Duff Man
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Posts posted by Duff Man
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skip to 1:00
yeah, it's an all-star game where nobody is playing D - but at least it gives you some idea of his current* physique
*as of last summer
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RM was the best one to advise him on his potential future in the NBA. Surprised, he didn't bring in one of his friends like Karl or Nelson to talk to WR and his dad to inject some reality into their thinking.
It wouldn't have made any difference. There was no getting through to them. They suffer from selective hearing and selective memory.
Michael Jordan could personally lecture Willie about how he's got to work harder and polish his game if he wants to make it, but that advice goes out the window the second some blogger casually includes Willie in a mock draft.
Any opinion telling them what they want to hear trumps anyone that dares to tell them the truth. The draft party is just the latest example of this.
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This thread is dedicated to simple speculation as to what player will step on the floor next year. There is no doubt that his season was disappointing, and there have been several reasons posited to explain this season, such as illnesses, etc. There really may be no reason to explain his season, there is a reason why we have all heard the term "sophomore slump," kids sometimes just get lazy as sophomores. He walked into SLU and put up double digits without any work, so who can blame him for expecting it to continue.
Also, who thinks he will bulk up? He was around 240, and he did not look muscular at all, he could easily walk in at 250 or more next year. However, it seems like Majerus is interested in trying CE as a small forward. Does anyone think that experiment is done? Under Majerus' strength and conditioning approach, could CE really be expected to put on 10-20 lbs of muscle?
While he certainly was disadvantaged without KM breaking down defenses and WR drawing double teams, I think his sophomore slump mostly boiled down to lack of shooting reps in the offseason (due to his myriad of ailments) - and the subsequent lack of confidence after the shaky start.
CE is a finesse 4 whose value derives from his ability to shoot from range. No amount of weightlifting is going to change that. He needs to continue to play hard on D (as he did last year), but if the shot isn't falling, his role on this team is dramatically reduced.
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at least Willie got some national publicity out of it...
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Hopefully he shows enough to get a late second round look from a team that needs a big.
fixed.
There's no way he's going in the first round - even in a weak draft - although it's certainly possible that he impresses a GM enough to take a 2nd round chance on his raw athleticism.
There's always a market for athletic power forwards who can play D and rebound, but the established guys also tend to play forever. Willie needs a bit of luck (get drafted, hope someone gets hurt), and also needs to transform (and maybe working out in a professional environment will help) into gritty role player who works his ass off.
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If we were in the market for a coach which one of these young coaches would you hire and why?
I'd go with the coach who is 116-24 including 10-3 in the NCAA tournament over a guy who coached his team to a 4th place finish in the CAA (behind Hofstra) this year.
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because of the poor way that rickma handles everything about the program except hands on basketball, the likes of this guy (I have no idea who this warmann guy is) and other local media, second tier boosters, casual fans, ancillary slu employees, area mid town businesses, local metro high school coaches and other potential recruit influences, have this perception. and while sure, rick is gearing up for a couple of good seasons on the court, he has done nothing to actually build the program beyond cream his own recruits to give himself that potential couple of year run.
what is likely going to happen, is he gets his two year run, retires and then the program will quickly regress because he didnt do the other things in program building to sustain his success. of course nothing will be his fault. and the poor followup walks into a firestorm.
too many of you are too close to realize that if the outsiders have this kind of a perception, there is a problem. and while short term rickma can indeed, "show this guy". long term i am afraid we are are going to fall hard.
Isn't advancing to the NCAA tournament in and of itself the single greatest factor in 'growing the program'?
Are all the local media hacks really going to hold their anti-Majerus grudges against the next (more media friendly) coach?
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Perhaps your perception of Dayton's home performance is obscured by the fact that they were shittier than usual this year, and that they've dropped 2 in a row to SLU. They'd actually won 14 of 15 home conference games heading into last year's senior night.Because BG's teams did not do so well at home either. Had they ONLY played bad on the road, then I'd agree. BG's teams, though, had similar conference records at both home and on the road. For instance, this year they were 4 wins and 4 loses at home and they were 3 wins and 4 losses on the road. In 2008, they similarly were 5-3 at home and 3-5 on the road. I'd suggest that their 4 -4 conference home record this year did more to hurt their season than their conference road record.
Gregory's Flyers in the A10 '07-11
2007 H: 6-2 A: 2-6 (2 A10 Bids)
2008 H: 5-3 A: 3-5 (3 A10 Bids)
2009 H: 8-0 A: 3-5 NCAA R32 (3 A10 Bids)
2010 H: 6-2 A: 2-6 (3 A10 Bids)
2011 H: 4-4 A: 3-5 (~2-3 A10 Bids)
5-year totals
H: 29-11 .725
A: 13-27 .325
Those home/away splits are hardly 'similar'.
