sludevil
-
Posts
381 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Events
Posts posted by sludevil
-
-
Miller not making a Final Four feels as fluky as Marshall making a Final Four. (Sometimes you get lucky/unlucky with seeding. Or sometimes your team just gets hot at the right time. I don't think Miller's brother is a top coach for that reason.) Though, yeah, it's definitely a hit against Miller and a plus for Marshall. But with the way Miller has things rolling at Arizona, the Final Four drought should be ending in the near future (from my perspective, Arizona, Wisconsin, and Kentucky look like the three teams most likely to pick up a championship this season). If we're basing things purely on wins (regardless of competition level), then you'd have to put Marshall before Miller. But if we're talking about the best coaches, or the coach I'd take right now to head my program, then I'd need to see more from Marshall before picking him over Miller.
-
Beilein is a good, but not great, coach. He's very good at developing talent, but doesn't recruit at an elite level.These last two seasons at Michigan were definitely a peak, but he's set up for a rough season ahead, and, with that great class of 2012 gone, I'd imagine he'll stay more grounded for a little while.
Marshall may be great, but I'm just not ready to anoint the guy yet. He plays in a bad conference, and he's enjoyed some favorable breaks. Let's give him some more time (probably at a bigger program) to prove that his success is sustainable. (He sort of reminds me of Shaka Smart in that he's a mid-major guy that everyone goes crazy about. But Shaka's "havoc" system puts a definite ceiling on his potential - in that it puts a ceiling on his recruiting ability. Marshall doesn't have the same system problem, but a lot still has to happen for his recent success to remain sustainable.)
Calipari deserves on this list. He's made the Final Four three of the last four seasons. He was the runner-up last year (a year in which he knocked out Gregg Marshall's Shockers...) and won the title just a few years ago. He has also been the best recruiter over that period of time. He isn't a good Xs-and-Os coach, but he does just about everything else.
K, as I've said earlier, is a debatable case for top 5. I'd probably put him on the outside, though a lot will turn on how this incoming class performs.
-
Or on Marshall, What is a coach supposed to do besides go to final four and go undefeated?
Undefeated in a bad conference. It's an accomplishment, no doubt, but let's keep it in context - his best wins (by far) were us and Tennessee - and, on any given night, he could be found playing the likes of Drake, or Illinois State, or Northern Iowa. I think the Final Four is a much bigger deal, but even there he caught some pretty favorable breaks (landing Gonzaga as the 1 seed, getting LaSalle in the Sweet 16). In other words, I think he's a good coach, but I'm not convinced his recent success is the norm or whether it's more an aberration.
On the other hand, if we're only looking at the last one or two seasons - and basing things primarily on wins - then, yeah he should probably be top 10. But, hell, then guys like Brad Underwood should be right there, too. I just need a bigger sample size with Marshall - and it seems we'll probably get it sooner rather than later when he jumps to a bigger program.
-
Ollie is much too high. He has no track record. Of course Beilein has just as many final fours as Ollie does and is #9. He's also too high.
My top 5 would be Donovan, Izzo, Self, Pitino, Calipari with Coach K father down the list. Everyone says Boeheim has lost his fastball, Coach K has too.
I'm with you on Boeheim, as he's just never done it for me (if I have to hear one more talking head go on about the zone...). And I agree that a good argument can be made for putting K outside of the top 5 - especially if we're cabining discussion to the last season or two - but let's not put him out to pasture just yet. The dude's last championship was in 2010, and he has the #1 recruiting class coming in (in addition to his duties with USA basketball).
Otherwise, even though he couldn't coach his way out of a paper bag, Calipari deserves his high ranking. He's the most successful recruiter out there, and that recruiting success has generally translated onto the court. And as someone else mentioned, I think there's something to the fact that he's managed to achieve that success even while asking McD's AAs to share the ball and - gasp - come off the bench. That in itself is a pretty noteworthy achievement.
Ollie, Beilein, and Marshall are too high. Miller (11) and Self are too low. Bo Ryan I'm of two minds about. He's a good coach, but this (including this upcoming season, in which he should be in the championship discussion) is definitely his peak, and I would expect him to recede back to the norm in coming seasons. He's a good coach, and his teams are always gonna be good, but his system (and, for that matter, his school) just doesn't lend itself to top-flight recruiting. Elite recruits want flashy plays and big moments; they generally don't want solid, slow-paced, fundamental basketball.
