SLUDrew Posted December 29, 2006 Share Posted December 29, 2006 When you are building a program which we are trying to do, you can't have years where you don't bring in one player. You need to stack a few nice classes together. And when I say one player, I don't mean some JUCO nobody wanted that you sign in the spring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 29, 2006 Share Posted December 29, 2006 like i said, i am not going to condemn him for not winning when he hasnt lost yet. what if he nails that junior class? what if he brings in the juco or two that more than offsets voyoukas and dixon/obi? hey i am not saying there are no concerns, i am just saying i wont condemn him yet considering the program is at a point it hasnt seen since 1998 at this point in the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moytoy12 Posted December 29, 2006 Share Posted December 29, 2006 Being supportive of the current team's success and critical of the program's future aren't mutually exclusive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlecat455 Posted December 29, 2006 Share Posted December 29, 2006 I believe your point about starting over with a new coach is valid and one of the reasons I fail to understand the Brad nay-sayers. Personally, I think the program is on the right track, but if it isn't, who wants to start over? If that happens we will be 4 years further down the road and in the same position we are now, if we are lucky. The gloom and doom posters seem to think that a change of head coach would somehow put us in a better position and I don't see that things would be any different. The truth is, we are better off now than when Brad took over. It is likely that we will be better next year than this year, given expected improvement in the play of the holdovers. It's just as cheap to be optimistic. Complain all you want, but as we sit here, Brad's the coach. I sure would like to see folks get on board with UB and get behind the progress that has been made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLUDrew Posted December 29, 2006 Share Posted December 29, 2006 As I have stated multiple times, I am excited to see where this year's team can go, but that does not mean I am happy with where the program is going. Liking one team and liking the state of program are two completely different things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NashvilleBilliken Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 I agree Roy. It's one thing to debate. But the same people have been talking about the same darn topic for 6 months. We get your point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLUDrew Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 It sounds like many of you want to maintain the status quo just for the sake of it. Why? Battlecat literally said, even if the program isn't on the right track why would you want to start over? Are you serious? You call me defeatist? That may be the most condemning statement I have read about SLU bball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NashvilleBilliken Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 "I sure would like to see folks get on board with UB and get behind the progress that has been made." Not gonna happen. Guys like Drew, Hardball, etc despise BS too much to root for the team. The proof is the pudding. I buy that Drew is a SLU fan. But his disappointment in Brad far surpasses his enjoyment of the team. If not, maybe a positive post would arise from time to time. But that doesn't happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlecat455 Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 "You call me defeatist? That >may be the most condemning statement I have read about SLU >bball" Are YOU serious? Aren't you the fellow that pronounced the team's tournament hopes dead at halftime of the Pacific game? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLUDrew Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 You can love this team and program and not love where Soderberg is taking it. I find it difficult to believe that some of you are so narrow-minded that you can't see that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Battlecat455 Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 In fact, it has something to do with keeping an open mind about Brad's leadership. That is apparently something you are unable to accomplish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 first off the balance of discussion is way off. second, if our remaining roster was mainly seniors i would agree. our remaining roster that is seniors is two. one of which barely plays. so once again the balance of discussion seems a little skewed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NashvilleBilliken Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 If you can link me to two posts that you would consider positive, I'll take it all back. I know you're a fan. But the only things you say are negative. Maybe you don't realize it...or maybe I have it wrong. That's why I'll take it all back if you can link me to 2 posts in the last 6 months that are positive. And no, saying "I hope Brad takes us to the sweet 16" at the end of a negative tirade doesn't count. I'm looking for something where the topic is NOT about recruiting. As I said, I think you are a SLU fan. I have concerns about the team as well. Everybody does. Even reading UNC's board, they have concerns. But there is a difference between enjoying yourself and being concerned, and looking at a team and only focusing on the bad things. Perhaps that's your perogative...i don't know...and you have that right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 but it isnt status quo. the program is far better off than it was the day romar tearfully said good bye. the players we are debating about were not impact players. now if it was lisch and or liddell heading out the door, then you got something to cry about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moytoy12 Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 I don't know what the "balance of discussion" has to do with the fact that one can appreciate the current team and be critical of the future of the program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 because there is far more discussion about the future after this season than there is about this season. that makes no sense to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quality Is Job 1 Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 >i think that our returning four players starters and the >other returnees will continue to improve and yes we will >again improve. > >when dobbs left, spoon only brought in freshman jeff harris >(not the jeff harris that was a stud 4 years later) and the >team improved the next year. Jeff Harris was a freshman in 1993-94, which was Donnie Dobb's senior year. That team went to the NCAA Tournament as a No 7 but lost to Joe Smith and Maryland. Harris, David Robinson, and Donnie Cambell all came in at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 Roy said "coach soderberg will signed the needed role players this spring to surround kevin and tommie and elevate the team even more than this year. and we will still be sitting in the enviable position to sign the now junior class as well." Like how last year we all knew we needed to sign a PF that could come in immediately and help TL, KL and Ian. We know how that worked out as we whiffed on Stemmler, HD is gone and Adam is gettin about 2 minutes a game. Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 what are your thoughts on AK. I was thinking I wanted to see him more, but I checked the season stats and he is making 1 turnover per minute. I hadn't noticed. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H Waldman Official Sponser of the Stemmler and Ahearn could and would have helped club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 he's not ready to play yet for prolonged periods but I certainly think he'll contribute to this team in the future. The thing I notice watching him play is the other team seems to get more offensive rebounds when he's in. I think he's young and probably doesn't know what it really means yet to box out. I'd also like to see what DM can do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billinikens Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 I just replied to the first post because this thread is brutal, so much to respond to. First of all, I haven't read anyone in the last few days that was critical of Brad's recruiting suggesting he be fired. People are legitimately concerned about the status of a program that has only EIGHT returning scholarship players on it. I respect Brad as a person and believe he is honest and a good man, I respect him as a coach, but you cannot build upon success if you don't continue to bring in quality players. We aren't bringing in ANY players. Secondly, the "balance of discussion" isn't out of whack. I have been beating this poor recruiting drum the last few days, however, I started a thread earlier today about my observations of today's game. There is only so much to talk about regarding what actually happened. Recruiting and the future can go in any direction so there is plenty more to talk about. Finally, for those of you that don't want to look SOOO distantly into the future as next year, what do you propose we talk about? Should we agonize over each and every possession of today's game until January 3rd? Then we can pat each other on the back after we annihilate one of the worst teams in the country...get used to it, recruiting is an essential part of building a program and people want to talk about it. When you come into a year with multiple schollies not given out, lose two more players, and have zero commitments in the fall when many schools are already done and moved on to the next class you're going to hear some negativity. And deservedly so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlumniFan Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 I have no idea about Roy, but I can absolutely guarantee you that Brad is NOT ignoring history. Having two sons 22 and 25 I can tell you that persuading them to take out the trash is tough enough. Persuading them to go to a particular college when 10 other programs are in their ear cannot be easy. Brad made some moves and brought in players that, at the time, appearred to be solutions. They did not work out. Bad luck or bad skill? Not sure, but it sure as hell wasn't as if Brad ignored the need or history for that matter. "A strong man stands up for himself; a stronger man stands up for others." - Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 I'm 100% sure Brad realizes that we need to sign some big men for next year in the worst way. I'm also sure he will do his best to get it done. But for Roy to make comments like the one I quoted above and this one "if you all think we cant come up with at least the equal of donnie campbell and david robinson to go along with lisch, liddell, polk and meyer for next year to replace the departing ian vouyoukas i think you are crazy." sure seems to me like he is ignoring the history of the past 3 signing periods when it was well known that we needed to sign some quality PFs. My question to Roy would be who among the PF/C we've signed in the past 3 springs are anywhere near as good as Donnie Campbell and David Robinson? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlumniFan Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 Gotcha and fair point. Wasn't Robinson undersized? It seems like he and Dobbs were, inch for inch, two of our most effective "big men". If we could just get our current big men to play with the heart (and body love) of Donnie Dobbs we would be a top 25 team. "A strong man stands up for himself; a stronger man stands up for others." - Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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