5 Things We Learned Over The Long Weekend

[mrjoelabs]

1. SLU will go as far as JN and TH carry them.   -When these guys score, we are a different team. If we can get both of them scoring consistently together, watch out. Also, I think seeing Jones on the floor more isn't a bad thing. Guy can flat out shoot and is a great passer as well. 

2. The AD needs to schedule better when it comes to holiday tourneys. - I am not complaining about winning Cancun. It is nice to win any tourney. But honestly if we did anything but win with that group of teams, it would've been a disaster. Why is it every year we are in these it is a watered down group of teams?  I got to watch Dayton and VCU both get to play 2 or 3  Power 5 teams and Dayton somehow beating Kansas.  VCU beat Syracuse and narrowly lost to Baylor then took UConn to OT. We need to be in a better tournament. 

3. Dayton makes no sense.  -Sure teams that are almost brand new like Dayton need time to gel. But how in the world do you lose 3 straight to Umass-Lowell, Lipscomb and Austin Peay then beat Miami Kansas and Belmont. No clue what to think of this group.

4. The Bonnies are not that good- Schmidt gets by with his coaching and his scheming. He has for years. But he is essentially playing with 5 guys. It can't last. And if he runs into a coach who can play chess on his level (sadly not ever Travis Ford) he can be beat. Ben Jacobsen got a lot of help with 35 points from Green, but he coached circles around Schmidt. Fatigue and a lack of athleticism will catch up with this group. Hopefully they are still top 25 on 2/11, and we can notch that victory.

5. Memphis isn't that good. - I wanted to say this after the loss, but I know I would've gotten flamed for being a "troll". People on here were ready to give Memphis the final four trophy. Penny can coach up a great defense and yes he has lottery picks. But this team is very limited offensively. Honestly, if we didn't play like jackasses in the first half, we would've been right there to steal it at the end. And now Iowa State destroyed the Penny defense. This team could improve if the lottery guys mature, but right now this team isn't that good. I could see them either going Final Four if everything comes together or losing in the Second Round. 

---Oh, and we better beat Belmont after Dayton did...

[SLU_Nick]

8 minutes ago, mrjoelabs said:

1. SLU will go as far as JN and TH carry them.   -When these guys score, we are a different team. If we can get both of them scoring consistently together, watch out. Also, I think seeing Jones on the floor more isn't a bad thing. Guy can flat out shoot and is a great passer as well. 

2. The AD needs to schedule better when it comes to holiday tourneys. - I am not complaining about winning Cancun. It is nice to win any tourney. But honestly if we did anything but win with that group of teams, it would've been a disaster. Why is it every year we are in these it is a watered down group of teams?  I got to watch Dayton and VCU both get to play 2 or 3  Power 5 teams and Dayton somehow beating Kansas.  VCU beat Syracuse and narrowly lost to Baylor then took UConn to OT. We need to be in a better tournament. 

3. Dayton makes no sense.  -Sure teams that are almost brand new like Dayton need time to gel. But how in the world do you lose 3 straight to Umass-Lowell, Lipscomb and Austin Peay then beat Miami Kansas and Belmont. No clue what to think of this group.

4. The Bonnies are not that good- Schmidt gets by with his coaching and his scheming. He has for years. But he is essentially playing with 5 guys. It can't last. And if he runs into a coach who can play chess on his level (sadly not ever Travis Ford) he can be beat. Ben Jacobsen got a lot of help with 35 points from Green, but he coached circles around Schmidt. Fatigue and a lack of athleticism will catch up with this group. Hopefully they are still top 25 on 2/11, and we can notch that victory.

5. Memphis isn't that good. - I wanted to say this after the loss, but I know I would've gotten flamed for being a "troll". People on here were ready to give Memphis the final four trophy. Penny can coach up a great defense and yes he has lottery picks. But this team is very limited offensively. Honestly, if we didn't play like jackasses in the first half, we would've been right there to steal it at the end. And now Iowa State destroyed the Penny defense. This team could improve if the lottery guys mature, but right now this team isn't that good. I could see them either going Final Four if everything comes together or losing in the Second Round. 

