BLIKNS Posted December 27, 2004 Share Posted December 27, 2004 He`s a relatively strong 185-pond combo guard who fairly solidly (although some turnovers under pressure),finishes well and has quick feet on defense.His jump shot is pretty good in the 15- to 18 foot range but less reliable beyind that,and shhots better off the catch than off the dribble.Mid-major prospect signed with nearby SLU. Lisch not in their top 200.Liddell ranked #122. No new names mentioned in recruiting,but listed SLU and Washington (others not listed) for #155 Rashad Austin(6-7 pf from Etiwanda,CA)(LA area) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 27, 2004 Share Posted December 27, 2004 i wonder what game this expert watched of kevin's to come to his conclusions. because his words are not indicative of his high school career. other than claggett, i dont know of any area high school player that i have ever seen that shoots better off of the dribble. the range that this expert notes is crazy, who isnt less reliable further away? but the way it is written makes it appear he doesnt shoot the three well, he does. and the turnover note is just wrong as well. anyone that has seen althoff play knows that when the crusaders are being pressured or are in danger of losing, knows that kevin lisch will have the ball. if the turnover tendency was correct, would althoff be amongst the top teams kevin's entire career? wouldnt turnovers and losses go hand in hand if kevin has the ball all the time under pressure? now if this guy is upset that kevin has a couple of turnovers when he is being triple teamed, my question is "will he probably be triple teamed at slu?" if he is, that is great news for dwayne polk and tommie liddell since then no one will be guarding them. another good example of some expert upset that kevin didnt bother to show up at their presigious aau events over the summer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted December 27, 2004 Share Posted December 27, 2004 The only reason I even bother with the gurus is to see who area schools are recruiting. I rarely find their "evaluations" useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 27, 2004 Share Posted December 27, 2004 i agree 3 star. however, it is painfully true that these "experts" have an influence on the casual fan's belief of what the truth is. and of course that affects enthusiasm for the program which in turn affects ticket sales and fund raising etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted December 27, 2004 Share Posted December 27, 2004 "another good example of some expert upset that kevin didnt bother to show up at their presigious aau events over the summer." He also committed the sin of not signing with an elite team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted December 27, 2004 Share Posted December 27, 2004 I'm of the belief with the exception of the top 30 or so prepstars these guys don't know crapola about the rest of the kids. Who do you think they spend the most time evaluating? The future NBA'ers and those kids who signed with Duke, KY, etc. Unless they have a large staff that breaks down the games of around +1,000 kids they're blowing smoke. It's a little akin to the mags that forecast conference races. They do very little research on the also rans. How many times could prepstars have seen KL or TL, for that matter, play? Who gives a damn what his rap sheet looks like? Let him come to SLU and play like Broy and 3 star says he can. I trust their judgements alot more than some guy who is wined and dined by Nike at their summer camps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate Latsch Posted December 27, 2004 Share Posted December 27, 2004 My guess would be the Prepstars writer saw Lisch at the Shootout. I don't know who wrote that article, but I know Eric Bossi writes for Prepstars and I saw him at the Shootout. Most of the writers for those kind of sites don't get around much outside of bigger events -- like AAU tourneys, the Shootout, etc. -- so they only have a couple of chances to see someone like Lisch. Lisch's evaluation was probably based on his performance at the Marshall County HoopFest and the Shootout. Just trying to shed some light on how that stuff works. - Nate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 27, 2004 Share Posted December 27, 2004 the shootout would show some merit in his "report" i was to distraught after the hawaii game to make the drive to kentucky that day, but it is my understanding that kevin played pretty good at the marshall county event and outplayed minnoy