Grawer's Bills in the MCC '87-91
1987 H: 5-1 A: 2-4 (1 MCC Bid)
1988 H: 4-1 A: 1-4 (1 MCC Bid)
1989 H: 6-0 A: 2-4 (2 MCC Bids)
1990 H: 6-1 A: 3-4 (2 MCC Bids)
1991 H: 6-1 A: 2-5 (1 MCC Bid)
5-year totals
H: 27-4 .871
A: 10-21 .323
Note the conference road winning percentages are nearly identical.
As to the conferences, I take you at your word that the MCC got 2 teams in the Tourney in 1989. Not saying it never happened but instead that would have been the exception rather than the rule.
Would you take the Internet's word for it?
Technically, it never actually went down as you describe it. Here's what actually happened...Grawer-led teams finished second to Xavier and went to the NIT while Xavier went to the Tourney. Not all that uncommon.
1986: SLU finished 2nd to X in MCC, X beat SLU 74-66 in MCC Final, no NIT for SLU
1987: SLU finished 4th in MCC, 3rd place X beat SLU 81-69 in MCC Final, SLU advanced to 2nd round of NIT
1988: SLU finished 3rd in MCC, lost to last place Detroit in MCC Quarterfinal, 1st place X wins MCC Tourney, no NIT for SLU
1989: SLU finished 2nd to Evansville in MCC, 3rd place X beats SLU 79-56 in MCC Semifinal then beat Evansville for the automatic bid, Evansville received an at-large bid having won the regular season and finishing 2nd in the conference tournament, SLU placed 2nd in NIT
1990: SLU finished 3rd in MCC, lost to 6th place Loyola in MCC Quarterfinal, 2nd place Dayton beat 1st place X for the automatic bid, X received an at-large bid having won the regular season and finishing 2nd in the conference tournament, SLU placed 2nd in NIT
1991: SLU finished 3rd in MCC, 1st place X beat SLU 81-65 in MCC Final, no NIT for SLU
In order to make the dance, SLU either needed to win the conference tournament (which they never did - losing to X every time they got close), or they had to win the regular season title (which they never did - because they dropped too many road games to bad teams) then win a game in the MCC tourney against a crappy team (which we couldn't do in '88 or '90 when we actually had good teams).
You're thinking of 1992 (SMS didn't join the MVC until 90-91 and Spoon went to SLU in 92-93). SIUC beat Tubby Smith's Tulsa twice in the regular season, then lost to them by 3 in the MVC semis. Tough break, but if you look at their schedule that year, they played a cream puff schedule - only had 3 games against quality opponents and lost all 3 (getting swept by SMS and losing 99-98 at Evansville), not to mention they were one of the 5 teams to lose to SLU that year. I don't know about unfair, but they were definitely unlucky.I remember some very good Rich Herren SIUC teams that went to the NIT b/c Spoon brought his Bears to town and worked his magic in the Valley Tourney. Very unfair period of time for mid-majors.
If by 3 to 4, you mean 2 to 3.In constrast now with the A10, we have had 3 to 4 teams get into the Tourney each year.
See above. Grawer didn't just lose to X. He lost first round MCC tourney games to BAD teams in 1988 and 1990 when we had Bonner.Gregory has taken his Flyers to the Dance (Brad did not and RM has not yet) but the other years when BG did not make the Tourney, I would suggest it was because of their mediocre conference records (both home and away) and their failures down the stretch (losses to several teams) as opposed to constantly losing to the same team like Grawer did. To me, that's a big difference.
I will concede it's probably not fair to Grawer - who revived a comatose program and actually made players better over their careers - to put him in league with Brian Gregory - who inherited an NCAA caliber team and consistently failed to develop his players into something better.
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Gregory's failure to develop his players is where the Grawer comparison fails - agreed - and yes, the Billikens have thumped them at home on Senior Night 2 years in a row - which never happened under Grawer - BG has had better recruits, yet none of them have developed into NBA players - no doubt Grawer did better with the hands he was dealt
BG's problems are not that UD cannot win on the road or that they cannot get past a particular program such as Xavier.
How are those not BG's problems?
2007: 2-6 on the road in the A10
lost to X in A-10 quarterfinals
2008: 3-5 on the road in the A10
lost to X in the A10 quarterfinals
2009: 3-5 on the road in the A10
lost to Duq in A10 quarterfinals
received at-large bid toNCAAs as 11-Seed
2010: 2-6 on the road in the A10
lost to X in A10 quarterfinals
won NIT
2011: 3-5 on the road in the A10
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Matt Dickey and UNC Asheville were the first team to qualify for the dance.
