Family Arena and other kicks.

[Taj79]

The thread entitled "Family Arena Dates" and some of the conversations occurring in there shows me why this program faces the problems that it does.

If dates at the Family Arena are a "power play" or some other ruse by the SLU administration to further their "plight" and get a school arena built, so what? Its not like its the first time its been used in the context of mankind. Is it right? I am not in a position to offer ultimate judgement but my opinion right now is that its not. Ten years or so ago Biondi said he wants to be a "top 50" program. Two years ago he pledged to build our own arena. Last year we got a new athletic director who's main goals were wrappe dup in boht Biondi statements. In a world where action speaks louder than words, what kind of volumes are being written here?

The calls that identify the program as "small time" seem to strike a resonant chord here. It is stuff like this that makes the elite players not even cast a glance our way. And it is amplified by our inability to win with any consistency. To be vagabonds within our own city and so on seesm to me to be another negative that must be righted in the overall turnaround of the program. We might get looks from a Ben Hansborough and a Troy Robertson and a Johnnie Parker Jr. and a Monroe Douglas Jr and Jesse Leonard's kid or some other associated legacy, but it is rare that these kids come and play. We have a chance with some locals of local repute ... the Hughes, the Liddells, the Claggetts, the Grays and Lischs ... but we have to seal those deals and then succeed with them in order to advance the state of the overall program. Hughes is long gone. So too are Claggs and Gray. Was the program sustained over their successes and subsequent graduation? I'd say no. We are rebuilding once again in that I've lost count over the number of times we've rebuilt. I want reload, restock, adjust ..... not rebuild.

It sounds like to me, we on this board are the ghetto neighborhood of the SLU alumni base. I can't fund the arena .. neither can nark, or roy, or skip, or boxer, or 72, or Schaz ... A lot of you guys are in better standing with the school based on your claimed donations and all but while that elevates you certainly above me, it is not the upper crust level of the alums that a Biondi among others would appeal to. And if big donors are the ones that get involved in small things like renaming a girls dance troupe, we are indeed small time potatoes.

Roy, for one, has argued long and hard against moving out of the creature comforts that are Savvis and into a typical college arena. I disagree withthat and agree with the masoleum references but respect his concerns. Bonwich has argued against the move for monetary reasons. I disagree but he has many good points. Kshoe and kwijybo and others disagree about the home court advantage that I think we'd get at ahomeof our own. But then we see arguments about driving 30 or so extra miles to Strip Mall H*ll for a game and it becomes a real question in my mind what kind of supporters we really are. St. Charles? In old days living at the then-end of Page Avenue, St. Charles would have been a plus as opposed to my driving downtown. But I'm an idiot, I went to see the women's soccer team at Princeton from here (Baltimore) a few years ago. This year, I am in for any games at LaSalle, St. Joe's, and GeeDub and do not believe Richmond, Fordham or Duquesne to be that far out of my reach. When you consider that the shortest (one-way) trip there is about 70 miles to Philly, the Strip Mall H*ll argument don't play in these parts.

We seem to have a disinterested upper crust base, a disinterested student fan base, and a passionate yet financially-challenged mid- to lower-class fan base screaming for changes and better results but not in much of a position to empower those changes and results.

[billiken_roy]

nm

[slu72]

Taj Mahal '79, you are "da man". Think you've nailed the state of the program in one fine post. The only thing you left out was a comparison to our fellow Jesuit institutions, if places like X, Gonzaga, BC have year in and year out success why can't SLU? If the powers that be were serious about making us a top 50 nationally recognized program we'd have done it by now. Spoon started something that wasn't sustained. And what's really maddening is SLU out of all the Jesuit institutes in the country is in the best position to really make us a headline program. We've got no professional hoops to compete against and no other major program to compete against for the area's "subway" alumni, eg UC vs X, St.Joes vs Villanova, Penn, etc. We are the only show in town and College hoops has proven year in and year out it's one of the finest shows going.

[StLouBlue]

Great post, a lot of good stuff in there. As far as not being able to reload, I blame this on the fact that every 4 years we are hiring a new coach. I hope with Brad here for the long term(at least it seems that way), we will be reloading and not rebuilding. Stability is a must in order to build a program that consistantly wins and I think Brad is building the foundation with all of our young talent on hand.

Playing the games at Family Arena raises a lot of questions for me and it sounds like with much of the board. I think the games could be a success but SLU will have to sell it as an "event", something to pull in people. I have a feeling this probably won't happen and there will be about 3000-4000 at the game though.

As far as our fan base, I think most of it is sitting at home waiting for the team to start winning and bringing back the excitement of the Clagget/Highmark and Hughes years. Even with our season ticket base at a decent number--when compared to similar schools, our no-shows seem to be very high. I know a lot of pressure is being put on this freshman class already, but I hope they and the sophomores are able to bring back that excitement.

[cheeseman]

Ok - first of all, there will be more than 3-4000 people at the games at the FA - the season ticket base is more than that. Second, those of you complaining about the two games and creating all the conspiracy theories are simply whining about nothing - it is only 2 games for goodness sakes not the whole season. Third, some of you may not have any big money to give but that is what that matching donation was all about - give $50 and it will be equal to 100. I know that does not sound like much but every dollar counts - remember the arch was helped paid for by collecting pennies at the local grade schools in the area for those of you who don't remember or were too young to know. Fourth, you all can not have it both ways - a big time program with no money costs to the fans. I think SLU has done remarkably well given the resources it has had - now it is time to step up by both the school and its fans. Finally, it seems like all of you were bitching about the need for a home arena and what small time SLU was for not stepping up and making it happen - now that it is close to a reality you are now bitching about that. What is with you guys? - it is almost like you are going through the change.

