OT US vs Ghana

[SLUBALLS]

Look we do not have the same type of ATHLETES trying to become the best soccer players. We just don't attract it and not sure if we ever will. It's getting better but glory every four years isn't going to cut it for guys who can have it every year in NHL, NBA, MLB, and NFL.

People keep saying, "More kids are playing soccer these days...." Soccer has been the dominant youth sport for years; this isn't new. What is new and I can attest ot this directly given the 11 year boys I coach is that these kids are WATCHING soccer more. I call it the Fox Soccer Effect and I think it will do more to help gain more of the higher level of athlete US soccer needs. These kids know the big players, know the big teams, know the big tournaments and most importantly, they WATCH.

I believe the boys did well this year. Did they dig their own holes time and time again? Yes, but the ability to never say die and push was freakin unbelievable with this team. I don't blame Clark for yesterday and while I didn't get his selection, Bradley siad he wanted fresh legs. Makes sense but it backfired. What else backfired is our finishing ability. Clark did not lose the game. We had three to four quality chances (Findley, Feilhalber, Altidore) to make that our game and we didn't put the biscuit in the basket. If you want to blame anyone this year, I would say to have a word with Charlie Davies, the one guy the US has produced that has the pace to give defenses fits, the size and balance to stay on the ball through traffic, the touch to hold onto the ball, and the FINISHING ability to put away shots. One mistake on his part and we have a second tier forward line.

The US will build form this. Hopefully we will add some more depth because that is the one thing I'm most worried about. Next go around Demp's and DOnovan are on their last legs, Cherundolo/Demerit/Boca are all done. I guess we can look forward to Mr. Tim Ream running the back line for the US.

[MB73]

This St. Louis Post Dispatch guy tells it like it is, written before USA loss to Ghana. A fluke "over", by the way.

Tie with England was a gift, we struggled to tie Slovenia and took over 90 minutes to take Algeria 1-0.

Facts are facts. US athletes wanna play baseball, basketball, hockey, football...

Oh, by the way, there was a pro soccer game in St. Louis last night... 0-0.

(not sure about the "goat" info, but if true, I will add it to my repertoire)

World Cup soccer snobs really get the Sherpa's goat

Story Discussion BY JOE HOLLEMAN | Life Sherpa • [email protected] > 314-340-8254 |

The World Cup is on, and the Life Sherpa is an ugly American.

Why? Because I don't care.

With the current rush in America to make sure we don't sound like Americans, saying you don't enjoy soccer is tantamount to saying you don't care about global warming or Third World hunger.

No one mentions rugby is more popular in Australia and New Zealand, or that hockey is king in Canada and European countries that have ice on a regular basis.

It's only Americans who are bombarded with snobbery about soccer's world popularity.

"Did you know more people play soccer more than any other sport?"

I'm not surprised, since it is the easiest game to get going. Needed equipment: One ball. You don't need a bat, stick or glove, and you can make a goal with two rocks, four rocks if you play a full field.

If impoverished countries historically had been given the same access to equipment as any CYC baseball team or Pop Warner squad, my guess is Cameroon would have cranked out several Super Bowl MVPs and the World Series would be dominated by Algerian southpaw closers.

Even worse, commentators talk about our disdain for soccer with that superior tone that translates into: "Stupid Americans can't appreciate soccer's beauty."

Gee, I think we grasp the intricacies: Kick the ball into the opponent's goal more times than they kick it into yours. I get it, really I do. In fact, I played it in grade school. It made me appreciate junior league football. Why? Two main reasons:

One, soccer was played in the winter and we wore short pants. Why is that a good idea?

Second, you're told to hit the ball with your head. In every other sport, contact between your head and the ball is a bad thing. In fact, helmets were provided for when such contact couldn't be avoided. In soccer, however, we actually practiced — practiced, mind you — hitting the ball with our heads.

Maybe this is a partial answer to the educational question "Why Johnny Can't Read." And it has to be the only reason for those annoying horns known as vuvuzelas. (I never thought anything could be worse than those inflatable plastic "thundersticks." I was wrong.)