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The field expanded to 64 in 1985. Grawer's best teams (the Gray/Douglas/Bonner years) were after the field expanded.Grawer missed out on the NCAA tourney because only 48 teams were eligible then - today he would have gone at least twice and maybe one other time.
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Stop repeating the lie that the MCC was a one-bid league. It was for a while in the 80s (for good reason), but Evansville received an at-large bid the year we had our best team (1988-89). We could have gotten one too if we didn't 1) fail to get a single quality win away from Kiel 2) lose those games at Dayton and Detroit and 3) lose by double digits to X in the MCC tourney semis.As to X, yes, Grawer/SLU could never seem to get past them. Sure, we had a few wins over X but I'd say X probably won 3 out of 4. Unfortunately, the MCC was a one (1) bid conference and we were number 2.
I'm not faulting Grawer for failing to win in the early 80s. I'm faulting him for failing to get to the dance even once during the window of opportunity he had in the late 80s. You don't think those teams should have done better thanStill, I don't think I's say that Grawer failed to get the most out of his talent like Gregory does. Not all Grawer teams had guys like Bonner, Gray, Douglas and Newberry each year. Instead, we had guys like Rahim Al Matiin, Tony Brown, Jim Roder...
1988: 14-13 regular season (5-5 T3rd MCC), lost to Detroit (6-22, 2-8 MCC) 66-63 in MCC 1st round
1989: 22-8 regular season (8-4 2nd MCC), lost to X 79-56 in the MCC semis, NIT runner-up
1990: 17-9 regular season (9-5 3rd MCC), lost to Loyola 67-58 in MCC 1st round, NIT runner-up
I don't really recall the 2 point loss to UD you are referring to
Do you remember us losing to Grambling St at home in 1987?
but a 2 point loss to a 12 win team is not the same as a 20 point blowout to a 12 win team, at home on Senior night, when it also is to a team that you handled rather easily a month earlier.
The comparison doesn't correlate game for game, but in each case you have a coach who is by all accounts 1) a nice guy who 2) advanced the program in the right direction (i.e. boosted attendance), and 3) got a free pass for underachieving from fans who can't see past 1) and 2).
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No comparison is ever perfect but Rich Grawer knew his x's and o's. Headstrong, his way or no way, overly intense, quick to pull a kid after a mistake, too many risky kids after Upchurch was not let in .... but Grawer knew the game, could gameplan/coach and had disciplined teams.
Grawer's teams missed out on the NCAAs because they couldn't win on the road, and never got past Xavier in the conference tourney. Those are precisely BG's problems!
http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/SLU/1989-schedule.html
http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/SLU/1990-schedule.html
Just look at those backbreaking 2pt losses to Dayton (12-17, 6-6) and Detroit (7-21, 4-8) in 1989. Without those losses, we're 24-6 and co-MCC champs with Evansville and possibly avoid X in the MCC tournament. If that team had won @SMS or @Colorado (or beaten a good Iowa team on a neutral court instead of losing by 3) they'd have been 25-5 and almost certainly in the dance.
Don't use Upchurch as a blanket excuse. That team had Bonner, Gray, Douglas, Newberry - a good coach would have had them in the tournament.
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BG is a rich man's Brad Soderberg.
Originally I viewed Gregory as a poor man's Calipari (talented undisciplined teams, wears expensive suit to overcompensate for lack of coaching ability), but lately I see him as a rich man's Grawer (nice guy, lands talented local players, gets credit for advancing the program, capable of losing to anyone on any given night, makes deep NIT runs, fails to get the most out of talented teams, drives fanbase nuts).
Soderberg was a good coach that just couldn't string enough strong recruiting classes together.
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BTW, I thought the decision to have Jett guard James was interesting. I don't think he did a bad job. He stopped his dribble penetration and forced him to hit some very tough fade-aways.
In hindsight, maybe we shouldn't have give our most (only) productive offensive player the toughest defensive assignment during crunch time.
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Would it kill Rammer to ask Porter why our best rebounder and most effective defender of James was on the bench for crunch time? That game changing 3-pt play never happens if Evans is on the floor.
The only thing I can figure is that Majerus is using FT% as the basis for crunch time minutes...
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Not much to quibble with here, but the NHL was locked out for the first part of the 1994-1995 season until early Jan 1995 (the 1st in the new Kiel Center).
This is true...however, the majority of SLU's sellouts that season came AFTER the lockout ended - and the Blues were a hot ticket that year (Mike Keenan's first year). Not to mention the 15-18k+ SLU crowds from the year before at the Old Barn.
When the team is good, people (alumni, casual fans) start to pay attention. They will typically wait for a game that looks good on paper (i.e. vs a team they've heard of) to stick their toes in the water, and if all goes well they buy into the program and start attending games regularly. It doesn't matter how (un)friendly the coach is, or how well the other STL sports teams are doing.