---Oh, and we better beat Belmont after Dayton did...

Good Post Joe.  I always enjoy your measured view of the team...some view it as negative but it's clear you do not miss a Billikens game and want the team to win so I do not know how some people view you as a troll.  

1 - I think you are spot on with identifying the 2 players who can make us a top 25 team.  If TH and JN are attacking, engaged and not turning the ball over then it takes pressure off Yuri and Jimmer and we look great.  This team can withstand one player having a stinker of a game and still win...that is a big time luxury. 

2,3 - no argument of comment

4 - It is really annoying that Mark S. refused to recruit anyone of any ability to come off the bench.  It is pretty incredible that the starting 5 does not seem to wear down when I always expect them too.  They came off a back to back and got down big to Clemson...then came storming back for the W.  Pretty impressive.  

5 - I completely disagree on this one.  Iowa St outschemed them and Memphis players are used to just playing basketball without much of a scheme or purpose.  If Larry, Rasheed and Penny can get that talent to work together, they can absolutely be a force.  I think they will win 30 games.  Agree to disagree on that one.

 

Go Bills!

-Nick 

[Bills By 40]

4 minutes ago, SLU_Nick said:

Good Post Joe.  I always enjoy your measured view of the team...some view it as negative but it's clear you do not miss a Billikens game and want the team to win so I do not know how some people view you as a troll.  

1 - I think you are spot on with identifying the 2 players who can make us a top 25 team.  If TH and JN are attacking, engaged and not turning the ball over then it takes pressure off Yuri and Jimmer and we look great.  This team can withstand one player having a stinker of a game and still win...that is a big time luxury. 

2,3 - no argument of comment

4 - It is really annoying that Mark S. refused to recruit anyone of any ability to come off the bench.  It is pretty incredible that the starting 5 does not seem to wear down when I always expect them too.  They came off a back to back and got down big to Clemson...then came storming back for the W.  Pretty impressive.  

5 - I completely disagree on this one.  Iowa St outschemed them and Memphis players are used to just playing basketball without much of a scheme or purpose.  If Larry, Rasheed and Penny can get that talent to work together, they can absolutely be a force.  I think they will win 30 games.  Agree to disagree on that one.

 

Go Bills!

-Nick 

Same here. Memphis is a powerhouse and they lost bad to Iowa State because they're a powerhouse led by an 18 and a 17 year old, and it's November. Give it time. 

[billikenfan05]

2 minutes ago, Bills By 40 said:

Same here. Memphis is a powerhouse and they lost bad to Iowa State because they're a powerhouse led by an 18 and a 17 year old, and it's November. Give it time. 

Memphis is a top 10 team but are young. They’ll have some shocking performances but they’ll be few and far between. Hoped it would have been against us but it wasn’t. 

[3star_recruit]

3.  A few years back a Purdue squad with a bunch of freshmen lost to North Florida and Gardner Webb before knocking off multiple top 25 teams.  Teams whose best players are freshmen do stuff like that.  The upperclassmen role players fail in the leadership role, the freshmen are forced to take over and eventually figure it out.

[billiken_roy]

almost every good team in the country can say that 2 players are the team difference makers.   congratulations figuriing out the billikens 2 players.   my 9 year old grandson told me that same thing 2 weeks ago though.  

[3star_recruit]

4 minutes ago, Bills By 40 said:

Same here. Memphis is a powerhouse and they lost bad to Iowa State because they're a powerhouse led by an 18 and a 17 year old, and it's November. Give it time. 

Iowa State is a top 25 team based on their performance this season.  They've been under ranked due to their putrid performance last season and the inability of prognosticators to assess the value of program changing point guards, transfers and head coaches.  At the end of the day this will just be a Q1 loss.

