cheeseman Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 24 minutes ago, AnkielBreakers said: The topic of NCAA Tournament Expansion was brought up somewhere, and I could not fine it, so I will bring it up here. I really agree with the expansion. It feels like teams at our level are getting unnecessarily limited. I also think it will add more viewers to the Tournament, as smaller conference fans will be more invested in their teams. More overall interest, and ultimately more money. That said, how many Tournaments would Travis have made if 96 Teams were let in, 3 or 4? I think that is about where he would be if he coached SLU at the same level in the 1990’s. Too bad we cannot make it retroactive! This would be about a third of the D1 schools - a little less. When does it reach a point that we just let them all in and play it out like high school does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 54 minutes ago, cheeseman said: This would be about a third of the D1 schools - a little less. When does it reach a point that we just let them all in and play it out like high school does. that would be great. it sure seems to work fine for high schools Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenfan05 Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 44 minutes ago, billiken_roy said: that would be great. it sure seems to work fine for high schools @cheesemancouldnt the case be made that the conference tournament + NCAA tournament is basically the high school model? District, sectional, state. dlarry, SShoe and Billikenbooster like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnkielBreakers Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 2 hours ago, cheeseman said: This would be about a third of the D1 schools - a little less. When does it reach a point that we just let them all in and play it out like high school does. Well, that is the thing, it is not 1/3. It is about 27% of the field that will exist in 2023/4. The theory for the expansion is that more teams are now in D1. Like from 300–>350 over 20 years. The long term plan might be to peg the number of schools in the Tournament to around 25%. So, maybe the future update would put the field at 90 total teams, and go from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 45 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said: @cheesemancouldnt the case be made that the conference tournament + NCAA tournament is basically the high school model? District, sectional, state. Sort of but the problem is that other teams get in who lost in the Conf tourney. In high school, when you lose you are out period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetorch Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 I'm all for the expansion of the tourney. It makes sense. We had a 64 team tourney when we had 240 D-1 teams, now we have 100 more than that. The amount of teams must go up. I favor expansion with the caveat that we cap the teams from conferences. Come up with some sort of relegation system. I don't want to see 90 teams and 12 of them from the Big 10. Set up something like a graduated system for conference. The best conference gets 8 teams. 2 & 3 get 6 4,5,6, get 5 teams, 7,8,9 get 4, 10, 11, 12 get 3 12-24 get 2 and 24 and below only get auto qualifier. If your tourney winner is 8th in the league, they get the autobid and your lowest team otherwise gets left out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 18 minutes ago, thetorch said: I'm all for the expansion of the tourney. It makes sense. We had a 64 team tourney when we had 240 D-1 teams, now we have 100 more than that. The amount of teams must go up. I favor expansion with the caveat that we cap the teams from conferences. Come up with some sort of relegation system. I don't want to see 90 teams and 12 of them from the Big 10. Set up something like a graduated system for conference. The best conference gets 8 teams. 2 & 3 get 6 4,5,6, get 5 teams, 7,8,9 get 4, 10, 11, 12 get 3 12-24 get 2 and 24 and below only get auto qualifier. If your tourney winner is 8th in the league, they get the autobid and your lowest team otherwise gets left out. Nice idea but who does the ranking? If the NCAA does it then you will simply have another way for them to use a loophole. Mid majors will find themselves still being snubbed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Elrond Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 1 minute ago, cheeseman said: Nice idea but who does the ranking? If the NCAA does it then you will simply have another way for them to use a loophole. Mid majors will find themselves still being snubbed. Agreed. Does expanding the tournament to say 96 just mean 32 more Power 5 conference members every year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLUMS81 Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 For conferences with automatic bids, for lower ranked teams the conference tournaments basically function as a series of must win play-in games for the Big Dance. Every school in an auto-bid conference has the opportunity to get to the Final Four. The only way to make the NCAA Tournament more inclusive would be to invite every single school. Either way, you gotta win your games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetorch Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 That is why I would cap the number of teams from conferences. Just plain expansion would result in 12 teams from the ACC, Big 10, SEC, and Pac 12. Nobody wants that but their fans. If you finish 9th in any conference you aren't one of the best teams in the country and shouldn't be rewarded as such. Lets use an example ACC is the best conference, they get 8 teams Big 10 gets 7 & SEC next get 6, 21 teams total BE, Pac 12, Big 12 get 5 apiece now we are up to 36 teams AAC, WC, MWC get 4 apiece, up to 48 teams MVC, CUSA A10 get 3 up to 58 13-24 get 2, 25-32 get 1. there is your 90. Cap the big conferences but reward them for being the better conference. It also gives an opportunity for a conference outside the Big 6 to cut in to the tiers if they rank high enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 There is no perfect model. The current model excludes some good teams. Allowing everyone in renders the regular season meaningless. If you want the high school playoff setup, then you have to get rid of conference tournaments altogether, which is never gonna happen. The big conferences are making too much money the way things are. cgeldmacher likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almaman Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 4 hours ago, billiken_roy said: I am a big believer of expanding the tourney. i personally would go to 256 teams and eliminate the conference tourney. totally regionalize the teams and play the first two rounds within the regions. then reseed the 64 teams left in the tourney. this would come as close to possible to giving us the true best 64 teams in the nation. afraid of too many good teams getting upset? well if the number one overall seed loses to the 256th seed, were they really the best team in the country? this would would also eliminate likely all the big conference pretenders with 500 records getting to the round of 64 just because they play in the big conferences. that all said, imo with this NLI bs the likelihood is things will go the other way, splitting D1 into at least two levels of D1 no way for the most part the mid majors and below will be able to compete for talent. 1000%. HS seems to keep the sport exciting & everyone is in post season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 6 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said: There is no perfect model. The current model excludes some good teams. Allowing everyone in renders the regular season meaningless. If you want the high school playoff setup, then you have to get rid of conference tournaments altogether, which is never gonna happen. The big conferences are making too much money the way things are. The season is not meaningless - your record and standing is how you get seeded. I do agree that the conf will not get rid of their tourneys. Those who have will only want more - the way of the world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 1 hour ago, cheeseman said: The season is not meaningless - your record and standing is how you get seeded. I do agree that the conf will not get rid of their tourneys. Those who have will only want more - the way of the world. The way programs are currently measured is by NCAA tournament appearances. If everybody gets in, that no longer matters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierPal Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgstl Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 19 minutes ago, HoosierPal said: 39th lolz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slu72 Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 2 hours ago, 3star_recruit said: There is no perfect model. The current model excludes some good teams. Allowing everyone in renders the regular season meaningless. If you want the high school playoff setup, then you have to get rid of conference tournaments altogether, which is never gonna happen. The big conferences are making too much money the way things are. If the Big Conferences get what they are really after the size will shrink or be restricted to only the P5-7 conferences. What they really want to do is cut out the little guys from the pot of gold at the end of the tourney rainbow. That said, I think the media is in favor of keeping the tourney as is. More often than not you hear them saying the Cinderella concept is a good one and attracts way more of the casual fan than would be the case if you went strictly to the biggies. Yeah, the biggies usually cut down the nets but the first 2-3 rounds also add to the David Goliath flavor of the whole deal. billiken_roy likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 2 hours ago, 3star_recruit said: The way programs are currently measured is by NCAA tournament appearances. If everybody gets in, that no longer matters. Oh they will come up with another way to measure - no worries there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old guy Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 With all due respect to everybody that has been spending time and effort trying to improve the NCAA. It will not happen, not unless every organization involved in the various tournaments, including leagues, promoters, announcers, arenas, agents, and TV producers manage to make more money (every one of them) with the new system. I just cannot figure out how this can be done under the present system, NILs, and the current state of the economy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgstl Posted October 17, 2022 Share Posted October 17, 2022 A little strange a start time hasn't been announced yet for the season opener. Edit: Murray states website says 7pm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgstl Posted October 17, 2022 Share Posted October 17, 2022 SLU checks in at "30th" in the AP's first poll. UD at #24 MattyMo213 likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Elrond Posted October 17, 2022 Share Posted October 17, 2022 16 hours ago, Old guy said: With all due respect to everybody that has been spending time and effort trying to improve the NCAA. It will not happen, not unless every organization involved in the various tournaments, including leagues, promoters, announcers, arenas, agents, and TV producers manage to make more money (every one of them) with the new system. I just cannot figure out how this can be done under the present system, NILs, and the current state of the economy. More TV money from streaming service providers eager to get exclusive content (Apple +, Amazon Prime, Paramount+, etc) will get the job done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierPal Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 Two of our four Valley games(Drake and SIUC) might be interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 46 minutes ago, HoosierPal said: Two of our four Valley games(Drake and SIUC) might be interesting. cant wait to hear Gus do the starting lineup for SIU. slight mishap on "Domask" could be entertaining. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almaman Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 8 minutes ago, billiken_roy said: cant wait to hear Gus do the starting lineup for SIU. slight mishap on "Domask" could be entertaining. when he started he could of been safe & go with first names, but nowadays first names are just as difficult Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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