Marlow

>>well... maybe what separates SLU and schools like Gonzaga, >>Marquette, etc.... are the expectations. we deserve better. > >What is not pointed out ....is several things....take >Marquette and Gonzaga for just one example...the coaches >there had TO WIN FIRST in order to get their money...in >order to get their updated facilities etc....They are >example of coaches who can initially do more with less. >While it would be nice if SLU had a greater commitment to >win in hoops and made things easier on its coach, it does >NOThave to be the case. Marquette has increased and >extended Crean many times because his name came up for jobs >every year....in order to keep him...Crean himself lobbied >high dollar donors for new facilities, he as the head coach >built relationships with people like Dick Strong of Strong >Funds....etc...and so on... > >The kool-aid drinking ....no one is ever allowed to hold >Brad accounatble group or poor Brad he doesn't have a school >commitment to win group.....conveniently leave ouyt examples >of schools similar to SLU who succeed in Athletics and >academics and do so in hoops with coaches who can do more >with less initially. Brad has shown he has not been capable >of that. Many aren't capable....however there are plenty >who are.... > >Even schools who are not as comparable to SLU....Billy >Donovan won first, then got paid more...then 5 years later >received updated facilities etc... > >sLU definitely needs more of a commtment to win in men's >hoops....but Brad has as equally failed to succeed as a >coach to this point. There is one ingredient you fail to mention: TV. It is no coincidence that every one of the coaches mentioned above coaches at a school that gets maximum exposure on TV--they have lucrative TV contracts. Now the money from these contracts is one thing, but the key ingredient is what it does for recruiting. Every player in this country who thinks he has a chance to make it in the NBA craves face time on TV because he knows his talent means nothing if it is not displayed and recognized in everybody's living room. With 5 games on Channel 11 as his calling card, Brad is at a HUGE disadvantage in recruiting the 4 and 5 star players, because they for sure think that TV will pave the golden path. It is no coincidence that the teams left in the Tournament were all on ESPN or Fox many more times than the Bills were on Channel 11. Sure Brad, or any future SLU coach, can rise above this and create a team that forces the TV market to pay attention, but I can almost guarantee you that the market would choose to show a Kentucky team that is 10 and 10 before they would show a 20 and 0 SLU team. It's the greedy nature of the beast.

If this kid is a 4.0 student from a private Catholic prep school, Biondi will automatically be interested: he has stated many times that he actively and aggressively pursues the best and brightest. I hope Brad figures Biondi, the ultimate salesman, into the recruiting mix for Peterson.

>and even if the likes of luke meyer or a kevin lisch is on >self start, doesnt soderberg get credit for bringing that >type of player to slu? > >btw, anyone that doesnt see the improvement in luke meyer, >bryce husak, ian vouyoukas, tommie liddell on the current >team needs to pay a little closer attention. > >soderberg and his staff have done fine developing talent. > >the big what if this year that didnt happen was obi ikeakor. > obi will haunt soderberg for a long time imo. I agree. The player who stands out for me is Kenny Brown. The difference between Kenny Brown's junior year with Romar, who is a fine coach, and his senior year with Soderburg was night and day. Kenny Brown had trouble hitting a lay up his junior year, but he definitely needed to be guarded his senior year under Brad and his staff. That let me know that someone on this staff was schooling him on post play.

The evaluating/recruiting of athletes is definitely an inexact science. Even Earl Austin, who, in my estimation, is the only member of the local media who knows what he is talking about when it comes to evaluating local athletes, has frequently admitted misjudging an athlete. Heck, look at all of the time and resources that the NFL and NBA put into player research before the draft--and they still make plenty of mistakes.

What we think his job is and how he wants to do his job are two totally diferent things. He's the president/CEO of the university, and he has taken the university into big time progress. . . and endowment heaven. He's been highly successful doing it his way, and I get the feeling that he views CL as no more important than any other department head at SLU, even though BBall fans might not view it that way.

Nobody said they are mutually exclusive. And I'm sure that if you sat down with Father Biondi he would understand your thinking and hire the coach you thought would do the trick.

