Taj79

Ditto here as in Temple and Xavier. 12. Richmond Spiders What they're losing: Chris Mooney loses three key seniors, including point guard Kevin Anderson. The core elder statesmen of the team exhausted their eligibility and leave a hole in the lineup that won't be easily fixed. The team's top rebounder, scorer and assist man graduate this season. What they're adding: Now for the good news, help is on the way. Trey Davis (Richmond, Va./Benedictine) turned in an outstanding senior season and could be seasoned enough to make a splash as a freshman. Luke Piotrowski (Egg Harbor, N.J./Atlantic Christian) is a Mooney-style power forward and their other two recruits provide depth. What it equals: There's going to be a rebuild taking place for the Spiders. The system, structure and culture of the program are huge assets in helping the next group of players assimilate into the A-10. However, when you lose as many good, older players as the Spiders will, there's bound to be growing pains. Lots of flat tires to fix here. I can see it taking a few years. I don't see Martel being the kind of guy who steps up nor one you can build around. I thought the depletion of the talent cupboard would easily provide the impetus for Mooney to bolt to Georgia Tech. I was, of course, wrong... for the first time I might add. We should lap these guys next year. Well, at least pass them. I have a lot more respect for Mooney then I do a Brian Gregory. They had a nice mid-major run, fueled by the required need in such a program -- guys staying in the system for four years and gettin gprogressively better. They are not, however, stocked to reload, as xavier always seems to be.

Same topic as the OT: Xavier thread. 7. Temple Owls What they're losing: The inside presence of center Lavoy Allen is the most significant loss for the Owls. Allen played a ton as a freshman so there's precedent for young bigs entering the program and stepping onto the court. What they're adding: So far, the Owls signed just one player but we love him. Will Cummings (Jacksonville, Fla./Providence) is a very good point guard. He came on strong as a senior and we see him as a guy who can impact the program down the road. What it equals: Reasonable expectations for this team to continue trending toward the top of the A-10 remain intact. Ramone Moore exploded this season and if he can take another step up with his game it would mean the world to the Owls. Replacing Allen might not be that hard. I voted him a disappointment this year because he, like, Chris Wright at Dayton, ddin't really improve as much as i thought he should and how I thought he would dominate a weak interior league presence. But, lik emy comments in another thread about loie and Ellis, maybe Allen jsut wasn't the inside terror I though thim to be. Neither was Aaric Murray for that matter. I think Temple, with the heavy senior presence of Moore, Fernandez and Eric will keep them relevant in the A10 title hunt. I still think the title hunt route leads through Cincinnati but you will have to go through Philly before you get to Cincy. Issue here seems once again to be depth. Will Temple have it and does it really matter with Fran Dunphy's bunch? He needs a big or two. We might be able to catch these guys; Xavier i don't think so.

Since we didn't make the Dance, there is little to say about us at thispoint igven we don't know what Rick and company are up to concerning the spring signing period. But here is what they are saying about Xavier. Xavier Musketeers What they're losing: The losses are manageable for coach Chris Mack. Jamel McLean is the team's top rebounder, but aside from his presence inside, Mack won't have to re-write the script. The only potential hitch in Mack's giddyup is Tu Holloway. If he gets happy feet for professional basketball would cause some rain clouds to form for Xavier. What they're adding: This is where it's exciting for Musketeers fans. With a strong nucleus, "X" is adding three good recruits. The best of the lot is Dezmine Wells (Raleigh, N.C./Hargrave Military). Wells is one of the best finishers in high school ball and he's country strong. Jalen Reynolds (Stevenson, Mich./Stevenson) has explosion and Darwin Davis (Bloomington, Ind./South) is a top 30 point guard. Translation: Another good class is on the way. Plus, Mack has former Monmouth standout Travis Taylor (who averaged 17 points, 7 rebounds per game) ready to rock next fall. What it equals: This program is one of the healthiest in the nation and the class of its league. Combine the incoming talent with the established players and Mack can pencil himself into the tournament for a few years to come. I did not know about the Monmouth transfer. But, as a word of caution, I recall Xavier's last class, with Jay Canty and Jordan Lantham as "great" recruits and they did essentially nothing this year. Still, all roads to league titles will go through Cincinnati. As usual.

