Billiken Law Posted July 19, 2004 Share Posted July 19, 2004 just a long as we don't give up too much. The team is getting older and let's face it, the farm system is pretty thin right now. Memphis has been awful this season - not a good sign. By the way, anyone know what happened to Ivan Cruz? He had great power numbers at Memphis in 02, came up near the end of the season then that was it.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aj_arete Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 Duncan is when it comes to catching. I have no idea what improvement Barton has made in Peoria, but when he was drafted there were many questions about whether he'd end up as a catcher. I just seriously doubt whether Duncan would ever put up with Barton behind the plate. Duncan places so much responsibility on his catcher to exhibit superior defensive skills, effectively call games and manage the emotions of a pitching staff. I'm wondering if Barton wouldn't be more ideal in the AL. If he continues to hit like he is now, he could be some attractive trade bait. I just think it's insane to think about dealing Molina, who has improved his hitting lately. I think Pujols has been very influential in this area. Combine his innate catching and leadership talents and I can't see him not in a Redbird uniform for many years to come. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted July 20, 2004 Author Share Posted July 20, 2004 aj ... it is clear you really don't know how good or bad Barton is as a catcher. You can't just go with the fact he was a better hitter than defensive catcher coming out of HS. If the cards didn't think he could develop defensively he would be learning to play another position now. They would not be wasting a 1st round pick on someone they didn't think they could develop or just to trade down the line. Making remarks about hid defense when you really don't know tends to leave people thinking the wrong thing. Check this out http://www.minorleaguenews.com/baseball/fe.../062204.41.html Matheny is not done and can serve us well for a while. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aj_arete Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 I may have to go to Peoria and check this guy out before he heads to Tennessee in AA. It's good that it appears he's a smart guy, which is a prerequisite for Duncan. However, there was no mention of his arm strength or any other defensive attributes. Of course, I'm basing my opinion of observations of scouts and nothing more. Yes, I place a certain amount of credence to their ability to decipher talent, but I also realize that evaluating baseball talent is extremely difficult. I still stand by my opinion after reading this link, though. http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/Stats...cardinals.shtml If you scroll down to Peoria, you will see that Matt Pagnozzi does most of the catching down there. Looks to me like Barton will be a DH. As for Matheny, I'd be shocked if he's around next year. Again, the Cardinals could use the payroll flexibility of installing Molina. Quite frankly, I'd rather save my $2-3 million than spend it on Matheny. That's another key reason why Randy Johnson will not be coming here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted July 20, 2004 Author Share Posted July 20, 2004 Barton has played in 52 and caught 25 ... they like both catchers and want to keep Barton's bat in the lineup every day. The link I provided you with states they expect him to be a future all star catcher. I follow the Cards minor leagues daily ... don't mistake the fact that his strength being his bat as a statement that his defensive is horrible ... that is not correct. The cards like him as a catcher ... and don't fool yourself ... if he can hit 300 with 25 HR's. and 100 RBI's he will catch, even if he is only average or a little worse defensively. Hell LaRussa and Duncan probably won't be here when he comes up. Next at 2 mil a year, or less which is what it will take to keep Matheny ... Yadi is a back up. If they let Matheny go and could keep him for anything in the 2 mil a year range ... you have your answer to how much say Duncan has. Yadi is not yet in Matheny's league defensively. I'm not knocking Yadi ... I just think Matheny is very underrated by the casual fan. he is also hitting 264 with 29 RBI's. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
