cheeseman Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 I just heard Rammer on KFNS and I have got to set something straight - he proclaims SMS a better program then SLU because they have a 13-6 win advantadge in the series. I am sorry, I think you measure a program's success by the number of NCAA trips - such as over the last 10-12 years, I am sorry, SLU has more trips than SMS in that time. Now if he wants to say they have our number than fine - no one can argue that they have a big edge in the series but that does not make one program better than the other. Lots of teams seem to struggle in certain parks/arenas than they do in others - for whatever the reason, we do not play well at SMS. No arguement. The other issue I have with Rammer is that if he wants to say they beat us then fine but does he have to proclaim to the world that that they put a whippin on us - his words - without also saying that we did fight back to within 3 points with about 4 minutes to play and we had RV at the line with a 1-1 and he missed the front end. No he just says for all of those who did not listen to the game that we got whipped when in reality we did get out played but the game was closer than his description. This is what Mike Kelly would have said for MU but not Rammer - he has to paint the worse case scenerio. I am sorry, I am not being petty here because as I have said before - what is the point of having the Bill's play by play guy on the radio if you can not get a little positive spin from him. In my mind none - so once again, thanks for nothing Rammmer - at least your consistent. Woolard do you ever listen to the radio? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 i used to be a big ramsey fan. over the last 3 years he has done and said enough negative slu stuff that imo he needs to pack up and go. he is exciting to listen to on the radio, but i just dont get his over the top attempts to be objective. he goes to the point he isnt objective. i wonder if he is just sucking up to worthless clayborne? however when he made his "worst billiken team in 20 years" comment last year, he wasnt playing to clayborne then though. i agree just because a team has the other's number doesnt mean they are a better team. someone should call him and ask if we are better than louisville based on how we have more or less owned them the last few years. that would get an interesting stammer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 I agree with the above sentiments ... I heard most of the radio segment. He did try to say that SLU wanted to be part of a Catholic conference down the road and SLU beleives that the A-10 is the bettter road to get them there ... but the overtone was that he didn't agree ...and fat mike just came out and said he didn't. He never tried to defend why SLU should go to the A-10 over the MVC. Apparently he gets paid more from the MVC than from SLU. I suggest all alumni, season ticket holders, and Billiken Club members send an email to Woolard letting him know how we feel. If Doug learns how his fan base and contributors to the program feel ... maybe he will take the steps to clear up the issue. Also ... I will if I can be there ... but if not somebody else should let whomever is there know what we think ... especially if it is Coach S. He is a no nonsense guy. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NashvilleBilliken Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 Man, if I were in St. Louis I would call in and say exactly that, Roy. I would love to hear his response to that one. He would look like a moron and Billiken fans would eat it up.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billikan Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 Earlier this year and late last year I posted my view that BR is not a true Billiken fan but he is an announcer that has ambitions and he happens to be the current Billikens play by play announcer. He is often overly negative and defensive. I think he takes it personally when the Bills do not play well because he is connected with the program as the announcer and his buddies at KFNS--all MU fans who dote on pretty Quinn--beat him up over the losses by the Billikens. Rather than look at this as a long term project he looks for immediate gratification and if he does not get it he will never let up on the Bills. Contrary to some, I don't care much for his call of the game either, he goes over the top sometimes but he more often is very critical on the broadcasts. As much as I dislike his repeated belittling comments about our Bills, I would like us to get someone like Mike Kelly who is a decent announcer and almost never criticizes his beloved Tigers. He always sees the positive and is a true fan. What we have is a guy who is looking for a bigger announcing gig and he thinks that if he is like a New York shock jock who criticizes all of the time he can get a "bigger" position. If you don't think I am right look at his amnnouncing of obscure sports on cable. I have heard him several times on shows that I am sure that no more than a few hundred people would watch. He is also a voice for the MVC so he again is looking to advance his position at the expense of the Bills. If he doesn't want to be a fan of the Bills then he should quit--but he won't because he likes the pay and the publicity--as limited as those things might be at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjray Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 I think Rammer's play-by-play of Bills games with Earl is outstanding. I don't want some homer blowing smoke up our rear ends about how wonder the team is when that is not the case. Tells us accurately what you see. As to the KNFS stuff, I don't listen to that little rinky-dinky station so what happens there doesn't concern me. Obviously, other posters listen and it bugs them that Rammer tries to curry favor with his fellow commentators through his