Thanks. For some reason, I thought Kim English, who is local here to Baltimore (Randallstown, I think), was his nephew (otherwise why would he go so far away to a non-typical basketball school). And then for him to say this, I thought "WOW!' But if he ain't then I get it. Again, thanks.

I'll only go to 1250 words in this responser, in deference to kshoe .... My opinions on the local talent scene are well-known. I don't know that they are totally and irrefutably correct. I think whoever said it best was the one talking about second-tier local kids. D1 talent is obviously there, the names are all over the Final Four just past and big time programs are taking all the big-time St. Louis recruits --- who move on to eventually be dependable contributors in national programs. There still remains very few "stars." There is absolutely no reason for these guys to even give a sideway glance to our program. Could we have won with the lineup slu72 suggests? One would think so but if I'm condemning speculative threads on who we will start and play next year and what our record will be, then speculating on how such a lineup would do at SLU in the A10 is even more ludicrous. The key point I take away from this article is the one we've discussed here ad nauseum --- that if you're considered "that" good, you are NOT staying at SLU and Mizzou's chances of getting you, while slightly better than SLU's, aren't very good either. I don't think attention paid by either staff matters in those cases, making it impossible for SLU to ever get the big St. Louis talent. Ever. Unless you win and win for the next ten or twenty years. Outside the rare chance the stars align (Douglas/Gray, Claggs/Hmark, Hughes).

Wasn't one of Anderson's recruits his nephew? Some sort of relation? Was that English? If not, who and what is their status? Did this person graduate or are they still on the roster? Just curious.

Anyone thinking Rob and Cody are suddenly going to develop this interior game and presence can't see the forest for the trees. Loe might, by that great equalizer that you can't teach (height), but Ellis' game is not an interior one. He didn't get his rep playing in the paint I suspect. Plus, having had shoulder surgery myself, his off-season development is going to involve just getting back to where he was --- a stop-n-pop outside shooter. Add to that the fact that he is too slow to guard a three and not big enough or strong enough to match up on the inside as a four and Cody and Rob are the same player at this point, advantage Rob on the height. Expecting them to morph into something they are not now is a high expectation on anyone's part. The relief will be in the recruit(s) and if history shows us anything, the guys still around for spring signings aren't usually guys you build a foundation on. Plus --- if we are to believe all the hub-bub around Rick and his system and how long it takes to learn it, then expecting some spring signee to come in and be good enough to play, along with learning about the Majerus' gameplan and inf what is needed to stay out of the doghouse and on the court, is expecting a lot. This is the very reason Reed's return was critical in my book. Of course, if you have four guys standing around the bomb line, it makes the middle open up and allows for driving point guards (KM, JJ) to do their deeds and if the exterior drops down to double team, we have the opening for both the bomb and the slasher (DE) going backdoor. But as someone already said, live by the three, die by the three. Uconns bigs weren't nothing more than an option last night, but a valuable option at that just to have said pesence.

