Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjray Posted October 14, 2010 Author Share Posted October 14, 2010 According to KSDK, they have to completely apologize. This tees them up for a civil lawsuit. As far as law suit against SLU, it may ultimately be a loser but I guarantee SLU will look completely incompetent. Emails and memos from competing interests in the school. The secrecy that has ruled the day would be gone. Bad press all around. It would also keep the deep wound that exists over this wide open The argument is devoid of the SLU perspective. It's all about what is best for Willie and his future given the ugly situation he now finds himself in. Is it a "bite your nose to spite your face" situation? When you strip away seeking justice and such nebulous concepts and just focus on what is best for Willie Reed going forward one may arrive at a different decision making process. Then again, perhaps not because I know nothing about the internal dynamics of the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlarry Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 According to KSDK, they have to completely apologize. This tees them up for a civil lawsuit. I would hope that the school or advisors for the studnents would make sure that they put in a clause saying the appology cant be used in a civil trial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moytoy12 Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 The argument is devoid of the SLU perspective. It's all about what is best for Willie and his future given the ugly situation he now finds himself in. Is it a "bite your nose to spite your face" situation? When you strip away seeking justice and such nebulous concepts and just focus on what is best for Willie Reed going forward one may arrive at a different decision making process. Then again, perhaps not because I know nothing about the internal dynamics of the situation. Or maybe Europe is best for Willie and what you really want is actually what is best for SLU? I have no clue if Europe or SLU or the J-League is best for Willie, but I won't pretend to know either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARon Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 Or maybe Europe is best for Willie and what you really want is actually what is best for SLU? I have no clue if Europe or SLU or the J-League is best for Willie, but I won't pretend to know either. Willie is not ready to be an NBA player at this point. Even if none of this had happened I think he would have needed to make a pretty good leap this year to be a legit draftee. He probably needs two years. We'll see though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clock_Tower Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 Willie is not ready to be an NBA player at this point. Even if none of this had happened I think he would have needed to make a pretty good leap this year to be a legit draftee. He probably needs two years. We'll see though. Not only 2 years but he also needs a shot, extra weight/muscle and the ability to hit a free throw. Good college player but NBA is still a dream for him. As to smart decisions, WR and his family/father presumably also chose to drop out of a good catholic/private high school to attend the unacredited basketball factory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRN Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 Not only 2 years but he also needs a shot, extra weight/muscle and the ability to hit a free throw. Good college player but NBA is still a dream for him. As to smart decisions, WR and his family/father presumably also chose to drop out of a good catholic/private high school to attend the unacredited basketball factory. On top of that he needs to be able to play more than 5 minutes in a row without sitting on the bench before being a pro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 Not only 2 years but he also needs a shot, extra weight/muscle and the ability to hit a free throw. Good college player but NBA is still a dream for him. As to smart decisions, WR and his family/father presumably also chose to drop out of a good catholic/private high school to attend the unacredited basketball factory. I was recalling that move last night after listening to WR, sr's rant on KDSK. He destroyed WR's senior year of HS so why do the same to his college career? I can see why dad's so upset given what we've heard about the so called "trial", but he ought to take a time out and think about what's really best for his son's future. Am sure he envisions WR going to some BCS program where he'll be a star and a lottery pick but that's likely not going to happen, and WR's future may best be served by staying at SLU. Look at Josh Harrelson, Mr. Reed, and figure out if that's what you want for your son. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Box and Won Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 I would hope that the school or advisors for the studnents would make sure that they put in a clause saying the appology cant be used in a civil trial. Yeah, I'm sure they could get a second-year law student to write that in. 2L's are perfectly suited for that kind of thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjray Posted October 14, 2010 Author Share Posted October 14, 2010 Or maybe Europe is best for Willie and what you really want is actually what is best for SLU? I have no clue if Europe or SLU or the J-League is best for Willie, but I won't pretend to know either. Good point. I'm no expert on the best path to the NBA but check out how many players get drafted from Europe or elsewhere each year versus NCAA schools. One player out of the 30 first round picks in the 2010 NBA draft were international. Five out of the 30 second round picks. http://www.mynbadraft.com/NBA-Draft-Results/ It's not rocket science. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeTimeBilliken Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 I would hope that the school or advisors for the studnents would make sure that they put in a clause saying the apology cant be used in a civil trial. These guys are fools if they write an apology that says anything other than "I'm sorry you mistook our actions." The statute of limitations on sexual assault has not run. Any apology can be used as probable cause to re-open the criminal investigation. And, no, you cannot have an enforceable clause that it can't be used in a criminal case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikendave Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 I would hope that the school or advisors for the studnents would make sure that they put in a clause saying the appology cant be used in a civil trial. As a civil trial lawyer, once a statement or admission is made, it is nearly impossible to put the genie back in the bottle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamitalian85 Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 Just to clarify, is it an apology to the girl or to the University for not living up to moral standards? If it is to the University it is a whole different story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjray Posted October 14, 2010 Author Share Posted October 14, 2010 As a civil trial lawyer, once a statement or admission is made, it is nearly impossible to put the genie back in the bottle.We're not talking responses to requests for admission here. This is Eddie Haskell apologizing to the teacher. "I'm very sorry if anything I did was an embarrassment to the university. And geewiz, girl x seems like a very nice person and I am sorry she had to go through all this. If I did anything that offended her, I'm plum sorry about that. I promise to be good. Player X." It's meaningless. The university is being childish to insist on something so infantile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slulefty Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 This is a joke!! Its not like a kid cheated on a test and the student council is voting to kick him out of school. This is serious stuff and SLU is acting as its not by letting a group of students decide the future on KM and WR. What a joke!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 I would hope that the school or advisors for the studnents would make sure that they put in a clause saying the appology cant be used in a civil trial. You can apologize by simply saying that "I never intended to hurt anyone and if my actions made someone feel hurt then I am sorry." This does not admit anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clock_Tower Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 Just to clarify, is it an apology to the girl or to the University for not living up to moral standards? If it is to the University it is a whole different story. News reports say the letter is to be to the girl, the school and the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 News reports say the letter is to be to the girl, the school and the team. as someone else stated in one of our many threads going right now, i cant see how any attorney would allow either of these two players to write such a letter at this point in time that actually was a specific apology without being incriminating. and anything else would be so murky it likely wouldnt constitute an actual apology that would be acceptable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikendave Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 We're not talking responses to requests for admission here. This is Eddie Haskell apologizing to the teacher. "I'm very sorry if anything I did was an embarrassment to the university. And geewiz, girl x seems like a very nice person and I am sorry she had to go through all this. If I did anything that offended her, I'm plum sorry about that. I promise to be good. Player X." It's meaningless. The university is being childish to insist on something so infantile. Envision whatever is written and signed by player x, put on an ELMO machine in front of a jury. Lawyer says: explain. In front of a jury, if you are explaining, you are losing. I would never knowingly let my client do this -- especially with the potential for criminal charges still out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted October 14, 2010 Share Posted October 14, 2010 Envision whatever is written and signed by player x, put on an ELMO machine in front of a jury. Lawyer says: explain. In front of a jury, if you are explaining, you are losing. I would never knowingly let my client do this -- especially with the potential for criminal charges still out there. Isn't it a matter of what they're apologizing for? Would agree you don't want them saying sorry we broke the law and assaulted you, but what about sorry for the misunderstanding. Doesn't matter in WR's case 'cause he ain't writing no letter according to his dad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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