Quality Is Job 1

Taj, what are you talking about? I understand you're not in St. Louis and may not hear Billiken broadcasts on a regular basis, but I don't understand how this is peripheral to Billiken basketball. It was a Billiken broadcast and involved Bob Ramsey fawning over a Mizzou game during a Billiken game. It's similar to topics we've discussed at length dozens of times in the past.

So, that's 17 NBA players from A-10 schools compared to 3 NBA players from Missouri Valley schools. I imagine those three include Troy Hudson (Southern Illinois), who actually started at a Big 8 (Big XII) school.

another bump

>We've got 14-14 talent. Southern Miss and TCU have more >athletic talent than us. The reason we're 18-12 is because >Brad is our coach. Southern Miss and TCU may have more athleticism than SLU, but they're not more talented than SLU. I think people are selling the Billikens short on their talent. Giftedness and talent are not the same thing. Giftedness = nature = genetics Talent = nurture = hard work Southern Miss and TCU may be more gifted than the Billikens, but the talent of Soderberg's team overcame them.

Tony Bobbitt was the Cincinnati player that took the cheap shot by the DePaul player, who was ejected from the game. Bobbitt did return to the game (according to the highlights &l;and lowlights&r; I saw on CBS) and help his team win.

err, bump

>"Once again, Gordon alternate a positive statement with a >slap. I contend with the idea that the Bills ever "appeared >to be swirling down the drain" this season. When? During the >three-game road losing streak? Please! That was par for the >course." > >3 game road losing streaks are not "par" for the course >unless you have no high expectations for your team. I was >dissapointed in the bills when they lost 3 in a row, >shouldn't I have been? Of course I was disappointed when the Billikens lost in consecutive road games to UAB, Charlotte, and Memphis, but it's still what I had expected from when I had looked at the schedule prior to the season. You'll note that those three teams were among five that tied for the conference championship. Even for a team with high expectations, its fans can expect to lose those three straight games.

Well, the production company that does Tigers games (Leerfield) should pay the company that produces SLU's games a little something for marketing. I found it rather annoying that, during the second half, Bob Ramsey repeatedly trumpeted the Mizzou broadcast to follow the Billikens game: "For all you Mizzou fans, don't forget that Missouri-Kansas is coming up" &l;paraphrase&r;. I appreciate that KMOX has put SLU ahead of Missouri most of the time this season, but I don't think a member of SLU's broadcast team should be pushing another team. If the games occurred in reverse order, you would not have heard Mike Kelly telling listeners that (for a portion of them) the SLU broadcast would follow the conclusion of the Missouri game. Someone in the KMOX studio would have done it at an opportune time (during a break, not during the play-by-play of the game). Even if the Billikens games are produced exclusively by KMOX or a "sister" company, it should be the studio -- not Bob Ramsey -- that reminds listeners that the Mizzou game follows the SLU game. The way Bob did it makes it seem like SLU fans should have some interest in Missouri (The fact that I DO have interest in Missouri and, in fact, am listening to the broadcast that I had already known would follow the Billikens broadcast is beside the point).

The Billikens were playing their third game in three nights and had a short turnaround between games, and Cincinnati was playing for just the second consecutive night, had a couple of hours more between games, and had the adrenaline of the home crowd. Furthermore, Cincinnati is deeper than Saint Louis.