I think most players would view playing time as #1 with TV, TV, TV as a close second. Most quality young athletes have big dreams, and they're smart enough to know that TV exposure fuels those dreams of NBA/NFL better than anything else. Channel 11 or Charter don't cut it. ESPN and Fox do.

I don't think you can say Father Biondi is satisfied with the status quo; he clearly wants the best for the university, and he wants SLU to be the cream of the crop as an academic institution. You can see that from the way he has improved the campus and from the way he is on a mission to recruit the best and brightest students in St. Louis--distinct differences from the years before he arrived. What is also clear is that he is in charge, and everyone at the university knows it, from the person who delivers the mail to the dean of the medical school. As a result, he has demonstrated time and again that anyone who works with students, coaches included, must espouse the Jesuit philosophy and work to develop the moral, academic, and social fiber of the students. Just look at the basketball coaches he has hired; the only one who veered a bit off that path was Spoon--there was plenty of speculation that many of the faculty had disdain for Spoon because they felt he compromised those standards by recruiting and playing players like Biles who bent the academic integrity. I also feel that Spoon knew he was on thin ice for this stuff when he resigned. I'm convinced that Rich Grawer was done in, not by the 5 win season, but before that, in trying to get wins quickly, he recruited some "questionable characters," like McGlother Irvin and others. I think that Brad is clearly following the Jesuit code: he has consistently recruited scholar athletes, and his players have been strong members of the community. I'm convinced that Brad could have has his team the NCAA tourney every year, but if he had players getting DWI's and skipping class, he would be gone in a "Biondi minute." Will his current status allow him to keep his job? Only Father Biondi knows. However, from Biondi's record, I think we can clearly tell, that Father would NEVER hire a coach who doesn't buy into the Jesuit philosophy 24/7.

I agree, Any player who played quality point guard and defense for DeMatha--which he supposed has--against the top flight competition that they play, and also qualified for Princeton, would be a recruiting gem.

I fear that the disparity between the BCS schools and the non BCS schools will only get larger. First of all, the BCS schools refuse to play the mid majors because they don't want to risk a loss, so the mid majors are relegated to playing each other--and knocking each other out of the tourney, Secondly, the BCS schools get huge exposure on TV--I feel that I saw Indiana, Duke, Louisville, and Georgetown on TV much more than Creighton, SIUC, MSU, Air Force, and the others. Because of this TV exposure, recruiting of the 4 and 5 star players is done, by and large, by television. If the BCS schools keep getting the key players because of TV exposure, the gap between those schools and the mid majors will only get larger. It's quickly becoming a fact that the only way for a school like SLU to get to the tournament is to win the conference tourney, and that will become much tougher without the players, who will be lured to other schools because we in a conference that gets absolutely no TV coverage.

Get over it! As many posters said yesterday, Bonner will turn out victories AND productive citizens. He is class with a capital C, and his players will be the beneficiaries of his education and his coaching. Give him two or three years, and you won't find any players like Kern who play ball for four years and are left with nothing--any coach who allows that to happen is commiting a crime. By the way ,V, have you seen the Vashon uniforms?

Amen,Taj!

You're sick!

If qualifying is the issue, then the burden is squarely on Leon Powell's shoulders.

Luke is a senior academically. He finished his undergrad coursework at semester.

I absolutely agree. The marketing and PR folks have handcuffed coaches for decades. Even though I am not yet convinced that the MVC would have been a better choice for the Bills, one overwhelmingly compelling reason to join the MVC is the built in PR and marketing that would occur: Doug Elgin and his staff are some the absolute best in this department, and, as a result, their league is growing in recognition and stature each year. The MVC would pick up some of the slack from SLU's inefficiency.

Grawer is by far SLU's best recruiter of local talent. His group of Gray, Douglass, and Bonner was terrific, and then his last class of Claggett, Highmark, Julian Winfield, and Ryan Grant is arguably the best recruiting class in the past 30 years--even though two of them didn't finish their careers at SLU.