there. clark francis and the bullyseye brothers both wrote very good reports of kevin after that game. i believe it was the first time that francis had seen him play. bullseye had seen kevin last year vs centralia in a game and had given him glowing reports then and after the kentucky matchup against nate minnoy. i urge all to go see kevin vs carbondale in his upcoming games vs them. carbondale is the best area team imo. with athletes galore and will test kevin by probably guarding him with rotating fresh players the entire games. the matchups are fri, jan 7 in carbondale and then again sat, feb 19 in belleville. that feb 19 game may decide the conference title as i suspect carbondale will have no losses coming to that game and althoff only losing the game in carbondale. or vice versa. i hope coach soderberg has feelers out for carbondale's inside player, manuel cass, who i see as a nice pf that could really develop into a nice player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted December 27, 2004 Share Posted December 27, 2004 Kevin was 2 for 14 from three between those two games (1 for 6 at Marshall County and 1 for 8 at the Savvis), thus the description of him being an inconsistent three point shooter. The fact that Kevin is shooting over 50% from three excluding those two games doesn't mean anything to the national gurus because they weren't at those other games. The fact that he shot over 40% from three the past three seasons doesn't mean anything either, for the same reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 27, 2004 Share Posted December 27, 2004 3 star, have you seen cass play? if so, what are your thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted December 27, 2004 Share Posted December 27, 2004 Nope, haven't seen Cass outside of the Shootout. I understand he plays for the Illinois Warriors, one of these programs were the AAU coach exerts a lot of influence over where his players go, so we have virtually no shot at Cass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 27, 2004 Share Posted December 27, 2004 i dont follow the aau teams enough to know that. but i have heard that larry butler has his hand out quite a bit. cross that one off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jalensdad2002 Posted December 28, 2004 Share Posted December 28, 2004 >i wonder what game this expert watched of kevin's to come to >his conclusions. because his words are not indicative of >his high school career. At the end of the day what does one expert's opinion really mean. I know I posted Bob Gibbon's evaluation of Tommie Liddell recently, but really their opinion's don't make players. I'll bet Kevin has had to prove himself everytime he has competed. I remember the first time I heard of him and I must be honest I didn't believe the hype. So I asked some of the East St Louis assistant coaches for an evaluation and they were in awe. Repeatedly mentioned how well conditioned Kevin was and how he played lock down defense. This is what matters to me, the respect of his peers. When the news broke about Tommie attending UNLV, his stock went through the roof. Hoopmasters begin listing Liddell as a 6'7 inch guard who nearly averaged a triple double in high school. Once he recommitted to SLU the shine slowly begin to shade. The same thing happen to Lisch statewide. ChicagoHoops has Lisch rated top 5 since his junior year, once he verbaled to SLU his ranking dropped to #15. What happened? Did his skills dramatically falter? No he simply signed with a non-glamorous college. That perception I hope should change during Kevin and Tommie's sophmore year. If I were you, B-Roy I would flood Kevin with every negative article I could find as I do with Liddell Sr or Jr. I never want Liddell to get complacent. I want him to always have something to prove. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jalensdad2002 Posted December 28, 2004 Share Posted December 28, 2004 "At the end of the day what does one expert's opinion really mean". To leave no doubt that I am a hypocrit, here is studentsports ranking(Scouts.com prep site). Look at who checks in at #81. Class of '05: Top 100 Hoop Recruits By SchoolSports Staff Date: Oct 14, 2004 Two years ago, you could pencil in LeBron James as the top player in the senior class and call it a day. Last year, there were only a few players worthy of consideration for the No. 1 spot. This year? Take your pick. But out of this crowded group of worthy contenders emerges high-flying South Gwinnett (Ga.) guard Louis Williams, our pick as the No. 1 player in the Class