willie Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 Billiken Roy tells us that schools like SLU can't compete at a high level because out tuition is too high relative to state schools. While this argument makes some sense how do you explain a school like Tulane. Tulane which I believe is the number one ranked team is one of the most expensive universities in the country. Somehow they are getting players to pay for part of their tuition bill. Bad coaching and lack of attention are the main reasons were so bad. Lets hope Cheryl can at least get them to mediocrity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 being a southern school helps tremendously. i went to high school with a group of guys that were fantastic baseball players. 7 out of the 9 starters on my high school team went on to play major college baseball and 6 of them played some level of minor league baseball. all talk about the advantages of being a southern school and having better weather for a longer period of time. not saying that alone is the reason the kids are paying to go to tulane, but another advantage compared to slu. that said, i have no use for hughes anymore. after following the area high school and legion scene very close the past two seasons, i have no idea what hughes is even thinking recruitingwise. for example, swic coach, neil fiala literally got ever single quality senior on the east side this spring. last year close to the same. i would venture to say that the swic juco team would kick slu's butt every single time they played. i know most of the kids that are going to swic as my son played legion with or against all. i am reasonably sure that there is someone in the group with outstanding academics that could have qualified for academic awards and played baseball. i also know hughes didnt recruit them. no excuse for it. especially considering hughes lives in belleville and played mon-clair ball himself for the sauget team for years and knows a lot of the dads, coaches, etc. no defending the baseball team from me anymore. if she took out jill, then hughes should go as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Law Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 It doesn't help us when the baseball facility is inferior to many high school facilities and the recruiting and operating budgets are woefully inadequate. Thank our wonderful president for that.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 recruiting budget as in what? if you are talking about travel, as i said, had hughes "traveled" down the street from his home to whitey herzog field a little more last summer during the legion season and talked to a few kids there he could have easily garnered some of the stellar class that swic is getting this season. my son played for the smithton senior legion team last summer which had two kids that both threw over 90 mph on it. never saw hughes at one of our games. i have seen bob hughes at one metro east high school game and one metro east legion game in the last two seasons. i see neil fiala from swic constantly. my point is, recruiting budgetwise, until we start bringing some of the local quality kids, what's the point? as to the field, hughes used to play mon-clair ball at sauget. go work a deal to use the grizzlies stadium. he'd likely have the best field in the conference to play on then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cujaysfan Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 IMO - SLU has many built in advantages to take advantage of with regards to baseball... unfortuneatly - one of those has left the building now that SLU is no longer part of CUSA - one of the best baseball conferences out there. st louis is arguably the best baseball town in america - if a decent product is put out - support should be there. st louis is really on the southern end of the northern states - the weather shouldn't be a huge factor...if ND, creighton, nebraska, and Wichita can have decent programs - there is no legit excuse for st louis not to - hell illinois chicago is in the tourney this year... there is very good talent in missouri - SMS was in the CWS just a few short years ago with mostly homegrown kids - and st louis is pretty strategically located where southern il and arkansas could be mined for talent. the jays will be playing this afternoon in the lincoln regional - and i have to tell you - it has been a lot of fun following this team all season and i am pumped to take on the nc state wolfpack this evening - and take down the huskers tomorrow or sunday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newberry Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 B-Roy just like you supported Jill, Then I am going to support Bob. Until he gets the backing and funds from the athletic department, it is going to be hard to recruit and get the players you want. There are plenty of good baseball players here in SAINT LOUIS if he had the money to get them. BUt the AD only cares about soccer and men's basketball. Plus ROY, you are from Illinois, your opinion does not count you WORTHLESS PISS ANT. Maybe you should donate money instead of bashing SLU and the AD department. I bet Garrison and Braun are glad they are gone so they do not have to put up with your BS anymore by being nice in front of them and bashing them on here. Donate some money to the baseball team if you are goingto ***** and moan. All you are is some middle age 40 year old man who never amounted to anything in sports and now trys to tell everybody that he knows a lot about college sports. Stick to selling insurance or whatever you do and watching your daughter's softball games. I am sure she is a great softball player but she probably will not even be good enough to play at SLU much less John Logan Junior College! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 Roy is correct, Hughes has had his chance to recruit bettter players. I have heard from more than one source out in the h.s. baseball circles that Hughes seldom heard or seen. I know he has some limits but good gravy he ought to be able to play 500 ball one of these years. The swim team is not getting any great help either but at least that coach has put together a competitive team the last 2-3 years. So, Hughes has no excuses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NashvilleBilliken Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 Damn Newberry, you don't like Roy too much. Did he sleep with your girlfriend or something back in college? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newberry Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 It is just the fact that Iuse to ***** and moan about Jill and Roy would say she didn't get enough support but he is doing the exact same thing to Bob as I did to Jill. The only difference between me and Roy is that I donate more money than him and I get my own parking spot in the garage at Billiken games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cujaysfan Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 not much excuse for lack of effort as far as recruiting goes... brad would be brutalized here if he wasn't making the effort to go see the best local kids play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crymdg2 Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 Simply put, Billiken baseball is a joke! If you look at the quality players in the metro east area, the enability to sign any of these quality players is a joke. For example, Nathan Culp, Evan Frey (Mizzou), Shaun Seibert, Brock Bond, T.J. Sinovich (Arkansas), Andy Schutzenhofer (Illinois now with the Cardinals Class AA) The two guys from SMS college world series team, etc... I know for a fact that the players from Arkansas were recruited by the Arkansas pitching coach, not even the head coach. Like billiken_roy stated already, the excuse of the weather is not the factor. The SWIC baseball team annually has a very good team, and the recruiting class they have coming in next year is sick! So what does Fiala have to offer that SLU doesn't? Hughes needs to go now. If you have to, hire the Arkansas pitching coach. Hell it looks like he can get kids to come. Hughes is not the answer nor has he ever been. PS A few weeks ago when SLU hosted the #1 team in the country, Tulane, wouldn't you think that we would have been boasting this game up like crazy trying to get people to come watch? I didn't hear of any advertising or anything, probably because they didn't want people to come and see how bad the team is. It's definately time for a change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 3, 2005 Share Posted June 3, 2005 i do donate money to the athletic department each year. so not sure where you are coming from. as to your tirade about hughes compared to jill, for the last year, i have not supported jill as well because of her recruiting as well. so i am being consistent. thanks for your opinion though and i sure hope my daughter gets that scholarship you are promising! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StLouBlue Posted June 4, 2005 Share Posted June 4, 2005 On why no marketing of the Tulane game, I would guess since they don't charge admission to the games they wouldn't spend any money marketing these games also. I didn't make any games this year, but last year there was no charge. I also agree that it is time for a change. I am not close enough to know why we are bad year after year, but a new head coach to energize the program would certainly help. Even if Hughes is retained, I would expect our new AD to issue a statement one way or the other in the next few weeks. If we are speculating he might be fired, I am sure any recruits considering SLU are doing the same. Someone earlier stated our facilities are poor/bad something to that effect. I don't agree at least on the field part. I think it is a nice on campus field, where if the team was winning students would come out to see the games. When I went to SLU they played in Sauget and no one ever thought about driving over there to see a game, maybe if the gametime was 3:00am after the clubs closed, but otherwise no. The SLU baseball team will be more competitive in the A-10 simply because it is not a very good baseball conference, where as CUSA was a very good baseball conference with Tulane, East Carolina, Houston, etc. This is the one thing that to me might save Hughes' job, joining a conference where being 500 is possible, our RPI will probably drop like a rock, but we should win more games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 4, 2005 Share Posted June 4, 2005 newberry, other than ripping the slu marketing and strongly disagreeing with any possible psl plans, both of which i have indeed discussed in person with john and jim while they were employed at slu, please tell me where i ever said anything derogatory about them on this board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted June 4, 2005 Share Posted June 4, 2005 imo, the main reason Tulane is successful is one, the year-around baseball weather, and secondly, excellent facilities. With that, throw in excellent coaching and a baseball sugar-daddy or two to help fund the baseball budget, and you have the receipe for success. Tulane's academic reputation will be a factor to some players. This summer, Tulane is remodeling its "stadium" (not field). It will then seat 4,200 fans. Tulane baseball generates cash.....SLU baseball is a cash drain. I would wage that Tulane's assistant coaching staff makes 4x what the SLU assistants make. During the winter months at West Pine (while watching Soderberg's group practice) you can hear the baseball team taking batting practice in one of the old West Pine handball courts. Later, you can see some of the baseball players running laps around the top of West Pine gym walk-way. At the same time, Tulane's squad is practicing outdoors in grade-A facilities. Huge difference. I expect SLU to compete at least mid-level in the A-10. When your pitching walk-ons/academic scholarship players against the likes of Tulane, SoMiss, TCU, Houston, East Carolina, etc. your in deep trouble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted June 4, 2005 Share Posted June 4, 2005 cheese...evidently Hughes is talking to some area high school coaches as 18 of the 34 current Billiken baseball players are from the metro St. Louis area. It's good to see the SLU swim teams have more success and set more school records. However, take a minute and look at their schedule. Their dual meets are against