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8 minutes ago, gobillsgo said:

I admit I do not have much memory of the coaches pre-Soderberg.  But it seems since then that we are willing to put a little more money and effort into coaching hires. Crews is the obvious exception to this, but he was never in a million years going to be replaced after his coach of the year season (which as we now know, was entirely undeserved— that team coached itself).  Majerus was a program changing hire, and Ford was just what we needed at the time to increase the talent level.  Now go get a coach that can do something with talent (Chris Mack) 

as much as we all recognize rickma was a basketball savant, you have to ask why the program didnt have more depth?   rickma could develop players, but come on, really that last rickma roster that crews "inherited" was four players.   so basically rickma was not an end all recruiter.   he was a developer of talent and a teacher that could get the needed precision to win with less.  amazing actually.

so yes ford was the need to bring in the talented depth.  but it still doesnt excuse what the results have been.  

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1 minute ago, CBFan said:

The new transfer rules allows a new coach to bring his players with them so it probably won’t take 5 years.

I will only be living with in the area another 5 to 8 years so I am running out of time to watch a top 25 Billikens team play in Chaifetz.

im not sure our BoT will go along with NiL and transfers to put a top 25 team immediately in place.   i cant imagine that price tag and surely that would take a coaching hire that would be the highest paid billiken coach in history.   i dont see that happening.   a new coach will start over with what we had and build as we have in the past imo.  

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9 minutes ago, Billiken Rich said:

I wouldn't say I've defended Ford "tooth and nail."  I do think he's a damn good recruiter. After watching Brad, Jimmy, and even Romar recruit here, I do not think you lightly throw that away.  I agree, ultimately he is responsible for our record.  You just better be sure you've got a Majerus coming in before you "Brad" Travis...... 

Good post and I think moving forward I think he will have a physically stronger team next season.

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2 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

im not sure our BoT will go along with NiL and transfers to put a top 25 team immediately in place.   i cant imagine that price tag and surely that would take a coaching hire that would be the highest paid billiken coach in history.   i dont see that happening.   a new coach will start over with what we had and build as we have in the past imo.  

Good point I forgot about the money.

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When I describe Ford to my friends I tell them he has raised the floor significantly, but not the ceiling. If you have been a fan since the 80's or even before, you have seen some bad basketball that has scarred you. Many years the teams were just not competeitive. I belive that won't be the case under Ford. He recruits enough good players to keep the team from having that disastrouse single digit win season.  However, the next step is more frequent tourney appearances, that is where he has failed to date. Ultimately that is what he should be judged by. 

In terms of donors, they are out there and they care. I hear that recently, the top donors have been hit up to put together an NIL program for the existing players and the recruiting cycle we are in right now. That is critical, apparently. Tough to recruit when a visiting player asks your PG (who leads the nation in assists) what his NIL deal is and it isn't there. Why a collective is necessary long term. We are all going to be solicited to donate and and each of us will have to decide how important this is to us. Is it season ticket important? Or is it that plus the manadatory seat/Billiken Club donation, plus the additional donation plus an NIL contribution plus ....., you get the point. 

This is big business, which is why this offseason will be critical with a program that is losing some of the fanbase and turning over the roster. Until then I will root for the program and its current head coach as hard as I can, hope we right the ship and run the table and worry about the coaching staff after the season is over.

As Norman Dale said "I would hope you would support who we are. Not, who we are not. These six individuals have made a choice to work, a choice to sacrifice, to put themselves on the line 23 nights for the next 4 months, to represent you, this high school. That kind of commitment and effort deserves and demands your respect. This is your team."

 

 

 

 

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41 minutes ago, shempie said:

When I describe Ford to my friends I tell them he has raised the floor significantly, but not the ceiling. If you have been a fan since the 80's or even before, you have seen some bad basketball that has scarred you. Many years the teams were just not competeitive. I belive that won't be the case under Ford. He recruits enough good players to keep the team from having that disastrouse single digit win season.  However, the next step is more frequent tourney appearances, that is where he has failed to date. Ultimately that is what he should be judged by. 

In terms of donors, they are out there and they care. I hear that recently, the top donors have been hit up to put together an NIL program for the existing players and the recruiting cycle we are in right now. That is critical, apparently. Tough to recruit when a visiting player asks your PG (who leads the nation in assists) what his NIL deal is and it isn't there. Why a collective is necessary long term. We are all going to be solicited to donate and and each of us will have to decide how important this is to us. Is it season ticket important? Or is it that plus the manadatory seat/Billiken Club donation, plus the additional donation plus an NIL contribution plus ....., you get the point. 

This is big business, which is why this offseason will be critical with a program that is losing some of the fanbase and turning over the roster. Until then I will root for the program and its current head coach as hard as I can, hope we right the ship and run the table and worry about the coaching staff after the season is over.

As Norman Dale said "I would hope you would support who we are. Not, who we are not. These six individuals have made a choice to work, a choice to sacrifice, to put themselves on the line 23 nights for the next 4 months, to represent you, this high school. That kind of commitment and effort deserves and demands your respect. This is your team."

 

 

 

 

Frequent tourney appearances are difficult to come by in non power 6 conferences, the odds are greatly stacked against the mid majors, if tourney appearances are the only measure of success billiken fans will be disappointed most years. a power 6 conference team can schedule a crap non con schedule go 500 in conference and be in the tourney that is not available to an a 10 team

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1 hour ago, billiken_roy said:

as much as we all recognize rickma was a basketball savant, you have to ask why the program didnt have more depth?   rickma could develop players, but come on, really that last rickma roster that crews "inherited" was four players.   so basically rickma was not an end all recruiter.   he was a developer of talent and a teacher that could get the needed precision to win with less.  amazing actually.

so yes ford was the need to bring in the talented depth.  but it still doesnt excuse what the results have been.  