Further, I don't buy the "most popular in the world" argument. It's said that goat is the world's most popular red meat. Should I feel bad because I don't want to eat it? I'm sure there are many tasty goat recipes, but I'm sticking to the beef-pork-chicken diet when it comes to land animals.

And maybe, just maybe, if everyone in the goat-eating world had easy access to filet mignon, goats could sleep easier. My guess is that if McDonald's and Hardee's expanded on a massive scale, goats would die of old age.

After careful analysis and every effort to be sensitive, I have figured out why soccer is not a premier sport in the U.S.:

Soccer is boring.

Don't talk about the excitement of playing the game. No activity is boring to the participants.

Last year, I spent two days watching the best chess players in the U.S. battle it out over the checkered boards. I'd be an idiot to say the skill level and concentration was not impressive. But I'd be a bigger idiot to watch it again. From a spectator's standpoint, it's yawn-inducing.

To give you an example of why soccer fails, I was in my car and an announcer was running down the scores of the day's World Cup matches. Direct quote: "South Korea trounced Greece, 2-0."

Trounced? A 2-0 trouncing?

I'm not a heartless soul. I'm happy my soccer-loving friends have a chance to watch soccer being played at its highest level.

Also, I have watched some World Cup matches. Hey, I'm a sports junkie and have been known to watch the Winter Olympics, bowling and women's lacrosse in a pinch.

And I'll watch more soccer when the semifinal and final matches come around — as long as they aren't on when the Cardinals are playing.

[MusicCityBilliken]

. MB is dumb but he has a point the US should be able to beat Ghana which has a population about the size of Texas and the 9th worst economy in the world. 310 million people and we can't produce enough guys to get past the round of 16 when we have the most favorable draw EVER? They also had the youngest team in the whole tournament.

I don't know if that is great analogy. Who produces more NBA players> Beverly Hills or South Central Los Angeles? Chicago's Gold Coast or Chicago's South Side? Scarsdale or Bedford Stuyvesant?

[For-DaLove]

MB,

We will NEVER win the World Baseball Classic that is one thing I do know. I feel as though we one day can win the World Cup. We aren't dominant in every sport like you seem to think. Sure, we have the worlds best sports league's in nearly every sport, but that has never promised us victory on the international level. Look at basketball vs. P. Rico.

I'm truly starting to believe you have a deep down love for soccer, because nobody is a big enough idiot to post that much about something they hate.

[moytoy12]

Look we do not have the same type of ATHLETES trying to become the best soccer players. We just don't attract it and not sure if we ever will. It's getting better but glory every four years isn't going to cut it for guys who can have it every year in NHL, NBA, MLB, and NFL.

People keep saying, "More kids are playing soccer these days...." Soccer has been the dominant youth sport for years; this isn't new. What is new and I can attest ot this directly given the 11 year boys I coach is that these kids are WATCHING soccer more. I call it the Fox Soccer Effect and I think it will do more to help gain more of the higher level of athlete US soccer needs. These kids know the big players, know the big teams, know the big tournaments and most importantly, they WATCH.

I believe the boys did well this year. Did they dig their own holes time and time again? Yes, but the ability to never say die and push was freakin unbelievable with this team. I don't blame Clark for yesterday and while I didn't get his selection, Bradley siad he wanted fresh legs. Makes sense but it backfired. What else backfired is our finishing ability. Clark did not lose the game. We had three to four quality chances (Findley, Feilhalber, Altidore) to make that our game and we didn't put the biscuit in the basket. If you want to blame anyone this year, I would say to have a word with Charlie Davies, the one guy the US has produced that has the pace to give defenses fits, the size and balance to stay on the ball through traffic, the touch to hold onto the ball, and the FINISHING ability to put away shots. One mistake on his part and we have a second tier forward line.

The US will build form this. Hopefully we will add some more depth because that is the one thing I'm most worried about. Next go around Demp's and DOnovan are on their last legs, Cherundolo/Demerit/Boca are all done. I guess we can look forward to Mr. Tim Ream running the back line for the US.

I also think we have first active generation of soccer adults. Those who grew up eating and drinking soccer and actually support the games (World Cup, MLS, etc.) and who are starting to take the kids to the games.