NAIA, D3, D2 and small midwestern D1 schools. C-USA only holds a season-ending conference swim meet. SLU baseball on the other-hand plays a 30 game C-USA schedule, including 12 games against four C-USA teams (Tulane, TCU, SoMiss, ECU) that went to the NCAA tournament. Your comparison of SLU swimming to SLU baseball is silly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted June 4, 2005 Share Posted June 4, 2005 crymdg2, I had high hopes for you, high hopes, but it looks like you are going to be a chip off the old block! Sad, really sad! First, SLU did offer Andy Schtz a significant scholarship, but at the last moment Illinois came in and offered some scholarship money and a lower tuition bill. SWIC does indeed have a good midwestern juco baseball program, but on a year-in-year-out "national" scale.....they are average. Kids go to SWIC basically because it is the best offer they have. In rare cases (like wanting to get drafted earlier than the four-year school rule) these SWIC kids are not turning down offers from Sun Belt and California colleges to play in that wind tunnel at SWIC. byw, did you see that huge P-D article on the SLU vs. Tulane series? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tseugnekillib Posted June 4, 2005 Share Posted June 4, 2005 broy....you and your over-rating of metro-east baseball sound like V-TIME and his local high school basketball bs! broy, they have to have tools, academics and/or some money to play at SLU. Again, 18 of the 34 SLU players are from the metro area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted June 4, 2005 Share Posted June 4, 2005 don't forget a major difference ... you are classy enough to brag about the money you donate. Official Billikens.com sponsor of H. Waldman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 4, 2005 Share Posted June 4, 2005 how would hughes know, he never talked to any of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted June 5, 2005 Share Posted June 5, 2005 Tbill - I understand that swimming has a different type of schedule but how do you get good swimmers to come if the competition is weak you go against - I still say the swimming coach has done a good job particularily given the previous coaches did not fare so well. All things are relative so Hughes has to recruit to his competition - he has not. Sorry, just because he has some local kids on the team does not mean the they are worht a damn - obviously they are not. That is like saying Brad has 60% of his team as local kids but really they should all be playing D2 ball - Hughes has to get better local kids not just any local kid! Your comparision is just silly from my point of view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Posted June 5, 2005 Share Posted June 5, 2005 It's not the point that he has a lot of local kids on the roster. The point is that he does not make an effort to see all the top talent in the area and therefore typically gets stuck with the less talented kids. Most of the kids on his roster should not be playing D-1 baseball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Law Posted June 6, 2005 Share Posted June 6, 2005 >imo, the main reason Tulane is successful is one, the >year-around baseball weather, and secondly, excellent >facilities. With that, throw in excellent coaching and a >baseball sugar-daddy or two to help fund the baseball >budget, and you have the receipe for success. Tulane's >academic reputation will be a factor to some players. > >This summer, Tulane is remodeling its "stadium" (not field). >It will then seat 4,200 fans. Tulane baseball generates >cash.....SLU baseball is a cash drain. I would wage that >Tulane's assistant coaching staff makes 4x what the SLU >assistants make. I've already mentioned in this thread that our facilities are worse than many HS facilities for games. And for off-season practicing, we have none. The Bills baseball players have to use facilities that are comparable to most low-level high schools for practicing. Goes back to the refusal to fund to be competitive by Biondi. Moving games to Sauget is NOT an option. Secondly, you mention Tulane's assistants. Compare that to SLU's "assistant." SLU only has one assistant coach. Hughes doesn't even have a secretary. Thus, the 2 coaches have to do everything but drive the bus to games. Hard to be out recruiting full-time like the Tulane coaches are when you have to do everything that other programs would have an administrative assistant doing. Do not underestimate the built-in obsticles SLU baseball has.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsboys Posted June 6, 2005 Share Posted June 6, 2005 Thats why when broy opens his mouth about what coaches should do or gives his opinion on billiken athletics it should be taken with a grain of salt. The reality is unless your Men's Soccer every other program is deficient in major areas including Men's BBall. The facilities are a joke and the budjets are even worse. What gets my blood boiling are these posters on this site that think they have all the fixes and they know all. The biggest porblem is from the top down. When I say the top I mean BIONDI. Money creates oppertunity to win. If the money was there and no wins then you could hammer others. Is the baseball team any good???? NO! But give them a break. They have absolutely no support and are expected to compete. With all that being said, I do think Bob should step down and go back to the east side and coach some high school ball. I think that would give him more joy than having to endure the SLU Athletic pitfalls. People on this board and in ST. Louis need to understand that SLU Athletics Overall is a lower tier Athletic Program!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Law Posted June 6, 2005 Share Posted June 6, 2005 Baseball does have some good players, including Ryan Bird who was all-CUSA - that's damn impressive considering the national baseball powers in that conference. However, tSLU don't have the depth the other programs have. The #5 starter on Tulane, USM, Houston, etc. would be the #1 or 2 at SLU. Houston back-ups would start for SLU. SLU does well considering what it's up against.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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