Two Man Game with Rammer, a Podcast

[HoosierPal]

Billiken Men's talk 7 min to  22 min

What happened at Richmond?  Rammer thinks the team has hit the wall and are out of gas mentally.  Ford said fatigue is setting in.  Because they have lost close games, Ford has shortened the rotation, and this hasn't solved the physical problem.   But the same thing happened in November as is now happening.

Rammer mentioned the play where Richmond had a shot, we had everyone blocked out, the ball hit the ground between three Bills, and Gilyard gets the ball.....mental fatigue.  Nick Sherod, the only thing he does is shot threes, the scouting report said HE SHOOTS THREE'S.  It was talked about at practice, it was discussed in the walk through, but they left him open. 

The report on the Bills that all coaches have is to guard Jimerson close, and to double Collins: cut the head of the snake.  They know Yuri will get in deep.  They are letting him get in too deep where he has to pass out.  They are ready for him to pass the ball out.  We had no answer for the double on Okoro or the team wasn't executing the fix.  His shot has improved, the team is feeding him down low.  But he needs to take that next jump on court vision and passing.   If they double Okoro, someone is open.  Not being able to attack that double in the second half of the game was disappointing. 

Rhode Island is one of the more physical teams in the league followed by maybe the most physical team in VCU.

Playing physical may be a good thing.  Richmond is a skill team, not a physical team.  A knock down, drag out may be a remedy for the Bills.  Rhode pounds the paint a lot.  They will give us a test inside with the Mitchell's.  M. Mitchell takes three's.  Will the Rams game plan Jimerson out of the game?  The physical part of the game may be a problem.  There legs are gone.  Will Ford play 2 bigs to counter the Mitchell's?  Traore?

 Offense cannot go dry for long runs by the Rams.  

 

[HoosierPal]

Billiken talk 2 min to 22 min.

Rammer liked the Rhody win, even though 'style points' weren't there.  Rocc thought the Bills were mentally tough, with the runs on both sides.  When the game was slipping away, they put their foot on Rhody's neck and pulled away.  Down 10 in the first half, Bills went on a 19-3 run.  Moved the ball well and hit the threes.  Then up to 15 points in second half, and Rams went on a run, taking the lead.  Unlike earlier in the year, Bills came back.  Pace dictated the SLU runs. 

Early in the game Rams were running Jimerson off his spots but he came back with this new move, that side step back three pointer.  Complained about the discrepancy of FT between Jimerson and Burton.  Rammer will investigate with League Officials.

Thatch has become a unique matchup.  6'2" going against bigger guys.  He muscles over smaller guys and out moves larger guys.  In conference play Thatch is shooting 48% from the Arc, best on the Bills.  He has become a leader on and off the court. 

20th win of the season. Tradition says 20 wins is an earmark of a good team. 

Senior Afternoon, honoring Perkins is not indicative of what he will do. Ford said it is yet to be determined if he comes back.  The door is open.  They want to honor him, just in case he doesn't come back.

Looking for a third transfer big and backup transfer PG for next season.  Thames may be 6'8" by the time he gets to SLU.  He is a PG in high school but may be more of a wing here.  Won't be surprised if Williams goes hunting for another team for next season.  Rammer "And I wouldn't blame him."   But can Nesbitt and Thames handle 10 min of PG next season?  Rammer - Ford being a former PG, he will want a PG, not a wing.

VCU - can SLU dictate pace and speed up VCU?  VCU has one of the most methodical, slowest pace in the league.  But they will fly down the floor off of turnovers.  VCU has the most assists per game in the league.  Vince Williams has jacked up his shooting. He has gone up to 45% from the arc.  SLU has a size advantage over VCU rotation players.  SLU must outrebound VCU.  Paint defense has done better since Davidson.   

[HoosierPal]

Billiken Talk, 4 1/2 min to 26 min

Jones had maybe his best game as a Billiken with the way he handled the ball against the press and his playing defense.  Best minutes from him and Yuri also.  We have been waiting the entire season to see this.  Linssen's cut on his right eyebrow was an elbow from a Thatch.  VCU's run wasn't them necessarily turning the heat up but was about SLU stopping doing the things they were doing well. 

VCU started with just a couple players back to press.  In the big push VCU was hanging all five back, letting the Bills think that we had numbers up court, but then we had turnovers, bad passes, they jumped the passing lanes or they back tapped from behind. 

When ball movement is quicker and players are moving to spots, the Bills play better.  They bog down too much, standing too much.  Move the ball, move without the ball, it looks like we are playing faster.  We just don't do this for 40 minutes.  Against VCU we were moving maybe 35 minutes, and when we slacked off and VCU put on their run.

Offense ran better when they played more direct and drive to the basket.  Game plan was to do this.  VCU can leave the lanes open when they press as they try to force the ball to the side.  We got a lot of good calls, the crew was not biased.  But we won the game at the FT line. 

