GDT: @ Memphis

[Old guy]

38 minutes ago, brianstl said:

Memphis outrebounded us because we missed 53 fg attempts.  They had 27 more chances to grab defensive rebounds off missed opponents fg attempts than we did.  We had a better defensive rebound percentage (64.5 vs 60.7) and offensive rebound percentage (39.3 vs 35.5).  So even though Memphis had four more total rebounds than us, we did a better job rebounding than they did.

This is true but we did not manage to convert our advantages into a win.

[A10Ref]

I think last night was a great experience and will lead to some big wins in the next few weeks - onward and upward.

[Reinert310]

7 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

Last night went way beyond face guarding.  Yuri was having trouble just getting the ball across half court against all that length.  We never got to the point where we could run sets consistently.  That's why there were so many bull rushes to the rim and blocked shots.  If you can't get into a half court set, that's what happens.

Then someone needs to go help him by getting open. Not just stand around hoping Yuri pulls something something out of his a$$. I’m not sure how standing around watching is helping anything. We need to have a other ways to get into our sets, or at least a release valve or someone other than Yuri who can get us to start our sets. Just standing around because they’ve tried to take out Yuri’s distribution isn’t an answer. This isn’t CYC basketball. 

[AnkielBreakers]

31 minutes ago, JettFlight5 said:

TJ really tried to take over last night and put up some big numbers. I worry if we struggled that much against Duren, Osun will be similar for the Bonnies. 
 

Tough matchup against really good athletes without the one difference maker on offense on the roster…onto Mercer.

The problem wasn’t Duren. The problem was Williams and Minott. I was really encouraged by Okoro’s FT shooting for the Bonnie’s. We can go at him hard with 10 fouls (Linssen and Okoro) to his 5. The Bonnie’s don’t have a wealth of PF/C bodies to throw at us and keep him out of foul trouble.

It is really telling, considering how hard and often Memphis was fouling that they only had 1 guy foul out. That was both depth and the refs.

[almaman]

18 minutes ago, A10Ref said:

I think last night was a great experience and will lead to some big wins in the next few weeks - onward and upward.

locker room quote from Larry brown?

[JettFlight5]

4 minutes ago, AnkielBreakers said:

The problem wasn’t Duren. The problem was Williams and Minott. I was really encouraged by Okoro’s FT shooting for the Bonnie’s. We can go at him hard with 10 fouls (Linssen and Okoro) to his 5. The Bonnie’s don’t have a wealth of PF/C bodies to throw at us and keep him out of foul trouble.

It is really telling, considering how hard and often Memphis was fouling that they only had 1 guy foul out. That was both depth and the refs.

You are right about their depth. Penny has a ton of talent.

[dlarry]

3 hours ago, billiken_roy said:

i thought from an offensive standpoint, the billikens performance was embarrassing.  terrible display for what we all think is a top 2 in the league team.

Nothing to be embarrassed about. They played hard, missed some shots and began to press. Misses lead to others misses especially when you are going against freak athletes.
 

I would say only 1 other team in the A10 keep it within 25 playing at Memphis and that’s the Bonnies.

All last nights game did was help us prepare for the rest of the season.

[Reinert310]

2 minutes ago, dlarry said:

Nothing to be embarrassed about. They played hard, missed some shots and began to press. Misses lead to others misses especially when you are going against freak athletes.
 

I would say only 1 other team in the A10 keep it within 25 playing at Memphis and that’s the Bonnies.

All last nights game did was help us prepare for the rest of the season.

I totally agree with this. We missed a lot of shots that we wouldn’t normally miss, whether it was nerves or pressing or whatever. But we can’t just give up on our offense because a team takes Yuri out of his comfort zone. If I’m Ford, I’m drawing up sets where Yuri starts off the ball as we speak. Other teams are going to figure out that taking Yuri out is the way to beat us.

[3star_recruit]

27 minutes ago, Reinert310 said:

Then someone needs to go help him by getting open. Not just stand around hoping Yuri pulls something something out of his a$$. I’m not sure how standing around watching is helping anything. We need to have a other ways to get into our sets, or at least a release valve or someone other than Yuri who can get us to start our sets. Just standing around because they’ve tried to take out Yuri’s distribution isn’t an answer. This isn’t CYC basketball. 

Eventually that guy will be Nesbitt but it's not going to happen overnight.

[A10Ref]

2 minutes ago, Reinert310 said:

I totally agree with this. We missed a lot of shots that we wouldn’t normally miss, whether it was nerves or pressing or whatever. But we can’t just give up on our offense because a team takes Yuri out of his comfort zone. If I’m Ford, I’m drawing up sets where Yuri starts off the ball as we speak. Other teams are going to figure out that taking Yuri out is the way to beat us.

Agreed - we've got a lot to work on and now will be better prepared to face Boise, UAB, Auburn, Drake... All of those teams are at least better than 80% of our league.

