Yuri

[Bay Area Billiken]

13 minutes ago, Old guy said:

I think this kind of discussion fits quite well into the Western/Catholic tradition. After all the monks in the middle ages spent lots of time and effort discussing how many angels would fit on top of a pin's head. So, what is the best option available to Yuri? the answer to that is simply whatever Yuri decides is the best option open to him. Other than that we are discussing rumors we hear, or strong desires that drive what we want to believe.

I think this board should be open to everyone's opinions, whatever they may be. After all, what we are posting, at least at this time of the year, are essentially rumors and personal opinions. My personal opinion in this regard is that I hope Yuri comes back to SLU to play the next season. I hope this is Yuri's choice.

I also hope Yuri Collins returns to SLU next season, assuming he isn't drafted yet in the NBA.  That may be a big assumption because Yuri was the national assists leader, both overall and per game average.  I've seen him compared to Chris Paul and Steve Nash.

[brianstl]

Yuri going to Tennessee would be worse for his NBA chances. He wouldn’t be the the focus of the offense like he has been and will be at at SLU.  He goes to UT he will be playing at a program where almost the entire rest of the players focus on creating and getting their own shot.

[Bay Area Billiken]

Look at the other thread, the Mizzou fan/apologist dismissing SLU as a mid-major.  SLU would have run that lousy Mizzou operation off the floor the last several years.  Good grief, talk about faux delusions of grandeur.  Mizzou went 12-21 in '21-'22.  That was preceded by 15-17 in '19, 15-16 in '20, and a gift bid 16-10 in '21.  That is not a strong program, no matter how much those Mizzou apologists howl to the Moon.  Just because they say it doesn't make it a fact.  The Mizzou basketball program has been adversely affected by its move from the stronger in hoops Big XII to the SEC.

Frankly, SLU gets a good amount of national exposure in the Atlantic 10.  All the games are available in some form to be viewed, most are on cable and satellite TV.  I have no desire to watch Tennessee play, so I don't.  But I would say that at least out here on the West Coast, just as many, if not more, of the SLU games are available to be watched on TV, vis-a-vis Tennessee.  

The SEC remains a football first conference, with basketball playing a distant second fiddle, except at Kentucky.

[slu72]

Bay, living in SEC country surrounded by alums from just about every member school, my SEC friends tell me that about 5 years ago all SEC members were told to start increasing their hoops budgets in order to increase their share of the NCAA pot. The SEC’s goal is to dominate national championships across ALL sports for both men and women. 

[Bay Area Billiken]

51 minutes ago, slu72 said:

Bay, living in SEC country surrounded by alums from just about every member school, my SEC friends tell me that about 5 years ago all SEC members were told to start increasing their hoops budgets in order to increase their share of the NCAA pot. The SEC’s goal is to dominate national championships across ALL sports for both men and women. 

SEC = Football Factories.

I’m aware of the SEC commitment to basketball, and it did rise to #3 nationally in conference NET in ‘22. The SEC is a big time self promoter where football rules the roost. 

In ‘15 I was invited to see LSU host Auburn. That was quite an event. I don’t think I saw a single LSU student carrying a book that early in the football season weekend. My Bayou Bengal host still talks about BAB’s Bud Light + donut combo at the post-game tailgate. The tailgates at LSU are a legendary, a veritable way of life.

[slu72]

Just now, Bay Area Billiken said:

SEC = Football Factories.

True enough, but they also want to open factories in all sports. 

[Brighton]

40 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

Look at the other thread, the Mizzou fan/apologist dismissing SLU as a mid-major.  SLU would have run that lousy Mizzou operation off the floor the last several years.  Good grief, talk about faux delusions of grandeur.  Mizzou went 12-21 in '21-'22.  That was preceded by 15-17 in '19, 15-16 in '20, and a gift bid 16-10 in '21.  That is not a strong program, no matter how much those Mizzou apologists howl to the Moon.  Just because they say it doesn't make it a fact.  The Mizzou basketball program has been adversely affected by its move from the stronger in hoops Big XII to the SEC.

Frankly, SLU gets a good amount of national exposure in the Atlantic 10.  All the games are available in some form to be viewed, most are on cable and satellite TV.  I have no desire to watch Tennessee play, so I don't.  But I would say that at least out here on the West Coast, just as many, if not more, of the SLU games are available to be watched on TV, vis-a-vis Tennessee.  

