Is it just me or was that last dunk completely crass

[brianstl]

Why care?

We won by double digits. It was a nice dunk to watch. It would have been low class if he did it with the Dukes up by ten at that point in the game, but I have no problem with with the dunk tonight.

[Quality Is Job 1]

Hicks, you're a demagogue. You constantly pick on people about petty grammatical mistakes on an internet board. You sanctimoniously argue many of your points even when the other side of the argument is at the game and you aren't.

Your baseball analogy is ridiculous, because baseball doesn't have a clock. Games are never "over." See also: Roger Freed, circa 1980.

The Willie Reed analogy is also ridiculous. If Willie found himself "under the basket," then THE GAME HADN'T STOPPED BEING PLAYED. And certainly, no Billiken players HAD LEFT THE COURT. Did you see the Duquesne player walk into the backcourt from your vaunted TV perch?

Finally, you're the one who justified a deliberate attempt to injure Kwamain (again, when the game was decided) based on "competitiveness." Did you see the Mizzou-Baylor game? Did you see English get fouled at the end? Not even close to as egregious as the play on Kwamain, and it was called an intentional foul (as any hit from behind on a breakaway should be) -- and it very well could have affected the outcome of the game (as an intentional foul) if Mizzou could have finished.

"NEXT."

"Demagogue: a political leader who seeks support by appealing to popular desires and prejudices rather than by using rational argument." I'm doing the exact opposite. I'm going against the popular opinion, and I am using a rational argument. You just disagree.

I rarely discuss grammatical matters on this board and let the vast majority of the ones I see go without comment.

I didn't see Duquesne players leaving the court early, but what does that have to do with the player who didn't?

The foul in the Southern Illinois game: I just disagree that the Saluki player was trying to injure Mitchell. Perhaps that's another example of SLU fans supposedly wanting big-time hoops but then wanting everyone to be nice. Also, I have no control over how the officials called a foul in the Bills game or in the Mizzou game.

[Quality Is Job 1]

Why care?

We won by double digits. It was a nice dunk to watch. It would have been low class if he did it with the Dukes up by ten at that point in the game, but I have no problem with with the dunk tonight.

Exactly. (Another person who gets it.)

[Quality Is Job 1]

I completely agree that this was not appropriate... and not sure why you are attacking billikens fans for having high integrity around how to play the game?

I think it IS integrity to keep playing until the buzzer sounds.

[slufan13]

speaking of that dunk................you know what would be sweet??????? if slu beat temple on wednesday

[MB73]

Why should they say something to him??? Do they want their players to just roll over? Compete until the buzzer sounds! Duquesne is not the kind of team to just quit.

Put it this way: If the Cardinals are playing the Pirates in Pittsburgh and trailing 12-1 with two outs and the bases empty, are you going to get ticked off because Albert Pujols hits a home run? Should he TRY to strike out or make an out?

No wonder Bernie Miklasz frequently puts Billikens fans down: many of them want high-major basketball to be like youth leagues!

Duquesne had clearly gone into the "game over" mode, no fouls, down by 12, a few seconds left.

One Duq player even walked off the court, others were walking away, head down.

Happens at the end of most games.

KM lets his guard down, thinks the Duq player has some class.

Wrong.

The ******, who was playing possum, steals the ball and slams it home.

Classless.

Sportsmanship? I think not.

Original poster here: correct!

So called moderator: wrong again.

[NH]

"Demagogue: a political leader who seeks support by appealing to popular desires and prejudices rather than by using rational argument." I'm doing the exact opposite. I'm going against the popular opinion, and I am using a rational argument. You just disagree.

I rarely discuss grammatical matters on this board and let the vast majority of the ones I see go without comment.

I didn't see Duquesne players leaving the court early, but what does that have to do with the player who didn't?

The foul in the Southern Illinois game: I just disagree that the Saluki player was trying to injure Mitchell. Perhaps that's another example of SLU fans supposedly wanting big-time hoops but then wanting everyone to be nice. Also, I have no control over how the officials called a foul in the Bills game or in the Mizzou game.

1) I would say you more than rarely argue grammer.

2) Good point. I applaud Saunders for continuing to play even when his teammates had quit.

3) The biggest difference in the SIU situation vs. Duquesne is that Bocot could have hurt Mitchell. Saunders dunk didn't hurt anyone.

[bonwich]

"Demagogue: a political leader who seeks support by appealing to popular desires and prejudices rather than by using rational argument." I'm doing the exact opposite. I'm going against the popular opinion, and I am using a rational argument. You just disagree.

I rarely discuss grammatical matters on this board and let the vast majority of the ones I see go without comment.

I didn't see Duquesne players leaving the court early, but what does that have to do with the player who didn't?