Ted Hillary is head of officials for A10.  Rammer still has a burr on Jimerson not getting calls.  Maybe Ford needs to talk to the officials before every game.  But do you want 75 FT per game if every off ball grab in the game is called?  Don't want to bog down the game.

LaSalle or St. Joseph's.  STJ may have more talent, but LaSalle has won both contests.  Can LaSalle win three times?  Probably not.  LaSalle may have a toughness edge that pushes them to a win. 

Davidson /  St. Bonnie is a tough bracket for SLU.  Top 4 present real problems.  None of the 4 are unbeatable.  SLU can beat the Bonnies for sure - three times in one season - no - but can we beat the Wildcats?  Davidson can't duplicate the game where they beat us by 20 at their house.  Osunniyi, the mystic he has earned, freaks guys out when they go inside. 

 

 

 

[HoosierPal]

Billiken talk up to 15 min.  Interesting comments on Nesbitt, Rocc said maybe a 40% chance of getting drafted as the NBA looks heavily on potential.  They also discussed the NBA pipeline has expanded to just about every league in the world.  Rocc said his announcement was written properly-not saying anything about a return, as Nesbitt didn't want a potential employer to ask, "Are you serious about this"? 

While we all have said, yeah we need a backup PG and a stretch, perhaps the coaching staff has other thoughts.  First, what veteran PG will come to SLU to play 5 minutes?  None that we want.  He would need to be a combo guard at a minimum capable of taking minutes from whomever returns on the wings.  Second, perhaps the staff is thinking that the future is 4 out players, and that Traore can fill the gap left by Linssen's departure.  Interesting.

[Taj79]

Serious question ---- why wouldn't we want to groom Thames for those five or ten minutes per game as Yuri's eventual replacement?  We keep talking about a transfer guard but as Rammer points out, he's being generous saying ten minutes a game and who would want to transfer in to such a situation.  DeAndre Jones was one thing and he transferred up from Central Arkansas but what if you are like Brayon Freeman from Geedubya, and you just played 27.2 mpg over 30 games, why are you even bothering to look at our situation?  Personally, I think Freeman will look to transfer up as well but you get the point.

Thames is an award-winning high school guard.  So is Nick Kramer.  They are the eventual future.  Why not?

The power forward/backup center situation is more problematic.  I don't recall any of us turning our heads when we found out we were getting a guy from Valpo/UNC Wilmington but that is the kind of guy we are likely looking for.  My reaction at the time was 'great another Rashed Anthony.'  But Martin was much better than that.  I'd like to see Traore progress and play but it would be a large hole in the roster if he did not.  

Somewhere along the Nesbitt news line, someone asked if he was still in school.  Anybody know?  Not that it matter much to me --- I'm moving on.

[billiken_roy]

i think that our two incoming freshman are the roster replacements (noticed i didnt say lineup or rotation) replacements for jones, strickland and to some degree nesbitt (i had figured nesbitt was going to pick up the needed 5-6 minutes to back up yuri)   surely thames can handle that?   all we've heard is he is point guard worthy.   throw him in.  kramer can surely handle the now to be missed presense of jones, strickland and to some respect some of nesbitt's wing time.  

i think the real minutes eater of nesbitt's minutes has to be parker.   how good is parker?   well we are definitely going to find out unless the transfer portal surprises us.   

i will be surprised if the transfer portal doesnt yield us a player capable of giving us linssen minutes.   i am not looking for anything beyond that.   if somehow we do find a true okoro clone i will be very happy. 

i have to admit selfishly perkins coming back is the big kahuna.   i still dont think for perkins benefit that is in his best interests, but for the billikens and all of us in the billiken fandom, it would be a reason to have a party.   

2 weeks ago i was pretty much done with hargrove.   figured he was done with us as well.   but now i am hoping he and ford can patch things up, do some compromising and he returns.   that is a lot of athlete to let walk away.   we have already lost 2 of our 3 best athletes, i dont want to lose another.   

when oh when will the basketball gods ever let us billiken fans have complete joy?   it is a curse.  tease and pull the rug out.  lucy pulling the football out from charlie brown.   please stop.   

[wgstl]

I do think Thames + Thatch can eat up a good chuck of Jones minutes, and getting that combo guard should just about wrap that up. Plus we need a combo guard for more than just jones' minutes. 

I still worry about Traore getting 15 MPG, especially if we don't have another big to back him up with foul trouble games. 

Also good chance Parker starts out slow, common with JUco kids

[Billikenbooster]

But can Thames + Thatch do it in crunch time when Auburn is pressing?  We need real depth on the team, so if Yuri tweaks an ankle, folks aren't running for the exits.

mhg

[HoosierPal]

29 minutes ago, Billikenbooster said:

But can Thames + Thatch do it in crunch time when Auburn is pressing?  We need real depth on the team, so if Yuri tweaks an ankle, folks aren't running for the exits.

mhg

So what is your recommendation?  Get a Grad Transfer in who wants to sit 35 minutes a game?  Get a combo guard who will take minutes away from Perkins (maybe), Jimerson and Parker?  Tell Yuri he will only get 20 to 25 minutes per game?

