Bills By 40 Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Everyone seems to posthumously romanticize Nesbitt, the only thing he ever had was raw potential and an unhinged attitude. I wish him the best but he'd be at best the 9th man on this team, and there's a good argument that he'd fall as low as 10th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOC Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 I agree. What it would have cost to get Nesbitt vs what he would get for his 2nd season here would be night and day difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgstl Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 17 minutes ago, Bills By 40 said: Everyone seems to posthumously romanticize Nesbitt, the only thing he ever had was raw potential and an unhinged attitude. I wish him the best but he'd be at best the 9th man on this team, and there's a good argument that he'd fall as low as 10th. Agreed. Nesbitt could have been the 4th best player next year, or never leave the bench. My only complaint with him leaving was that he's still young, and I still think by senior year he would have been special. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old guy Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 I do not know if you see the similarity or not but I want to compare this NIL mess with the way houses were sold not long ago, and the way they are sold now. It goes like this: 1. Traditional way of selling homes: the buyers agent would arrange a visit to the home for sale for the customer to see. If the customer liked it, there would be a second or more visits to the home. An offer oftentimes followed by counter offers would be made subject to the results of the inspection, and usually with time limits for the buyer to sell his/her house. After the inspection was done the agents for the buyer and seller would negotiate what repairs or credits the seller would provide to firm the deal. Then all that was left was closing the deal with the bank. It took some effort to buy and sell a home using this system, but the method used was a real negotiation in which both parties would reach an agreement. The seller would have the option to place the house in the market again if the buyer could not sell his house within a given time period. This was the traditional method used for years. 2. This is what is happening in the real estate market presently. The seller's agent arranges for all the buyers showing interest in the property to come in the same day during a specific time period. You may literally have a couple of dozen buyer families in the house at the same time. There is very little time to really check the house, and the selling agent is generally too busy to answer questions the buyer may have. When the specified time period is over everyone goes home, the seller agent will take any offers anyone wants to make for a limited period of time. There is no negotiation, no inspection, houses are sold "as is." The highest bidder gets the house, usually at a price that is over the asking price. The buyer pays for any required repairs to the house just bought. The larger the number of families at the showing at the auction, the higher the price markups obtained. See the difference, the traditional way is a real business purchase negotiation, the current way is an auction. What we have with NILs at this time is an auction. If you offer players what you think is a good level NIL, this amount becomes a bottom price which the player and his agent will try their best to beat in the transfer portal. The transfer portal works like an auction company. Loyalty, and team discounts do not count in this system, what counts is the amount the buyer is willing to pay. The winner is the largest bidder, and the transfer portal really works as an auction house. As it happens in the real estate market, the agents, and lawyers get better commissions (prices are higher), the seller (player) gets the best amount obtainable. NILs are an auction market system folks, and that is what reality is. A school wanting to retain a good player cannot afford to come up with their best offer up front, they must keep something in reserve to be able to beat any better offers received by the player. In a system like this one, the better players or the most successful players will get very large amounts of money. The lower level or lower experience players may have no takers, this is exactly the way an auction house works. The goods receiving no offers at an auction are sold after the auction at a deep discount. NOW is the deep discount time at the transfer portal, keep that in mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOC Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 36 minutes ago, JMM28 said: 800k would be more than most Big10 teams have right now. If boosters could come up with that, I'd hold it and recruit better players with it. No need to pay guys 6-13 on the roster much of anything. They're already here. What do most Big10 teams have? Would like to see your data on this one. Illinois paid more than that for Skyy Clark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taj79 Posted June 23, 2022 Author Share Posted June 23, 2022 I ask the Nesbitt question because of it's relevance ...... if you are going to compete for four-star recruits, you will have to pay the going freight. Since this program rarely is in the mix for four-star recruits (Hughes, Goodwin, Gordon, Nesbitt) the hypothetical 'pay-for-pay' question