Okay, Where from Here?

[slufanskip]

Not every coach promises recruits that they'll schedule a series against a team in or near their home towns.

(How did you manage to capitalize Purdue?)

He capitalized it out of respect for their chicken.

[Clock_Tower]

I'm still trying to figure out why Roy thinks our non-conference record led to false expectations for people. If anything, our 3-3 record in the A-10 has been better than what people thought we'd be given 4 of the first 6 were on the road.

As to the alternating of MSU and SIU....that may sound great but there is no way either of them will agree because it would effectively be skipping one of their home games so it seems unlikely to me unless we plan on not playing one of them next year.

I think Roy's constant harping on the scheduling is tiring and I realy don't have a huge problem the last two years given the youth of this team. I also think his belief that all we have to do is call up the Kentuckys of the world and they'll gladly accept a home and home is ridiculous.

That being said, I do believe that next year we need to challenge ourselves much more during the non-con. If you want to be an at-large candidate we need to play a tough schedule that can't be solely based on a couple games in Cancun. If you lose those you are up a creek. We can still have 5 or so buy games but we need to play about 9 games against BCS or mid-major teams. This year we played only 7 of those and went 2-5. Next year we need to go 7-2 to be in position for an at-large.

Good points. Along these lines, if the NCAA goes to 96 teams, it won't necessarily be the top 96 teams - just like it's not the top 64/65 teams now. Depending upon the year, the Tourney now is supposed to be the top 45 or so teams. With 96 teams, the Tourney then would probably result in the top 85 or so teams. With an RPI betweeen 120 and 150, we still have a long way to go. Improved play AND scheduling will both be required.

Maybe, just maybe, the BCS schools won't feel like ther margin for error is so small OOC and maybe just maybe the BCS schools will play their regional mid-major schools knowing that a .500 BCS conference record alone will probably get them in the Field of 96. Yes, first round bye games and seedings are still important but .... maybe just wishful thinking on my part.

[kevinfootes]

that is a great move getting the siu and missouri state games alternating.

bruce weber actually has balls and some integrity so that doesnt surprise me.

If Illinois comes to Chaifetz I'll agree with you. While I'd certainly like to play them, I won't be too excited about a neutral site game and a trip to Champaign. When was the last time the Illini had the stones to play a true road game against us? Hasn't it been more than 30 or 35 years?

[billiken_roy]

I'm still trying to figure out why Roy thinks our non-conference record led to false expectations for people. If anything, our 3-3 record in the A-10 has been better than what people thought we'd be given 4 of the first 6 were on the road.

As to the alternating of MSU and SIU....that may sound great but there is no way either of them will agree because it would effectively be skipping one of their home games so it seems unlikely to me unless we plan on not playing one of them next year.

I think Roy's constant harping on the scheduling is tiring and I realy don't have a huge problem the last two years given the youth of this team. I also think his belief that all we have to do is call up the Kentuckys of the world and they'll gladly accept a home and home is ridiculous.

That being said, I do believe that next year we need to challenge ourselves much more during the non-con. If you want to be an at-large candidate we need to play a tough schedule that can't be solely based on a couple games in Cancun. If you lose those you are up a creek. We can still have 5 or so buy games but we need to play about 9 games against BCS or mid-major teams. This year we played only 7 of those and went 2-5. Next year we need to go 7-2 to be in position for an at-large.

i never said all we have to do is call up kentucky and they will play, but i am wondering out loud why spoon, romar and soderberg programs had no problem getting a game or two every year of that magnitude and now it is deemed impossible.

if you dont think we had false expectations due to the pre conference schedule, why dont you go back to the general feeling of the board right before the bowling green game and reread.

as to your not having a problem with our schedule the last two years, i am sorry you think our team isnt as worthy to take ona tougher schedule made up of mid majors.

personally i say you take the 8 games knnesaw (264) miss valley st (330) umkc (301) semo (283) umkc (301) rockhurst st ambrose and ark ft smith, pick two exhibits between rock st a and ft smith, and pick two of the buys, and then pick four from the likes of programs akin to this: utah (155) indiana st (90) san jose st (124) george mason (103) portland (91).