of 2005. With the high school basketball season rapidly approaching, SchoolSports.com unveils its preseason ranking of the nation's Top 100 hoop recruits in the Class of 2005. To get more information on the nation's top players, check out our new 2005 HS Hoops yearbook. Once again, SchoolSports and the Sporting News have combined forces on this annual preview which includes in-depth player rankings and analysis for the Class of 2005, 2006 and 2007, as well as national and regional team rankings and features on some of the top prep players in the country. The 2005 HS Hoops yearbook hits newsstands on October 26, but you can order your advance copy today . Class of 2005 Preseason Rankings 1. Louis Williams South Gwinnett (Snellville, Ga.) Shooting Guard, 6-0, 172 2. Richard Hendrix Athens (Ala.) Power Forward, 6-8, 257 3. Tyler Hansbrough Poplar Bluff (Mo.) Power Forward, 6-8, 224 4. Josh McRoberts Carmel (Ind.) Power Forward, 6-10, 231 5. Julian Wright Homewood-Flossmoor (Flossmoor, Ill.) Small Forward, 6-7, 214 6. Brandon Rush Mount Zion (Durham, N.C.) Small Forward, 6-6, 200 7. Martell Webster Seattle Prep Small Forward, 6-6, 236 8. Tasmin Mitchell Denham Springs (La.) Power Forward, 6-8, 235 9. Monta Ellis Lanier (Jackson, Miss.) Shooting Guard, 6-4, 175 10. Andray Blatche South Kent (Conn.) Prep Center, 6-11, 235 11. Gerald Green Gulf Shores Academy (Houston) Small Forward, 6-8, 195 12. Keith Brumbaugh DeLand (Fla.) Power Forward, 6-8, 197 13. Shawne Williams Laurinburg (N.C.) Prep Small Forward, 6-9, 228 14. Eric Devendorf Oak Hill Academy (Mouth of Wilson, Va.) Shooting Guard, 6-3, 180 15. Greg Paulus Christian Brothers Academy (Syracuse, N.Y.) Point Guard, 6-2, 185 16. Micah Downs Juanita (Kirkland, Wash.) Small Forward, 6-8, 190 17. C.J. Miles Skyline (Dallas) Small Forward, 6-5, 195 18. Mario Chalmers Bartlett (Anchorage, Alaska) Point Guard, 6-2, 175 19. Chris Douglas-Roberts Northwestern (Detroit) Point Guard, 6-4, 170 20. Amir Johnson Westchester (Los Angeles) Center, 6-11, 215 21. Mike Mercer South Gwinnett (Snellville, Ga.) Point Guard, 6-3, 168 22. Tyler Smith Giles County (Pulaski, Tenn.) Small Forward, 6-7, 225 23. Bobby Frasor Brother Rice (Chicago) Point Guard, 6-3, 180 24. Jon Brockman Snohomish (Wash.) Power Forward, 6-6, 246 25. Terrence Williams Rainier Beach (Seattle) Shooting Guard, 6-6, 220 26. Andrew Bynum St. Joseph’s (Metuchen, N.J.) Center, 6-11, 280 27. Marcus Williams Roosevelt (Seattle) Shooting Guard, 6-7, 195 28. Luke Zeller Washington (Ind.) Power Forward, 6-10, 223 29. Eric Boateng St. Andrew’s (Middletown, Del.) Center, 6-9, 230 30. Byron Eaton Lincoln (Dallas) Point Guard, 5-10, 200 31. Jamont Gordon Oak Hill Academy (Mouth of Wilson, Va.) Shooting Guard, 6-3, 215 32. Brandon Costner Seton Hall Prep (West Orange, N.J.) Small Forward, 6-9, 230 33. Tyrell Biggs Don Bosco Prep (Ramsey, N.J.) Power Forward, 6-8, 250 34. Kevin Rogers South Oak Cliff (Dallas) Power Forward, 6-7, 223 35. Korvotney Barber Manchester (Ga.) Power Forward, 6-7, 220 36. Davon Jefferson Lynwood (Calif.) Small Forward, 6-8, 205 37. Fendi Onobun Alief Taylor (Houston) Small Forward, 6-6, 224 38. Marcus Ginyard Bishop O’Connell (Arlington, Va.) Shooting Guard, 6-5, 195 39. Gary Flowers Lincoln (Dallas) Small Forward, 6-8, 210 40. Joe Krabbenhoft Roosevelt (Sioux Falls, S.D.) Small Forward, 6-7, 225 41. Theo Davis Cardozo (Bayside, N.Y.) Center, 6-10, 220 42. Leo Criswell Piper (Kansas City, Kan.) Power Forward, 6-8, 220 43. Rashad Woods Heritage Christian (Cleveland, Texas) Shooting Guard, 6-6, 210 44. Jamal Boykin Fairfax (Los Angeles) Power Forward, 6-6, 226 45. Danny Green St. Mary’s (Manhasset, N.Y.) Shooting Guard, 6-5, 200 46. Andre McGee Canyon Springs (Moreno Valley, Calif.) Point Guard, 6-0, 185 47. Shane Clark Hargrave Military (Chatham, Va.) Small Forward, 6-7, 190 48. Rashad Chase Mays (Atlanta) Power Forward, 6-8, 225 49. Dominic James Richmond (Ind.) Point Guard, 5-11, 169 50. Vernon Goodridge Lutheran Christian (Philadelphia) Center, 6-10, 220 51. Kevin Swinton Dudley (Greensboro, N.C.) Power Forward, 6-5, 216 52. Uche Echefu Montrose Christian (Rockville, Md.) Power Forward, 6-7, 204 53. Courtney Fells Shannon (Miss.) Shooting Guard, 6-7, 190 54. Marcus Johnson Westchester (Los Angeles) Small Forward, 6-6, 190 55. Dior Lowhorn Berkeley (Calif.) Power Forward, 6-7, 215 56. Casaan Breeden Marlboro County (Bennettsville, S.C.) Small Forward, 6-6, 182 57. Terrel Harris South Garland (Texas) Shooting Guard, 6-4, 175 58. Lewis Clinch Crisp County (Cordele, Ga.) Shooting Guard, 6-3, 185 59. Lamar