Indiana Seen At SWIC Gym

[tseugnekillib]

Curios,

imo, it would have been a less difficult task for SLU to get to and stay consistently in the top three spots of the MVC....than get to and stay in the top three spots of the A-10.

I think that over time (say a ten year period) that St. Joes, Temple, Charlotte, Xavier, GWU and Dayton will always will be tougher to hurdle than the top six teams in the MVC.....just my opinion.

Regarding LS and Indiana and the Big10....I think Lance needs to be very careful where his signs. While Indiana must obviously need some players, I don't recall Sampson recruiting LS and his skills for Oklahoma. If Lance is not successful in his junior year in the Big10 and wants to transfer....he may be looking at McKendree College for his senior year. I guess it depends on what Lance is looking for. Quite frankly, SEMO may be his best bet!

I wish LS good luck where ever his signs, as his high school and juco coaches both told me that Lance is a real good kid!

[slufanskip]

I thought they came to watch Gonzaga and Morrison

Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman

[Curios]

Curios,

imo, it would have been a less difficult task for SLU to get to and stay consistently in the top three spots of the MVC....than get to and stay in the top three spots of the A-10.

<>

Again, my main point was that LS seems a good fit with SLU, but now is getting looks from the prettiest girls at the dance. Similarly, SLU would have fit nicely with the MVC with local competition, much less travel, some private schools that are similar academically (Bradley, Creighton, Drake, and Evansville), the development of rivalries and so forth. However, SLU obviously thought they could achieve more. I just think their fans with these feelings should be more understanding of a player who is now doing the very same thing. I have seen Lance play quite a bit and have talked with him a number of times. I think he is a high quality person, I like him a lot, and I wish him the best. I think he can be a contributing member of a solid mid-major program, but I do not think he will play much of a role at a high-major program. Similarly, I think SLU could have been a contributing member of the MVC…

[Curios]

“But the main point is:

look at the size of those five crowds I listed and look at who the opposition was for that night. Those huge crowds turned out to see THE BILLIKENS. They didn't give a damn who they were playing. They came to see highmark, claggett, waldman, hughes, etc.. They guys in white and blue.â€

No question there is a lot of validity in this summary. Winning builds crowds, and winning big builds big crowds. However, I also think the quick development of regional rivals and a heavy concentration of their fans in the local area would really help attendance. SLU only averaged 8030 in attendance last year. Considering the area population, that is sad. Creighton averaged over 11,000 and Bradley over 9,000 (in a metro area that is 1/8 that of St. Louis). In fact, this figure (9,000) is about the Bradley minimum regardless of the team’s record. Having regional rivals – especially those that boost attendance themselves – would help both raise and stabilize the attendance. Not only when SLU has an excellent team, but to create a BASE of 8,000+.

[p diddy]

curios,

we're talking about college basketball recruiting here and the last thing you'll see is understanding fans. in the heat of the process, everyone wants their school to get the best players they can. Other than selection sunday and the month of march, emotions are at an all time high around the signing period.

Of course, lance is doing the right thing by exploring all of his options. This is probably the first time he has actually been recruited, so he is enjoying the process. He didn't get recruited at all out of high school.

But SLU fans don't want to hear that right now. people are going to be emotional about it anyway. This takes place all over the country and at different levels. if this scenario was taking place at other schools and a player like lance doesn't sign with the home team, the message boards would be in an uproar. This one would be tame compared to fans of other schools.

for example, when shaun livingston chose duke over illinois, the illiniboard was so overrun with explosive and vulgar posts towards livingston, that the moderator had to shut the board down for at least three days. The UI fans were pretty understanding weren't they.

Norm Stewart was quite understanding when he told Johnny Robertson to go put his f***king blue coat on when his son Ryan signed with Kansas instead of Mizzou. the Mizzou fans at Hearnes were quite understanding when they booed Ryan every time he touched the ball for four years.

the kentucky fans were very understanding of Rick Pitino when he showed up in Rupp Arena. As the coach of the LOUISVILLE CARDINALS.

seattle mariners' fans hate alex rodriguez to this very day because he had the nerve to sign that $250 million contract with texas. of course, the mariners fans were understanding of A-Rod's signing for the biggest contract in history.