now are you going to tell me that programs of that ilk are too tough to play? if so, then screw it, throw in the frickin towel. while i know they will give us good games and maybe beat us (especially on the road) there is no reason to believe that is too tough. throw in a big time program someway somehow (look both rickma and biondi have the power. i refuse to believe they cant call in an old favor someway somehow) now you have a schedule. and if you have to play them home and away so be it. we know how they feel, we shouldnt be too good to recipricate with home game for them as well.

assuming we are competitive and maybe only lose one more game than what we did anyway playing teams from sesame street our rpi and sos would surely have gone up significantly, our players would have gotten a lot better competition and us as fans would have gotten a hell of a higher level of basketball to watch in november and december.

[kshoe]

Good points. Along these lines, if the NCAA goes to 96 teams, it won't necessarily be the top 96 teams - just like it's not the top 64/65 teams now. Depending upon the year, the Tourney now is supposed to be the top 45 or so teams. With 96 teams, the Tourney then would probably result in the top 85 or so teams. With an RPI betweeen 120 and 150, we still have a long way to go. Improved play AND scheduling will both be required.

Maybe, just maybe, the BCS schools won't feel like ther margin for error is so small OOC and maybe just maybe the BCS schools will play their regional mid-major schools knowing that a .500 BCS conference record alone will probably get them in the Field of 96. Yes, first round bye games and seedings are still important but .... maybe just wishful thinking on my part.

Unfortunately, I could see it being wishful thinking on your part because the BCS schools could now say, "we don't have to play anyone in Non-con and as long as we get near .500 in conference we'll have an RPI in the 50-60 range". Given the option of hosting a bunch of buy games and the large payouts that come from season ticket holders for each extra game they will choose more buy games instead of a few road games. Right now, the only motivations some of these teams have to leave home is t.v. and the RPI threat of only playing a bunch of bad teams at home. It will be interesting to see how it all shakes out.

[kshoe]

i never said all we have to do is call up kentucky and they will play, but i am wondering out loud why spoon, romar and soderberg programs had no problem getting a game or two every year of that magnitude and now it is deemed impossible.

if you dont think we had false expectations due to the pre conference schedule, why dont you go back to the general feeling of the board right before the bowling green game and reread.

as to your not having a problem with our schedule the last two years, i am sorry you think our team isnt as worthy to take ona tougher schedule made up of mid majors.

personally i say you take the 8 games knnesaw (264) miss valley st (330) umkc (301) semo (283) umkc (301) rockhurst st ambrose and ark ft smith, pick two exhibits between rock st a and ft smith, and pick two of the buys, and then pick four from the likes of programs akin to this: utah (155) indiana st (90) san jose st (124) george mason (103) portland (91).

now are you going to tell me that programs of that ilk are too tough to play? if so, then screw it, throw in the frickin towel. while i know they will give us good games and maybe beat us (especially on the road) there is no reason to believe that is too tough. throw in a big time program someway somehow (look both rickma and biondi have the power. i refuse to believe they cant call in an old favor someway somehow) now you have a schedule. and if you have to play them home and away so be it. we know how they feel, we shouldnt be too good to recipricate with home game for them as well.

assuming we are competitive and maybe only lose one more game than what we did anyway playing teams from sesame street our rpi and sos would surely have gone up significantly, our players would have gotten a lot better competition and us as fans would have gotten a hell of a higher level of basketball to watch in november and december.

Roy, we were 2-5 this year in non-conference games against real opponents. I guess its fun to suggest we could play 4 similar non-con opponents to those we went 2-5 against (2 at home and 2 on the road) and we would magically maybe only lose one of those games. What color is the sky in your world? 2-2 is what I would expect and that would not meaningfully have improved or hurt our RPI.

Lastly, how many road non-conference games did you watch this year? Georgia was the only one I saw because it was the only one on t.v. Your comment about us fans getting "a hell of a higher level of basketball to WATCH in november and december" isn't ringing true to me. At least when we play a crap team at home I get so SEE them play.