[mrjoelabs]

6 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

Iowa State is a top 25 team based on their performance this season.  They've been under ranked due to their putrid performance last season and the inability of prognosticators to assess the value of program changing point guards, transfers and head coaches.  At the end of the day this will just be a Q1 loss.

I agree with that fully. But Memphis started to show weakness in the 2 games leading into the Iowa State game. Maybe they will go Final Four, like I said. But this could turn into a Kentucky style mess with a bunch of talented guys that slip up in the tournament early.

[wgstl]

2 minutes ago, mrjoelabs said:

I agree with that fully. But Memphis started to show weakness in the 2 games leading into the Iowa State game. Maybe they will go Final Four, like I said. But this could turn into a Kentucky style mess with a bunch of talented guys that slip up in the tournament early.

Memphis, like all these one and done programs always show a ton of weakness early. 

[Taj79]

I think Schmidt has arguably his best bench ever right now at Bonaventure.  Linton Brown was a JUCO All-American, Karim CoulibaLy played for Pitt in the always tough ACC, and Quadry Adams has some promise base on  his being at ACC Wake.  The problem is Schmidt goes with what he knows and and Brown and Adams aren't in hsi trust circle just yet.  Coulibaly has seen the most time, but only because the stick in the middle is experiencing bad problems now.

[A10Ref]

Point number 2, I think I agree as a whole and hope for better going forward, but, for this year, I liked the tournament that we were in. We got two hard-fought victories and were able to build up confidence for the gauntlet that we're about to go through. If we didn't have a tough remaining out of conference, I would feel otherwise.

[brianstl]

2 hours ago, mrjoelabs said:

 

2. The AD needs to schedule better when it comes to holiday tourneys. - I am not complaining about winning Cancun. It is nice to win any tourney. But honestly if we did anything but win with that group of teams, it would've been a disaster. Why is it every year we are in these it is a watered down group of teams?  I got to watch Dayton and VCU both get to play 2 or 3  Power 5 teams and Dayton somehow beating Kansas.  VCU beat Syracuse and narrowly lost to Baylor then took UConn to OT. We need to be in a better tournament. 

 

We were scheduled last season to play in the tournament Dayton just played in. That was canceled because of COVID.

We are scheduled to play in the the Tip Off Classic next season.

[AGB91]

The other teams in next year's Tip Off Classic are reported to be Miami, Providence and Maryland.

[Slu let the dogs out?]

2 hours ago, mrjoelabs said:

1. SLU will go as far as JN and TH carry them.   -When these guys score, we are a different team. If we can get both of them scoring consistently together, watch out. Also, I think seeing Jones on the floor more isn't a bad thing. Guy can flat out shoot and is a great passer as well. 

2. The AD needs to schedule better when it comes to holiday tourneys. - I am not complaining about winning Cancun. It is nice to win any tourney. But honestly if we did anything but win with that group of teams, it would've been a disaster. Why is it every year we are in these it is a watered down group of teams?  I got to watch Dayton and VCU both get to play 2 or 3  Power 5 teams and Dayton somehow beating Kansas.  VCU beat Syracuse and narrowly lost to Baylor then took UConn to OT. We need to be in a better tournament. 

3. Dayton makes no sense.  -Sure teams that are almost brand new like Dayton need time to gel. But how in the world do you lose 3 straight to Umass-Lowell, Lipscomb and Austin Peay then beat Miami Kansas and Belmont. No clue what to think of this group.

4. The Bonnies are not that good- Schmidt gets by with his coaching and his scheming. He has for years. But he is essentially playing with 5 guys. It can't last. And if he runs into a coach who can play chess on his level (sadly not ever Travis Ford) he can be beat. Ben Jacobsen got a lot of help with 35 points from Green, but he coached circles around Schmidt. Fatigue and a lack of athleticism will catch up with this group. Hopefully they are still top 25 on 2/11, and we can notch that victory.