Roberson Central Park Christian (Birmingham, Ala.) Small Forward, 6-8, 205 60. Jonathan Kale St. Andrew’s (Barrington, R.I.) Power Forward, 6-8, 245 61. David Huertas Arlington Country Day (Jacksonville, Fla.) Shooting Guard, 6-4, 178 62. Cyrus McGowan Meridian (Miss.) Center, 6-9, 225 63. Michael Washington McGehee (Ark.) Power Forward, 6-8, 219 64. Nyan Boateng Lincoln (Brooklyn, N.Y.) Shooting Guard, 6-3, 190 65. J.P. Prince White Station (Memphis, Tenn.) Point Guard, 6-5, 183 66. Lawrence Hill Deer Valley (Glendale, Ariz.) Small Forward, 6-8, 205 67. Emmanuel Mayben Troy (N.Y.) Point Guard, 6-3, 170 68. Abdul Herrera South Miami Center, 6-10, 245 69. Magnum Rolle Laurinburg (N.C.) Prep Power Forward, 6-9, 199 70. Lawrence Kinnard Raleigh-Egypt (Memphis) Small Forward, 6-6, 186 71. Wes Matthews Memorial (Madison, Wis.) Shooting Guard, 6-5, 205 72. Shawn Taggart Mount Zion (Durham, N.C.) Center, 6-11, 210 73. Joey Cameron Leeds (Ala.) Power Forward, 6-9, 240 74. Roderick Flemings DeSoto (Texas) Small Forward, 6-6, 210 75. A.J. Abrams McNeil (Austin, Texas) Point Guard, 5-10, 142 76. Jordan Wilkes Loyola (Los Angeles) Center, 6-10, 200 77. Bryan Harvey Dominguez (Compton, Calif.) Shooting Guard, 6-6, 210 78. Clarence Holloway Harlan (Chicago) Center, 7-1, 270 79. K.C. Rivers Oak Hill Academy (Mouth of Wilson, Va.) Shooting Guard, 6-3, 218 80. Austin Jackson Denton (Texas) Ryan Point Guard, 6-2, 180 81. Kevin Lisch Althoff Catholic (Belleville, Ill.) Point Guard, 6-0, 182 82. Ben McCauley Yough (Herminie, Pa.) Power Forward, 6-9, 225 83. Levance Fields Xaverian (Brooklyn, N.Y.) Point Guard, 5-10, 204 84. B.J. Raymond St. John’s (Toledo, Ohio) Small Forward, 6-5, 192 85. J.R. Inman St. Joseph Regional (Montvale, N.J.) Small Forward, 6-8, 200 86. Artem Wallace Toledo (Wash.) Power Forward, 6-8, 235 87. Devan Downey Chester (S.C.) Point Guard, 5-9, 156 88. Chad Millard Brewster Academy (Wolfeboro, N.H.) Small Forward, 6-9, 212 89. Danny Williams Fremont (Los Angeles) Shooting Guard, 6-3, 185 90. Jeff Adrien Brewster Academy (Wolfeboro, N.H.) Power Forward, 6-5, 218 91. Alfred Aboya Tilton (N.H.) School Power Forward, 6-7, 242 92. Terry Martin Richwood (Monroe, La.) Shooting Guard, 6-7, 194 93. Ryan Ayers Germantown Academy (Fort Washington, Pa.) Shooting Guard, 6-6, 205 94. Derwin Kitchen Raines (Jacksonville, Fla.) Shooting Guard, 6-4, 184 95. Josh Thornton Caesar Rodney (Camden-Wyoming, Del.) Point Guard, 6-2, 163 96. Darren Collison Etiwanda (Calif.) Point Guard, 6-2, 150 97. Marcus Landry Vincent (Milwaukee) Power Forward, 6-6, 205 98. Denis Clemente Calusa Prep (Miami) Point Guard, 5-11, 150 99. Joey Shaw Deer Valley (Glendale, Ariz.) Shooting Guard, 6-6, 170 100. Octavius Spann Banneker (College Park, Ga.) Small Forward, 6-8, 218 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidnark Posted December 28, 2004 Share Posted December 28, 2004 Jalensdad, I love your stuff. Keep the good posts rolling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted December 29, 2004 Share Posted December 29, 2004 I attended the Marshall County (KY) Hoopfest on Dec4. All of the recruiting guru's were in attendance, sitting in two rows under one of the baskets. At one point in the day, the guru's were introduced individually to the fans. Althoff let a game get away from them and lost to Chicago Hales Franciscan by a bucket. Kevin Litsch had a sub-standard shooting performance, even though he scored 17 pts or so. The guru's did not see KL's normal game. The following Thursday some of the same guru's saw Althoff at Keith Pickett's Shootout. KL is much better then the guru's saw in early December. I could give a crap what they write! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jalensdad2002 Posted December 29, 2004 Share Posted December 29, 2004 "KL is much better then the guru's saw in early December. I could give a crap what they write"! I think he proved that this morning, going for 15 4th qtr points and 9/10 from the line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crymdg2 Posted December 29, 2004 Share Posted December 29, 2004 Jalensdad2002 said, "I think he proved that this morning, going for 15 4th qtr points and 9/10 from the line." I too saw the game yesterday morning. In a game where it came down to the wire, Kevin simply willed Althoff to win. He was unable to be stopped and as Jalensdad said he dominated the 4th quarter. His ability to hit clutch free throws would sure look good on this years team! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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