[kevinfootes]

i never said all we have to do is call up kentucky and they will play, but i am wondering out loud why spoon, romar and soderberg programs had no problem getting a game or two every year of that magnitude and now it is deemed impossible.

roy, spoon, romar, and sodie coached us when we were in a much better conference. It's easier to get those games when you're in a conference like GM/CUSA. The A10 is much improved this year, but has been down for a few seasons before that.

[Cowboy]

Cowboy. With all due respect, your expectations for SLU must be quite low. This year's OOC schedule is aweful.

What is a marque game? Well, to quote J. Potter Stewart, "I know it when I see it." And this year, I don't see it.

Here's a good way to define a marque game: Act like you are giving away (there is no second hand market for SLU tickets) 2 tickets to a SLU OOC game. Or, act you are considering donating two (2) tickets to a SLU OOC game to a charity auction. You know these tickets are not likely to necessarily be going to a hard-care SLU fan or a SLU student or alumni. Instead, you know they are likely to go to a "general St. Louis sports fan." Then, when this general St. Louis Sports fan, responds, "Who is SLU playing?" you then fill in the names of our OOC teams this year. My take is that there would be little interest.

The only saving grace for this year is that we played both MO State and SIUC here at home. Add to that, Nebraska which, of course, is more known for its football than its basketball - but at least it is a BCS school that general sports fans are aware of. Other than that, there are no other OOC home games anywhere close to a "marque game" - and frankly - I wouldn't consider any of them to be a marque game anyway. Is UNC a marque game? Of course. Other teams would be Marquette, ND, GTown, Cincy, Louisville and most of the other Big East teams, Indiana, Purdue, Illini or most of the other Big 10, UCLA, USC, Washington and most other PAC 10 schools. While Gonzaga would be a marque game, schools of interest would include the likes St. Mary's, Santa Clara, Butler, Creighton or Tulsa. I am not expecting UNC every year. Instead of a neutral court, had we played ND and Iowa State at home, it would be a really good home OOC schedule.

Maybe next year things will be different. Maybe RM believes he needed these teams for the youngest team in the NCAA. When you consider we play the better A10 teams at home, when you consider we played both MO State and SIUC at home. When you consider NE at least is a BCS team. When you consider we played a marque team - ND - on a neutral court along with Iowa State (similar but better than NE), this season is tolerable. Next year - and the years after - we need to play AT HOME teams like Boston College, ND, etc.

-so this season's schedule is tolerable, i will call it appropriate and i think we end up in the same boat

-why are my expectations low? because i think with the lack of experience this yr's team has our non conf schedule was appropriate?

-if the schedule was inappropriate wouldn't we have been unbeaten and had a 20 point margin of victory?

-i did not want to throw our guys into the mixer much this year, i am satisfied with this schedule

-i also said that i hope next yr's schedule is improved as i beleive the team should be

-it has been reported that we had a VERBAL agreement with BC to continue the series, fellow jesuit school, we win the game, we call them to continue the series and they say no thanks. that is a pisser

[Pick and Roll]

arkansas fort smith, st ambrose, semo, kennesaw state, mississippi valley state, rockhurst, umkc, eastern. 8 games. of course three are "exhibitions" (most programs only play 2). two more of these eight would have been sufficient. and i would prefer area teams. so we should have picked say st ambrose and rockhurst as our exhibitions, and then played two of semo, umkc and eastern illinois.

sure mississippi valley delta state college and judge kennesaw landis state school were part of the "tourney". but one or the other, play the stupid tourney set up to get your buys or play a couple of buy games. we dont need all of them.

had we taken four of these games and played 4 more 120ish rpi games and won all four, it would be interesting to know where our rpi and sos would be in comparison to what we got now. and for those of you worried we might have lost a game or two then, i say first, i guess i got more confidence in my billikens and second even so, a good game vs the likes of belmont or siu or missouri state is worth a hell of a lot more in evaluating what we got then those buy game opponents and a hell of a lot more entertaining imo.

well i remember the sky indeed was falling after chicago/georgia, but then we had our gimmees again and life was all rainbows and butterflys again and we were headed to the final four.