is indeed relevant. DOC points out above the relevance or reasons for higher pay outs to Collins and Perkins. But I would say those are on 'knowns' as in past performance. But a lot of the NIL questions also seem to focus on unknowns as in highly ranked recruits. We've also joked about our 'bag men.' Dropping money off for recruits. I haven't included Gordon in this for the reason his time was before the NIL onset but that too would apply in this context. Neither amounted to much and both left here so it would be good money thrown away. If you accept DOC's premise (knowns) then what do you do for the unknowns? You going to allot $20k for Kramer and Thames and another $20k for Nesbitt? He won't come here to be ranked like a Thames, or Kramer or Strickland or Lorentsson, would he? And again, it's just a hypothetical but it points to so much more. Personally, I don't think a kid needs $20k annually but that is just me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlebill Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 54 minutes ago, Bills By 40 said: Everyone seems to posthumously romanticize Nesbitt, the only thing he ever had was raw potential and an unhinged attitude. I wish him the best but he'd be at best the 9th man on this team, and there's a good argument that he'd fall as low as 10th. Are you not literally doing the opposite here? Like I know he left and was intense but he still gave us 8 & 4 as a freshman. If he were still on this tea, people would be saying he may start. the 9th or 10th statement is one of the crazier things that have been said on this site stmdragons, Gremio14 and BilliesBy40 like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgstl Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 11 minutes ago, Littlebill said: Are you not literally doing the opposite here? Like I know he left and was intense but he still gave us 8 & 4 as a freshman. If he were still on this tea, people would be saying he may start. the 9th or 10th statement is one of the crazier things that have been said on this site I would not be shocked if Nesbitt logged the 8th most minutes next year, possibly 9th depending on Parker. Would also not be shocked if he was one of our best players. He could do a ton of different things, but was widely inconsistent(expected for his age), and struggled to put different parts of his game together at once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlebill Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 21 minutes ago, wgstl said: I would not be shocked if Nesbitt logged the 8th most minutes next year, possibly 9th depending on Parker. Would also not be shocked if he was one of our best players. He could do a ton of different things, but was widely inconsistent(expected for his age), and struggled to put different parts of his game together at once. He used the words *at best* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 As for Nesbitt, he might have served us well as Yurimania’s backup. He does have good handles but not the judgement of Yurimania, eg that wild pass into the stands in a game I can’t remember. But he also had his moments of some slick assists. When someone said Ford was rumored to urge him to leave, it didn’t surprise me. I see him being a Gordon or Bleidscheid head case, ie make it all about me. I wonder if he got an NIL deal at Hampton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 2 hours ago, Bills By 40 said: Everyone seems to posthumously romanticize Nesbitt, the only thing he ever had was raw potential and an unhinged attitude. I wish him the best but he'd be at best the 9th man on this team, and there's a good argument that he'd fall as low as 10th. just curious if you can expand on this and share with us how you know this? are you in the lockerroom and practices regularly? do you personally know a player or coach that shared this with you? i never saw it sitting in the stands as far as "an unhinged attitude". Gremio14 and SLU_Lax like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiseOfTheBillikens Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 5 minutes ago, billiken_roy said: just curious if you can expand on this and share with us how you know this? are you in the lockerroom and practices regularly? do you personally know a player or coach that shared this with you? i never saw it sitting in the stands as far as "an unhinged attitude". https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10620703/Teammate-NY-cheerleader-says-basketball-player-rival-team-called-w-s.html Bills By 40 likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Just now, RiseOfTheBillikens said: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10620703/Teammate-NY-cheerleader-says-basketball-player-rival-team-called-w-s.html that incident was already debunked. no one besides the cheerleader backed it up. and what would that have to do with his "player attitude towards the billikens"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiseOfTheBillikens Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 3 minutes ago, billiken_roy said: that incident was already debunked. no one besides the cheerleader backed it up. and what would that have to do with his "player attitude towards the billikens"? ?? All he said was unhinged attitude. You asked for an example of said unhinged attitude. I showed you one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOC Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 2 hours