Johnny Damon has gone from the most popular player in Boston to Public Enemy # 1. Do you care to guess why those understanding Bostonians hate JD so much now?

I can think of thousands of more examples, but I don't want to overload your circuits this early in the morning.

as for getting attention from the prettiest girls late, that happens all the time. When word of Kevin got out, Illinois, Indiana wisconsin, notre dame, purdue started to show up at althoff games regularly during his junior year. Even kansas showed a little interest.

when tommie decided for prep school, michigan state, oklahoma, nc State and several other high majors started sniffing around. as V-time said once, even washington and lorenzo came calling.

both had the same options as lance, but they stayed home and became impact players right away. and remember, TL and KL were much better players than LS coming out of high school.

as for larry hughes' options out of high school... ah, I won't bother, that is too easy.

bad boyz for life

[Curios]

Excellent post and a thoughtful explanation. I agree...

On Shaun Livingston, though, the local team would have been Bradley (not Illinois). Imagine if all the Peoria players stayed home to play basketball! BU would be a top 15 team regularly.

[p diddy]

True dat about bradley being the local school and You just proved the other point that i wanted to make. bradley is in the MVC and most of the top players out of peoria don't go there straight out of high school. They may transfer back like Sommerville did, but most go to high major programs (Illinois, indiana, notre dame just to name a few). That's why the analogy you make about Stemler?SLU and SLU and the MVC is not a good one.

If SLU was in the MVC instead of the A 10, they would still be on pins and needles waiting for stemler (and other top area stars) as he atrracts new major-college suitors every day.

SIU (a tremendous program) lost josh tabb, a local kid, who committed to SIU then went to prep school, then signed with tennessee.

Justin Dentmon of carbondale, signed with illinois state, went to prep school instead and wound up as washington.

when the bardo brothers were stars at c'dale, craig signed with indiana and stephen signed with illinois.

calbert chaney was from evansville, but he went to indiana. walter mccarty was also from evansville. he went to kentucky.

sometimes you get the great local ones to stay, like wichita state did in the early 1980's, but its hard as hell.

bad boyz for life

[tseugnekillib]

pdiddy,

interesting point.....good recall of names.

[Sheltiedave]

Curious, I grew up in Peoria, and unless you want to see slow pitch softball or maintenance on Caterpillar earth movers, going to a Bradley game is the biggest thing to do on the social calender.

Also, Peoria is NOT a small town. It is the third or fourth LARGEST in the state, with over 250K in the metro area, so 8,000 average attendance is not sucking in every breathing body in the city, like you imply. They average 8K for a winning team, and they have averaged 8K for losing teams. There are few programs who have as loyal a fan base as Bradley's, just realize that 5K would turn out for horseshoes on many nights.

For the last three previous years, horseshoes would have been better than the product Bradley put on the floor at Carver Center, too!

[Sheltiedave]

Bradley also made a deliberate decision to deemphasise basketball under Molinari, and retained him for three years of horrible seasons BECAUSE he did not beat the drum to get more funding for the program. The program drifted into lala land under his helm, and only a cadre of longtime boosters drove him away and successfully hired Les.

There is NO WAY anyone in Peoria would consider Bradley to be the 'local' program and Illinois the interloper for Peoria talent. Illinois always would cherry pick the top local talent, so the top local talent Bradley has had over the past thirty years is sparse - Phegley(East Peoria,) Seymour Reed(Lincoln,) the Les bros out of near Chitown. Bradley always recruited well out of Chicago(Hersey Hawkins and Mitchell before him.)

Bradley's 'in' to local talent is the Peoria Central pipeline opened by hiring the Central coach, Buescher, respected by many. Of course I don't like him much, but I went to Peoria Richwoods, and we still kick Central's asx. 'Sides that, Illinois has more top Peoria talent in any given two year period than Bradley's entire team.

[p diddy]

an averaged of 8,000 only looks bad when you play in a 22,000 seat arena. put the same number in the family arena, or the upcoming new arena and you have quite a raucous and cozy college basketball atmosphere. a lot of good college programs would kill for 8,000 a night.

bad boyz for life