[BIG BILL FAN]

2 minutes ago, Reinert310 said:

I totally agree with this. We missed a lot of shots that we wouldn’t normally miss, whether it was nerves or pressing or whatever. But we can’t just give up on our offense because a team takes Yuri out of his comfort zone. If I’m Ford, I’m drawing up sets where Yuri starts off the ball as we speak. Other teams are going to figure out that taking Yuri out is the way to beat us.

you're confusing me, you admit we were getting good shots, but were just missing, but complain that we weren't running good sets to get good shots....sometimes you have to adjust to the style of defense your opponent is playing...Memphis was overplaying us and giving us the drive to the basket, unfortunately we were not making our layups or free throws at a high enough percentage...

[Reinert310]

2 minutes ago, A10Ref said:

Agreed - we've got a lot to work on and now will be better prepared to face Boise, UAB, Auburn, Drake... All of those teams are at least better than 80% of our league.

True. And I don’t expect this team to be perfect right now. If I come off too harsh, I apologize. But the frustrating thing for me is that this is the exact same thing that has caused our offense to struggle in years past. Nobody cutting, no ball movement, then the shot clock gets under 10 and JGood or Has end up going 1-on-3 and either forcing up a bad shot or turning it over. Hopefully, this is just a case of Memphis taking out Yuri and we weren’t prepared for it and we get better going forward. But it’s just really frustrating when the same issue keeps popping up even with new guys on the roster.

[RiseOfTheBillikens]

6 minutes ago, Reinert310 said:

True. And I don’t expect this team to be perfect right now. If I come off too harsh, I apologize. But the frustrating thing for me is that this is the exact same thing that has caused our offense to struggle in years past. Nobody cutting, no ball movement, then the shot clock gets under 10 and JGood or Has end up going 1-on-3 and either forcing up a bad shot or turning it over. Hopefully, this is just a case of Memphis taking out Yuri and we weren’t prepared for it and we get better going forward. But it’s just really frustrating when the same issue keeps popping up even with new guys on the roster.

I dont think I saw the same issues. Lots of on ball screens in the half court that lead to good attacking looks again just didn't make em. And I like pushing the pace and taking good shots if they are there early in the shot clock. Which we did a few times yesterday. Honestly think the offense was better yesterday than with Goodwin and has taking into account losing Perkins.

 

I would like to see some screens at half or 3/4 court when yuri has the ball and someone guarding him the length of court. Some Conklinesque screens from Linssen would be cool. Let him get downhill. That was one thing I wanted to see more of. When yuri is in open court I trust him to make the right play.

[Reinert310]

4 minutes ago, RiseOfTheBillikens said:

I dont think I saw the same issues. Lots of on ball screens in the half court that lead to good attacking looks again just didn't make em. And I like pushing the pace and taking good shots if they are there early in the shot clock. Which we did a few times yesterday. Honestly think the offense was better yesterday than with Goodwin and has taking into account losing Perkins.

 

I would like to see some screens at half or 3/4 court when yuri has the ball and someone guarding him the length of court. Let him get downhill. That was my one takeaway. When yuri is in open court I trust him to make the right play.

My criticism isn’t of Yuri at all. But if you go back and watch the off-ball cutting in the 1st 3 games versus last night, it’s night and day. And mayb @3star_recruitis right. Maybe it’s just that Memphis took Yuri away and we couldn’t figure out how to get into our sets and we’ll fix it going forward, but it’s been a problem in the past.

[billikenfan05]

2 minutes ago, Reinert310 said:

Then someone needs to go help him by getting open. Not just stand around hoping Yuri pulls something something out of his a$$. I’m not sure how standing around watching is helping anything. We need to have a other ways to get into our sets, or at least a release valve or someone other than Yuri who can get us to start our sets. Just standing around because they’ve tried to take out Yuri’s distribution isn’t an answer. This isn’t CYC basketball. 

I think I asked for a backcourt ball screen on more than one occasion. 

[Littlebill]

1 hour ago, Reinert310 said:

Then someone needs to go help him by getting open. Not just stand around hoping Yuri pulls something something out of his a$$. I’m not sure how standing around watching is helping anything. We need to have a other ways to get into our sets, or at least a release valve or someone other than Yuri who can get us to start our sets. Just standing around because they’ve tried to take out Yuri’s distribution isn’t an answer. This isn’t CYC basketball. 

I think we watched two different games 

[billiken_roy]

Imo Yuri is terrible using screens.  He circles around and gives plenty of room for the defender to get through.   One of the reasons we see so many moving screen fouls called as the teammate tries to get the defender at least bumped.

Yuri's not alone. most players these days don't dribble off their teamsters hip close enough to force the switch.   Hard to believe it apparently isn't taught any more

1 hour ago, RiseOfTheBillikens said:

 

 

 

 

[Reinert310]

12 minutes ago, Littlebill said:

I think we watched two different games 

I guess so. I’m not the only person in this thread that has criticized Gibson standing around standing around behind the 3-point line.

[cgeldmacher]

Didn't post during the game.  Glad I didn't.  Much better to post today after some perspective.

