Nothing New on Ellis

[brianstl]

This team is gonna have a chance to do some real damage specially if Ellis gets qualified. I like Salecich a lot. Jordan provided a spark. Smith and Remekun are long and athletic but raw. Femi is a tough kid who will be a good player. I think once Reid gets some confidence hell be good.

This team has some potential, but I wouldn't get to carried away yet. UAFS was a Juco until this year and they have no senoirs. This roster has a lot to like on it, but it is young and small. We are more athletic and have more pieces than we have had in a long time.

[slu72 fan]

This team has some potential, but I wouldn't get to carried away yet. UAFS was a Juco until this year and they have no senoirs. This roster has a lot to like on it, but it is young and small. We are more athletic and have more pieces than we have had in a long time.

I would definitely agree about the athleticism, and you can see that each of these 10 kids bring some basketball skills, but I wouldn't get too carried away for this year. We have, by Billiken standards, some height. Remekun and especially Smith have terrific length, similar to WR. But we have no strength and we're going to really struggle in the A-10. Teams like Dayton, X and Temple will overwhelm us with their strength. Hopefully, CE will get here and help with this.

You can definitely see why the coaches picked these players, but I believe this is going to be a real learning year, with a lot more downs than ups. Our schedule may save us, but I'm not even sure about that.

By the way, KM had a terrible time getting to the basket. I'm afraid he's going to find penetrating a tad tougher without KL and TL being guarded hard on the perimeter. CS was the best we had this evening breaking down the defense with penetration.

[Guest BillikenReport]

MB. Maybe you live out of town and/or could not make to tonight's game. If you did go to the game, however, you would have seen that both Smith and Remekun are big kids. They look every bit of 6'8" and both look like forwards and not really close at all to being guards. Frankly I was expecting guys with smaller and skinnier frames and guys more like that of a guard. Neither look like anyone SLU has had in years. A Justin Johnson type frame (Frosh and Soph years) is what I had been expecting. I was sure wrong. These guys both have alot of development left but both have true size and potential. Yes, WR is even bigger, but if I recall correctly, Nate had described CR or JS as being a smaller WR. Now, I understand better and would agree. Believe JJ grew to 6'8" and added muscle to his frame, but JS and CR will be even bigger and already are more skilled.

Remekun is 6-8. Smith is more like 6-5 or 6-6, but has good length and great athleticism that will allow him to play like he's bigger. Now he just has to get stronger and put on some weight. Smith is the one who I said is like a shorter version of Willie.

[Bluesman]

With rare exceptions, programs like SLU (midmajors) are not going to land polished post players. The polished post players, i.e. 6'8" and taller, are going to go to the high majors. Are there exceptions? Sure. Are there A-10 teams that can land these players-yes, Xavier and Dayton, the most likely targets. Xavier has done a very good job of positioning itself as an alternative in Ohio to Ohio State and the regression of UC in recent years contributed to that resurgence. The advantage X and UD have over SLU, is Ohio as a whole has a deeper pool of DI talent coming out of its high school ranks than MO. Of course, Ohio has significantly more DI one programs than MO. SLU was hurt by the abysmal recruiting of Brad S. But SLU also isn't going to land consistently at this point the finished big man. So you need to look for the "projects" some more project-like than others. Willie Reed is a good example. Athletic but thin. Offensively limited, and in my opinion still is, but he has height at 6'9", is long, athletic and does give SLU an inside prescense. But he certainly was not close to being polished out of HS. Conklin is another good example-an undersized at 6'6" PF. Jon Smith will fit that mold as well, an athletic, long, but somewhat undersized post player. Probably suited for the 3 but at times may have to slide to the 4 spot. Smith was a very good get for SLU, #12 player in the state of Ohio last year. Thompson was a loss as he was a higher regarded big man, but couldn't adopt to RM's system or the demands of higher DI ball. Perhaps that is why he slid to SLU. The other option for midmajors besides the project route is the JC route. But that has its dangers as well-academic qualification problems. And sometimes those players dont quite live up to expectations. Barry Eberhardt is a prime example. I had watched quite a bit of film on him and what always stood out to me is he didn't run/hustle up the floor while at JC. I was following him as my school was recruiting him as well. Honestly glad we didn't get him, but he still was a serviceable DI player for SLU, just not what many on here probably hoped for. Another option is to build the model that has been so successful for Kent State-a roster full of athletic 6'5"-67" players with versatility to play multiple positions. Look at Kent's 20 win teams over the last decade-all their power forwards have been 6'7". Midmajors ultimately will live and die with above average guard play. SLU should have that this year with KM and some of your freshman. Believe me I feel the frustration of not being able to consistently land quality big men. But there are only so many to go around and besides, everyone knows it is better to go to Kentucky, Duke, and Kansas and sit the bench than come to a midmajor and actually play! (Yes, that comment was dripping with sarcasm!)

