Need more coaches like him!!!!!!

[bleedbluegary]

Bill Parcells, Vince Lombardi, Bob Knight, Mike Ditka, Rick Majerus, Lou Holtz, Bear Bryant, Woody Hayes.

These are the types of coaches we need. The players who played for these guys and played for four years are glad the did. These guys would do anything for these coaches, and the coaches for their players. Oh those were the days.

[brianstl]

Bill Parcells, Vince Lombardi, Bob Knight, Mike Ditka, Rick Majerus, Lou Holtz, Bear Bryant, Woody Hayes.

These are the types of coaches we need. The players who played for these guys and played for four years are glad the did. These guys would do anything for these coaches, and the coaches for their players. Oh those were the days.

I am glad you take time away from working on your question/speech for the coaches show next week to post here. Gary remember to breathe while you are on the air. I would hate for you to drop dead next week.

[Postcard]

Bill Parcells, Vince Lombardi, Bob Knight, Mike Ditka, Rick Majerus, Lou Holtz, Bear Bryant, Woody Hayes.

These are the types of coaches we need. The players who played for these guys and played for four years are glad the did. These guys would do anything for these coaches, and the coaches for their players. Oh those were the days.

You're probably right, except for the players Knight and Hayes hit. Wasn't Lou Holtz on probation just about everywhere he coached? Great example for the kids - cheat and leave. Tony Dungy won't even utter a cuss word yet he was somehow able to win a Super Bowl. Bill Bellichek is about as cerebral as they come. My point is there is more than one way to skin a cat. Perhaps you crave the hard core disciplinarian, others don't need that.

[Majerus Magic]

You're probably right, except for the players Knight and Hayes hit. Wasn't Lou Holtz on probation just about everywhere he coached? Great example for the kids - cheat and leave. Tony Dungy won't even utter a cuss word yet he was somehow able to win a Super Bowl. Bill Bellichek is about as cerebral as they come. My point is there is more than one way to skin a cat. Perhaps you crave the hard core disciplinarian, others don't need that.

You mean the bill billichek who got caught cheating earlier this year and who doesn't have the best reputation in regards to his personal life?

[Postcard]

You mean the bill billichek who got caught cheating earlier this year and who doesn't have the best reputation in regards to his personal life?

Good point. I had forgotten about that. Scratch him off the list. Although he isn't a big rah rah, in your face guy like many on the list. How about Dick Vermeil? He would cry and hug players before he would say a bad thing about them.

Bill Walsh

Tom Landry

Phil Jackson

In fact you could probably list many more coaches who don't fit the Hayes/Knight/Holtz, etc mold who were just as if not more sucessful than the coaches mentioned.

[Westy03]

Good point. I had forgotten about that. Scratch him off the list. Although he is a big rah rah, in your face guy like many on the list. How about Dick Vermeil? He would cry and hug players before he would say a bad thing about them.

Bill Walsh

Tom Landry

Phil Jackson

In fact you could probably list many more coaches who don't fit the Hayes/Knight/Holtz, etc mold who were just as if not more sucessful than the coaches mentioned.

Actually Dick Vermeil was brutally hard on his players during practice and then later was the players best friend, kind of sounds a lot like Majerus.

[brianstl]

Actually Dick Vermeil was brutally hard on his players during practice and then later was the players best friend, kind of sounds a lot like Majerus.

Everybody forgets that the players were basically revolting the year before the SB against DV. Bruce hated him and blamed his injuries on DV's practices.

[Billiken Rich]

Good point. I had forgotten about that. Scratch him off the list. Although he is a big rah rah, in your face guy like many on the list. How about Dick Vermeil? He would cry and hug players before he would say a bad thing about them.

Bill Walsh

Tom Landry

Phil Jackson

In fact you could probably list many more coaches who don't fit the Hayes/Knight/Holtz, etc mold who were just as if not more sucessful than the coaches mentioned.

Cowboys to the bone! And a fan of Landry but how quickly we forget the players who HATED him, came up with the term "plastic man" and thought the flex defense was the work of the devil........

There's good and bad in every coach even the man in the hat.......

[Postcard]

Actually Dick Vermeil was brutally hard on his players during practice and then later was the players best friend, kind of sounds a lot like Majerus.

I'm not saying the coaches initially listed were bad just that there is this implied notion in the post that the "old school" coaches were perfect and that coaching begins and ends with them.

Everybody forgets that the players were basically revolting the year before the SB against DV. Bruce hated him and blamed his injuries on DV's practices.

If you also remember, Vermeil eased up on the players in practice and if memory serves correct had a pretty good few years after that. Walsh always had his players practice in shells or didn't have them hit during the week so they would be fresh for the game and throughout the year. That's the anthesis of what someone like Bryant would have done. Point is, both worked.