Metz ... it is an idiotic question .... if one Billiken boarder chooses "B" they are out of their minds. There is no choice in this question therefore its idiotic in my book. Butler frankly looked like us at times in that game last night. Norad can't shoot and was playing the role of Dwayne Polk. Zach Hahn was/is the Butler version of Paul Eckerle. Smith as Husak? Enuff said. Howard was just a three-inch taller version of Luke Meyer -- a battler dramatically overmatched. Mack could have played the role of any number of past Bills last night ---- Cory Frazier, John Redden, Virgil Cobbin all come to mind. Stigall hit two threes in the first and then one more in the second ..... I dunno, maybe Kyle Cassity, Christian Salescich or Drew Deiner all come to mind. Not bad, but certainly not good nor the best. Watching Butler was like watching the real life version of "Hoosiers" only they all weren't from small-town Indiana and they didn't pull out the Hollywood ending. There was no Jimmy Chitwood. As I said coming back from the Cleveland pod, we do not get these kinds of athletes. Instead of Okiakhi or CJ Fair or Dallas Lauderdale or Rick Jackson or Jae Crawford, we get guys like Justin Johnson, Barry Eberhardt, Va'shune Newborne, Horace Dixon and Cory Remekun. Just saying. Okwandu looked like some alien freak out there -- but his talent didn't match up with his size --- yet. But he's a senior and out of Uconn forever. Of course, you can't teach size so he'll likely land a paying gig somewhere. I liked SLU's movement from the MCC outward, but wish the old Great Midwest had stayed together. If Grawer hadn't burned out (or was given the necessary resources back then) we might have been able to parlay the MCC success into something greater, as Xavier eventually did. But its all still a crapshoot and one never knows for sure. Loyola of Chicago waslarge for a while in those old MCC days. And who did they just hire? Butler has somehow hit that lucky meteor ride ala Gonzaga and Xavier. I would not say any of those three are at the same plateau as Geoergetown and Villanova because of national titles won and their stars can fade if they don't start making more national noise soon. VCU? Shaka was indeed smart to re-up with them for the number he did. I don't know that they'll be back but they should be. Them, Mason and Old Dominion have been playing some nice ball in the Colonial for some time now. Thjey'll stay relevant for anothetr two years based on this -- longer if they continue to win and show up in the dance annually. Hope will always spring eternal for us but its indeed tough being a Billiken fan. Much like St. Joe's, our "hawk" will never die either.

Watched the first half. As Tony Kornheiser said yesterday on PTI when discussing this game, the game had the "ridiculous starting tip of "nine-twenty-three eastern thereby guaranteeing the loss of the majority of the east coast audience by halftime." Watching this game or sleep? I went to bed. Nice, idiotic question Metz ...... I just think of how our athletic department would BOTCH the sales of Billiken merchandise despite being in two straight championship games, no matter the outcome. I have to tip my hat to the Butler group. In hindsight, I just don't see how that team (and that team plus Gordon Hayward) makes not one but two Final Fours/Final Twos. The talent level was weak -- but it worked so who can knock them. They played tough defense and really made playing ugly work. There isn't a guy on that team I'd say was a "must have." But the sum was a total of its parts. Stevens will never be hotter --- if he wants to go, now is the only time he will have IMO. On the flip side, Uconn wasn't really much better and a tip of the hat to them and Kemba Walker for carrying them. I've got to learn that you have to pick the Big East tournament winner to make a nice run in my brackets from here on out. Anyone on that roster a "must have?" Yes -- definitley Lamb and Oriaki and even Walker. The rest? Not so much. What is really amazing to me and should be also for the rest of the old-timers on here ---- Butler was Fordham when we were in the Midwest Cities Conference together. We were duking it out with Xavier and Loyola of Chicago and even Oral Roberts way back when but Butler was the literal dog of that conference. They were what Tulane was in the Metro. What DePaul currently is in the Big East. And here they are today. Hats off. Now, having said that, will it continue? Doubt it. Yeah -- they'll likely remain relevant in the Horizon, alhtough I think Porter can rise real fast in there with Loyola. And they might continue to dominate there ala Gonzaga in the WCC (or whatever league they're in). But this is the highwater mark for Butler. Nice mark, again.

Six schools mentioned in this thread .... Mizzou, Georgetown, Kansas, Saint Louis, Tennessee and Arkansas. Hmmmmmm .. pick out the basketball interloper.

Let's see .... 1) We don't even know who is on the roster, 2) We don't know who is on the schedule, 3) We don't know and can't assume that any physical improvement will result from the summer, and 4) We don't have any clue what the league will look like given a new coach at Dayton, the upheaval at La Salle and Charlotte, incoming talent at all schools, and unknowns in terms of grades and early entries around the league. Call me Billikan ..... undefeated! No matter the answers to the above. Dumb thread. Even dumber post on my part.