My dad did a great job coaching us, but he really didn't care much for soccer. It was an outlet for his boys to run around and burn energy. He didn't take us to games or make a point of watching them on TV (this was further compounded by living in Oklahoma at the time and having no games to really go watch or games on TV to view).

[TheA_Bomb]

Look we do not have the same type of ATHLETES trying to become the best soccer players. We just don't attract it and not sure if we ever will. It's getting better but glory every four years isn't going to cut it for guys who can have it every year in NHL, NBA, MLB, and NFL.

People keep saying, "More kids are playing soccer these days...." Soccer has been the dominant youth sport for years; this isn't new. What is new and I can attest ot this directly given the 11 year boys I coach is that these kids are WATCHING soccer more. I call it the Fox Soccer Effect and I think it will do more to help gain more of the higher level of athlete US soccer needs. These kids know the big players, know the big teams, know the big tournaments and most importantly, they WATCH.

I believe the boys did well this year. Did they dig their own holes time and time again? Yes, but the ability to never say die and push was freakin unbelievable with this team. I don't blame Clark for yesterday and while I didn't get his selection, Bradley siad he wanted fresh legs. Makes sense but it backfired. What else backfired is our finishing ability. Clark did not lose the game. We had three to four quality chances (Findley, Feilhalber, Altidore) to make that our game and we didn't put the biscuit in the basket. If you want to blame anyone this year, I would say to have a word with Charlie Davies, the one guy the US has produced that has the pace to give defenses fits, the size and balance to stay on the ball through traffic, the touch to hold onto the ball, and the FINISHING ability to put away shots. One mistake on his part and we have a second tier forward line.

The US will build form this. Hopefully we will add some more depth because that is the one thing I'm most worried about. Next go around Demp's and DOnovan are on their last legs, Cherundolo/Demerit/Boca are all done. I guess we can look forward to Mr. Tim Ream running the back line for the US.

You're right about watching Soccer. I'm a passive fan watch world cup and maybe an MLS game here and there. I do have some younger cousins that watch Euro games on the FS Soccer channel.

I know there are some holes in the population argument IE China, Pakistan and India aren't soccer powers either They can use the same argument that other sports are their primary sport. Pakistan/India Cricket, China gymnastics/table tennis. They don't really produce that great of athletes besides the Chinese gymnasts. The US does care we do want to compete and Soccer is now popular maybe it is the first generation of popularity but it should improve. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once and a while. Maybe we do need to hire Jurgen Klinsman as our Head Coach and adjust the entire system.

And like I said England was overrated I predicted 3-1 in some other boards but this was even better.

[kevinfootes]

Gave Germany fits with out their Captain and the most prolific German Goal Scorer of All time in the World Cup sitting out. That was not a full up German squad. Oh yeah Ghana was without their best player Esman (Spelling) in the game against the US. Soccer is the most popular sport in Germany but they do take part in many other sports as well. So lets not act like the rest of the world doesn't play any other sports. We aren't dominating at baseball either or basketball anymore and those are our sports.

The US has significant portions of the population that eat sleep and drink soccer. Take a quick drive around Dallas/Ft. Worth soccer fields on SAT or SUN morning they are full. Many many kids have been playing soccer for the past 20 years. As a kid I played soccer more than any other sport. We have enough people and support to achieve some level of success in soccer this finish was sad.

I'm not saying I'm not a fan. I know the haters cause people to band together. This is kind of like those die hard star wars fans defending the Attack of the Cones and Jar Jar Binks when they know the movies really sucked deep down. (Just to spell it out for the nerds on the board)

How are you defining "dominating"? How many countries have as many talented basketball and baseball players? Team USA won the basketball gold medal in 2008. Don't even go there with the world baseball classic. Most of our best players are too smart to play in something stupid like that. Any team with Latroy Hawkins on the roster is far from the best we can offer. If by "dominating" you mean that we aren't going to win every basketball game by 40 points and every baseball game by 10 runs (with a team that has many marginally talented players on it), then I would agree.

[MB73]

MB,

We will NEVER win the World Baseball Classic that is one thing I do know. I feel as though we one day can win the World Cup. We aren't dominant in every sport like you seem to think. Sure, we have the worlds best sports league's in nearly every sport, but that has never promised us victory on the international level. Look at basketball vs. P. Rico.