-
The full ranking is now available. The top 10:
10. Kevin Ollie
9. John Beilein
8. Gregg Marshall
7. Bo Ryan
6. Bill Self
5. Rick Pitino
4. Mike Krzyzewski
3. Tom Izzo
2. John Calipari
1. Billy Donovan
-
Really skip? How about a little more ingenuity? Seven points and three points .. like I haven't heard that somewhere before. And, by the way, I say make the posts you so describe thinner .. lik ein arean football. Make 'em earn it.
Big Three: Football, basketball and baseball.
Secondary Sports: Hockey, Wipe-Out/Most Extreme Elimination Challenge, tennis (majors) and golf (majors).
Bullcrap: Soccer, lacrosse, cricket, volleyball, anything starting with "X", WWE, anything involving "Dew," Tour de Frank, rugby, Australian rules football, surfing, ping pong, and so on ......
Blatant WWE trolling.
-
It looks a lot like the new ACC logo (which, in turn, resembles the Big East logo). I was never a fan of the old A10 logo, so I'm on board with the change.
Edit: ^ Apparently looks a lot like the Arena Football League logo, too. I guess everyone's using the same marketing firm?
-
Thanks for the updates, torch. Really cool to see what these guys are doing overseas.
-
Tatum apparently playing well at the KD Skills Academy. He's one of three underclassmen there.
-
So maybe this is close-minded/sexist/xenophobic/whatever, but I'm bothered by soccer players and the culture around them. The flopping and writhing around, the metrosexual (is that still a term? I don't know) haircuts and grooming - it doesn't jive well with "traditional" American masculinity, which is something I associate closely with sport. Granted, I'm not a huge fan of the sport itself - it's not the most exciting thing in the world - though I appreciate the strategy and skill involved, and I think it's cool that the whole world is participating in this thing. But then I turn on the TV and see guys who look like they spent the two hours before the game in the salon, and I see other guys being gently tapped (or not touched at all), and then hitting the ground like they've suffered a massive injury. And that just loses me completely.
(And I realize that other sports aren't guilt-free in this area. Basketball has a flopping problem - and that bothers me, too - but no sport has these things to the same extent and in the same combination as soccer.)
-
Jabari can't play for everyone.
It's a shame, I know. (Though after Jabari's workout with the Cavs, I would've picked Wiggins first, too.)
Also, our old friend TJ Warren just went 14 to the Suns.
-
One of the draft guys was reporting last year Gilbert wanted Oladipo and the front office wanted Bennett. That appears to be driving the indecision.
Looks like the front office lost the argument this year. I guess picking Bennett will do that.
Also: Gordon goes 4 and Smart (!) goes 6. Were these teams watching the same games that I was?
-
The day has arrived. Sounds like Cleveland is internally split between Parker and Wiggins, though is aggressively trying to trade out (to the Magic?). Wonder if the success of their last #1 pick is giving them cold feet.
-
Are you connected to Jayson or his family?
Nope, only to Duke.
Edit: Just to clarify my previous comments: word tends to get around quickly when shady things are afoot in a recruitment. Duke is staying on top of this kid (trying to make that Tatum/Giles/Smith package actually happen), and I haven't heard anything that would raise eyebrows. Have heard great things about him personally, though.
-
Yeah, it definitely goes on, but it's nowhere near as common as some people seem to think (e.g., whenever Calipari pulls a top recruit). Often it's the kid's handlers - parents, guardians, coaches, "family friends" - who first make it clear the kid is taking offers, rather than a program making the first move (although that happens, too). But Tatum is a good kid - and I think there's a lot of truth to the belief that, generally, if programs feel they don't need to expose themselves to unnecessary risk, they won't. And, in Tatum's case, they aren't, at least not yet.
Like I said, he's a good kid - and if we land him, we'll be getting a kid with a lot of integrity, and a good head on his shoulders (beyond being an outstanding basketball player).
(Full disclosure: I have no idea how things work in college football these days. Though if you're looking for a good book on the subject - at least as it existed a decade or so ago - I really enjoyed Illegal Procedure by Josh Luchs.)