You got to consider, Ford will play 8 +2.  He isn't going to change, no matter who is on the bench.

I don't have an answer.  I'm sitting back and will see who laces them up this fall.

[Bizziken]

We just need guys who can handle the damn ball. That can be a combo guard who can spell Yuri at point or a backup PG who can play with Yuri for a few minutes per game. Preferably both. Yuri handles the ball way too much, and not only does it tire him out, but pressure forces him into too many mental mistakes. 

[thetorch]

I think many posters are thinking about this the wrong way.

We have a good top 4.  Yuri, Perkins, Jimerson, Okoro

We need to be recruiting guys in the portal to push Thatch and Hargrove into deep rotation players.

We are good if Thatch & Hargrove are our 8 & 9 players.

We aren't good if they are our 5 & 6.

PT won't matter, we need starters on this team.  We can't be recruiting backups.  How did that work this past season.

We are in a position to tell guys you won't play behind anyone.

[Schasz]

5 minutes ago, thetorch said:

I think many posters are thinking about this the wrong way.

We have a good top 4.  Yuri, Perkins, Jimerson, Okoro

We need to be recruiting guys in the portal to push Thatch and Hargrove into deep rotation players.

We are good if Thatch & Hargrove are our 8 & 9 players.

We aren't good if they are our 5 & 6.

PT won't matter, we need starters on this team.  We can't be recruiting backups.  How did that work this past season.

We are in a position to tell guys you won't play behind anyone.

I still hope Perkins comes back but until he says he is...it could be fools gold to count on it. I do agree with you on hitting the portal for replacements.

[willie]

1 hour ago, thetorch said:

I think many posters are thinking about this the wrong way.

We have a good top 4.  Yuri, Perkins, Jimerson, Okoro

We need to be recruiting guys in the portal to push Thatch and Hargrove into deep rotation players.

We are good if Thatch & Hargrove are our 8 & 9 players.

We aren't good if they are our 5 & 6.

PT won't matter, we need starters on this team.  We can't be recruiting backups.  How did that work this past season.

We are in a position to tell guys you won't play behind anyone.

I think you are selling Thatch short. His last 10-15 games were very strong. I also haven’t given up on TJ. Just needs to work on his ball handling if that’s possible. 

[CBFan]

Could Larry Hughes Jr fill the combo guard need?

 

[3star_recruit]

2 hours ago, thetorch said:

I think many posters are thinking about this the wrong way.

We have a good top 4.  Yuri, Perkins, Jimerson, Okoro

We need to be recruiting guys in the portal to push Thatch and Hargrove into deep rotation players.

We are good if Thatch & Hargrove are our 8 & 9 players.

We aren't good if they are our 5 & 6.

PT won't matter, we need starters on this team.  We can't be recruiting backups.  How did that work this past season.

We are in a position to tell guys you won't play behind anyone.

I agree.  We've got a starting spot open for a guard who can play alongside Yuri and handle the ball.  

[thetorch]

1 hour ago, willie said:

I think you are selling Thatch short. His last 10-15 games were very strong. I also haven’t given up on TJ. Just needs to work on his ball handling if that’s possible. 

6'2 PFs who can't shoot, defend on ball, or cause TOs, don't start on A10 championship teams.

How are we going to realistically get better recruiting players that are worse than the ones we already have?

I don't understand the posters who want to ride with this 23 win first round NIT team and expect better results.

If we want D-1 level guys to play behind Thatch, TJ, and Okoro we already had them on the team.

[Littlebill]

3 hours ago, thetorch said:

6'2 PFs who can't shoot, defend on ball, or cause TOs, don't start on A10 championship teams.

How are we going to realistically get better recruiting players that are worse than the ones we already have?

I don't understand the posters who want to ride with this 23 win first round NIT team and expect better results.

If we want D-1 level guys to play behind Thatch, TJ, and Okoro we already had them on the team.

They do if they shoot 40% from 3 like Thatch did in conference play. To act like thatch in conference play wasn’t playing like a fringe all-league guy is lying to yourself 

averaged 11/6 in 29 mins. 45% from the field and 42% from 3 in a10 play

I was as out on thatch as anyone in nov but he was completely different in the second half of the season. Spent most of his time on the floor as the secondary ball handler as well.

With Perkins coming back, there are less balls to go around. Fred is the perfect 5-7 guy. A good shooter and a plus defender and rebounder who can guard 4 positions in todays game

 

 

 

i don’t understand the posters who develop an opinion and can’t change it based on a player’s development 

 

 

Also, no one is “riding with his years team”. We’re (knock on wood) adding the a10 POY. You think that’ll make a difference?

