davidnark Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 http://forums.stltoday.com/viewtopic.php?t=236312 "SLU fans are some of the most amazing creatures around. The program is an embarrassment, an inexcusable embarrassment at that, and yet these fans continue to act as if they're being persecuted by anyone who types in a couple of sentences that raise questions. Poor little SLU...everyone is so mean to their little SLU boys. Remarkable. If you're happy with what's going on with SLU basketball, knock yourself out. Others have higher standards. And I won't lower my standards just because some of you are living in 1947." "And furthermore ... I don't even know why the Post-Dispatch wastes resources covering SLU basketball. We could make such better use of our budget money and manpower." Pardon my french, but the guy sure sounds like a first-class jackass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYBill Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 I'm so glad Bernie wrote that. The press needs to start calling SLU out even more. The school should be disgraced by this year's performance. The AD has been a disaster - absolutely ZERO improvement, at least that I've seen. I mean give a real update on the stadium at least. They won't even do that. Saying it will be built and we're expecting a few major contributions is not a real update. We're more than $25 million away. Does she think we're that stupid. SLU basketball is an absolute joke right now, there's no sense denying it. It's just no fun and until fans start putting feet to the fire SLU will try to skate by on the cheap and mediocre. Thanks Bernie! >http://forums.stltoday.com/viewtopic.php?t=236312 > >"SLU fans are some of the most amazing creatures around. >The program is an embarrassment, an inexcusable >embarrassment at that, and yet these fans continue to act as >if they're being persecuted by anyone who types in a couple >of sentences that raise questions. Poor little >SLU...everyone is so mean to their little SLU boys. >Remarkable. If you're happy with what's going on with SLU >basketball, knock yourself out. Others have higher >standards. And I won't lower my standards just because some >of you are living in 1947." > >"And furthermore ... I don't even know why the Post-Dispatch >wastes resources covering SLU basketball. We could make such >better use of our budget money and manpower." > > >Pardon my french, but the guy sure sounds like a first-class >jackass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGoat Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 The truth of the matter is that everyone is entitled to his/her opinion and Bernie just happens to have a loud stage from which to voice his. Whether or not he chooses to agree/disagree with what is going on is his own perogative. Let him be ignorant and mis-informed about it, for all I care. At this point, any publicity is good at all with the way things have been going. I like the fact that there is going to be something to really prove and hence prove others wrong next year and in the near future. AND, when the tides are coming around our way once again, he will be on the bandwagon singing our praises and how he could see the turnaround as it was occuring. The main thing that people need to learn is to take sportswriters with the biggest grain of salt EVER. It is opinion. Nothing more, nothing less. That is why they are columnists and not beat writers, their job is to stir ###### up and for the most part he and Burwell do their jobs well. Just because they write something doesn't mean the editor/fans have to agree with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pooch1918 Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 Bernie has no axe to grind with SLU...he's calling it like it is. And stirring things up a little. It's all in his job description. He's wrong about none of what he said, BTW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlumniFan Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 Bernie has VERY thin skin when criticized - there is absolutely, positively no doubt about that whatsoever. He is reacting to our comments and e-mails about his comments on Gordon. And don't think that he doesn't read this board. Personally, he has a minimal impact on anything that is important to the SLU program. No recruit is going to listen to his nonsense. No serious donor is going to listen to his blathering. The administration has made it pretty clear by their actions that the Post is a non-starter. So let him dole out his drivel all he wants. The more controversy he creates from having his ego bruised, the more people who were previously completely unengaged from SLU will start to read on their own about SLU. And, the SLU story, especially overall, is a great story. As for basketball, we had four freshmen on the floor hanging in there with L'ville today. Next year they are all back plus two new frosh that will probably contribute right off the bat. Bernie has always had it out for SLU - it just ebbs and flows. I guess it is a slow news period in sports so he is turning his targets on us so he has something to write. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlumniFan Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 nm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 He is right we could use Gordon ... but Gordon couldn't get in so it is irrelevant. However ... I wish we had a major that would help us get guys like him in Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGoat Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 This is what all the fuss is about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 Living in NYC you miss the opportunity to attend SLU's home games. Sure, SLU is 7-17, and yes we are disappointed with our win-loss record. Unfortunately, Frericks was lost for the season with concussions, and Bryant isn't the same player(when he played)because of foot and ankle injuries. As a result SLU has to play three freshmen in a real men's league. NYBILL, what you are missing is the fun and excitement of watching the three freshmen and our 6-10 soph center play at a high energy level. Even with a crappy record, this group of hard working Billiken players bring fans back to the Savvis. In addition to the exciting young Billikens, SLU has two really good local recruits coming in next year. The young quality players and the move to the A-10 gives most Billiken fans something to look forward too. I'd wager that season ticket sales will increase over the summer months even after this piss-poor season. Disgraced.....no way, AD a disaster.....no way, is this a team for front-running fans.....no way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjray Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 David, I think you bated Bernie by going to his message board and complaining about the few comments he made a week or so ago in "Bernie Bits". Should we really be complaining about our media coverage on the STLToday.com board when our team has 7 wins? You may very well be right that we are not getting a fair shake from Bernie and the Post but it makes us look bad when we publicly complain about it while our program is way down. As a SLU hoops fan, I'm disappointed you went to Bernie's board and did that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlumniFan Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 It is one thing for Bernie to criticize the results of the program. It is another to make a statement which appears to be in direct contradiction to the facts. IF Gordon really said on the radio that he did not have the grades to get into SLU, then Bernie misled readers within the context of what he wrote, plain and simple, and he should be called on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjray Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 I accept that point but that was not the lead in David's post on Bernie's pressbox: http://forums.stltoday.com/viewtopic.php?t=236312 It reads more like a general complaint about the coverage SLU gets as opposed to a factually based attack on a specific report. We need to be careful not to cry wolf to the media if we ever expect to receive positive coverage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYBill Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 You just can't defend 7-17, under any circumstances. I don't think it helps the program to try to put a positive spin on a 7-17 season. The program will only get better when the supporters demand it - isn't that capitalism AlumniFan? >Living in NYC you miss the opportunity to attend SLU's home >games. Sure, SLU is 7-17, and yes we are disappointed with >our win-loss record. Unfortunately, Frericks was lost for >the season with concussions, and Bryant isn't the same >player(when he played)because of foot and ankle injuries. As >a result SLU has to play three freshmen in a real men's >league. > >NYBILL, what you are missing is the fun and excitement of >watching the three freshmen and our 6-10 soph center play at >a high energy level. > >Even with a crappy record, this group of hard working >Billiken players bring fans back to the Savvis. In addition >to the exciting young Billikens, SLU has two really good >local recruits coming in next year. The young quality >players and the move to the A-10 gives most Billiken fans >something to look forward too. I'd wager that season ticket >sales will increase over the summer months even after this >piss-poor season. > >Disgraced.....no way, AD a disaster.....no way, is this a >team for front-running fans.....no way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidnark Posted February 21, 2005 Author Share Posted February 21, 2005 JJ, I beg to differ. The very first line of my post on BM's forum is a direct link to Bernie's article that mentioned Gordon (which was published yesterday BTW). Much of my initial post specifically references the Gordon comment, and the remainder of my initial post indirectly references the issue. My problem with Bernie is that he is misinformed regarding most college basketball issues, but yet he speaks as though he has first hand knowledge. Unfortunately, most casual readers assume that he has first hand knowledge. This is not the first time he has erred in his column to the detriment of SLU. Those who regularly read Bernie's bits column may remember when he criticized SLU for not signing Troy Slaten--who is currently an average D2 player. Those who read Bernie's forum may also remember when he claimed that Dwayne "Pope"--a sophomore at Vashon at the time--would be following Jimmey McKinney to Mizzou. In my string of posts on BM's forum, I asked why so many posters over there regularly diss SLU. I think the answer is clear: it starts at the top with BM and trickles down to the average poster on that forum. BM can't have it both ways. He can't criticize SLU for not signing mid-level D1 prospects out of SLU and then criticize SLU for not being a top 25 D1 program. The bottom line is that BM is a bandwagon guy, and right now the SLU bandwagon is not very crowded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidnark Posted February 21, 2005 Author Share Posted February 21, 2005 NYBill, you are nuts. Spreading false information that degrades the program is not good under any circumstances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlumniFan Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 nm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjray Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 I see where you are coming from but the problem is that we are in a weak position right now to argue that anyone is screwing us over in the press. They