Eckerle had 28 last night in a 2 point loss to Washington--Suggs had 23. I wonder how close Eckerle and Suggs are? Would they like to play college ball together? Hmmmmm?

I guess that, in my eternal optimism, when I see a player like Matt Lawrence rise from relative obscurity during his freshman year at Mizzou to become a terrific 3 point threat and play sound defense in the Big 12, I feel there is hope that Maguire might be able to have similar results in the A10 next year. I know that Lawrence had a rigorous offseason shooting program. Again being optimistic, it would be great if Maguire could "connect" with Lawrence to develop the same rigorous workout. Time will tell.

My point about Evans is that he was an established player in the community, and he was a product of Marvin Neals, one well-respected and classy coach. If Brad would have offered Evans, even if it didn't pan out the way it has--but he is the kind of kid who had the makeup to create his present situation--Brad would have garnered much respect with a powerful coach and a big chunk the St. Louis basketball community. That, in itself, would have helped Brad, if he followed up on it, to make huge inroads in recruiting by sticking by a St. Louis kid.

Correct. But if we had Shaw and a Terry Evans, for example, we would have the other pieces that are keeping this from being a tournament team. I believe if Brad had a solid and consistent relationship with ALL of the high schools in the area (and I don't know just how extensive his connection is) then I feel that his focus would be more beneficial. Not that he should ignore the Lisch or Liddell, but those other pieces are just as important.

Roy, I believe that great strides could be made in this program if Cheryl Levick pushed the entire basketball office to get on the same page in recruiting area athletes. Brad needs way more face time in all of the high schools, not just the ones that have great players, but every high school, on a consistent basis. Brad has missed on several area players because, like Romar, he focused on the wrong kid. If he had a strong relationship with every coach in the area, that wouldn't happen. Over time, Brad, with the area coaches' input, would be able to make better evaluations. But Brad needs to make this a priority, and he needs time to do it. SLU can't be too proud to take a look at all players, not just the blue chippers. If we don't get a Leon Powell, we might get a kid from Gateway who would serve our needs just as well, but Brad has to have a connection and the willingness to make this happen--Levick could force this issue. This has been a weakness with this program ever since Grawer's last recruiting class of Highmark, Winfield, Claggett, and Grant--all were area kids, and with just two of them SLU got to the tournament.

I'm not denying that Brad has responsibility for his own fate, but I am saying there is a sorry trend of mediocrity in this program that has lasted through four coaches, and all four of them have some definite strengths as a coach, and none of them have been able to recruit consistently or establish a winning tradition. Bobby Cremins told Rich Grawer to get out and take the Bradley job when he was offered it, but he stayed and sank. Spoon quit before the ship sank. Romar left before the ship sank. And Brad is on his way out. It's going to take Moses to right this ship. . .and Moses is sure to see that there are better opportunities elsewhere. Let's save all of the posts from the past two weeks and call them back up in another four or five years because I've got a feeling they are going to be quite applicable for whomever the next coach is.

But look where each one of the last four coaches has left the program--in the toilet. If those two were such established coaches when they came to SLU, and I'm not denying they weren't, then what were the reasons that they were never able to recruit or build a strong winning tradition. The program was just as bad when they left as when they got here. There are other factors that are gumming up the ability of a coach to get it done in a big way and then keep it there. SLU is not a plum job, and it will never be until every person at SLU who has anything to do with basketball, from answering phones, to selling tickets, to chartering a plane has the same goals and standards. Spoon got another job, but he was roasted by the supporters at UNLV the same way the SLU folks are circling Brad. Romar has gone home, but I dare say he could have jumped to that job by way of Pepperdine

Roy, I also believe that because the infrastructure at SLU is such a mess, any "up-and-coming" coach would steer clear. All of those posters who think that this job is a gold mine for a prospective coach are sadly mistaken. The coaching network, which all coaches rely on, will send up all kinds of red flags about SLU. They only have to look at the history of the last four coaches during their tenure at SLU to see that there are major flaws. Any coach with an imagination would look for a job with a much more supportive network. We've got plenty of evidence--the past 4 coaches at SLU-- as to what happens when the support is missing.