The foul in the Southern Illinois game: I just disagree that the Saluki player was trying to injure Mitchell. Perhaps that's another example of SLU fans supposedly wanting big-time hoops but then wanting everyone to be nice. Also, I have no control over how the officials called a foul in the Bills game or in the Mizzou game.

Hicks, your memory is selective. You're the prime offender of citing petty spelling, usage and grammatical mistakes.

And you also conveniently forgot your primary argument from one of your initial posts: "Duquesne is not the kind of team (italics added) to just quit." THAT'S what it has to do with the player who didn't.

"Big-time hoops"? The Big 12 isn't "big time"? Baylor wasn't "nice," and they got called for an intentional foul, the way the rules intend for it to be called. And of course you, or I, or Roy, or anyone else on this board doesn't have any control over fouls are called. But, as fans, we can desire consistency.

Something else I don't know: I don't know if Coach would have reprimanded a Billiken player for a spinning tomahawk dunk on an opposing floor when a game was out of reach. But I'll lay odds he would, just as he threatened to forfeit when a single one of our fans (at least we think it was one of our fans) got out of hand and tossed something on the floor, either intentionally or unintentionally. I do know damned well that he would have sat down for at least a half, if not a full game, any player who walked off the court well before the buzzer sounded.

The initial post was about class, and Duquesne lacked it, as does defending their classlessness.

[Quality Is Job 1]

Duquesne had clearly gone into the "game over" mode, no fouls, down by 12, a few seconds left.

One Duq player even walked off the court, others were walking away, head down.

Happens at the end of most games.

KM lets his guard down, thinks the Duq player has some class.

Wrong.

The ******, who was playing possum, steals the ball and slams it home.

Classless.

Sportsmanship? I think not.

Original poster here: correct!

So called moderator: wrong again.

So having an opinion different from yours makes me not really a moderator? You're wrong — again.

[brianstl]

Duquesne had clearly gone into the "game over" mode, no fouls, down by 12, a few seconds left.

One Duq player even walked off the court, others were walking away, head down.

Happens at the end of most games.

KM lets his guard down, thinks the Duq player has some class.

Wrong.

The ******, who was playing possum, steals the ball and slams it home.

Classless.

Sportsmanship? I think not.

Original poster here: correct!

So called moderator: wrong again.

Was it classless of Kyle to take a 3 pt shot up by 12 with 19 seconds left?

[Bill_Ken R]

My immediate reaction was that it made the player look foolish and his coaches obviously thought so too. Upon reflection I think the player looked foolish.

[NH]

Was it classless of Kyle to take a 3 pt shot up by 12 with 19 seconds left?

or for Kwamain to grab the offensive rebound off of the three.

[Quality Is Job 1]

Hicks, your memory is selective. You're the prime offender of citing petty spelling, usage and grammatical mistakes.

And you also conveniently forgot your primary argument from one of your initial posts: "Duquesne is not the kind of team (italics added) to just quit." THAT'S what it has to do with the player who didn't.

"Big-time hoops"? The Big 12 isn't "big time"? Baylor wasn't "nice," and they got called for an intentional foul, the way the rules intend for it to be called. And of course you, or I, or Roy, or anyone else on this board doesn't have any control over fouls are called. But, as fans, we can desire consistency.

Something else I don't know: I don't know if Coach would have reprimanded a Billiken player for a spinning tomahawk dunk on an opposing floor when a game was out of reach. But I'll lay odds he would, just as he threatened to forfeit when a single one of our fans (at least we think it was one of our fans) got out of hand and tossed something on the floor, either intentionally or unintentionally. I do know damned well that he would have sat down for at least a half, if not a full game, any player who walked off the court well before the buzzer sounded.

The initial post was about class, and Duquesne lacked it, as does defending their classlessness.

Sigh! Whatever! I must harp on grammar a lot!

Answer one question for me, please. Did you have any drinks at the game? If so, how much did you drink?

I'm not defending classlessness, because it wasn't classless. I will agree that any Duquesne players leaving the court prior to the final buzzer lacked class.

[RUBillsFan]

Was it classless of Kyle to take a 3 pt shot up by 12 with 19 seconds left?

No. The shot clock was about to run out. This is a pretty stupid argument. I think the showboat dunk made the player look kinda stupid because his team had basically lost on the road and he is showboating, but in the end who cares. The Billikens won. Bring on Temple.

[bk18]

All my coaches have always taught me that if the game is already decided and there isn't much time left on the clock, don't shoot at all - whether you are winning or losing.

Its not about a sense of class or professionalism. Its about caring whole heartedly about the letter result (W or L) and not the stats or score.

If you win and you do that, its like saying we won, but I wish I had more points or I wish we won by 2 more points. It makes you look like a selfish idiot. Shows you got your heart and soul into the team's record when you drop the ball to the floor when there's a few seconds on the clock and you are right next to the hoop. Your energy is better spent looking ahead at the next game instead of trying to add 2 more points.