5. Memphis isn't that good. - I wanted to say this after the loss, but I know I would've gotten flamed for being a "troll". People on here were ready to give Memphis the final four trophy. Penny can coach up a great defense and yes he has lottery picks. But this team is very limited offensively. Honestly, if we didn't play like jackasses in the first half, we would've been right there to steal it at the end. And now Iowa State destroyed the Penny defense. This team could improve if the lottery guys mature, but right now this team isn't that good. I could see them either going Final Four if everything comes together or losing in the Second Round. 

---Oh, and we better beat Belmont after Dayton did...

I believe we are scheduled to play in the Mohegan Sun Tournament next Thanksgiving with Miami, Providence, and Maryland. Definitely a step up from this year's tournament. Not the best location but close enough to spend a lovely Thanksgiving in New England. Hard to beat NE in the fall. 

[bauman]

19 minutes ago, Slu let the dogs out? said:

I believe we are scheduled to play in the Mohegan Sun Tournament next Thanksgiving with Miami, Providence, and Maryland. Definitely a step up from this year's tournament. Not the best location but close enough to spend a lovely Thanksgiving in New England. Hard to beat NE in the fall. 

Two words make it a great location:   Lobster Rolls.  Eat 'em for lunch and dinner.

Fly into either Providence or Hartford and you'll be close.  If snow isn't an issue then Thanksgiving in NE is fantastic.

[HoosierPal]

This is a good discussion @mrjoelabs.   Thanks for starting this thread.

I'm taking a different approach to #1.  For me, at this point of the season, the most indispensable player is Collins.  He is the one who stirs this drink.  His play will dictate how far we go. If he has games like he did at Cancun and Memphis, we will have a rough ride.  If he plays like he did in the other games, we will be rolling.

We are only 8 deep.  (If you are St. Bonnie, that is a deep team.  If you are VCU that is not deep.)  We have four or five players who could hit 20 a given night.  We have three or four who could hit five three pointers a given night.  Yes we have Jones as Collin's backup, and he has been quite impressive, but for him to run the team 35 minutes, well we would have a different look. 

[thatskablamo]

2 hours ago, billiken_roy said:

almost every good team in the country can say that 2 players are the team difference makers.   congratulations figuriing out the billikens 2 players.   my 9 year old grandson told me that same thing 2 weeks ago though.  

Snap. 

[cheeseman]

The biggest thing I think we learned from this tournament is that we can win even if things are not going our way.  That alone will serve us well throughout the season.  I also thing that unless Okoro can score from the paint we will not be the team we could be.

[Bills By 40]

5 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

This is a good discussion @mrjoelabs.   Thanks for starting this thread.

I'm taking a different approach to #1.  For me, at this point of the season, the most indispensable player is Collins.  He is the one who stirs this drink.  His play will dictate how far we go. If he has games like he did at Cancun and Memphis, we will have a rough ride.  If he plays like he did in the other games, we will be rolling.

We are only 8 deep.  (If you are St. Bonnie, that is a deep team.  If you are VCU that is not deep.)  We have four or five players who could hit 20 a given night.  We have three or four who could hit five three pointers a given night.  Yes we have Jones as Collin's backup, and he has been quite impressive, but for him to run the team 35 minutes, well we would have a different look. 

Yes, Yuri is most definitely the glue that holds us together. Thankfully he's one of the best point guards in the country and that's a comfortable pillar to lean on. 

No, we're not only 8 deep. We may play 8 deep right now but I expect that to change as the season continues. We could see contributions from RW, LT, MS, and AL as they gel with the team, gain experience, and develop in practice. November trends do not predetermine a season. And frankly having Jones as Yuri's backup is everything we could've asked for as he has proven more than capable. 

[HoosierPal]

9 minutes ago, Bills By 40 said:

Yes, Yuri is most definitely the glue that holds us together. Thankfully he's one of the best point guards in the country and that's a comfortable pillar to lean on. 

No, we're not only 8 deep. We may play 8 deep right now but I expect that to change as the season continues. We could see contributions from RW, LT, MS, and AL as they gel with the team, gain experience, and develop in practice. November trends do not predetermine a season. And frankly having Jones as Yuri's backup is everything we could've asked for as he has proven more than capable. 

Ford has played 8 +2, like forever. Annually he has stated his preference is an 8 man rotation with 2 others that can hold the fort for the rotation in selected short periods of time.  I don't see him changing his methods any time soon.  NOW would be the time to get those guys experience, not in the A10 season. 

But I raise my eyebrows as to why Williams has been relegated to the bench. 

[Slu let the dogs out?]

20 minutes ago, bauman said:

Two words make it a great location:   Lobster Rolls.  Eat 'em for lunch and dinner.

Fly into either Providence or Hartford and you'll be close.  If snow isn't an issue then Thanksgiving in NE is fantastic.

If I could eat seafood I'd be all over the lobster roll. Most likely the Connecticut roll. Not sure I could get behind the Maine lobster roll...

Fall in NE really is truly fantastic, there is no doubt about it. However having just experienced Sonoma and Napa in the fall for the first time, that might be right up there with NE. Sonoma/Napa comes complete with fall foliage, slightly warmer temps, plus the added bonus of sporadic palm trees. And wine. Lots of wine. 

[slufan13]

14 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

Ford has played 8 +2, like forever. Annually he has stated his preference is an 8 man rotation with 2 others that can hold the fort for the rotation in selected short periods of time.  I don't see him changing his methods any time soon.  NOW would be the time to get those guys experience, not in the A10 season. 

But I raise my eyebrows as to why Williams has been relegated to the bench. 

I don't see it changing either. Maybe there will be a game or two where we go 9-10 deep because of foul trouble or game flow but those will be the exceptions. If anything, I could see the rotation getting cut down. I probably wouldn't do that but Ford has shown a willingness to play 3 or 4 guys for 30+ minutes in a game from time to time.

A thought I've been having a lot lately is what our rotation would look like if Perkins was playing. I can't really figure out who would be out of the rotation. 

Linssen/Okoro - Maybe a decrease in minutes if we went small but both would play regularly and be part of the rotation

Jimerson/Hargrove/Nesbitt - Again probably less minutes but still big factors

Collins - Probably the only player whose minutes don't change

Jones - His main role is to back up Collins so I don't see his minutes really changing either

Thatch - He's probably the most likely but Ford seems to give him the benefit of the doubt more than anyone on the roster

My first thought was that Perkins' minutes would just come from decreased minutes from everyone else but that's not really what Ford prefers. It's a meaningless question because it doesn't matter and we'll never have the answer but I've been pretty curious about how the rotation would look

[Matty Light]

Memphis is extremely talented. Enough so that they can beat most teams in the AAC despite turning the ball over 20+ times.

But they will lose against other athletic teams as the Cyclones showed. If they cut the turnovers in half, however, they would be an elite team. Can Penny get the team there? We will see come March.

[CBFan]

1 hour ago, HoosierPal said:

Ford has played 8 +2, like forever. Annually he has stated his preference is an 8 man rotation with 2 others that can hold the fort for the rotation in selected short periods of time.  I don't see him changing his methods any time soon.  NOW would be the time to get those guys experience, not in the A10 season. 

But I raise my eyebrows as to why Williams has been relegated to the bench. 

I think out of necessity we will see Williams because of Thatch still dealing with the cramping issue.  When coach Ford spoke of cramping in the SFA game that is concerning because Fred has made himself in the last few games into a very productive player.  It appears back to back games could be an issue so I think we could see more Williams.

 

[3star_recruit]

54 minutes ago, Matty Light said:

Memphis is extremely talented. Enough so that they can beat most teams in the AAC despite turning the ball over 20+ times.

But they will lose against other athletic teams as the Cyclones showed. If they cut the turnovers in half, however, they would be an elite team. Can Penny get the team there? We will see come March.

Emoni Bates is a helluva talent but I'm not sure he's a point guard.  And if he isn't the point guard I'm not sure Memphis has one.  That limits their ceiling.