 

 

[thetorch]

10 hours ago, Littlebill said:

They do if they shoot 40% from 3 like Thatch did in conference play. To act like thatch in conference play wasn’t playing like a fringe all-league guy is lying to yourself 

averaged 11/6 in 29 mins. 45% from the field and 42% from 3 in a10 play

I was as out on thatch as anyone in nov but he was completely different in the second half of the season. Spent most of his time on the floor as the secondary ball handler as well.

With Perkins coming back, there are less balls to go around. Fred is the perfect 5-7 guy. A good shooter and a plus defender and rebounder who can guard 4 positions in todays game

 

 

 

i don’t understand the posters who develop an opinion and can’t change it based on a player’s development 

 

 

Also, no one is “riding with his years team”. We’re (knock on wood) adding the a10 POY. You think that’ll make a difference?

 

 

LOL

Thatch made a whopping SIXTEEN 3s in conference play.  What a sample size.  One game he took *gasp* 5 threes in one game.  5 games he attempted NONE.  Down the stretch when we needed victories Thatch was 1-7, or translation after he got hot in Feb and then teams started guarding him he made 1-7 while losing key games down the stretch.  Far from an All League performance.

Our "A10 POY" who never actually won an A10 POY is coming off major knee surgery.

Again if Thatch is our 7th or 8th man we are a good team.  If he's starting our performance will be more of the same.

[Littlebill]

55 minutes ago, thetorch said:

LOL

Thatch made a whopping SIXTEEN 3s in conference play.  What a sample size.  One game he took *gasp* 5 threes in one game.  5 games he attempted NONE.  Down the stretch when we needed victories Thatch was 1-7, or translation after he got hot in Feb and then teams started guarding him he made 1-7 while losing key games down the stretch.  Far from an All League performance.

Our "A10 POY" who never actually won an A10 POY is coming off major knee surgery.

Again if Thatch is our 7th or 8th man we are a good team.  If he's starting our performance will be more of the same.

Role players are a thing. I’m not advocating for him being the guy. I think we agree at the end of the day. He’s the perfect 5-7 guy in the rotation imo

 

be less combative, it’ll make you happier! LOL!

[AnkielBreakers]

12 hours ago, Littlebill said:

They do if they shoot 40% from 3 like Thatch did in conference play. To act like thatch in conference play wasn’t playing like a fringe all-league guy is lying to yourself 

averaged 11/6 in 29 mins. 45% from the field and 42% from 3 in a10 play

I was as out on thatch as anyone in nov but he was completely different in the second half of the season. Spent most of his time on the floor as the secondary ball handler as well.

With Perkins coming back, there are less balls to go around. Fred is the perfect 5-7 guy. A good shooter and a plus defender and rebounder who can guard 4 positions in todays game

 

 

 

i don’t understand the posters who develop an opinion and can’t change it based on a player’s development 

 

 

Also, no one is “riding with his years team”. We’re (knock on wood) adding the a10 POY. You think that’ll make a difference?

 

 

I do not think anyone would turn down a bigger PF, but to insult Thatch’s conference play is ridiculous. He was probably the toughest matchup for our opponent in every conference game. Too fast for a big power forward and too strong for a little one. I don’t remember him being a liability against anyone on defense.

Finally, conference play showed our biggest weakness: ball handling. Gibson Jimerson cannot help bringing the ball up the court, or dribbling in the half court to set up a play. Hargrove clearly struggles with ball skills. If you want Gibson, then you need someone like Thatch to help Yuri against the guard dominated A10.

[HoosierPal]

33 minutes ago, AnkielBreakers said:

I do not think anyone would turn down a bigger PF, but to insult Thatch’s conference play is ridiculous. He was probably the toughest matchup for our opponent in every conference game. Too fast for a big power forward and too strong for a little one. I don’t remember him being a liability against anyone on defense.

Thatch's 17 game conference stats:

29.8 mpg, 11.5 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 46% FG, 45% 3FG (best on team), 78% FT, and 31 Assists, 23 TO, 11 Blocks, 17 Steals.  No one who watched the Billikens will argue his defensive presence was a plus. 

If we find a power paint transfer/recruit that can top those stats, that player would be pretty darn good and likely destined for P5. 

[thetorch]

1 hour ago, HoosierPal said:

Thatch's 17 game conference stats:

29.8 mpg, 11.5 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 46% FG, 45% 3FG (best on team), 78% FT, and 31 Assists, 23 TO, 11 Blocks, 17 Steals.  No one who watched the Billikens will argue his defensive presence was a plus. 

If we find a power paint transfer/recruit that can top those stats, that player would be pretty darn good and likely destined for P5. 

What are Thatch's stats against the best teams in the league? