2023 Offseason - Coaching Discussion Thread

[Brighton]

“TheAthletic department is well aware.”

Are they ? Are they really ?

[billikenfan05]

6 hours ago, Soderball said:

Again: he. Is. The. Coach.

Travis Ford decides and everyone else obeys. You don't like it? Fire him. This is how coaches in the college game operate. He will choose his staff, players, strategy.

Not you, not me, not Chris may, not Fred Pestello, not troy Robertson, not dr chaifetz. Only C T F. The sooner people get this the better.

If you're upset with what I posted, I'm not sure you fully understood the premise of my post....

[DOC]

1 hour ago, billikenfan05 said:

If you're upset with what I posted, I'm not sure you fully understood the premise of my post....

There’s a lot he doesn’t fully understand. 

[BIG BILL FAN]

7 hours ago, Soderball said:

Your takes just get worse and more clueless. You have absolutely no idea what you are watching.

You’re an idiot if you think recruiting will still not be important. What if the financial offers are similar where will they go? How about your job, are you going to work for a Ford hater type personality for an extra $500, or go somewhere where you will be treated respectfully? There are lots of things to still consider, playing time, happiness, development, oh and maybe even education? Your hatred has robbed you of any common sense. 

[JMM28]

59 minutes ago, BIG BILL FAN said:

You’re an idiot if you think recruiting will still not be important. What if the financial offers are similar where will they go? How about your job, are you going to work for a Ford hater type personality for an extra $500, or go somewhere where you will be treated respectfully? There are lots of things to still consider, playing time, happiness, development, oh and maybe even education? Your hatred has robbed you of any common sense. 

No one hates Travis Ford. Stop with the straw man. 

[BIG BILL FAN]

9 minutes ago, JMM28 said:

No one hates Travis Ford. Stop with the straw man. 

Thanks for the laugh….

[dennis_w]

50 minutes ago, JMM28 said:

No one hates Travis Ford. Stop with the straw man. 

there are many who may not hate the man, but they certainly hate him as coach or at least they post such on message boards, if the threads are read it is very difficult to come to a different conclusion

[billikenfan05]

Hey you know what would be fun? If everyone stopped being to each other over this.

[wgstl]

14 hours ago, BIG BILL FAN said:

His average finish is actually 4.3, kind of you to bump it up to 5th however.. 

Hmm this is interesting to me.  coach Ford, it appears you used 2nd place to calculate the average. We finished 4th, had we finished 2nd like you really want to believe, we would have gotten the 2nd seed.  Had we gotten the 2 seed, we would not have seen VCU or UD to the finals, really big difference in getting a 2 seed vs a 4 seed.  So that said we finished with an average 4.6 which rounds to 5. 

[dennis_w]

18 minutes ago, wgstl said:

Hmm this is interesting to me.  coach Ford, it appears you used 2nd place to calculate the average. We finished 4th, had we finished 2nd like you really want to believe, we would have gotten the 2nd seed.  Had we gotten the 2 seed, we would not have seen VCU or UD to the finals, really big difference in getting a 2 seed vs a 4 seed.  So that said we finished with an average 4.6 which rounds to 5. 

We were seede 4th for they tournament, in conference play we tied for second. Wikipedia lists a second place finish, so someone somewhere agrees 

[wgstl]

Just now, dennis_w said:

We were seede 4th for they tournament, in conference play we tied for second. Wikipedia lists a second place finish, so someone somewhere agrees 

That seed says all I need to know, it wasn't a 2 seed, it wasn't a 3 seed, why?  those teams beat better teams and or head to head. 

[BIG BILL FAN]

46 minutes ago, wgstl said:

Hmm this is interesting to me.  coach Ford, it appears you used 2nd place to calculate the average. We finished 4th, had we finished 2nd like you really want to believe, we would have gotten the 2nd seed.  Had we gotten the 2 seed, we would not have seen VCU or UD to the finals, really big difference in getting a 2 seed vs a 4 seed.  So that said we finished with an average 4.6 which rounds to 5. 

Hey nitwit, I used the official standings of the conference… you must enjoy being dishonest.  Now get back on your job of telling recruits not to consider SLU because we have a horrible coach. 

[wgstl]

Just now, BIG BILL FAN said:

Hey nitwit, I used the official standings of the conference… you must enjoy being dishonest.  Now get back on your job of telling recruits not to consider SLU because we have a horrible coach. 

You have to be one of those, "hang a banner" for everything type guys aren't you? Seven teams would have tied for 2nd and you would be celebrating.   

[DeSmetBilliken]

28 minutes ago, dennis_w said:

We were seede 4th for they tournament, in conference play we tied for second. Wikipedia lists a second place finish, so someone somewhere agrees 

What difference does it really make? Whether you call it second place, tied for second, fourth seed, fourth place, the bottom line is that this team had very reasonable NCAA tournament expectations going into the season and didn’t come close to meeting those expectations, and didn’t even make the NIT. It sounds like you view this idea of finishing in a tie for second as some sort of a silver lining that overrides the disappointment of the season. I just don’t agree with that.

Look at Dayton. They had similar expectations as us, if not higher. They did have the #2 seed. I don’t think many Dayton fans are looking back at their season and saying “well, we were preseason Top 25, we missed the NCAAs, didn’t get in/opted out of the NIT, but we got that #2 seed in the A10 tournament, so we had a good season.”

[wgstl]

2 minutes ago, DeSmetBilliken said:

What difference does it really make? Whether you call it second place, tied for second, fourth seed, fourth place, the bottom line is that this team had very reasonable NCAA tournament expectations going into the season and didn’t come close to meeting those expectations, and didn’t even make the NIT. It sounds like you view this idea of finishing in a tie for second as some sort of a silver lining that overrides the disappointment of the season. I just don’t agree with that.

Look at Dayton. They had similar expectations as us, if not higher. They did have the #2 seed. I don’t think many Dayton fans are looking back at their season and saying “well, we were preseason Top 25, we missed the NCAAs, didn’t get in/opted out of the NIT, but we got that #2 seed in the A10 tournament, so we had a good season.”

And it seems there's a good chance UD moves on from Grant( in a different way than most)

[JMM28]

3 minutes ago, DeSmetBilliken said:

What difference does it really make? Whether you call it second place, tied for second, fourth seed, fourth place, the bottom line is that this team had very reasonable NCAA tournament expectations going into the season and didn’t come close to meeting those expectations, and didn’t even make the NIT. It sounds like you view this idea of finishing in a tie for second as some sort of a silver lining that overrides the disappointment of the season. I just don’t agree with that.

Look at Dayton. They had similar expectations as us, if not higher. They did have the #2 seed. I don’t think many Dayton fans are looking back at their season and saying “well, we were preseason Top 25, we missed the NCAAs, didn’t get in/opted out of the NIT, but we got that #2 seed in the A10 tournament, so we had a good season.”

Absolutely. Both things can be true! 

SLU did finish 2nd in conference. If SLU finished T-1, we'd celebrate a conference title regardless of seed. 

The season was a huge disappointment. A disappointment that would be ok for a coach that had some successes to hang his hat on. Unfortunately this coach and staff do not have any successes to hang their hat on. 

[BigMouthBilliken]

6 minutes ago, JMM28 said:

Absolutely. Both things can be true! 

SLU did finish 2nd in conference. If SLU finished T-1, we'd celebrate a conference title regardless of seed. 

The season was a huge disappointment. A disappointment that would be ok for a coach that had some successes to hang his hat on. Unfortunately this coach and staff do not have any successes to hang their hat on. 

There are no ties as there are tie breakers! What is so difficult to understand?

[TheA_Bomb]

A lot of solid points in this thread. 

if i had to pick my top replacement coach I'd pick C. Mack.

Thoughts on Blake Ahearn?  Would he be your 2nd place or 4th place pick? 

 

Don't know much about him besides Austin Toros HC (G League) and current Grizzlies AC. Unknown in College but maybe he'd be a $1.5mil/yr salary guy. 

Any other candidates?

[wgstl]

2 minutes ago, TheA_Bomb said:

A lot of solid points in this thread. 

if i had to pick my top replacement coach I'd pick C. Mack.

Thoughts on Blake Ahearn?  Would he be your 2nd place or 4th place pick? 

 

Don't know much about him besides Austin Toros HC (G League) and current Grizzlies AC. Unknown in College but maybe he'd be a $1.5mil/yr salary guy. 

Any other candidates?

I dont want to get hung up on this too much since im 90% sure Ford is staying. There are a few other coaches worth keeping an eye on tho, not just Mack. 

[HoosierPal]

48 minutes ago, JMM28 said:

Absolutely. Both things can be true! 

SLU did finish 2nd in conference. If SLU finished T-1, we'd celebrate a conference title regardless of seed.

I'm not sure why this basic concept of Standings v Seeding isn't understood by some of our elite posters. 

Look at the A10 final standings on the A10 Website:  https://atlantic10.com/standings.aspx?path=mbball

Fordham is listed 2nd in the standings ahead of Dayton listed 3rd, yet Fordham had the 3rd seed. 

There was a three way tie for 8th.  Davidson is listed 8th in the standings and had the 8th seed. 

St. Joe, tied for 8th, is listed 9th and had the 10th seed

St. B, tied for 8th, is listed 10th and had the 9th seed

Richmond, tied for 11th, is listed 11th and had the 12th seed

LaSalle, tied for 11th, is listed 12th and had the 11th seed.

The listing in the standings is based on the total schedule.  So Fordham at .748 is listed ahead of Dayton at .647, and ahead of SLU at .636.  In each tie, the total schedule % is used to list the teams.  Doesn't mean much beyond that.

This is pretty easy to understand, yet some of our MBM's can't figure it out.  Final standings are different than seedings for the post season tourney.  Why are their tiebreakers for seeding?  It wouldn't be fair if the three teams tied for 2nd played one team.  What do you do, have 15 on 5?  You have to sort it out to have one team play one team.  And if you aren't familiar with tiebreakers, the final one is a coin toss.  So do you fire (or hire) a coach because his team lost (or won) a coin toss?

Oh my, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travis_Ford it appears we tied for 2nd.

Forum boards have plenty of opinions, which are fine.  You can agree or disagree with opinions and life goes on.  But facts are facts.

[NoCoBillsFan]

1 hour ago, dennis_w said:

We were seede 4th for they tournament, in conference play we tied for second. Wikipedia lists a second place finish, so someone somewhere agrees 

So what is the point of conference play if not to determine your playoff seeding? 

[BIG BILL FAN]

37 minutes ago, wgstl said:

You have to be one of those, "hang a banner" for everything type guys aren't you? Seven teams would have tied for 2nd and you would be celebrating.   

No, I’m just not a liar like you. Not hard to understand. Only people with weak arguments have to lie and deceive. 

[DOC]

2 minutes ago, BigMouthBilliken said:

There are no ties as there are tie breakers! What is so difficult to understand?

If 2 teams tie for the conference championship then they both get rings. They don’t use tie breakers to determine the champion. Breaking the tie is for conference tournament only. To be even more clear look at the Big10 standings. They do NOT reflect seeding in their final standings. They all tied and they will all say they finished 4th, as they should. The same can be said for the A10 standings and every other conference in the country. 

[wgstl]

2 minutes ago, BIG BILL FAN said:

No, I’m just not a liar like you. Not hard to understand. Only people with weak arguments have to lie and deceive. 

Sorry for lying and assuming you're a hang a banner for everything type person.  Hope you will forgive me. xoxo

[dennis_w]

2 minutes ago, NoCoBillsFan said:

So what is the point of conference play if not to determine your playoff seeding? 

to determine the winner of the conference, there is a regular season champion and a conference tournament champion, the tournament seeding is determined from the regular season standings and sometimes tie breakers are necessary, vcu got to hang two banners a-10 champion and a-10 tournament champion