If you are losing and you do it, it shows you don't care as much about how the team does as much as you do. It shows a really selfish attitude, especially when you try to hot dog it like the duquesne player did.

If I were his coach I'd make him do the 5 second dunk drill at the next practice - coach blows the whistle every 5 seconds and the player has to dunk the ball before the next whistle blow. Unless you are really tall, fatigue sets in after a minute and dunking becomes super hard. Your calves lose a lot of strength and you fatigue from having to shag the ball so quickly. I bet that player couldn't last 2 minutes. It strips a lot of power and ego from the player and leaves them with a sense of humility.

[Quality Is Job 1]

Was it classless of Kyle to take a 3 pt shot up by 12 with 19 seconds left?

or for Kwamain to grab the offensive rebound off of the three.

The shot clock was about to expire. No one could fault taking a shot. You don't just take a violation, do you?

[MB73]

Was it classless of Kyle to take a 3 pt shot up by 12 with 19 seconds left?

IMO no, shot clock was expiring.

[brianstl]

No. The shot clock was about to run out. This is a pretty stupid argument. I think the showboat dunk made the player look kinda stupid because his team had basically lost on the road and he is showboating, but in the end who cares. The Billikens won. Bring on Temple.

I think it would have been classless if he did it with his team up by 12 at that point. With his team down I don't have a problem with it. It was the best dunk we have seen this year.

[Quality Is Job 1]

I think it would have been classless if he did it with his team up by 12 at that point. With his team down I don't have a problem with it. It was the best dunk we have seen this year.

Better than the dunk where the kid wrenched his shoulder on it?

[bonwich]

Was it classless of Kyle to take a 3 pt shot up by 12 with 19 seconds left?

With 7 seconds left on the shot clock? Unless you feel like Rick would have been happy with them just passing back and forth until the shot clock expired, I think the 3 was as classy as any play we could have pulled. And since everyone was still contesting the rebound, then Kwamain and the rest of the team had an obligation to play on.

I'd love to see the tape, but I'd even be willing to bet that a few of the "classier" Duquesne players were already shaking hands by the time the dunk took place.

Note: I don't condone Kwamain's brain fart with four seconds left. I do, however, believe there's a code of honor at the end of a game, and we kept it, and Duquesne didn't.

[NH]

I think it would have been classless if he did it with his team up by 12 at that point. With his team down I don't have a problem with it. It was the best dunk we have seen this year.

We payed full ticket prices didnt we? Saunders gave us our money's worth. Like I said earlier, it sucks that KM had to get the turnover. If we are down 12 and WIllie steals the ball and dunks it, I wont be upset.

[GoBills]

I disagree.

Billikens fans: "We're old enough to drink and curse at basketball games!! Hey, that guy dunked on us at the end of a game even though they couldn't win! Waaaah! Mom!"

Well and I disagree with you. BTW, nice job to completely twist what I said. I have no problem with the guy dunking, it was the way in which he did it that invites ridicule. Doing it with authority in the waning seconds when your team has gotten thumped, in my opinion just makes you look stupid. The same way when you see some football players thumping their chests in the fourth quarter for simply making a tackle when their team is down by four touchdowns. It just makes you look foolish. Just curious, what in the world are yout talking about Billiken fans drinking and curisng? Perhaps you should put down the bottle and get some sleep.

[MB73]

So having an opinion different from yours makes me not really a moderator? You're wrong — again.

The issue here is that you are a moderator but you always stirr up crappola... multiple posts, potshots galore..

You even cited Bernie's cynical opinion of Billiken fans to support your so called "point".

Give it a rest.

(Hey, you proved you do not know baseball, either. Proper analogy would have involved stealing a base.)

[bonwich]

With 7 seconds left on the shot clock? Unless you feel like Rick would have been happy with them just passing back and forth until the shot clock expired, I think the 3 was as classy as any play we could have pulled. And since everyone was still contesting the rebound, then Kwamain and the rest of the team had an obligation to play on.

I'd love to see the tape, but I'd even be willing to bet that a few of the "classier" Duquesne players were already shaking hands by the time the dunk took place.

Note: I don't condone Kwamain's brain fart with four seconds left. I do, however, believe there's a code of honor at the end of a game, and we kept it, and Duquesne didn't.

Geez, look, Hicks and I just started to agree. I'm going to quit while we're ahead, wish Hicks and everyone else a good night and sweet dreams after a Billiken victory, and go have nightmares about having chosen Wednesdays as my class night.

[Quality Is Job 1]

We payed full ticket prices didnt we? Saunders gave us our money's worth. Like I said earlier, it sucks that KM had to get the turnover. If we are down 12 and WIllie steals the ball and dunks it, I wont be upset.

Another poster who gets it.

I'm adding a poll to this post.