Jump to content

Collins: Cousy Award Finalist


Recommended Posts

43 minutes ago, johnbj14 said:

I don’t necessarily believe it is fully Yuri’s fault he isn’t as impactful as his assist totals would indicate. There are certainly things I wish he would have done to round out his game, notably shoot more from deep to keep defenses honest and not drive directly into shot blockers multiple times a game. However I think there’s a pretty significant case that the roster construction around him simply was clunky. Not enough guys who can create for themselves, and a scheme overly reliant on Yuri making opportunities for others. As much as I like Gibson and Javonte, they just aren’t dynamic (this year in the case of Javonte) enough off the dribble, and a lot of their scoring was dependent on Yuri breaking down the defense first. We saw how disastrous that plan is against a team like Fordham, who took him out of the game completely. 
 

Yuri undoubtedly is the best passer we will ever see in a Billiken uniform. He’s also a flawed player who would have been better served with a different supporting cast. I’ll miss him a lot, but also hope our roster next year doesn’t have to rely on one player this much. 

I’ve said the same thing all year. An entire team that is dependent on Yuri to create for them. I think we thought Perk could be the guy that was not dependent and that just has not turned out to be the case. 
 

Like you my biggest disappointment with Yuri is that he still can’t keep defenses honest with his 3 and that despite the hype defensively he’s not been much better at staying in front of his man than Gib, Perk, or Pick allowing opposing guards to get in the lane too easily. Once a guard gets beat someone has to help generally leaving an open shooter. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, johnbj14 said:

I don’t necessarily believe it is fully Yuri’s fault he isn’t as impactful as his assist totals would indicate. There are certainly things I wish he would have done to round out his game, notably shoot more from deep to keep defenses honest and not drive directly into shot blockers multiple times a game. However I think there’s a pretty significant case that the roster construction around him simply was clunky. Not enough guys who can create for themselves, and a scheme overly reliant on Yuri making opportunities for others. As much as I like Gibson and Javonte, they just aren’t dynamic (this year in the case of Javonte) enough off the dribble, and a lot of their scoring was dependent on Yuri breaking down the defense first. We saw how disastrous that plan is against a team like Fordham, who took him out of the game completely. 
 

Yuri undoubtedly is the best passer we will ever see in a Billiken uniform. He’s also a flawed player who would have been better served with a different supporting cast. I’ll miss him a lot, but also hope our roster next year doesn’t have to rely on one player this much. 

Yep… one of the biggest roster/scheme issues in my mind is the consistent high ball screens with a 5 that has stone hands and is zero threat unless he has his back to the hoop and 5feet away.  Worked way better last year with linssen.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Are you really one of the top 5 PGs in the nation if your team isn't playing in the NCAAs?  

Despite our poor roster construction, injuries, and sometimes bad coaching decisions by Ford, Yuri could have done 2 things to make us a much better team.

Play All conference Defense, or even average defense.  Jimerson was a better defender than Yuri this year, outside of a couple "Big" games in front of NBA scouts.

Get Okoro better involved in the offense.  If Okoro was a real offensive threat it erases some of our liabilities.  Collins & Okoro's chemistry never emerged and by the end a lesser player, Forrester, was getting more PT because of it.

Glad so many people had fun watching Yuri set records this season.  Without wins they are meaningless.

H remains the best PG in Billikens history.  

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

53 minutes ago, Dr. Holly Hills said:

Yep… one of the biggest roster/scheme issues in my mind is the consistent high ball screens with a 5 that has stone hands and is zero threat unless he has his back to the hoop and 5feet away.  Worked way better last year with linssen.

Yep. Running a high ball screen with two big men that pretty much have to roll and not pop hurts too, as Yuri pretty much only goes downhill. Would be really curious to see how this staff recruits the portal to make them more offensively dynamic and not so reliant on this action. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, johnbj14 said:

Yep. Running a high ball screen with two big men that pretty much have to roll and not pop hurts too, as Yuri pretty much only goes downhill. Would be really curious to see how this staff recruits the portal to make them more offensively dynamic and not so reliant on this action. 

We have the players to run pick and pop at the 4, Hargrove, Perkins, Pickett. Not once did we run this.

Bizziken likes this
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, thetorch said:

Are you really one of the top 5 PGs in the nation if your team isn't playing in the NCAAs?  

Despite our poor roster construction, injuries, and sometimes bad coaching decisions by Ford, Yuri could have done 2 things to make us a much better team.

Play All conference Defense, or even average defense.  Jimerson was a better defender than Yuri this year, outside of a couple "Big" games in front of NBA scouts.

Get Okoro better involved in the offense.  If Okoro was a real offensive threat it erases some of our liabilities.  Collins & Okoro's chemistry never emerged and by the end a lesser player, Forrester, was getting more PT because of it.

Glad so many people had fun watching Yuri set records this season.  Without wins they are meaningless.

H remains the best PG in Billikens history.  

 

Disagree. But that's your opinion and I respect it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, thetorch said:

Are you really one of the top 5 PGs in the nation if your team isn't playing in the NCAAs?  

Despite our poor roster construction, injuries, and sometimes bad coaching decisions by Ford, Yuri could have done 2 things to make us a much better team.

Play All conference Defense, or even average defense.  Jimerson was a better defender than Yuri this year, outside of a couple "Big" games in front of NBA scouts.

Get Okoro better involved in the offense.  If Okoro was a real offensive threat it erases some of our liabilities.  Collins & Okoro's chemistry never emerged and by the end a lesser player, Forrester, was getting more PT because of it.

Glad so many people had fun watching Yuri set records this season.  Without wins they are meaningless.

H remains the best PG in Billikens history.  

 

So by this standard, was Kevin Lisch not a great SLU player? He never even had a sniff at the Dance and didn't even play in the NIT.

BTW, John Stockton never played in the Dance or NIT.

billiken_roy and slufanskip like this
Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, ACE said:

So by this standard, was Kevin Lisch not a great SLU player? He never even had a sniff at the Dance and didn't even play in the NIT.

BTW, John Stockton never played in the Dance or NIT.

Are you kidding me with this?  I don't know what is more foolish, your argument or me wasting my time refuting your nonsense.

What standard?  How do you equate Kevin Lisch as a great Billiken to Yuri being a top 5 PG in the Nation????

Lisch not making the dance does factor into his all time status as a Billiken as it does to Yuri but Lisch was never on the national radar for any award so the two have absolutely nothing to do with each other.

BTW John Stockton wasn't one of the 5 best PGs in the country his senior year.  Leon Wood, Alvin Robertson, Ricky Stokes, Michael Adams, Vern Fleming, Mark Price, Milt Wagner, Andre Turner, Scott Skiles, Spud Webb, Pearl Washington, Ricky Ross, Kenny Smith, Othel Wilson were all considered better. 

Too little was known of Stockton coming out of college.  He was thought of a run and gun shooter, more than a point.  He was a late addition to the Olympic camp following his Sr year, was only invited due to injuries from other players.  He made an impression in the camp, not enough to make the team, fellow points Roberston, Wood, & Fleming did. Knight promised to help him with NBA scouts.  He got him a workout in Utah and the rest is history.  The Jazz took him 17th overall, most at the time thought it was a major reach.  Stockton proved people wrong in the NBA but again that has little to do with his status as a college player.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

What I found interesting about the article was Yuri refusal to even consider playing overseas. 
 

Good for him. He has a goal and he is determined to reach that goal. I find that commendable.

I wonder if that mindset will change if the NBA doesn’t work out or doesn’t come calling. 
I think he has the ability and the type of game to become an absolute star and fan favorite overseas. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, thetorch said:

Are you kidding me with this?  I don't know what is more foolish, your argument or me wasting my time refuting your nonsense.  Yes, the argument is so "foolish" that it requires you trying to jump through several hoops to try to refute it. Ha!

What standard?  How do you equate Kevin Lisch as a great Billiken to Yuri being a top 5 PG in the Nation???? Your standard, judging individual player performances based on NCAA appearances.

Lisch not making the dance does factor into his all time status as a Billiken as it does to Yuri but Lisch was never on the national radar for any award so the two have absolutely nothing to do with each other. Anthony Bonner never made the Dance either, and his number is retired.

BTW John Stockton wasn't one of the 5 best PGs in the country his senior year.  Leon Wood, Alvin Robertson, Ricky Stokes, Michael Adams, Vern Fleming, Mark Price, Milt Wagner, Andre Turner, Scott Skiles, Spud Webb, Pearl Washington, Ricky Ross, Kenny Smith, Othel Wilson were all considered better. You don't like the John Stockton point? Okay, the first name you mention Leon Wood... also never made the Dance.

Too little was known of Stockton coming out of college.  He was thought of a run and gun shooter, more than a point.  He was a late addition to the Olympic camp following his Sr year, was only invited due to injuries from other players.  He made an impression in the camp, not enough to make the team, fellow points Roberston, Wood, & Fleming did. Knight promised to help him with NBA scouts.  He got him a workout in Utah and the rest is history.  The Jazz took him 17th overall, most at the time thought it was a major reach.  Stockton proved people wrong in the NBA but again that has little to do with his status as a college player.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, dlarry said:

What I found interesting about the article was Yuri refusal to even consider playing overseas. 
 

Good for him. He has a goal and he is determined to reach that goal. I find that commendable.

I wonder if that mindset will change if the NBA doesn’t work out or doesn’t come calling. 
I think he has the ability and the type of game to become an absolute star and fan favorite overseas. 

 

Grant Golden, Jacob Gilyard, Jalen Adaway, and Jordan Hall are all playing in the G League.  It is reasonable to assume Collins will get an invite to a team.  But yeah, interesting as you say, he doesn't want to be paid in Euro's.

I looked it up and the 'average' G League salary is around $40,000.  Very likely Collins could make more than that at a P5 school in NIL money, but it would delay any professional dreams by a year.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, HoosierPal said:

Grant Golden, Jacob Gilyard, Jalen Adaway, and Jordan Hall are all playing in the G League.  It is reasonable to assume Collins will get an invite to a team.  But yeah, interesting as you say, he doesn't want to be paid in Euro's.

I looked it up and the 'average' G League salary is around $40,000.  Very likely Collins could make more than that at a P5 school in NIL money, but it would delay any professional dreams by a year.

He could make that coin at SLU.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

56 minutes ago, Adman said:

He could make that coin at SLU.

He could but he would be putting money ahead of career. I can’t see him improving much with another year at SLU. See how Goodwin improved his game with a year in the G League. He just turned 22.  Want to wait until he is 23 to try Pro ball?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, ACE said:

 

Do you understand the concept of apples to oranges??????

Considering the Billikens rarely make the tournament it would be silly to have that as a standard to be a great Billiken.

Not silly to have that as a standard for a NATIONAL AWARD.  Winning may not be the only standard but it plays a key part in determining the role as no past winner has not made the NCAAs.

Absolutely nothing to do with each other.

Leon Wood was awesome.  If they had a Cousy award he probably wouldn't have been on the watchlist because he played for a low level school like Stockton did, yet he put up much better number than Stockton did and for a better team.  Since they didn't have the award we'll never know.  I do know that no winner of the cousy award has not made the tournament.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, thetorch said:

Do you understand the concept of apples to oranges??????

Considering the Billikens rarely make the tournament it would be silly to have that as a standard to be a great Billiken.

Not silly to have that as a standard for a NATIONAL AWARD.  Winning may not be the only standard but it plays a key part in determining the role as no past winner has not made the NCAAs.

Absolutely nothing to do with each other.

Leon Wood was awesome.  If they had a Cousy award he probably wouldn't have been on the watchlist because he played for a low level school like Stockton did, yet he put up much better number than Stockton did and for a better team.  Since they didn't have the award we'll never know.  I do know that no winner of the cousy award has not made the tournament.

Take a breath my man

ACE and RiseOfTheBillikens like this
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Littlebill said:

Take a breath my man

This plot has been played out so much.

I post.

Ace makes a dumb argument against it.

I refute it.

I get told "to take a breath" as if my typing has a tone.

Repeat for years. 

Or Ace could quit posting about things he knows nothing about.

Now you can chill.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, thetorch said:

Do you understand the concept of apples to oranges??????

Considering the Billikens rarely make the tournament it would be silly to have that as a standard to be a great Billiken.

Not silly to have that as a standard for a NATIONAL AWARD.  Winning may not be the only standard but it plays a key part in determining the role as no past winner has not made the NCAAs.

Absolutely nothing to do with each other.

Leon Wood was awesome.  If they had a Cousy award he probably wouldn't have been on the watchlist because he played for a low level school like Stockton did, yet he put up much better number than Stockton did and for a better team.  Since they didn't have the award we'll never know.  I do know that no winner of the cousy award has not made the tournament.

This was your statement: Are you really one of the top 5 PGs in the nation if your team isn't playing in the NCAAs? 

The finalists for this national award have been voted on prior to the NCAA field being set, so the question you raise makes no sense.

Then you said: no past winner has not made the NCAAs.  At this point he is simply a finalist for an INDIVIDUAL award. Throughout sports, there are NUMEROUS examples of athletes winning individual awards, even when his team has not made the postseason. This is not an MVP award.  I think it's quite impressive that a non-P5 player is a finalist- and obviously the voters agree.

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, HoosierPal said:

Grant Golden, Jacob Gilyard, Jalen Adaway, and Jordan Hall are all playing in the G League.  It is reasonable to assume Collins will get an invite to a team.  But yeah, interesting as you say, he doesn't want to be paid in Euro's.

I looked it up and the 'average' G League salary is around $40,000.  Very likely Collins could make more than that at a P5 school in NIL money, but it would delay any professional dreams by a year.

line getting thinner tween NIL & professional dreams.

Making some reasonable NIL $$ while becoming the #1 career leader in the 3rd most important offensive stat in the second most important sport in college sports, & being reasonably sure it will stay that way for the rest of your life, now days that's some pretty bankable sh*t. Do that then go G league. He'd have hype close to that dunk champ IMO

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, almaman said:

line getting thinner tween NIL & professional dreams.

Making some reasonable NIL $$ while becoming the #1 career leader in the 3rd most important offensive stat in the second most important sport in college sports, & being reasonably sure it will stay that way for the rest of your life, now days that's some pretty bankable sh*t. Do that then go G league. He'd have hype close to that dunk champ IMO

How much $$ is Jacob Gilyard getting this year for setting the NCAA Career Steals record?  Does he have a lifetime contract from a security company that will pay him forever for his legacy?

"Hi this is Yuri Collins for Bethesda Assisted Living Care. Trust me, I know that the workers at Bethesda will ASSIST you with your daily body functions." 

Priceless.

Luckily Mr. Collins isn't asking to either you or me for career advice.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

How much $$ is Jacob Gilyard getting this year for setting the NCAA Career Steals record?  Does he have a lifetime contract from a security company that will pay him forever for his legacy?

"Hi this is Yuri Collins for Bethesda Assisted Living Care. Trust me, I know that the workers at Bethesda will ASSIST you with your daily body functions." 

Priceless.

Luckily Mr. Collins isn't asking to either you or me for career advice.

that's y I posted it. don't do other team's boards but that Gilyard fella should heed your advice, he has much better chance than the #2 career steal leader or to mirror yurimania 19th best ain't being paid a thing. as with most of my observations driving them is a bit of levity, but I think it is as reasonable to think that big $$ could be made in the NIL era with such a simple tie in. Much better chance than Thatch retiring on pickled cucumber proceeds.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 3/9/2023 at 5:45 PM, thetorch said:

This plot has been played out so much.

I post.

Ace makes a dumb argument against it.

I refute it.

I get told "to take a breath" as if my typing has a tone.

Repeat for years. 

Or Ace could quit posting about things he knows nothing about.

Now you can chill.

Odd

ive been here ten years I’m not some new guy. 

 

just because it’s been happening for a while doesn’t make it normal 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...