Up in arms over around the Triple D. The sweater vests are not happy about this one. Archie Miller, brother of Sean, former head coach at hated Xavier, and his name is ARCHIE .... just not really happy. Crying along the "if you can't beat them, join them" thought line. Sounds like the UD AD has placed his job security in Miller's hands. Given the article, it sounds like to me that Wabler had his idea and mind made up and went hard after Miller, 32, who has been an assistant in the ACC (NC State), Big Ten (Ohio State) and the Pac 10 (Arizona). But he is a coat-tails kind of guy according to a lot of alumni and UD season ticket holders. And he's completely unproven on the game startegy and management. So only time will tell. http://www.daytondailynews.com/dayton-sports/university-of-dayton-flyers/ud-hire-hopes-for-home-run-1126362.html Hard to tell where this is going to go; could be great, could be a major flop. I think Miller is going to be successful. YouDee is the second largest basketball revenue producer in the A10, trailing only Xavier by about $1 million (Xavier boasts $10 million in basketball-produced revenue). Dayton folks believe that should equate into a much more important national program out of the Flyer kingdom but this ain't the Yankees. You can't buy talent (supposedly) at the college level. And the so-called YouDee tradition is only three NIT titles in their overall history. (Of note, the stats given to me by the YouDee fan also said SLU was #3 in the A10 with almost $3.6 million in basketball-produced revenue; the only other A10 program with over $3 million is Fordam -- really showing how money produced does not mean court-level success. Temple produces most of its revenue from football, so I was told). YouDee players seem happier --- less structure in the offense and no "commando" pressure. I guess they didn't really like to hustle or play in a structured system as was the case with Gregory. Yet they still signed up to play for that? Interesting.

I agree with doowop --- Bonner is inconsequential and growing even more irrelevant as time passes by. Right now, kids know about the same and as much about Bonner as they do McCauley. Both are the dark ages as far as today's attention span goes. I think I'll be surprised by whomever the hire is. Can't see Biancardi coming back. Can't see an internal promotion either.

I can think of only one word --- blah. As in ho-hum. I can't see the Mizzou crowd getting very excited about this move. Also, on the A10 side, the sweater vest crowd isn't too thrilled about the Dayton hire of Archie Miller either.

"And yeah, the production likely would be at least the same probably better at SLU, because he would be a focal point." --- stlhoops Bullsh*t! You cannot extrapolate and make SWAG assumptions or conclusions like this. I believe that Harrelson's numbers go down if at SLU because the talent around him would be considerably weaker, thereby allowing teams to sag the middle and block it off marking him and making him less effective. But that's my extrapolation which is just as correct as yours. Because no one really knows. Harrelson as a focal point ---- from what I've seen on TV, he's a mudder. He is doing a really good job in his current universe. Given what I've seen, he doesn't how me anything that would make him a focal point anywhere, frankly. The big body alone makes him worth a toss-away second round, late round draft pick. Who knows. If this was his plan all along, it worked in an odd sort of way. Good for him.

BustedDreams49 --- are you advocating cheating when you say "I don't care how we get there" in terms of the Bills doing well on the court? Because, if you're not, then saying you don't really care isn't quite true. You don't care if team memebrs commit gang rape as long as we win? You don't care if a star basketball player steals from other students rooms and wallets as log as we win? You don't care if the team is involved in drug sales and underage drinking so long as we win? You don't care if the players sell their belongings and memorabilia to finance tatoo deals as long as we win? You don't care if the U hires a bus driver as an assistant coach because their son is 6'9" and an All- American as long as we win? You don't care that a kid is so bad at school that he graduates and still can't read as long as we win? And all these things would occur where? Off the court. All of these things have occurred --- of course not at Saint Louis University, including the gang rape.