just slap us with the "winer" tag and it becomes a finger pointing exercise. I'd just stick with facts: i.e., SLU has a problem recruiting JUCOs who can qualify elsewhere because we don't have a PE major. I forget the exact rule (I am sure you remember) but a JUCO trans can't apply the PE credit hours toward eligibility at SLU whereas he can at other schools such as Mizzou. Bernie obviously does not understand this situation and assumes SLU is applying some sort of subjective standard of its own making on admissions ala the Craig Upchurch fiasco. I bet Bernie has the Craig Upchurch thing in his mind and thinks the same stuff is still going (i.e., the player qualifies per NCAA rules but SLU just decideds they won't let him in). He needs to know that SLU is committed under Biondi (so I have heard) to not repeating the Upchurch disaster and shall accept all b-ball recruits who qualify per NCAA rules. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheltiedave Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 The fact of the matter - Lorenzo could not be accepted into SLU as a transferring juco because he would start on academic probation, and his cumulative transfer hours were not sufficient to slot into a SLU degree program. Case closed. Lorenzo is working hard, improving academically, and should become a successful person due to his hard work and dedication at ISU. Bully for him, good for ISU, and hopefully other players at Vashon can realize that hard working hitting the books CAN begin while in high school. It is very interesting to watch Bernie self destruct over SLU, and a shame he didn't come out with a similar quote last year regarding Mizzou. He wouldn't be alive today if he had done such, and I have lost all respect for Bernie. He wants total worship that he alone has all the facts and is supremely knowledgable of every matter. It ain't so, Bernie. I guess the next time I want to learn something about SLU basketball, I won't bother reading info from an overweight recovering alcoholic who swills from free food troughs provided by those he disparages. What a waste of time, expecting equitable treatment from the Post. In hindsight though, they sold so many papers last year with the slog through Mizzou's ethical nightmare, we should expect them to do the same in our venues... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 to the casual fan, you are right. 7-17 is horrible. but what i have seen is improvement by the youngsters galore. you do realize that of the 17 losses that 12 could VERY EASILY been won? it isnt like this team is being out matched every game. i think back to claggett and highmark's freshman season. they only won 5 games and were getting beat by more by worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 he is most certainly lying about the way he is portraying the recruitment of lorenzo gordon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 jj, he lied about gordon. for that bernie should be called out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 You wouldn't come to me for a used auto. You wouldn't go to Skip for a home loan. You wouldn't go to Roy for your lawn care needs. WHY, IN THE NAME OF ALL THAT'S HOLY, WOULD YOU GO TO BERNIE FOR INFO ON COLLEGE ATHLETICS? I know more than he does and I don't know anything about basketball other than the Billikens. This board is a better source than Bernie has. He may not know about our problems getting juco in. He probably couldn't pick Frericks and Reggie out of a lineup of Fransiscan nuns. He is clueless. I'll be happy to scooch over a little bit so he can get his fat posterior on the bandwagon in a year or two. In the meantime I'd ask him to shut the heck up about things he doesn't know about. Good advise for all of us......wait this is an internet message board...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 no argument from me rich. and the fact that there is very little traffic on the slu message board at stltoday.com or at bernie's board in regards to slu discussion tells you that most hardcore slu fans dont frequent the post or stltoday.com. however, if we expect the attendance at billiken games to get back to the 17k it was in the mid 90's, that has to come from st louis casual fans that do believe bernie and the post are the end all of information. they read slu sucks slu, isnt trying, soderberg is not a good coach, they believe it. thus if someone like davidnark doesnt go there occasionally and call them on their lies and misinformation the spiral down will continue. so i applaud davidnark and his efforts over the weekend. btw, i have weekly been sending larry starks, who is stu durando's boss, an e-mail asking him to provide the recruiting article he claims the post published in the last few months that would have detailed who else slu was recruiting to fill those last two scholarships. amazingly, larry doesnt answer my e-mails anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesycow Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 "Those who read Bernie's forum may also remember when he claimed that Dwayne "Pope"--a sophomore at Vashon at the time--would be following Jimmey McKinney to Mizzou." How is this to the detriment of SLU in any way? When Polk was a sophomore how certain were you he was going to SLU? Didn't he have a knee injury that caused a lot of schools to withdraw interest following his sophomore year? I understand the point you're trying to make, but I feel like you're reaching a bit for evidence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesycow Posted February 21, 2005 Share Posted February 21, 2005 Didn't this all start because of errant information in Bernie's Bits surrounding Gordon? Wasn't that comment about gordon directly preceeded by a criticism of Mizzou? Just checking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.