I think it’s reasonable to assume that if Majerus remained coach, we’d have seen more development of the younger/depth players.  Instead, Crews played the main guys about 36mpg each and said, development be damned. 

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The problem with Rick Majerus at SLU was that he was in very poor health and did not last long enough in good enough shape to leave a lasting imprint upon the program. His tenure as head coach was a bright flash of light that was soon extinguished not to come back.

We do have the facilities in place, and I believe we have the talent. But talent amounts to nothing if it is not used properly.

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Leave Slu Sign Guy alone, he provides a tremendous service to all of us.

Finances in a University are extremely complex and capital expenses are made with long term aims. It should be clear that SLU prioritizes academic development over sports in the allocation of its funds.

As I have posted in other threads, this year has been difficult and investments have generally yielded losses. Harvard (the only University I have access to budget and financial information from) had a -1.83% return on investments in 2022, and had to draw down heavily from its endowment, causing a drop of -4.3% in its value (over $ 8 B draw down). This was necessary despite record income from tuition (students returned to campus after the Covid lockdowns), reduced salary expenses (frozen salaries and no bonuses for non union employees), and the usual multi billion yearly fund raiser.  MIT had investment returns of -5.3%, and Stanford -4.2% for this year. The returns quoted are on investments only, they do not include endowment draw downs or other income. I assume that both MIT and Stanford dipped into their endowments heavily just like Harvard did. Not every University lost this much money last year, Yale had a +0.8% investment gain, and Penn had a flat investment return.

SLU most likely also experienced investment losses and may also have had to draw down from its endowment this past year. I have no access to this information.

The investment figures from MIT, Stanford, Yale, and Penn were provided in the Harvard report.

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8 hours ago, Old guy said:

Leave Slu Sign Guy alone, he provides a tremendous service to all of us.

Nobody was actually taking jabs at Slu Sign Guy and everybody, including Slu Sign Guy (but apparently excluding you), knew that. 

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22 hours ago, billiken_roy said:

i think we have to watch and see.   maybe just maybe he is waking up to some of his poor decisions.   for example it was pretty obvious, our point guard decided to play like a point guard instead of trying to be allen iverson Saturday.   was that all on him or did Ford make that decision?   imo it was the difference in the game.  

maybe he is willing to continue with a new leaf?

look i agree what was going on was not going to cut it anymore.   i was a big, defender that he should be our coach.   not because he is good at planning for and managing a game or developing talent but because he has been very good at bringing talent to Saint Louis University.   we have never had the abundance of talent at SLU in my fandom to compare.  and talent always gives us a chance.  those giving up on our current talent imo are just wrong.   i think they just arent being used correctly.   ford might be the champion of square peg in a round hole.  

now i will say his rosters often didnt make sense and left us scratching our head.   for example, we really only have two game ready bigs on this roster.  we really only have 1 point guard on this roster.  but we have a cargo ship full of wings.   

we've all had instances of questioning not only the makeup of the roster but the use with his insistence that he really only use 7 or 8 players even though after the first few players it seems that we could easily be playing 10 or 11 players.   which leads to the question of how we use the team on the floor.   why if we have all these guards and wings arent  we playing fast on both ends of the floor pressing, fast breaking etc.   of course if we only basically use 7 or 8 players their effectiveness playing fast cant be done due to the depth.   not using those next level of guards and wings only will lead to a self fullfilling prophecy of "see they arent good enough" ruined confidence, or disillusionment and transfers.   i hate turnover.  

im still in the "play with ford" camp, but i admit, with the disappointing non conference results, i am on the edge of leaving such.  

last, i want to throw out our horrible program history of bringing in new coaches for all to think about.   other than Rickma and maybe spoon (imo coachingwise, spoon is a level below Rickma) we havent exactly been bringing in 20 year program masters that get us to the tourney.   it's been more like maybe 5 years and start over most of the time.   i really dont want to do that again.  i am too old to go through a rebuild the program again.   

This is pretty much where I am.  Let the season play out and see how Ford adjusts, especially since he must be aware of the growing discontent.  If we make the tournament, CF will be retained.  If CF makes the 2nd weekend, he'll be extended.  If we fall short, AD May has some decisions to make.

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Dr. Bird, if you read what I posted about 2022 University investment results plus the need to draw down on endowments, you may realize that whether Ford manages to make improvements or not it may be a better financial decision for SLU to keep Ford until things stabilize or his contract expires.  Having to pay to terminate his contract plus the expenses and salary of finding and hiring a new coach may not be a good option for SLU this year. We may be stuck with Ford regardless of what he does.

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6 minutes ago, Old guy said:

Dr. Bird, if you read what I posted about 2022 University investment results plus the need to draw down on endowments, you may realize that whether Ford manages to make improvements or not it may be a better financial decision for SLU to keep Ford until things stabilize or his contract expires.  Having to pay to terminate his contract plus the expenses and salary of finding and hiring a new coach may not be a good option for SLU this year. We may be stuck with Ford regardless of what he does.

True, and that may in fact be AD May's decision if we don't make the tourney....retain CF for multiple reasons including financial.

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On 1/3/2023 at 1:39 PM, gobillsgo said:

I think it’s reasonable to assume that if Majerus remained coach, we’d have seen more development of the younger/depth players.  Instead, Crews played the main guys about 36mpg each and said, development be damned. 

Majerus was not going to stick around. He was sick of Biondi and Biondi was sick of him. I don’t believe Biondi was going to extend his contract. Majerus was considering his options and openly flirted with the SMU job. 

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