-
Tatum is a clean recruitment. He's a good kid, with good parents. (Granted, that won't stop a coach from making first contact with respect to benefits. But I bet this one stays clean.)
-
Just to throw something else out there: a source close to UF (who has been reliable in the past) seems pretty convinced Tatum is staying in the Midwest. I didn't get that same impression out of the Duke camp, but there it is. Also, the fact that Tatum is explicitly denying rumors that location is going to play heavily in his decision makes me think location is going to play heavily in his decision.
-
I think we are either going to end up in Tatum's top 2-3 schools or not in the running at all. We have a pretty unique recruiting pitch. If he buys it, we have a great shot. If he doesn't, we have no shot against teams like Kansas and Kentucky.
So far, things look overwhelmingly positive.
Agreed. It basically comes down to the hometown hero angle vs. the bright lights and deep pockets of the traditional powers. Assuming we keep pushing, I think we'll remain a serious contender; the hometown thing seems to hold a lot of sway with this kid and (importantly) his parents, and that's something the blue chips can't offer.
But a lot can (and will) happen between then and now. If nothing else, though, it's fun to be in the race.
-
How desperate is Crean? He's never mentioned in the schools Tatum says he is considering and he calls him at the stroke of midnight? Didn't he have a more plausible recruit to call then?
And I'm sure he had plenty of bad things to say about every other school on that call, too.
-
Interesting that all the schools he mentions by name (except Kansas?) don't really seem to be strong contenders for him.
-
Dude, it was a joke.
Gotcha, lack of sleep is making it so I can't read too good.
-
Thank you for proving my point. 38 universities ranked better.
Dude, 39 is still a solid ranking. (SLU is 101.) And, beyond the ranking, UC-Davis seems to enjoy a pretty good reputation generally in the academic community.
-
There's still some basketball going on. The U18 team is stocked with top prospects, though their games up to this point haven't been very competitive. Otherwise, it's tough - there isn't much in the way of recruiting right now, and I have a tough time watching old games. Cardinals are in season, though.
-
I would go Parker 1, as he seems the safest bet, even if his ceiling is lower than the other two. Wiggins 2 for the awesome potential, even if it has yet to be realized. Embiid 3 because I would be terrified of a big with back and foot problems, but you can't let his talent slip out of the top 3. Exum 4.
For what it's worth, I think this draft is deep but not overly talented. Teams have a good shot at picking up solid players pretty much throughout the first round, but there isn't a ton of top-end talent there.
I'm not sold on Randle. I think he can be a solid bench player, but he doesn't do any one thing extremely well, and I have doubts about his ability to transition to the NBA.
Recruiting - 2016
in Billikens.com Main Board
Posted
Agreed re: Calipari. He's a great recruiter, but he doesn't really develop talent. Guys coming out of Kentucky generally aren't much better than they were going in to Kentucky. And, hell, one of the guys mentioned in that article (Poythress) is a pretty compelling argument for not going to Kentucky: Poythress was a stud coming out of high school, then would've probably gone in the lottery had he left after his first year. But he stayed, and Calipari brought in a new stable of top recruits, all of whom wanted playing time. So Poythress had his time cut and regressed as a player, to the point where he was probably a (late?) second round talent after this last year. Now Calipari is bringing in a new stable, and the process looks like it's going to play out again, with Poythress (unless he has a hell of a bounce-back year) probably falling out of the draft completely after this season.
That's the risk you take with Calipari. If you stay, you can be guaranteed that he'll have at least one or two guys coming in behind you who want (and will probably be given) your minutes.
And for what it's worth, a similar storyline just played itself out over at UNC (another Tatum contender). There, it wasn't so much that McAdoo was crowded out by top recruits, but that he just never really developed as expected, and Roy kept getting him to come back to school. He would've been lottery after his first year, but finally went undrafted last month. That's a lot of money left on the table.
On the other hand, SLU has done pretty well with developing talent in recent years. And I feel pretty confident that 1) Tatum wouldn't be crowded out by a new wave of top-10 prospects and 2) Crews wouldn't lean on Tatum to stay if he had a lottery slot lined up. So, hey, something to think about.
(I'm not usually into bashing other programs - especially in the recruiting context - but I think it's a pretty big deal when these kids are leaving millions on the table unnecessarily. That's life-changing money.)