courtside Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 Cards said they are going after right handed set up guys. I agree with this. Tavarez and Calero are not dominant. This would be the first priority. An outfielder would be number two, especially considering it doesn't look like Sanders is going to hit for any kind of average with his homerun or K game. I was hoping for .280 for him this year, and he doesn't take walks. He is fine if there was a left fielder. Cedeno certainly hasn't taken advantage of his opporunity yet. RJ...well that would involve possibly even Renteria, which I am opposed to doing. Renteria makes what $5 million or so this year and is seeking $12 million next year. I think the cards will and should lock him up. That leaves Morris. Morris said earlier this year that he wanted to move on, ...possibly go back East. If he can improve on his new cutter, and get some movement, I am fine with Morris. If the cards had any prospects whatsoever, they could get Johnson easily. Unfortunately this has been the one big struggle area of Jocketty and co. Haven't been energized with Carpenter lately...looks a little tired, as if those innings are piling up. Marquis? We'll see, etc... A big lead offers the chance to rest a few of them if needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iggy Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 Thanks for the links. Now I've got someone to watch next Saturday in Peoria after attending the Rams-Bears scrimmage in Macolm that morning. Should be a fun weekend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schasz Posted July 20, 2004 Share Posted July 20, 2004 Well Courtside, it appears that Jockety agrees with you as relief piching appears the only thing that the club may add to the roster. After watching another butcher job by Ray Lankkkkkford in LF again last night VS the Flubs (where he played Patterson's double into an extra base with his p!ss poor play) I would still like to see an upgrade...providing the price was right. http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/sports/st...+in+trade+talks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted July 21, 2004 Author Share Posted July 21, 2004 Morrism didn't say he wanted to go back east ... he wants to stay a Card ... he turned down the extension because hen thought he could have a better year and get more $$'s. He said he took an gamble and so far this year he needs to improve. He actually sais he couldn't see himself in the AL and doesn't want to go to the Mets. He wants to stay. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
courtside Posted July 21, 2004 Share Posted July 21, 2004 I heard it differently on good sources that Morris was looking to move on after this season. Anything could have happened since then...He put up yet another bad outing today. I was in attendance for mon night's game, ...another gem and dandy in the series. If there are people out there looking to make the trip and haven't,...you are missing out big time. It is truly a spectacle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted July 21, 2004 Author Share Posted July 21, 2004 He definately didn't pitch well ... I have always been a Morris fan ... but there is no question that Baseball is a business ... eight now he is a 2 mil a year pitcher ... yes he has won 10 games but he just happenned to be the pitcher when we score big. Like I said earlier I would do what it takes to get Randy Johnson and ship Morris for salary savings this year ... Let Woody go next year ... that pays Randy's salary next year ... Randy and anyone can match the success of Matt and Woody. Games like yesterday scare me ... what if Wood and Prior get healthy ... how do we match up if they make the playoffs. Our #1 would be #3 or 4 for them. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aj_arete Posted July 21, 2004 Share Posted July 21, 2004 You make a good point that LaRussa and Duncan might not even be around when Barton comes up. He appears to be an exciting prospect, so let's hope he becomes a franchise-type player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
courtside Posted July 21, 2004 Share Posted July 21, 2004 Morris is learning a new cutter....very slowly I might add....and was supposed to have a good new changeup this year. If youl are going to throw 88 mph straight fastballs, albeit with poor location....you are in for trouble. Morris makes $12 million. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Law Posted July 21, 2004 Share Posted July 21, 2004 On the next block, actually and I haven't seen any for sale signs going up near his townhouse. Will keep my eye out, however. I personally think Morris is overrated and his homer problems concern me a lot. What is it with guys named Morris and giving up homers (my favorite pitcher as a kid, Jack Morris, had the same problem!)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
courtside Posted July 22, 2004 Share Posted July 22, 2004 Morris earned his stripes with two monster seasons of lights out ball. He earned playoff pts with me 2 of the plyoff years. But he has fallen back last season and this one. And he disappointed against SF in chance for WS a few years ago, after doing very well before that. I still think he can work it out this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schasz Posted July 22, 2004 Share Posted July 22, 2004 What are the local sports honks saying about why Morris has lost so much velocity on his fastball. Seems like just a couple years ago he could get it up there in the mid-90's...too many innings over the past couple years? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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