A winning SLU program will have no trouble selling out the bulk of the season schedule.
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Adman no bet because I said above we will get back to the 10k point and a big demand for the big games. But the scalpers won't be overworked in nov dec vs tennessee state. In 95 they would have been. Now the casual fan will say oh well, we got tix for the rams tomorrow anyway
Your assertion that SLU cannot duplicate the ticket scarcity they had in a building twice the size of Chaifetz is laughable.
First a history lesson: The Billiken scalpers were certainly not overworked in Nov-Dec 1995 (the dawn of the Corey Frazier era). I'll assume you meant November-December 1994. I don't remember those early season games against the likes of Bethune-Cookman selling out. After the run in of sellouts to close out the Arena, I expected it to carry over into the following season, but that was not the case. I remember the first sellout being vs Austin Peay on December 28th. Realize they averaged 17k playing in a 21k arena - if they were selling out the early season crap games, they'd have averaged 20k.
But that's beside the point, since they no longer play in 20k arena. This year, they drew 5,384 fans for Tennessee St. That's our rock bottom the plane has hit the mountain number. Last year, they drew ~6,500 for Mississippi Valley St and Kennesaw St. If they make an NCAA tournament run in 2011-12 and have the nucleus coming back, I'm pretty sure they can win over 3,500 new 'die-hard' fans from a metro area of nearly 3 million people who prefer the college basketball experience to NFL games which are more expensive in both money and time.
re: playing games at Scottrade or the Dome
If that's what it takes to get a game against Mizzou or Illinois, I think they should do it. I know we lose our home court advantage, but it would still be good for the program. I'm not sure the 1997-98 team gets an at-large bid without that win over Illinois at the dome.
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There are plenty of minutes to go around...here are the MPG for the guards this season
KC 29.9
MM 29.5
JJ 27.7
PE 15.0
CS 13.8
MM, and JJ will see their minutes-per-game drop closer to 20, but they'll still be major contributors on a NCAA caliber team as Sophomores. KC will play fewer minutes, but will be more fresh when he's in there. PE and CS probably won't play much, unless there are injuries.
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Not saying CS, CR, etc. will be as good as Highmark and Claggett, etc. Instead, though, we remember how good Highmark, Claggett, etc. were but it is fact that their Freshman team won only 5 games (and our Frosh sat the bench for most of the until the defections occurred) and then they won only 12 games their Soph year. Don't get me wrong. We saw flashes or glimpses of what these guys could do their Frosh and Soph years. Will we see enough of the same from CR and CS by the end of this year? I hope so.
CS is old for his class. He's not going to get any quicker, and he's already improved defensively as much as he's going to. Unless he can find his 3pt shot, he's not going to significantly improve over what we've seen.
CR is young for his class and could very well mature into a valuable low post presence.
Neither of those guys is going to suddenly become a major contributor this year. Ellis is the sophomore whose development (or lack thereof) we should be focusing on.
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It's not difficult, at all, to compare a team which relies heavily on freshmen to a team which is junior- and senior-dominated. The results we've seen speak for themselves. When Claggett and Highmark, the foundation of the mid-90s NCAA Tournament teams, were underclassmen, the team struggled. Similarly, this year's team, sans two star juniors, is also struggling.
Post hoc ergo propter hoc
The 92-93 team struggled because they only had 3 good players, not because Claggett and Highmark were underclassmen. 'The Big 3' were able to keep them in most games, but usually games slipped away in the 2nd half.
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Why should I "give it up" when now you're reversing field and agree with me?
You said: "The latter 2 were essentially more seasoned variations of Dwayne Evans." You included Jeff Harris as a freshman. So, since Harris's freshman contributions were less than Evans's this year, how was he a more seasoned version of Evans?
You questioned whether or not this years team (w/ KM and WR) was more talented than the mid 90s team(s). In comparing this year's team to those teams, I pointed out that it's difficult to compare a team that relies heavily on freshmen (read: undeveloped talent) to teams that didn't rely on freshman at all.
Yes, Harris was on one of those teams when he was a freshman, but he was not counted on for much. He played a major role the following year after Dobbs was gone. So, sophomore Jeff Harris - the guy who helped SLU win an NCAA first round game - is more seasoned than freshman Dwayne Evans.
The point is that we don't really know what we have until the players get a full season of D-1 experience under their belt.
Kwamain's possibilities in the NBA
in Billikens.com Main Board
Posted
After SLU becomes the first team since Bobby Knight's 1976 Indiana team to go undefeated en route to a National Championship, KM will be the 3rd player taken in the 2013 NBA draft.