[billiken_roy]

while we cant have it both ways, there is no reason we have to blindly throw money at the school either. we deserve to know the plan. the whole plan. not just bits and pieces and a "by the way, now you have to send more money".

you can say it is only two games, but why are we finding out about it via the grapevine only days before season tix are due? i think a class organization would have disclosed that upfront.

sorry, this reaks of either total disorganized chaos or else pure panhandling conmen. let me know which one or both we now are.

[Billiken Rich]

OK Cheeseman. Ok. Those of us on this side of those godforsaken bridges don't like going over them. Not at noon and most definately not in the evening commuter hell. Sorry to sound whiny to you but there it is. It is piss poor planning, bush league bs, and small time garbage, and a not ready for prime time, boneheaded move that is causing this. A season ticket holder lottery for a retro game at West Pine makes more sense

[billiken_roy]

i like the west pine idea better as well. make it an exclusive event that is served up to just the high rollers complete with lavish meal and after game party.

[Box and Won]

That would be so cool!

Georgetown did something like that during the NIT last year, but I think their on-campus facility is quite a bit bigger than WPG.

[StLouBlue]

The one date that someone through out is for 11/22, this is the Tuesday before Thanksgiving. I would guess this will be one of the dogs on the schedule, Savannah State, IUPUI, etc type teams. While you say the attendance will be more than 3000-4000, I guess if this game is part of the season ticket package then tickets sold will be greater than this. If we count actual number of people that come to a game on a Tuesday night, 25 miles from our normal arena to see SLU play a bad opponent and also guessing SLUs normally great marketing, I think my guess on attendance won't be far off.

I agree that the price of SLU basketball will be going up with our new arena, that is why the next couple of seasons will be important to generate that excitement in the program where fans don't mind spending the money. I would guess PSL or minimum yearly donations will be required for the best seats, now if this is the best 3k seats or the best 5k or 7k, that is what people are waiting to hear about.

[Billiken Rich]

That has got to be the most beautifully redundant phrase I've ever seen. It is also acurate, which is strange............

[Billiken Rich]

Make it a lottery or everyone will be po'd. I'd love to see a really imtimate game like that. How about a cheering contest at the door....no scream...NO SEAT FOR YOU! Shimmy could be the seat nazi......or the new volleyball goddess.....

[cheeseman]

I am not saying how SLU has handled things are the best but without knowing the full story, it is hard to know what their options really were. The retro game sounds good and probably something that could have worked with a buy game. By the way, I have to cross a bridge to go to FA also but like I said only 2 games.

[billiken_roy]

as of today, the savvis website does not list any activities 11/14, 11/15, 11/21, 11/22 and 11/24-12/6.

[billiken_roy]

cheeseman said, "without knowing the full story, it is hard to know what their options really were."

that is a big part of the problem, we never seem to know what the full story is and what the options were. i guess we are just lemmings in the billiken world according to ms levick.

[StLouBlue]

Isn't the Gun's & Hose's boxing matches on the Wed before Thanksgiving every year? That would be 11/23. I don't know how much setup they would need though. If it is a question of a Monday game at Savis or a Tuesday game at Family, I would think most SLU fans and especially season ticketholders would want the Monday at Savis.

[billiken_roy]

we've seen them take down and set up for same day hockey billiken events before. cant believe that it requires longer to set up a boxing match.

[StLouBlue]

Boxing does have floor seating which might take longer to set up than a hockey game and as was mentioned I doubt the Savis is doing us any favors now since we won't be a tenat much longer--hopefully.

[cheeseman]

Good point about the floor seating - remember we agreed to move our game for the big fight last year.

[cheeseman]

Roy - you did not hear anything more when Woolard was here so don't blame Levick exclusively. Like I said, you don't hear anything out Columbia or Champagne either.

[tseugnekillib]

It continues to amaze me how individuals can declare something "dumb" or "poorly managed" without having facts or knowledge about the issues at hand. I'm confident that when, or if, we ever know all of the 2005-2006 scheduling hurdles, SLU's playing at the FA will make absolutely good sense.

My guess is that a start date for the on-campus arena will be announced before SLU publishes next year's schedule.

[Billiken Rich]

Anything that causes Billiken supporters to consider not going to a CONFERENCE GAME is idiotic and poorly planned. Sorry.

[billiken_roy]

i dont recall woolard ever being staffless.

i dont recall woolard ever having to move regular season games.

[Basketbill]

I would bet they would not use the basketball floor under a boxing event, to rather than take out the few seats and open the ice and they are done for the ice event, they would have to disassemble the ring, all the floor seats then put down the basketball floor. I bet it takes longer than you think.

[cheeseman]

BRich - why assume ticket holders will not go - I figure they will attend the conference game but as usual, maybe not go to the buy game.

Roy, Woolard probably did not have all his staff leave at once but given his poor marketing record - as pointed out by you several times - he also did not seem to hire the right people either. Once again - it is two games and all this gnashing of teeth is hard to believe. I still think it is Brad who is driving this move of the two games not Levick. Laurie is no fan of SLU so he is not going to cut us any slack - as I have said since Spoon was here - he was right we need our own arena and the sooner the better.