[Majerus Magic]

Good point. I had forgotten about that. Scratch him off the list. Although he isn't a big rah rah, in your face guy like many on the list. How about Dick Vermeil? He would cry and hug players before he would say a bad thing about them.

Bill Walsh

Tom Landry

Phil Jackson

In fact you could probably list many more coaches who don't fit the Hayes/Knight/Holtz, etc mold who were just as if not more sucessful than the coaches mentioned.

I don't think Jackson is a good coach. What has he done without Kobe and Shaq or Michael and Scottie?

[moytoy12]

I'm asking because I don't know, how did/do coaches like Rupp, Sutton, Tubby Smith, Bill Self, Howland, Dean Smith, Roy Williams, Coach K, etc. coach? I'm sure they are all over the board, which goes to show what someone else said...there's more than one way to skin a cat.

[Postcard]

I don't think Jackson is a good coach. What has he done without Kobe and Shaq or Michael and Scottie?

Great point. Riley sucks as well. So does Chuck Daley. So does Red Auerbach. Add John Wooden to that list. Soderberg got alot out of not much talent. He could out coach any of those guys probably.

[Malibubill]

I would respectfully submit that some of you are missing the point. You are assuming there is a 'perfect' coach (and appear to be upset that Rick is not that 'perfect' coach), when in reality there is no such thing as a perfect coach (and if there were, he sure as hell wouldn't come to SLU - my apologies to those of you who are offended by profanity but I think there are bigger issues here and in the world than that). This debate about Rick and his coaching style misses the boat in my opinion and frankly I don't think anything constructive will come of it, so I offer the following for those of you debating the pros and cons of Rick and his style to consider. And I write as a teacher.

When it is all said and done, a coach is nothing more than a teacher (and I think Rick knows that more than most coaches). Learning is a two way street. Teachers have their way of teaching, and students have their way of learning. My way of teaching does not work for every student. No one teacher's style of teaching works for everyone. A good teacher realizes that, accepts that, and does not try to force all of his or her students to learn his or her way. When I teach upper level elective classes, the first thing I do is tell my students my expectations, my teaching style, and then I tell them if they don't like it, there are the doors and they can still drop the course. If they don't like my teaching style, or if my teaching style is not compatible with their learning style, it is not in their best interests to stay in my class (there are other teachers who teach the same course with different teaching styles), and it is not in my best interests for them to stay in the courses. The best case scenario is for me to have a class of students who enjoy my teaching style and who learn best under it.

So too for coaching. There are many different coaching styles and many different types of athletes. Not all athletes will strive and develop under each style. The ideal is the perfect match. The perfect match is the coach who is best for that particular player - not for some abstract player, and not for 'my son,' but for the player in question. More than most coaches, Rick knows and understands that. He is looking for the type of player who will strive and develop in his system - just as Brad looked for players that he thought would strive and develop in his system. Seems to me that from a fan's perspective the question we should be asking is whether this coach can recruit enough athletes who will strive and develop in his system that the program will improve. Brad had his chance. From everything I read about Brad, he was a first class, a first rate individual - but unfortunately he could not recruit enough athletes to his system for the program to be successful long term (great year last year, but I think everyone would agree that the cupboard was starting to look bare). The question is whether Rick can recruit enough athletes that will be successful in his system that the program will improve. Too early to tell, but early signs (next year's recruiting class) look promising. So give him a break. Rome was not built in a day, nor are successful basketball programs.

Moreover, for those of you who don't like Rick's blunt style, while I have reservations about it as well, it does serve an important service. Rick knows that he is recruiting athletes and that he needs athletes who will 'fit' in his system. Many coaches 'misrepresent' themselves when recruiting athletes on the assumption that if they can get the athlete to come to the program, the kid will be reluctant to transfer out (look like a loser or a quitter). Rick does not misrepresent himself. He is giving notice to all prospective recruits what his expectations are and style is. Like a good teacher, he sees coaching as a partnership. He is willing to work as hard, if not harder, than his players to see them succeed, but the players have to be willing to work as hard as he is. If you are an athlete, and you don't have the drive or discipline for his approach, it would not be in your best interest or Rick's best interest for you to come to SLU. All he is doing is giving the prospective athletes notice - 'this is who I am and what I expect, if you don't like it, there is the door.' I, for one, think that is the best way and the way all coaches should be. Be open and honest with the kids and let them select the coach and program that is best for them.