>we are the little engine that could .. how is that >condecending? .. with our milk the clock style .. and >defensive play .. and a whole 15 dunks all season .. >soderberg gets the most out of his players .. what's wrong >with that .. > >I think that's something to be proud of .. their blue collar >effort is what makes me love these teams .. I don't think of Saint Louis as a "little engine that could." The guys are good basketball players, not a bunch of Rudys. They are not David versus Goliath (well -- not against Memphis, but maybe tonight against Cincinnati, playing their third game in three nights, playing late last night and having a pretty quick turnaround). For a team to play a "milk-the-clock" style, it's amazing that they managed 72 regulation points against Memphis! Where did you get the stat that the Billikens have just 15 dunks this season? I question that. It seems to me that they have more than that. I think Brad Soderberg has done a very good job, and I commend him, but I don't know about your claim that he's gotten the most out of his players. It seems to me that he has players who have yet to reach their potential (that's not a criticism). There's nothing wrong with getting the most out of your players, but I don't think Brad has done that just yet, and he, himself, most likely believes he can get more out of some of his guys. There's nothing wrong with blue-collar teams, but whether a team is a blue-collar team or a run-for-the-races team, the idea is to win. Cincinnati is a rugged, grinding, physical, blue-collar team, but because the Bearcats win, people don't often refer to them as "blue collar."

>Hey .. i don't want to hear any complaining about this >article .. Gordo's lips were firmly placed on Billiken ass >in this article .. > >i know we think we "locked up" an NIT berth 2 weeks ago .. >but .. > >he summed things up pretty well .. i don't think he could >have written a nicer article .. Gordon has been condescending and belittling. There's no way he was kissing up to the Billikens. Rather, he was slapping them with a backhanded compliment. It's begrudging praise to try to placate Post-Dispatch readership. Your suggestion that SLU hadn't locked up an invitation to the NIT two weeks ago makes me believe that you're really a Missouri fan who follows the Billikens and gives them some sympathy points. I don't think it is a very nice article. To wit: [span style=color:gold;background-color:black]This team did so many little things well to beat a far more talented team. The Billikens worked hard defensively and forced lots of turnovers. They worked the clock. They made free throws. They took care of the basketball and took lots of good shots.[/span] While the things Gordon praised the Billikens for did happen, his notion that Memphis is "far more talented" than SLU disgusts me. I think Brad Soderberg's team is pretty darn talented. How do you "force lots of turnovers" against "a far more talented team"? [span style=color:gold;background-color:black]Let's face it, these Billikens could have gone 11-18 this season. SLU suffered some heart-breaking losses, but also pulled out some harrowing victories. This team spent much time teetering.[/span] "Teetering"? What the heck is he talking about? SLU won every game that is was "supposed" to win and even won some games they probably "shouldn't" have. [span style=color:gold;background-color:black]Had the supporting-cast players not progressed, this team could not have survived the various setbacks that arose. At various points this season, SLU appeared to be swirling down the drain.[/span] Once again, Gordon alternate a positive statement with a slap. I contend with the idea that the Bills ever "appeared to be swirling down the drain" this season. When? During the three-game road losing streak? Please! That was par for the course. [span style=color:gold;background-color:black]But the Billikens have built a season to be proud of. That 9-7 conference finish was significant. So was reaching the semifinals of the C-USA Tourney. So was advancing to at least the NIT.[/span] [span style=color:gold;background-color:black]Well done, fellas, well done.[/span] While the Billikens have surpassed my expectations for this season, I hope for so much more. I won't be content with 9-7 conference records, going no further than the semifinals of the conference tournament, and the NIT. I think Brad Soderberg feels the same way. He's pleased with the progress of his program, but he's not happy with where it is because he wants much more. Brad doesn't want to hear, "Well done" until the team has done something more significant than this.

Alameda Bob, your list exemplifies why I dislike Stanford. I have respect for Stanford, but I root against them. I realize they're good, but I don't want them to win. Like I said before, Do I have to be rational about it? Hey, if a program is no good, there's no point in "loving to hate" it.

You are aware, aren't you, that the C-USA format changed this season so that there are no divisions? SLU played every C-USA team once except for Charlotte, DePaul, and Marquette, whom they played twice. The only regular-season meeting between Cincinnati and SLU resulted in a 25-point loss at First Third Arena (fka Shoemaker Center). Besides, back in the days of the Great Midwest, a dominant Bearcats team knocked off Memphis four times on their way to the Final Four.