The SEC remains a football first conference, with basketball playing a distant second fiddle, except at Kentucky.

And the programs outside of blue blood Kentucky have passed them by. They’re up schitt’s creek.

[willie]

4 hours ago, Wendelprof said:

"Let me put to you this way. If Yuri's goal has been to play in the NBA his whole life and he thinks UT and their program give him a much better chance to attain that goal then you would still think he should stay at SLU and take the chance to not attain his goal. That's crazy if you feel that way. 

I think Yuri should play where he thinks he has the best chance to attain his goal, and if that is the NBA go for it young man where you have the best chance to succeed.. It's not my decision or anyone else on Billikens.com...it's his. I'll continue to watch him play, and root for him whatever and wherever he decides to play."

This is the problem with too many people - they over focus on professional sports.  The chance that Yuri plays in the NBA is not great.  Hopefully he is grounded enough to realize it is a long shot.  Might going to Tennessee slightly increase his chances of making the NBA?  Maybe.  At the same time, however, it will hurt his chances of otherwise being successful in life.  Yuri has become a hometown hero.  He is set up to be recognized and rewarded in St. Louis for the rest of his life.  If he bails on St. Louis at this point for - at best - a slightly increased chance at the NBA by going to Tennessee, what's that done to his chances of success the rest of his life?

People who care about college players need to remind them that the decisions of where they play college ball are life long decisions.  They shouldn't be focused solely or even primarily on how it affects their chances of making it to the pros.  They also have to think about life after their playing days are over.  A true fan wants what is best for the player, but a true fan takes the long view, not the short view.  Anyone who is not a UT fan would say what is best for Yuri is to stay in St. Louis, finish out his college career at SLU, take his chances with a pro career then, and when he is done playing sports, return to St. Louis and be honored for the decisions he made.  The UT fans will forget Yuri the day he graduates and it will do nothing to improve the rest of his life opportunities.  The only reason a UT fan would want Yuri to transfer is for their own self-interest (to advance their program), not for Yuri's best interest.

Chris May reiterated many of these sentiments to me.  

[almaman]

44 minutes ago, willie said:

Chris May reiterated many of these sentiments to me.  

hope he has to Yuri

[majerus mojo]

SLU is a mid-major. Gonzaga is a mid-major. IMO, success doesn’t change anything, but it’s a totally subjective moniker, so folks are gonna differ. I also don’t think it carries a negative conotation, despite what Mizzou fans would like you to believe. 

[Bay Area Billiken]

44 minutes ago, majerus mojo said:

SLU is a mid-major. Gonzaga is a mid-major. IMO, success doesn’t change anything, but it’s a totally subjective moniker, so folks are gonna differ. I also don’t think it carries a negative conotation, despite what Mizzou fans would like you to believe. 

Gonzaga is not a mid-major, has not been for a long time. 
The mid-major moniker has a negative connotation, which is exactly why mizzou supporters, including its media enablers, and other Power 5 + 1’s like Marquette, label SLU as one. 

Missouri State, SIUC, Illinois State from the MVC, USF, Santa Clara, St. Mary’s, LMU from the WCC, are mid-majors. 
 

If SLU is a mid-major, is Xavier one too? Are Butler, Creighton now, DePaul? 
 

Where is the line now drawn, or redrawn?
 

If SLU fans accept the moniker, it becomes fact. We don’t need to let it. 

[Schasz]

3 hours ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

I also hope Yuri Collins returns to SLU next season, assuming he isn't drafted yet in the NBA.  That may be a big assumption because Yuri was the national assists leader, both overall and per game average.  I've seen him compared to Chris Paul and Steve Nash.

Yuri is going for a NBA evaluation. He has pretty much zero chance of getting drafted this year as he has not shown up on any mock drafts I've seen.

[majerus mojo]

16 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

Gonzaga is not a mid-major, has not been for a long time. 
The mid-major moniker has a negative connotation, which is exactly why mizzou supporters, including its media enablers, and other Power 5 + 1’s like Marquette, label SLU as one. 

Missouri State, SIUC, Illinois State from the MVC, USF, Santa Clara, St. Mary’s, LMU from the WCC, are mid-majors. 
 