[Clock_Tower]

Remekun is 6-8. Smith is more like 6-5 or 6-6, but has good length and great athleticism that will allow him to play like he's bigger. Now he just has to get stronger and put on some weight. Smith is the one who I said is like a shorter version of Willie.

Nate. Are you adopting RM's measuring techniques? Smith sure seems like the biggest 6'5" I've ever seen. By comparison, and admittedly going back a few years, I recall former Bill's listed as 6'5" including Highmark and David Robinson. Recently, Luke Meyer may have been 6'4" or 6'5". At lest to me, Smith appears to clearly be in a different size category.

[Clock_Tower]

With rare exceptions, programs like SLU (midmajors) are not going to land polished post players. The polished post players, i.e. 6'8" and taller, are going to go to the high majors. Are there exceptions? Sure. Are there A-10 teams that can land these players-yes, Xavier and Dayton, the most likely targets. Xavier has done a very good job of positioning itself as an alternative in Ohio to Ohio State and the regression of UC in recent years contributed to that resurgence. The advantage X and UD have over SLU, is Ohio as a whole has a deeper pool of DI talent coming out of its high school ranks than MO. Of course, Ohio has significantly more DI one programs than MO. SLU was hurt by the abysmal recruiting of Brad S. But SLU also isn't going to land consistently at this point the finished big man. So you need to look for the "projects" some more project-like than others. Willie Reed is a good example. Athletic but thin. Offensively limited, and in my opinion still is, but he has height at 6'9", is long, athletic and does give SLU an inside prescense. But he certainly was not close to being polished out of HS. Conklin is another good example-an undersized at 6'6" PF. Jon Smith will fit that mold as well, an athletic, long, but somewhat undersized post player. Probably suited for the 3 but at times may have to slide to the 4 spot. Smith was a very good get for SLU, #12 player in the state of Ohio last year. Thompson was a loss as he was a higher regarded big man, but couldn't adopt to RM's system or the demands of higher DI ball. Perhaps that is why he slid to SLU. The other option for midmajors besides the project route is the JC route. But that has its dangers as well-academic qualification problems. And sometimes those players dont quite live up to expectations. Barry Eberhardt is a prime example. I had watched quite a bit of film on him and what always stood out to me is he didn't run/hustle up the floor while at JC. I was following him as my school was recruiting him as well. Honestly glad we didn't get him, but he still was a serviceable DI player for SLU, just not what many on here probably hoped for. Another option is to build the model that has been so successful for Kent State-a roster full of athletic 6'5"-67" players with versatility to play multiple positions. Look at Kent's 20 win teams over the last decade-all their power forwards have been 6'7". Midmajors ultimately will live and die with above average guard play. SLU should have that this year with KM and some of your freshman. Believe me I feel the frustration of not being able to consistently land quality big men. But there are only so many to go around and besides, everyone knows it is better to go to Kentucky, Duke, and Kansas and sit the bench than come to a midmajor and actually play! (Yes, that comment was dripping with sarcasm!)

Good comments. Please post more.

The only real exception I take with you, though, is Thompson. He did not "slide" to SLU b/c of problems adapting to/playing D1. Instead, he was a "local" with great size/potential that apparently wanted to come to SLU all along. Play for SLU whether the coach was Brad or RM. Maybe it was the desire to stay local. In any event, he really hit it off with Brad and truly wanted to play for him. Now he is at Lindenwood. Good for him. At the same time, many other D1 schools wanted hiim as he was in high demand. After his Freshman year, his stock dropped but not before the year. In any event, he is an example of a true big-man, with high rankings who picked SLU - a mid major.

Also, Willie Reed is not 6'9"

[NH]

This team has some potential, but I wouldn't get to carried away yet. UAFS was a Juco until this year and they have no senoirs. This roster has a lot to like on it, but it is young and small. We are more athletic and have more pieces than we have had in a long time.

I didnt say when they would do the damage. I definitely agree that we shouldn't get carried away. That being said, A lot of the pieces are in place for the future. We still need another big guy for sure, but We have a good point guard (KM), a good center (WR), a bruiser (BC), a couple tough guards who can score and play some D (CS and FJ), a quick backup PG who can bring energy (JJ), and some athletic bigs who can develop down the line (JS and CR). I also think that eventually, when he gains confidence, JR can be a really solid player and a good shooter.

With those guys, and the addition of CE, we have the pieces in place to, when these guys develop, make a run at the postseason.