Which bring me to the criticism of Rick's comments that he did not select these kids and they did not select him. All he is doing is being honest again and acknowledging that not all kids strive and develop under his system (or any coach's system for that matter, a fact overlooked by many on this board). That is a fact of life (not an opinion). Transitions are tough on all parties involved, Rick and the current players. All have different expectations. That is unfortunately, but it is inherent in change of this nature. As fans we should do our best to try to support the team to help get all parties involved through this difficult year. Booing them is not the answer. This is our team. They need our support this year more than ever, not this criticism of a trying year.

And lastly, remember that TV commercial - most of these student-athletes will be going professional in something other than sports. They will be graduates of St. Louis University who will go out into the community and represent the University. Is Rick recruiting athletes who will represent the University well? I think the answer is yes. I agree that previous coaches did as well. I just wanted to make sure that we keep all of this in perspective. These are not professional athletes. This is not a professional team. This is a college team, these are student-athletes. Rick is teaching them life lessons, not just basketball. He is teaching them skills that will serve them well after their lives as athletes are over. Brad and previous coaches did that as well, and for that we should be thankful that SLU has had a great tradition of great coaches of life's lessons. And isn't that in keeping with our Jesuit tradition.

Just a few thoughts from afar from a novice poster.

[Majerus Magic]

Great point. Riley sucks as well. So does Chuck Daley. So does Red Auerbach. Add John Wooden to that list. Soderberg got alot out of not much talent. He could out coach any of those guys probably.

Alright, so a coach is only as good as his players. I rest my case.

[Postcard]

Alright, so a coach is only as good as his players. I rest my case.

Partially. But some coaches are better than others. It can be argued how much they affect a game or season in the different sports but there is a little more to it than saying "a coach is only as good as his players." Do you consider Bill Walsh and Rich Brooks equals?

[billiken_roy]

I don't think Jackson is a good coach. What has he done without Kobe and Shaq or Michael and Scottie?

that might be more a matter of being "distracted" by the boss's daughter and losing his edge than being a bad coach. no other nba coach in history has as many championships. even if it was done with the right players, he still had to be able to balance egos and make that work. a lot of other "all-star" sports teams have been assembled and never came close to the run of championships that jackson won in chicago and LA.

[Majerus Magic]

no other nba coach in history has as many championships.

Red Auberbach has more.

even if it was done with the right players, he still had to be able to balance egos and make that work.

How did that Shaq and Kobe thing end up?

a lot of other "all-star" sports teams have been assembled and never came close to the run of championships that jackson won in chicago and LA

.

Yankees?

Patriots?

Celtics??!?

[Postcard]

Red Auberbach has more.

They both have nine unless I"m mistaken. I'm sure Auerbach had more Hall of Famers on his teams than Jackson had.

a lot of other "all-star" sports teams have been assembled and never came close to the run of championships that jackson won in chicago and LA.

Yankees?

Patriots?

Celtics??!?

The Yankees have arguably had the most talent the last 6 years and haven't won the World Series. The Braves had lots of talent and only won one WS during their run. I could name countless NBA teams that have a lot of talent that haven't won the big one.

Face it dude. Jackson is a great coach. So was Scotty Bowman(who had some talent). So was John Wooden.

You never answered my question about Bill Walsh and Rich Brooks. Do you consider them equals or are you able to admit that some guys can coach better than others?

[Majerus Magic]

They both have nine unless I"m mistaken. I'm sure Auerbach had more Hall of Famers on his teams than Jackson had.

The Yankees have arguably had the most talent the last 6 years and haven't won the World Series. The Braves had lots of talent and only won one WS during their run. I could name countless NBA teams that have a lot of talent that haven't won the big one.

Face it dude. Jackson is a great coach. So was Scotty Bowman(who had some talent). So was John Wooden.

You never answered my question about Bill Walsh and Rich Brooks. Do you consider them equals or are you able to admit that some guys can coach better than others?

Sorry I forgot to answer your question. Of course I would say that Bill Walsh is a better coach. Also, I would say that Walsh had more talent. The job that Books is doing at Kentucky is pretty good.

[brianstl]

Sorry I forgot to answer your question. Of course I would say that Bill Walsh is a better coach. Also, I would say that Walsh had more talent. The job that Books is doing at Kentucky is pretty good.

He also did a great job building the Oregon program. The Duck fans love him.

[kevinfootes]

Bill Parcells, Vince Lombardi, Bob Knight, Mike Ditka, Rick Majerus, Lou Holtz, Bear Bryant, Woody Hayes.

These are the types of coaches we need. The players who played for these guys and played for four years are glad the did. These guys would do anything for these coaches, and the coaches for their players. Oh those were the days.

You're right, coaches like these are the only ones who have ever been succesful. That's why Vern Rapp had such a great run with the Cardinals.

Who wouldn't want a football coach who will punch opposing players?

RM has a great winning percentage, but he lacks the championships that these other coaches have. This isn't really the best comparison.