If SLU is a mid-major, is Xavier one too? Are Butler, Creighton now, DePaul? 
 

Where is the line now drawn, or redrawn?
 

If SLU fans accept the moniker, it becomes fact. We don’t need to let it. 

Yes they are. 

That’s their opinion. I’m perfectly fine being labeled a mid-major. Doesn’t seem to both Gonzaga? https://amp.usatoday.com/amp/49946245

Yes those are also mid-majors.

Depends on your opinion of the Big East. I probably wouldn’t say they are mid-majors. Close though!

Everyone gets their own line. 

It is a fact? Guess we can reevaluate once we’re in the BE. 

[Bay Area Billiken]

13 minutes ago, majerus mojo said:

Yes they are. 

That’s their opinion. I’m perfectly fine being labeled a mid-major. Doesn’t seem to both Gonzaga? https://amp.usatoday.com/amp/49946245

Yes those are also mid-majors.

Depends on your opinion of the Big East. I probably wouldn’t say they are mid-majors. Close though!

Everyone gets their own line. 

It is a fact? Guess we can reevaluate once we’re in the BE. 

That’s a USA Today headline. There’s no quote in that article in which Gonzaga dubbed itself a mid-major.  It was heresy for Xavier to be associated with the term. And Gonzaga clearly is above Xavier in the college basketball pecking order. 
 

Are Villanova, Georgetown, St. John’s mid-majors? Of course not. Is Marquette, its supporters dubbing SLU one, itself a mid-major?  Is anyone outside the Football Power 5 a mid-major? 
 

Go back to the origin of the term mid-major. It’s out there. The A10 was not included. 

[3star_recruit]

27 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

Gonzaga is not a mid-major, has not been for a long time. 
The mid-major moniker has a negative connotation, which is exactly why mizzou supporters, including its media enablers, and other Power 5 + 1’s like Marquette, label SLU as one. 

Missouri State, SIUC, Illinois State from the MVC, USF, Santa Clara, St. Mary’s, LMU from the WCC, are mid-majors. 
 

If SLU is a mid-major, is Xavier one too? Are Butler, Creighton now, DePaul? 
 

Where is the line now drawn, or redrawn?
 

If SLU fans accept the moniker, it becomes fact. We don’t need to let it. 

P6 conference affiliation.  That's where those programs you mentioned above went.  If we got a P6 invite tomorrow, that's where we would go.

[Bay Area Billiken]

31 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

P6 conference affiliation.  That's where those programs you mentioned above went.  If we got a P6 invite tomorrow, that's where we would go.

What about the AAC, Houston, Memphis, and the Mountain West, UNLV.

The line of demarcation used to be Power 5, both sides of the old Big East, meaning New Big East and AAC, A10 and Mountain West. Those leagues by definition were not mid-majors. 
 

When we keep accepting the moniker, we become one. And then come faux claims that our players would be better off in the Football Power 5, the Football Factory SEC, and that the Mizzou program is better than ours. Those are the narratives. Narratives are not necessarily truths.

[slu72]

Gonzaga is an outlier. A freak if u will. All their 20 or so Little engine that could appearances in the NCAA has elevated their status. But they got all those by playing, until this year, in a two team conference, them and Saint Mary. Seriously, if they played in the A10 for the past 20 years do u think they would have made the dance 20 or so years in a row? I don’t. They lucked out. And now their new found fame helps them in landing great recruits and high rankings. They found a niche in the landscape and exploited it. If we had gone to the Horizon or MVC we might have become the Zaga of the Midwest. 

[3star_recruit]

19 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

What about the AAC, Houston, Memphis, and the Mountain West, UNLV.

The line of demarcation used to be Power 5, both sides of the old Big East, meaning New Big East and AAC, A10 and Mountain West. Those leagues by definition were not mid-majors. 
 

When we keep accepting the moniker, we become one. And then come faux claims that our players would be better off in the Football Power 5. 

The AAC is in transition.  They lost UConn to the Big East, they're losing Houston and Cincinnati to the Big 12.  Very soon their demotion to mid-major will be complete. The reason no conferences beyond the P6 can maintain their high major affiliation is because their best teams keep leaving.

Thank goodness the best Catholic schools had no other place to go or the Big East would be a mid major too.