Understand the point Metz, but Richmond is not a recruiting hotbed last I saw. Maybe folks in Richmond would disagree but I never heard of it as such. I saw Marquette and Syracuse up close and personal and neither team was locked into Milwaukee nor upstate New York as to their rosters. As kshoe can attest, I have long scoffed at the idea of St. Louis being a major recruiting hotbed as well, arguing vehemently against old Vtime's assertion that all it took to winning was signing the local talent to a LOI. As MUTGR shows, the hottest STL talent usually (sans Hughes) hits the road. Most seems not that good. I guess I remember the old Street & Smith magazine and it would break down local high school talent by metro area. New York would have a team. Philly. Memphis. LA. Chicago. Baltimore. DC. Miami. Houston. Detroit and even St. Louis. I guess that is where my question of the St. Louis talent generates from. Year after year, the guys listed on that roster would fail for the most part. Or as I seem to recall. One only need look to "talent" like Polk, Shelton, Kern, Mimlitz, Tatum, Jones and others. Yes, there is talent to be found, Hughes and those in the current tournament attest to my one-sided rant being wrong in some ways. There have been cases like Henderson, Douglas, Gray, Bonner, Claggett, Highmark, White, Carawell, Upchurch and others. I think while it is doubtful one can win assembling only St. Louis talent, there would seem to be some need to get some decent players to stay home and provide a local connection to the roster. However, its the name on the front of the jersey that supposedly matters and if that is indeed the case, who is inside that jersey should not matter. I think brian is right ---- the middle of the road would be okay. Getting one every now and then and maybe parlaying that into winning and then maybe scoring a big windfall down the road. Just don't see it.

I defer then to you Mr. Billikan ... what does Biondi care about? When does one see this "face" of the unviersity? And when seen, what are his "key messages" and "talking points?" I'm betting basketball isn't discussed. I have seen him and addressed him by name and he's called me by name but for the most part, I see him sightseeing in DC and Philadelphia. Because of the crowd and his need to work that crowd as best as he can, I get about five minutes tops and I know I am not important. So that's not a fair assessment. It seems to me, that given the opportunity to get your name out there and attract students, or donors, or whatever a university president does (and I really am ignorant as to the job requiremnts) to merit such status, taking advantage of advertising in a national medium would work to the achievement of that goal. Sadly, our society and culture demands that sports is a major means to that end. What kind of ratings does the "Larry Biondi Show" get in town? I'm going to take a sweet, wild-ass guess that there isn't such a show. Maryland? Gary Williams. Uconn? Jim Calhoun and Geno Auriemma. Missouri? Gary Pinkel. Notre Dame? Kelly and Brey. More Kelly then Brey. West Virginia? Huggins. Penn State? Joe Paterno. UCLA? John Wooden. Alabama? Nick Saban. VCU? Shaka Smart. Who's the football coach at Duke? How about the basketball coach? That one's easy altho most can't even spell it. Georgetown? Temple? Umass? Kentucky? Failure to learn from the past makes you doomed to repeat it. Failure to recognize what's in fron tof your face -- well, I don't know. Insanity? This board is like those call-in surveys on the TV news. Only those associated in some way with the topic will call in and vote or comment anyway. That alone skews the results. Everyone on this board is behind the U in some way or another. Just because roy asks some hard questions doesn't make him any less involved than you or I or metz, for that matter. I don't always agree with roy, and I certainly don't with you either. Metz -- well, let's say "m-e-t-z" and leave it at that. Frankly, I'm coming to the conclusion that this is a program doomed to forever spin its wheels in oblivion. I really thought Majerus was a bold move and a seismic shift in the way Saint Louis University did business. I'm underwhelmed with the five years of results so far. And with Reed and now Salescic (and there WILL be others -- I hope I'm wrong) the chants of BOHICA! ring in my ears. Bend Over Here It Comes Again!

Other than Cassity, who local is on our roster? And let's remember that Cassity is from a town 77 or so miles from St. Louis. Is that local? Before that it was Brett Thompson, who was from a town about 150 miles away. Locals prior to that were Maguire, Mitchell and Knollmeyer -- all run off by the current staff. All Painter's hire might do is add another player into the sweepstakes for guys we already have little to no chance of getting. If a kid is good enough (Beal, Tyus, Swopeshire, Suggs, Griffey, etc.) to get interest from any national school of note, its "sayonara SLU" as they pull away in the rear view mirror, the Arch fading slowly in the distance.