attempts at over-objectivity regarding our Bills. That's a fair criticism and I certainly wouldn't try and discourage anyone from voicing that criticism on the air to Rammer. However, by the same token, I see KNFS as a small time operation and really don't think an on-air perceived slight on that station should be cause for the guy's dismissal. SMS has owned us in recent years, there is no denying it, and that is absolutely unacceptable. Heck, if I were a sports commentator, I'd have a hard time defending the Bills vis-a-vis SMS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schasz Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 Has been doing the Bills games. I'm sure he started sometine during the 10 seasons that Rich Grawer was HC and Rich started coaching in the 82-83 season. I've said before that my feeling on Ramsey is SLU is strictly a job, and if something better came along, then he would be gone in a heartbeat. He's done an OK job but I go back to when Harry Caray and after him Jack Buck did the games and Bob just isn't in those two hall of famers league. The sports radio at KFNS sucked when I left town in September of '96 and I understand it still sucks...can't say it is any better here in Tampa either. My memory of Ramsey and Claiborne on KFNS weren't particularly good. I seem to remember the restaurant and movie reviews that were very boring to this sports junkie. I like the idea of writing to Woolard if Ramsey is ragging about SLU on his show. That's plain stupid...taking a bite out of the hand that feeds you. I would send Doug an email...please pass his email address for the out of town fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonka Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 I don't think any email to Doug will get anything done. I think Doug has his own agenda and motives. I didn't listen to Rammer, but just reading some of the quotes, was he that out of line? We did get whooped by SMS. The game may have seemed closer, but bottom line - we got our a##es kicked. I may not be the biggest fan of Rammer, but I'd rather him call it as he sees it. We may disagree with him, but at least I would respect him for voicing what he really thinks. I personally would not rather see him sugarcoat things as so many on this board do that already. Saying SMS is a better program is no different than what we would be saying about the Billikens if the roles were reversed. I do it myself because I am often blinded by my devotion to this program. Maybe the players and Brad should hear comments like that from the media and take personal offense to it and change it! How many times do teams respond to negative comments from the media. Some teams even hang quotes or articles in the locker room to motivate their players. You really want to change Rammer, well how about quit getting slapped around by SMS and then list endless excuses why. Bottom line - we lost! Arizona, bottom line - we lost! In the end, it's the only thing that matters! Win games, continue to win games, and people's views will change - quickly!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 you say that kfns is insignificant, yet it was kfns that started all the mvc crapola. the post only wrote about it after ramsey and clayborne and frank and tiger tim made it an issue. soon the town was in agreement that slu should go to the mvc and it was a hell of an uphill battle to turn that tide. we still have a lot of casual uninformed fans saying it. that is why he is dangerous with his "neutral" comments. we arent going to win casual fans with his making statements where ramsey declares he sees slu as a top 100 program for eternity, or last year's team being the worst in 20 years or now declaring that sms is the far better program. my gosh if our own "voice of the billikens" isnt going to serve as a media cheerleader, who the hell will? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 [email protected] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 tonka, if you agree with ramsey's idiocy, then tell me, are the billikens a better program than louisville then? we have dominated that series the last few years. so if that thinking is legitimate, than we must be better than louisville then too. i dont think we are, but cant have it both ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taq Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 Very surprised to see this conversation. I listen to Ramsey every day for 30 minutes or so on the way home from work and have never thought of him as anything less than a Homer equal to Kelly. In saying that, I guess I cannot specifically think of a situation where he was as quick to interrupt/change subjects when fielding a negative call as Kelly so often does, but at the same time, there are very few negative calls about SLU during my drive time. Actually, few calls period. Ramsey almost becomes a different person when talking about SLU/Sod./All-Catholic Conference/Anti-MU, etc., in terms of showing emotion - being a fan first - versus a typical sports host when discussing the Rams, Cards, Blues. In a couple of years of listening 30 minutes a day, I have never heard anything that was not absolutely glowingly favorable about SLU from Ramsey. As with Kelly for MU football, to me this gets a little old - I prefer to hear a little more truth, particularly if all I can do is listen versus see for myself. Can't imagine wanting a guy to be more blindly pro-SLU than Ramsey. I would have guessed Ramsey to be a graduate of a local Catholic high school and a life-long Bills fan simply because that's the way he talks. Is this not accurate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonka Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 I didn't say I agreed with Ramsey. I was just saying that he wasn't all that out of line in his comments about us getting whooped. Did we not get whooped, Roy? My other comment was that we would