I was referring to the games after ND/Iowa State as you were, therefore only Rockhurst, UMKC and EIU are in the conversation. These three are area teams in my opinion. Granted, the KS and MVU games were part of the tourney which allowed us to play ND and Iowa State. You have to take the good with the bad in this situation.

I guess you think this team is a lot better than it is. If we were to play 120ish RPI teams we would have lost most of them, or at least half of them, especially early in the season. We were not that good. We are not that good now. I don't think getting beat down, especially early in the season much less early in the career of these guys, is the best thing for our team. Think about how the GW loss was for our team last week, can you imagine a season-long string of these games (and the meltdowns to follow). That is not what I would wish for our team.

I am afraid the viewing entertainment of the fans was pretty low on the list of priorities in making the schedule this year. What's best for the development of the team does not always coincide with what's fun to watch. I do believe as the team gets better the schedule should get more challenging proportionate to our anticipated progression.

The future is bright but it will take some time to get there.

[billiken_roy]

I guess you think this team is a lot better than it is. If we were to play 120ish RPI teams we would have lost most of them, or at least half of them, especially early in the season. We were not that good. We are not that good now. I don't think getting beat down, especially early in the season much less early in the career of these guys, is the best thing for our team. Think about how the GW loss was for our team last week, can you imagine a season-long string of these games (and the meltdowns to follow). That is not what I would wish for our team.

I am afraid the viewing entertainment of the fans was pretty low on the list of priorities in making the schedule this year. What's best for the development of the team does not always coincide with what's fun to watch. I do believe as the team gets better the schedule should get more challenging proportionate to our anticipated progression.

The future is bright but it will take some time to get there.

i am sorry you think we cant compete with 120ish rpi teams. yes i think we are much better than that and would beat most at home and some on the road. if we arent good enough to do that, we need a hell of a lot more than just time to ever be a good team.

that said considering the cost of season tickets and the mandatory billiken gifts, you are extremely generous to be so patient if you think the team is this bad. so i do think you are a hell of a fan if that makes you feel any better.

[GOSLU68]

i am sorry you think we cant compete with 120ish rpi teams. yes i think we are much better than that and would beat most at home and some on the road. if we arent good enough to do that, we need a hell of a lot more than just time to ever be a good team.

that said considering the cost of season tickets and the mandatory billiken gifts, you are extremely generous to be so patient if you think the team is this bad. so i do think you are a hell of a fan if that makes you feel any better.

I think we are barely competitive in the A10-we can make it tough for any visiting team and we may not show up if we travel. RM

has to really hate being on the road with a a team that forgets everything once they leave town. I hope he installs a new plan for

"we are ahead by 10-15 points and there are 8 minutes left in the game and instead of milking the lead down to KM taking the final

shot to see if we win how about we continue to try and outscore the other guys for 5 more minutes and run the score up to our

advantage by 20?"

[bsheldon]

"we are ahead by 10-15 points and there are 8 minutes left in the game and instead of milking the lead down to KM taking the final

shot to see if we win how about we continue to try and outscore the other guys for 5 more minutes and run the score up to our

advantage by 20?"

Gos--excellent quote.

In the GW game in particular we allowed them to push us out further and further away from the basket as we initiated the Offense. This just lead to us passing the ball around on the perimetr for 30 seconds and then heaving up a prayer as the shot clock expires. Once maybe even twice is forgiveable, but they had to do it what seemed like 10 times in a row.

We will learn to put teams away and how to win games as we mature. Hopefully we pull out a couple of upsets in the coming the weeks (brutal stretch of the schedule) and finish strong in Conference Tourney. I'm already excited about next year.

[Pick and Roll]

i am sorry you think we cant compete with 120ish rpi teams. yes i think we are much better than that and would beat most at home and some on the road. if we arent good enough to do that, we need a hell of a lot more than just time to ever be a good team.

that said considering the cost of season tickets and the mandatory billiken gifts, you are extremely generous to be so patient if you think the team is this bad. so i do think you are a hell of a fan if that makes you feel any better.

Thank you!