This game was expected when one team is ranked #11 in the country, soon to be higher, and the other lost 58% of its scoring from last year.  Everyone needs to get a grip.  The effort we have gotten thus far in the season, including losing by 20 to a top team in the country, will put us somewhere in the top 4 in the A-10.

Here are some reality checks:

Hargrove - I have always been a Hargrove proponent.  He put up points, but was still only 9-23.  I hope he gained confidence from this game, but don't think this means he is on some meteoric rise.  Still, I'm glad he performed well.

The Bigs - Posters destroyed these guys during the game.  Why?  Linssen had 11 points in 16 minutes.  Okoro had 7 points, 13 rebounds and 3 blocks in 22 minutes.  Against a top team, that's not too bad.

Jimerson - Again, nobody passes to him when he's wide open on the 3 point line.  Rewatch this game if you have the time and tell me how many times he got the ball in a position to score.  Some of that is one him, although it certainly looked like he was hustling to get open.  A lot of it is on guys not having vision to see who's standing on the 3 point line when they drive inside.

Thatch - Also got bashed on the thread.  Look, the guy is who he is.  He had a strange injury that severely thwarted his development.  He will give us good minutes as we move forward.  This will not be his typical game.   His athleticism will show more against less athletic opponents.  Memphis was not a less athletic opponent.

Nesbitt - Someone said he looked like a freshman out there.  That's because he is a freshman.  I know that's what the commenter meant, but just wanted to say it again.  Nesbitt will have success in some games and struggle in others.  From what I have seen from this staff, he will be better at the end of this season than he is now.

Ford - Seriously?  Many posters were ragging on Ford for what happened.  Again, this was expected.  What I saw out there was a team that didn't give up against a superiorly talented and more athletic opponent.  That's good coaching.  He changed defenses.  He subbed in guys to try to keep everyone fresh.  Memphis kept its starters in until the very end, and we played with them most of the game.  The lead was 18 to 20ish range for most of the game.  I think he got a good effort out of his guys.

[RUBillsFan]

31 minutes ago, cgeldmacher said:

Hargrove - I have always been a Hargrove proponent.  He put up points, but was still only 9-23.

In other words Hargrove shot 39% in a game where as a team we shot 31%.  I don't think his performance needs to be discounted at all.  The only guy who shot better other than Stickland's 1-1 was Linssen (4-8, 50%) and all of his shots were right at the rim.

[JettFlight5]

Lot of good points above. Nesbitt was probably trying to score 100. Memphis is super athletic which is something you can’t really simulate. 
 

Maybe I’m too high on Osun, but I think he’s a lot better than Duren and the A10 road might go through Olean. There is sure not an Emoni Bates in the A10.

[Littlebill]

9 minutes ago, JettFlight5 said:

Maybe I’m too high on Osun, but I think he’s a lot better than Duren and the A10 road might go through Olean. There is sure not an Emoni Bates in the A10.

I think Osun and Duren are just polar opposites. Duren would eat Osun alive with the physicality IMO. But Osun is a better shot blocker/disturber than Duren is at this moment

[ACE]

13 minutes ago, RUBillsFan said:

In other words Hargrove shot 39% in a game where as a team we shot 31%.  I don't think his performance needs to be discounted at all.  The only guy who shot better other than Stickland's 1-1 was Linssen (4-8, 50%) and all of his shots were right at the rim.

I also recall two really good looking 3s from Hargrove that just rattled out - those were frustrating, halfway down.

[cgeldmacher]

21 hours ago, RUBillsFan said:

In other words Hargrove shot 39% in a game where as a team we shot 31%.  I don't think his performance needs to be discounted at all.  The only guy who shot better other than Stickland's 1-1 was Linssen (4-8, 50%) and all of his shots were right at the rim.

I don't think I was discounting his performance.  He played really well and showed no fear.  I was happy to see that.  I was just commenting that his 20 points on 9 of 23 shooting was different that say Jimerson's 18 points on 7 of 14 shooting against Eastern Illinois or Nesbitt's 19 points on 7 of 11 shooting against Harris Stowe.  I know the opponent was vastly different, and I just commenting on the efficiency.

[AnkielBreakers]

After rewatching the first half, there were some things that stood out:

1. We missed at least 10-12 points on straight layups, including too many free throws from consistent shooters. Everyone who watched knew that was the problem in the game, and it was.

2. Nesbitt blew his assignment/communication on three defensive plays, which lead to layups, or a kicked 3 pointer. I am hoping this was nerves, but otherwise, he cannot play like this, it is the equivalent of what he scored in the game.

3. The change to zone back-fired in the first half. I am not sure if it was bad luck, but we seemed a little loose in the zone, and Memphis went right at it. Maybe we should limit zone until we actually figure it out.

4. Stupid turnovers. Travels. Ugly for a stretch, which was when Memphis started to slip away.

5. Collins on the bench. Kind of obvious, but not good for the team. 

6. Finally, there definitely was home cooking from the refs. It didn’t change the outcome, but helped Memphis look better than their 22 turnovers indicates. Collins and Thatch’s offensive fouls. A missed kicking call. One could argue it was a wash, but it was not. Probably 4-6 point difference.