I'm truly starting to believe you have a deep down love for soccer, because nobody is a big enough idiot to post that much about something they hate.

Our best USA players do not participate in the irrelevant World Baseball Classic, and that argument is immaterial to the World Cup / USA / Ghana / Slovenia / Algeria picture I cited.

And then you say you think USA will win World Cup someday! (what stocks are you buying next week, let me know)

Then you reverse your postition and argue on my side that USA has the worlds best sports leagues in nearly every sport.

There is a woman's subdivision monthly luncheon out here, you should go with them for a year or so and sharpen up yor skills before you post here again.

[slufanskip]

The US will continue and improve. We've made it out of the group round 2 out of the last 3 years and 3 out of the last 5 years. Final 8 once and final 16 twice. Is that overly fantastic? No, of course ot, but it's far better than the 16 year period before and I'd bet the next 16-20 years will get better.

20 years ago kids were being coached by Dad's that never played. I coached HS kids in OKC in '89 and there were very few real soccer players in the city. Most HS coaches thought it was to keep football players in shape during the off season. I assisted a HS coach who had absolutely no experience in soccer, he was made to take the job. I coached the USAF Base team and one of our players kids played for the HS and recruited me to assist. The guy had no clue and that was the norm in the area. In '79 when I went back to the Dallas/FW area from Simi Valley Ca for my Sr year of HS, it was the same. My coach told me initially I wouldn't play if I didn't play football. Do you think there are many High Schools n DFW now who's coaches aren't real soccer people? I doubt it, even in football loving Texas.

Today many more of the parents who coach played, so the kids now are getting better coaching than they've ever gotten and as those kids grow up their kids coaching will be even better. How many Brazilian, Italian, English, German, Argentinian, or Dutch kids were coached by people who knew nothing about soccer over the last 10, 20, or 30 years?

Lastly, the US has this mentality at all ages, that winning is everything. In early teen and pre-teen years, it's of almost no importance. Teaching the proper skills and letting kids develop and make mistakes while playing properly is much more important, but most US adults just don't see it that way. They see their 8 year old son or daughter as unsuccesful if they don't win.

Currently the US has some very good world class players, just not enough depth. When the US lost Davies, look what it left us with. Finley, Buddle, and Gomez to play alongside a 20 year old Altidore. I'm sorry, but none of those 3 are good enough ... not even close. We lack a skilled midfielder with creative insticts, and speed along the back line.

Lastly, what the hell was Bradley doing putting Clark and Findley back in? We played our worst soccer with them on the field. Clark makes a miscue giving up a break and then gets a yellow out of frustration, so he has to be subbed out after 30 minutes. What had Bradley seen from Findley that made him think he would be any more succesfull against Ghana than he had been against either Slovenia or England? After 45 minutes, he clearly knew he was wrong and subbed him out. We just wasted 2 subs that could have given us fresher legs at the 75 minute mark and beyond because we made poor decisions to start with. When we needed energy late, we couldn't bring in a Holden to help out.

[billikenfan05]

MB why do you continue to post in soccer threads? You hate soccer, we all know it. That's your choice just as alot of people like soccer and thats their choice.

[For-DaLove]

Our best USA players do not participate in the irrelevant World Baseball Classic, and that argument is immaterial to the World Cup / USA / Ghana / Slovenia / Algeria picture I cited.

And then you say you think USA will win World Cup someday! (what stocks are you buying next week, let me know)

Then you reverse your postition and argue on my side that USA has the worlds best sports leagues in nearly every sport.

There is a woman's subdivision monthly luncheon out here, you should go with them for a year or so and sharpen up yor skills before you post here again.

That's not taking your side you idiot. My point is that we have the worlds best leagues in everything but soccer, so there's an obvious reason why it isn't as popular here. When our best soccer players get good enough they leave for Europe, just like people do to come to the NBA and MLB.

I agree that the world baseball classic is irrelevant, but it's basically the only comparable thing for baseball to the world cup.

Yes, I do believe the US will one day win the world cup. Look, this year we were without arguably our best striker and easily could have been in the quarterfinals. With him, there's a good chance we make it into the semi's.