[slu72]

I didnt say when they would do the damage. I definitely agree that we shouldn't get carried away. That being said, A lot of the pieces are in place for the future. We still need another big guy for sure, but We have a good point guard (KM), a good center (WR), a bruiser (BC), a couple tough guards who can score and play some D (CS and FJ), a quick backup PG who can bring energy (JJ), and some athletic bigs who can develop down the line (JS and CR). I also think that eventually, when he gains confidence, JR can be a really solid player and a good shooter.

With those guys, and the addition of CE, we have the pieces in place to, when these guys develop, make a run at the postseason.

I read the Wall article in ESPN. What a joke. First, he's been practicing with UK so he started school obviously. If the NCAA hadn't cleared him where'd his scholie come from? I don't get this whole clearance thing at all anyways. Please someone in the know clear this up for me, if CE had just been a regular student, ie non athlete, and SLU accepted him wouldn't he have been attending classes since Sept? So if it's the school's decision to admit, why does the NCAA have to be involved? Now I agree there would be schools that would admit a 6'9" illiterate from one of the lost tribes of the Amazon if he could score, but eventually he would fail. Is this what they're trying to protect against?

[Bluesman]

Good comments. Please post more.

The only real exception I take with you, though, is Thompson. He did not "slide" to SLU b/c of problems adapting to/playing D1. Instead, he was a "local" with great size/potential that apparently wanted to come to SLU all along. Play for SLU whether the coach was Brad or RM. Maybe it was the desire to stay local. In any event, he really hit it off with Brad and truly wanted to play for him. Now he is at Lindenwood. Good for him. At the same time, many other D1 schools wanted hiim as he was in high demand. After his Freshman year, his stock dropped but not before the year. In any event, he is an example of a true big-man, with high rankings who picked SLU - a mid major.

Also, Willie Reed is not 6'9"

How tall is Willie Reed? He is listed at 6'9" on your roster and looks about that height. Jon Smith is most definitely in the 6'5"-6'6" range from the coaches I have talked to. As to Thompson I didn't mean he slid to SLU because of problems playing DI. If that is what I typed it isn't what I meant. Thompson to me is one of those exceptions in true post players I was talking about. By the way, per Brian Snow's last ratings of Ohio prospects last year, Jon Smith finished as the 16th ranked player in Ohio, and the 4th ranked PF behind Bobby Capobianco (Indiana), Reggie Keely (Ohio University), and Danny McElroy (who you will see when SLU plays Bowling Green). Very solid group of PF in Ohio this past year. You will like what Smith will give you.

[Bluesman]

I read the Wall article in ESPN. What a joke. First, he's been practicing with UK so he started school obviously. If the NCAA hadn't cleared him where'd his scholie come from? I don't get this whole clearance thing at all anyways. Please someone in the know clear this up for me, if CE had just been a regular student, ie non athlete, and SLU accepted him wouldn't he have been attending classes since Sept? So if it's the school's decision to admit, why does the NCAA have to be involved? Now I agree there would be schools that would admit a 6'9" illiterate from one of the lost tribes of the Amazon if he could score, but eventually he would fail. Is this what they're trying to protect against?

Do you honestly think any of the freshman at UK this year are attending classes? I would bet they didn't even buy books! This is a very talented group of freshman at UK, all of whom are thinking one and done. One advantage of being a midmajor-the majority of the time your recruits stick around for 4 years and you get to develop them!

[MB73]

MB. Maybe you live out of town and/or could not make to tonight's game. If you did go to the game, however, you would have seen that both Smith and Remekun are big kids. They look every bit of 6'8" and both look like forwards and not really close at all to being guards. Frankly I was expecting guys with smaller and skinnier frames and guys more like that of a guard. Neither look like anyone SLU has had in years. A Justin Johnson type frame (Frosh and Soph years) is what I had been expecting. I was sure wrong. These guys both have alot of development left but both have true size and potential. Yes, WR is even bigger, but if I recall correctly, Nate had described CR or JS as being a smaller WR. Now, I understand better and would agree. Believe JJ grew to 6'8" and added muscle to his frame, but JS and CR will be even bigger and already are more skilled.

I'm a season ticker holder (Sec 115) but did not go. Perhaps Smith and Remekun are bigger than their published height / weights, but I do not consider them to be the type of BIGs we need.

Mid majors are usually hard pressed to get true power forwards with height and strength / weight, and SLU has additional problems with academic requirements compared to a lot of them.

I just thought that with RM's legacy (hype?) with big men, he would do better.

So far, all we have is Willie Reed, certainly a plus, but with Thompson gone, if we dont get Ellis and RM signs the two verbal committments (2 "smalls"), I think we are not getting there at all.