I have to wonder ..... does one believe, as the Dayton paper would lead one to believe in discussing the Gregory vacancy, that the coach of the most recognizable sport on campus is the most public face of the university? Any university. Dayton has DIII football, so DI basketball and its coach becomes its face. Like it or not. Gregory's morals and family values and perceived representation of the University of Dayton as a whole was unimpeachable. It even says so on the Georgia Tech board. Amazing. And everybody knew Brian Gregory yet no one really knew the prez -- Curran or something. Problem with Gregory is he just can't coach on the court. Isn't the same true here at thee most noble Saint Louis University? Given the accompanying logic mentioned above, who is that for us? Shimmy Gray? Harry Keough? Bill Selman? Lawrence Biondi? If you answer Rick Majerus, please describe that most-public face to me. What pray tell do YOU see? Ah, yes, Mr. Billikan ---- I see your hand up waving wildly in the back of the room. Please --- go ahead .......

Seesm the GT fans are split over what the Gregory hire means to their program: http://blogs.ajc.com/mark-bradley-blog/2011/03/28/techs-brian-gregory-not-a-hot-guy-but-hell-bring-the-heat/ In the meantime, Dayton's AD Wabler wants to make a "shining moment" but can't get the lights on at the Triple D for hi s meeting with the media. I find it nothing more thna symbolic. Funny, but only symbolic: http://www.daytondailynews.com/dayton-sports/university-of-dayton-flyers/wabler-wants-shining-moment-1120810.html Not surprisingly, Wabler is not naming names so he's not setting his bar too high right now. But that doesn't stop th emedia speculation from taking off. http://www.daytondailynews.com/dayton-sports/university-of-dayton-flyers/whos-on-the-list-to-replace-gregory--1120798.html Given the list, I'd palce the early lead on Lusk from Purdue. Although it would be really cool to see them pick Collins from Duke. It would give me jsut another viable reason to hate Dayton and wish for their failure and see Collins get away from bodyguarding Coach K and maybe share the same successful trek as Qiunny posted at ol' Mizzou.

My YouDee connections says they are going after Steve Alford (New Mexico) or Jerry Wainwright (fired at DePaul and replaced by ex-YouDee head Ollie Purnell). I can't see Alford doing it. He's done his time in Spingfield, Missouri, would you trade Albuquerque for Dayton. Wainwright?!?! Fired at DePaul for an ex-YouDeer. I can't see the sweater vests aiming so low. Plus Wainwright was ancient at NC-Wilmington. How bad did dePaul suck the life blood out of him? I agree with 72 that the sweater vest crowd probably think Smart would LOVE to come to Dayton. I mean, who doesn't, right????? But I agree with courtside even more, that Smart has his sights set higher and I sincerely doubt its Dayton. Dayton wil play Miami and is always bitching how Ohio State and Cincinnati ought to come to town and play them. Yet they don't book cross-town rival (because they don't it that way) Wright State. That fued sounds a lot like us and Mizzou.

I stopped short of making predictions --- lest I be called inflammatory or Chicken Little.

I/it ain't done yet either ..... I still see one more freshman and one more sophomore on the rocks. And this goes back to January predictions. When I said that back then, I was scolded, told that in mid-January it was not the time to be crying that the sky was falling or something to that effect even though it appears to be Rick's modus operandi. And here we are again. I also said we were likely never to see Willie grace the floor at Chaifetz again. Y'know what, the point of right or wrong is immaterial. The issue is that the program seems to be in a constant "try-out" kind of phase. Every year, two or four guys leave. That's the fact. No problem either way just something we are going to have to get used to and deal with, I guess.

Emotional .... http://www.daytondailynews.com/dayton-sports/university-of-dayton-flyers/uds-gregory-bids-farewell-in-emotional-team-meeting-1119831.html