ago, JMM28 said: 800k would be more than most Big10 teams have right now. If boosters could come up with that, I'd hold it and recruit better players with it. No need to pay guys 6-13 on the roster much of anything. They're already here. What do most Big10 teams have? Would like to see your data on this one. Illinois paid more than that for Skyy Clark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCoBillsFan Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 4 hours ago, Bills By 40 said: Everyone seems to posthumously romanticize Nesbitt, the only thing he ever had was raw potential and an unhinged attitude. I wish him the best but he'd be at best the 9th man on this team, and there's a good argument that he'd fall as low as 10th. Name the 8 ahead of him? And don’t include Pickett, because I can almost guarantee we don’t sign him if Nesbitt is still on the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stmdragons Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Personally not a fan of the speculation as to why Nesbitt decided to move on. He was obviously an emotional player, but essentially labeling him a head case and comparing him to Gordon and Biedscheid isn't really justified at all. BuiltFordBills, Gremio14 and slufanskip like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BilliesBy40 Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 17 minutes ago, NoCoBillsFan said: Name the 8 ahead of him? And don’t include Pickett, because I can almost guarantee we don’t sign him if Nesbitt is still on the team. Pickett wouldn’t be in front of him anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 7 minutes ago, stmdragons said: Personally not a fan of the speculation as to why Nesbitt decided to move on. He was obviously an emotional player, but essentially labeling him a head case and comparing him to Gordon and Biedscheid isn't really justified at all. I think his pursuit of playing where he’ll be appreciated is very similar to Gordon and Bleidscheid’s travels. Just like them he’ll find there is no Nirvana in college sports. 3 teams in a little over 18 months proves my point. Or another way to say it is he’s gotta a little prima Donna in him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 1 hour ago, RiseOfTheBillikens said: ?? All he said was unhinged attitude. You asked for an example of said unhinged attitude. I showed you one. but it was debunked. so how was it an unhinged attitude if it might not have happened? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgstl Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 6 minutes ago, billiken_roy said: but it was debunked. so how was it an unhinged attitude if it might not have happened? How was it debunked? because nothing came out of it? I'm not saying I believe the cheerleader, I don't know who to believe but I haven't seen anything debunking this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiseOfTheBillikens Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 51 minutes ago, billiken_roy said: but it was debunked. so how was it an unhinged attitude if it might not have happened? Debunked lol It may have been pushed under the table but it wasn't debunked. It almost certainly did happen. Several on twitter confirmed it. Not trying to bring all that up again and I love fire and passion but there was most certainly some attitude issues. But most college students have those so it's whatever. I wish nesbitt the best going forward. Bills By 40 and Billiken Rich like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old guy Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Personally I hated losing Nesbitt, Strickland, and Traore, but that is the way it was, so we move forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy II Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 -I'll play, my take 22 400,000 23 400,000 yuri 50,000 yuri 50,000 jperk 50,000 jperk 50,000 okoro 40,000 okoro 50,000 linnsen 40,000 pickett 25,000 jimerson 50,000 jimerson 50,000 tjh 25,000 tjh 25,000 ftj 30,000 ftj 50,000 strick 10,000 parker 30,000 jones 20,000 kramer 7,500 lorentsson 10,000 hughes 7,500 traore 10,000 thames 7,500 nesbitt 50,000 forrestore 32,500 courtney 5,000 cisse 7,500 williams 10,000 tbd 7,500 -the pot ($400k) is fixed, this is money at the start of the season which is flawed as should be based on actual production but I didn't want to pay at the end of the season as it would sting to fork over $50k and the next day, or 20 minutes later, have a kid enter the portal, projected starters all getting the same and the rest based on anticipated playing time/contribution -no doubt room to quibble -my recollection of anticipated playing time/contribution from last season might be a bit impacted by what actually did end up happening with the season -I am giving something to everyone as if CFord deems them worthy of Being a Billiken they are worthy of these funds rgbilliken likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMM28 Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 5 hours ago, DOC said: What do most Big10 teams have? Would like to see your data on this one. Illinois paid more than that for Skyy Clark. Most don't even have anything organized yet. They might have athletes getting random deals but a place like Iowa has jack and setup officially. Illinois has been way out front on all the NIL stuff all along. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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