[NH]

I'm a season ticker holder (Sec 115) but did not go. Perhaps Smith and Remekun are bigger than their published height / weights, but I do not consider them to be the type of BIGs we need.

Mid majors are usually hard pressed to get true power forwards with height and strength / weight, and SLU has additional problems with academic requirements compared to a lot of them.

I just thought that with RM's legacy (hype?) with big men, he would do better.

So far, all we have is Willie Reed, certainly a plus, but with Thompson gone, if we dont get Ellis and RM signs the two verbal committments (2 "smalls"), I think we are not getting there at all.

Why are you so negative? Remekun is around 6-8, certainly respectable for a PF. Ellis is 6-8 so if we get him theres another big. As for the recruiting, Evans is not a "small" he is a good rebounder who has solid size (6-5ish) and gets to the basket. The other guy, McCall, is a really good player the staff didnt want to pass on.

You say two guys are not the type fo big you are looking for and yet youve never seen them play. Let things unfold a little before you get to complaining.

[Bluesman]

Guess I should have added with Jon Smith the people I talked to at the end of the recruiting period last year said with his size 17 shoe he might not be done growing and might add an inch or two so it is certainly possible he is now up around 6'7".

[DeSmetBilliken]

Guess I should have added with Jon Smith the people I talked to at the end of the recruiting period last year said with his size 17 shoe he might not be done growing and might add an inch or two so it is certainly possible he is now up around 6'7".

Jon Smith is listed on the SLU roster at 6-4. I'm pretty sure that the Jon Smith I saw last night on the court was taller than 6-4, probably more around 6-6 or 6-7, but who knows.

In the lead-up to the season, we were given the idea that Smith was like a smaller version of Willie Reed. Very athletic, yet needs to add some weight. Last night's game in my opinion confirmed those comments, so much to the point that around halftime I declared Jon Smith to be "Baby Willie."

[Majerus Magic]

Jon Smith is listed on the SLU roster at 6-4. I'm pretty sure that the Jon Smith I saw last night on the court was taller than 6-4, probably more around 6-6 or 6-7, but who knows.

In the lead-up to the season, we were given the idea that Smith was like a smaller version of Willie Reed. Very athletic, yet needs to add some weight. Last night's game in my opinion confirmed those comments, so much to the point that around halftime I declared Jon Smith to be "Baby Willie."

JS is extremely long. That could be why you think he is taller than he is listed. I would peg him for right around 6-5.

[jimbofive]

I didnt say when they would do the damage. I definitely agree that we shouldn't get carried away. That being said, A lot of the pieces are in place for the future. We still need another big guy for sure, but We have a good point guard (KM), a good center (WR), a bruiser (BC), a couple tough guards who can score and play some D (CS and FJ), a quick backup PG who can bring energy (JJ), and some athletic bigs who can develop down the line (JS and CR). I also think that eventually, when he gains confidence, JR can be a really solid player and a good shooter.

With those guys, and the addition of CE, we have the pieces in place to, when these guys develop, make a run at the postseason.

This post got me real fired up. Never looked at it in a piece-by-piece way like that before. Real fired up. Everyone on this team seems like a hard worker. Have to appreciate that and have to appreciate RM, Porter, etc. for bringing that kind of kid in. PLEASE CE, GET HERE. This will be a completely different team and I really look forward to how he and CS will play together.

[jimbofive]

Jon Smith... size 17 shoe...

HOLY CRAP. RM's 6-inch philosophy will fall on deaf ears. That kid could potentially be a monster. I had trouble in the first half (via the interwebs, of course) discerning him from Willie.

[jimbofive]

WTF? This kid can get cleared, but Ellis can't? http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=4610060

I mean, I know why the kid is getting cleared before Ellis (UK), but his history and possible transgressions seem much more serious.

That is one of the coolest BBALL faux-toes I've ever seen... I especially like the two dudes making the "dubya" in the background.

[bhayes520]

I read the Wall article in ESPN. What a joke. First, he's been practicing with UK so he started school obviously. If the NCAA hadn't cleared him where'd his scholie come from? I don't get this whole clearance thing at all anyways. Please someone in the know clear this up for me, if CE had just been a regular student, ie non athlete, and SLU accepted him wouldn't he have been attending classes since Sept? So if it's the school's decision to admit, why does the NCAA have to be involved? Now I agree there would be schools that would admit a 6'9" illiterate from one of the lost tribes of the Amazon if he could score, but eventually he would fail. Is this what they're trying to protect against?

Wall and Cody aren't similar situations. Cody is trying to get cleared academically, Wall already was. Wall's situation involves them suddenly getting information regarding his amateur status due to his AAU coach being a certified agent and because Wall was provided illegal benefits during recruiting visits.