[TheA_Bomb]

20 years ago kids were being coached by Dad's that never played. I coached HS kids in OKC in '89 and there were very few real soccer players in the city. Most HS coaches thought it was to keep football players in shape during the off season. I assisted a HS coach who had absolutely no experience in soccer, he was made to take the job. I coached the USAF Base team and one of our players kids played for the HS and recruited me to assist. The guy had no clue and that was the norm in the area. In '79 when I went back to the Dallas/FW area from Simi Valley Ca for my Sr year of HS, it was the same. My coach told me initially I wouldn't play if I didn't play football. Do you think there are many High Schools n DFW now who's coaches aren't real soccer people? I doubt it, even in football loving Texas.

I moved from CA to GA in 8th grade. I had played Soccer out in CA so I made the JrHS team in GA. The coach was the football coach and I had to explain to him that when we kicked the ball to start the half we kicked it to ourselves not the other side. The next practice he showed up with a book from the library. I was the teams highest scorer on the season with a grand total of 1 goal.

The US will get better, I hope. In the mean time we can't settle for mediocrity it is a lot like our Billikens we shouldn't accept weak efforts.

[kevinfootes]

That's not taking your side you idiot. My point is that we have the worlds best leagues in everything but soccer, so there's an obvious reason why it isn't as popular here. When our best soccer players get good enough they leave for Europe, just like people do to come to the NBA and MLB.

I agree that the world baseball classic is irrelevant, but it's basically the only comparable thing for baseball to the world cup.

Yes, I do believe the US will one day win the world cup. Look, this year we were without arguably our best striker and easily could have been in the quarterfinals. With him, there's a good chance we make it into the semi's.

The wbc makes the pro bowl look interesting. Years from now it might be comparable to the world cup, but it's nothing like it now.

[For-DaLove]

The wbc makes the pro bowl look interesting. Years from now it might be comparable to the world cup, but it's nothing like it now.

My point was simply that the talent distribution ranges all over the world. To expect us to win in every sport during every international competition is naive. It is also unfair to say this WC was a failure. Yes, we should always strive to win everything, but realistically it's not going to happen.

[gister]

MB why do you continue to post in soccer threads? You hate soccer, we all know it. That's your choice just as alot of people like soccer and thats their choice.

AMEN!!!!!

[slufanskip]

I moved from CA to GA in 8th grade. I had played Soccer out in CA so I made the JrHS team in GA. The coach was the football coach and I had to explain to him that when we kicked the ball to start the half we kicked it to ourselves not the other side. The next practice he showed up with a book from the library. I was the teams highest scorer on the season with a grand total of 1 goal.

The US will get better, I hope. In the mean time we can't settle for mediocrity it is a lot like our Billikens we shouldn't accept weak efforts.

and you're not close to as old as I am. What year was that.

I don't think we gave a weak effort. I believe we don't have enough players that are capable of playing game after game at a world class level to allow us to have any kind of depth. Like I said take away Davies and we end up with Findley, Buddle, and Gomez. None of those 3 are capable of being consistently dangerous at this level.

[MUTGR]

Look we do not have the same type of ATHLETES trying to become the best soccer players. We just don't attract it and not sure if we ever will. It's getting better but glory every four years isn't going to cut it for guys who can have it every year in NHL, NBA, MLB, and NFL.

Bingo. Can you imagine if the athletes that comprise professional or even D1 college defensive backs, wide receivers and running backs and guards (at least the smaller ones) had all been thrown in a pool since they were 6 or so and just played soccer?

Even baseball has been losing out to football and B-Ball in the athletic arms race.

I have two sons playing select soccer at a fairly high level, and let's just say there is not a ton of diversity out there, although it is probably more so than 10 years ago and will be more so in another 10 years.

[Hawk]

Bingo. Can you imagine if the athletes that comprise professional or even D1 college defensive backs, wide receivers and running backs and guards (at least the smaller ones) had all been thrown in a pool since they were 6 or so and just played soccer?

Even baseball has been losing out to football and B-Ball in the athletic arms race.

I have two sons playing select soccer at a fairly high level, and let's just say there is not a ton of diversity out there, although it is probably more so than 10 years ago and will be more so in another 10 years.