[Bay Area Billiken]

11 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

The AAC is in transition.  They lost UConn to the Big East, they're losing Houston and Cincinnati to the Big 12.  Very soon their demotion to mid-major will be complete. The reason no conferences beyond the P6 can maintain their high major affiliation is because their best teams keep leaving.

Thank goodness the best Catholic schools had no other place to go or the Big East would be a mid major too.

This is the narrative. Memphis remains in the AAC, as does Temple. Neither are mid-majors. 

You skipped over the Mountain West. UNLV is not a mid-major. Most of the Mountain West are not mid-majors.

[3star_recruit]

17 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

This is the narrative. Memphis remains in the AAC, as does Temple. Neither are mid-majors. 

You skipped over the Mountain West. UNLV is not a mid-major. Most of the Mountain West are not mid-majors.

UNLV has been garbage for 10 years.  They are effectively a mid major and recruit like it.  Boise State and Colorado State finished first and second in the Mountain West this year.  They pull from the same pool of 3 stars every other mid major does.  Nobody is afraid of the Mountain West.

[Bay Area Billiken]

1 minute ago, 3star_recruit said:

UNLV has been garbage for 15 years.  They are effectively a mid major and recruit like it.  Boise State and Colorado State finished first and second in the Mountain West this year.  They pull from the same pool of 3 stars every other mid major does.  Nobody is afraid of the Mountain West.

4 NCAA Bids came from the Mountain West, 4- Boise State, Colorado State, San Diego State, and Wyoming. That’s one more than came from the Football Power 5 Pac-12, and the Pac-12 had no team anywhere near worthy of a 4th bid. The Mountain West plays full 85 scholarship D1-A Football, was the 8th ranked basketball conference after spending some weeks at #7. 
 

My goal is an attempt to get my fellow SLU supporters from falling into the Power 5 + 1 trap and becoming complicit in labeling our SLU program a mid-major. The narrative our adversaries want to spin has no basis in the very origin of the pejorative term. But when you keep purveying the narrative, the narrative becomes a given. 

[DOC]

1 hour ago, Schasz said:

Yuri is going for a NBA evaluation. He has pretty much zero chance of getting drafted this year as he has not shown up on any mock drafts I've seen.

He has no chance of being drafted this year and no chance of being drafted next year. 

[3star_recruit]

47 minutes ago, Bay Area Billiken said:

4 NCAA Bids came from the Mountain West, 4- Boise State, Colorado State, San Diego State, and Wyoming. That’s one more than came from the Football Power 5 Pac-12, and the Pac-12 had no team anywhere near worthy of a 4th bid. The Mountain West plays full 85 scholarship D1-A Football, was the 8th ranked basketball conference after spending some weeks at #7. 
 

My goal is an attempt to get my fellow SLU supporters from falling into the Power 5 + 1 trap and becoming complicit in labeling our SLU program a mid-major. The narrative our adversaries want to spin has no basis in the very origin of the pejorative term. But when you keep purveying the narrative, the narrative becomes a given. 

MBMs agreeing that the likes of Boise St., Colorado State and our beloved Billikens are high majors is not going to change our position in the basketball ecosystem.  Only winning regularly against high-profile teams will.  At that point, no one cares what your conference affiliation is.  

[Taj79]

Gonzaga wins every year ----- until it gets to the Big Dance.  My theory is while they do play some big national games, these are ome and dones and rare.  Then they cakewalk through the WCC only to bad their mystique which falls apart when they face sterner opposition night after night in that Dance.  They are not built for the long haul as it were.

[Bay Area Billiken]

13 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

At that point, no one cares what your conference affiliation is.  

Then why are we reading the narratives that are being spewed today, to wit:

1. The Mizzou program is better than SLU. That one is comically and patently absurd. But it is based upon SLU allegedly being a “mid-major.” SLU or someone on its behalf just didn’t have to spend $6M to pull the plug and buy out its Coach;

2. Yuri Collins’ professional aspirations are better served at SEC Football Factory (and a below par one at that) Tennessee  than at his hometown, alleged “mid-major” SLU. Read or re-read the excellent post above from wendelprof on this subject. 
 

Otherwise, I say enough already of these narratives and the utter nonsense contained therein.