be saying the same thing if a similar poster came on this board to bag SLU. We'd find a way to express our edge in the series if we had played well every time we played that team. I even said I do it as well. The fact of the matter is arguments will always be passionately made as it pertains to shedding our team in a positive light to any competitor who would saying something negative about SLU, even if the argument wouldn't hold much ground. We all do it. Again, I hate Ramsey saying this crap, especially since he's our guy. But, maybe we need to hear stuff like ever so often so this crap doesn't happen anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonka Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 Roy, I agree with a lot of what you say. But, I can't stand it when guys don't express how they feel from time to time. Should the majority of Rammer's comments be proSLU - absolutely!!!!! But, if that is all he does, then where is his credibility? It would be hard for any commentator or media person to paint nothing but a rosey picture for the Billikens this year and the last couple. And, even the casual fan can pick up on that if they did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted December 23, 2003 Author Share Posted December 23, 2003 For those of you who think KFNS is a rinky dink station - wake up and smell the coffee. They are the #1 sports talk radio station in St. Louis - KMOX is listened to less and 1380 is hard to get all the time and is KFNS sister station - try to listen to a game on 1380 - tough to do. Most ardent sports fans in St. Louis now listen to KFNS so Rammers comments are not only heard by a handful of people. The Bills need nurturing now not public negative comments by those who are getting a paycheck from SLU. Earl can be objective but he does so in a positive manner - Rammer is a problem and eventually needs to be dealt with. He can go or he can solider up- his call. By the way, at one point during his comments, Clayborne tried to change the subject and Rammer says - no no, I am not finished and he drives the negative comment home again. If SLU wants a big time program they have do all the little things necessary to get there along with the big things - positive PR is important. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted December 23, 2003 Author Share Posted December 23, 2003 This is not about just any media type doing an anaylisis of the Bills - this is about the voice of the Bills making negative comments about his team on the air. That is bull and it has to stop - no other top program in the country would tolerate this behavior and we should not either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted December 23, 2003 Author Share Posted December 23, 2003 I am sorry you are not listening very closely - this board has been full of posts about Rammer over the last year or so and his luke warm at best public comments about SLU on KFNS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted December 23, 2003 Author Share Posted December 23, 2003 You are missing the point - this is not about painting a rosy picture but putting a positive spin on the situation. I can call you stupid or I can say you simply do not have all the facts - you tell me which has a better spin? Ultimately, both comments make their point but leave a far different taste in your mouth. That is all I am saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 let him be the voice of reason on cardinal baseball, rams football, blues hockey, the nba, nascar, field hockey, elephant polo, etc. but when it comes to billiken basketball, he needs to be to the billikens what mike kelly is to the tigers. or what jack buck was to the cardinals. i dont really remember them ever knocking their teams and they seem to do just fine credibility wise. now he doesnt have to go off the deep end and declare the billikens final four contenders, but he has the on off switch and can control the content and extreme he comments on the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 your comment about earl is a fantastic example. earl is credible. and earl always comes across positive for the billikens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 tonka said, "Did we not get whooped, Roy?" well no, we didnt get "whooped". we were within 3 with very little time left and got caught in the miss and foul routine to end up a double figure loss. a three to tie would have brought that game to an end totally different. imo a whooping is what we did to grambling or savanah state. the loss was disappointing, but i dont consider it a whooping by any means. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 thank you mrs ramsey. your son is obviously very proud of you too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillikenButch Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 Every Tiger fan I know, and I am thinking of two dozen or so absolutely hate Mike Kelly. I think his calls are awful as well. I personally like that Ramsey calls it as he sees it, but I also agree he needs to turn it down a notch, he should pick if he want to be an announcer or a radio commentator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 butch, what do those tiger fans hate about mike kelly. he is smooth, knowledgeable, and a tiger fan through and through. what else do they want? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillikenButch Posted December 23, 2003 Share Posted December 23, 2003 He is too smooth and really has no personality. He is too canned. The really good announcers in any sport, IMO, have some rough edges that show they are real people not just good voices. I know of some large corporate sponsors that absolutely hate the guy's call, of course these sponsors do not rival the WalMart fortunes, so the have no voice in the matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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