Pretty much all of the Elite world players go to soccer academies. I know the US has a few, but I wonder how close they are to the European or even African equivalents.

[Pistol]

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/world-cup/col...5901&ver=us

Nice discussion of the future of the US roster, with Tim Ream mentioned as a guy who will get some looks over the next four years.

[slufanskip]

The U.S. continues to crank out defensive midfielders at an impressive pace. Maurice Edu is just 24, and given the European experience he is already getting, he should be in his prime when 2014 rolls around.

This had to make me laugh, anyone reading the board for long knows my thoughts on defensive mids. Not that they aren't important, they are very important. However, this is the problem soccer in the USA in general. Not enough players aquire the technical skills required of them at an early enough age to be anything but defensive mids, hence the always overflowing cup of defensive mids at all levels. What if Bradley, Edu, Holden, Clark, et al had develop world class skill with the ball that allowed them to slow the game down and have time to see the pitch at a very young age? Combine that with their current work ethic, what would we have then? The people in charge at our highest levels of youth teams at the pre to early teen ages have got to put less of an emphasis on athleticism and winning games and more of an emphasis on ball skills and creativity. Let the kids have fun with the ball and be creative even if it means they will turn it over too often. Mistakes lead to adjustments and the best and most ambitious players will learn how not to make those mistakes and will push themselves to be better.

[strozier]

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/world-cup/col...5901&ver=us

Nice discussion of the future of the US roster, with Tim Ream mentioned as a guy who will get some looks over the next four years.

Do you think Brad Davis has any shot making that roster? Age might be a factor in '14. What about Tim Ward?

[slufanskip]

Do you think Brad Davis has any shot making that roster? Age might be a factor in '14. What about Tim Ward?

Brad may still get the occasional look, but if he hasn't gotten any real consideration yet I'm not sure he'll ever be a difference maker at the National team level.

Has Tim Ward done anything to deserve a look?

[Pistol]

Brad may still get the occasional look, but if he hasn't gotten any real consideration yet I'm not sure he'll ever be a difference maker at the National team level.

Has Tim Ward done anything to deserve a look?

That's a shame about Brad, because he left SLU early with the intention of trying to make the USMNT roster for the 2006 World Cup and beyond (maybe even the 2004 Olympics, right?). Would have been cool to see him get a shot at some of the big events.

[strozier]

That's a shame about Brad, because he left SLU early with the intention of trying to make the USMNT roster for the 2006 World Cup and beyond (maybe even the 2004 Olympics, right?). Would have been cool to see him get a shot at some of the big events.

He's a perennial MLS All-Star too and has done exceptionally well with the club in Houston. A very well-deserved nod to the Billiken Hall-of-Fame not too long ago. You think the Sorber connection would help the cause.

Any news on guys like Dipsy or Will John? Vidad?

[MUTGR]

The U.S. continues to crank out defensive midfielders at an impressive pace. Maurice Edu is just 24, and given the European experience he is already getting, he should be in his prime when 2014 rolls around.

This had to make me laugh, anyone reading the board for long knows my thoughts on defensive mids. Not that they aren't important, they are very important. However, this is the problem soccer in the USA in general. Not enough players aquire the technical skills required of them at an early enough age to be anything but defensive mids, hence the always overflowing cup of defensive mids at all levels. What if Bradley, Edu, Holden, Clark, et al had develop world class skill with the ball that allowed them to slow the game down and have time to see the pitch at a very young age? Combine that with their current work ethic, what would we have then? The people in charge at our highest levels of youth teams at the pre to early teen ages have got to put less of an emphasis on athleticism and winning games and more of an emphasis on ball skills and creativity. Let the kids have fun with the ball and be creative even if it means they will turn it over too often. Mistakes lead to adjustments and the best and most ambitious players will learn how not to make those mistakes and will push themselves to be better.

I tend to agree. The other issue is that kids don't often go out and just play soccer. I think it is a cultural thing. I am assuming these Brazilian kids don't sit around playing video games all day, but go out in the street or to the fields and play pick up games of soccer all day.

It may happen in the US, but you don't see it much.