I don't think Washington will get in without reaching the Pac 10 final, if not winning the championship. In 1997-98, Missouri had that stretch in which they knocked off four highly rated teams at home (Kansas, Maryland, and Iowa among them) in a brief stretch, but they were denied an at-large bid because they went 8-8 in the Big XII and didn't win a single road game. That team was occasionally impressive but did not have the overall profile to garner an at-large bid. Washington, in 2004, may experience the same thing.

Oh, I don't know for certain about that. Sure, the Billikens would be 19-12 if they reached, but lost in, the Tournament champhionship, but there's still doubt about their RPI ranking. Heck, if they beat Cincy tomorrow, look for them to win on Saturday and remove all doubt.

...I'll nibble on your bait. I didn't see the game; I listened to it on the radio. I can't say John Calipari coached poorly, but I can say that, based on what I heard and what Bob Ramsey noted a few times, Brad Soderberg had all the right players on the floor at the right times. Beyond that, let's congratulate the players, because it sounded like they just outplayed and outhustled the Tigers. I was rather concerned about the Tigers' offensive rebounding, particularly in the first half, but as the second half wore on the Bills seemed to get much better on the defensive boards. Also, whatever Brad Soderberg said to Izik Ohanon after he "passed up" a dunk in favor of getting fouled on a layup attempt (he did hit the FTs) should be bottled up for future use. Furthermore, Ian Vouyoukas provided nine points and five (?) rebounds, and Justin Johnson got a big offensive rebound and putback during his stint in the second half. Heck, even Ross Varner played big on the boards. Rammer reported that with six assists, Josh Fisher is up to 426 career assists and is now the all-time Billiken assist leader (Charles Newberry had 424). Brad Soderberg's Billikens are now 5-0 in in-season rematches this year and 10-1 over the past two seasons. And the Bills are in the C-USA Tournament semifinals for the second consecutive year.

Jeremy Biles was a quick point guard; Corey Frazier was a smallish shooting guard. I believe Biles was unable to remain eligible, so he left. It's too bad, because he would have been a sophomore during the freshman seasons of Matt Baniak, Chris Heinrich, and Larry Hughes, and the team would have been quicker.

>Tom looked to be in terrible pain all night and I question >the wisdom of putting him at risk for who knows an injury >that could impact the rest of his Billiken career? IMHO he >should not see anymore action the rest of this season. I >wonder how bad his shoulder is? I had a brother who had to >have his shoulder operated on and it took quite some time >before he was back to normal. I believe I read somewhere that Tom believes he can play because he can't do any further damage to the shoulder. I guess it's not that playing will make the injury any worse, but whether or not he can tolerate the excruciating pain. It seems to me, though, that his being bumped and hacked in the shoulder by opposing players has to exacerbate the pain. Poor Tom has had a rough year. First it was the (upper) back spasms, then it was the groin strain, and now it's the separated shoulder. I hope he's healthy all season next year. If so, he could be second- or third-team all conference.

But Phillip Hunt did start.

>The post said "Romar recruited" both players. This is >false. Actually, his post says, "re-recruited." That's true.

Paul Nondas is a player from Greece who played for the Billikens for one season in the mid '90s (1996-97?). He didn't play much -- he had to adjust to USA basketball -- and had to leave the team after his first season because of obligations to the Greek Army.

The thing that makes that inbounds play by the Legend special is that that was during the only (if I'm not mistaken) game in which Larry didn't score double-digit points.

*

Saint Louis played two strings of three consecutive road games. Furthermore, SLU played Marquette, Charlotte, and DePaul twice, two of which were among the conference co-champs and all of which finished at .500 or better in conference. Missouri played Colorado, Kansas, Kansas State, Nebraska, and Iowa State twice. Kansas finished 12-4 and Colorado finished 10-6, but the others were all below .500 in the conference. Further evidence that SLU's 9-7 is better than Mizzou's 9-7 is that, while SLU did not lose to any team that had a record below .500 in the conference, Mizzou lost to Iowa State and Nebraska, both of which finished below .500.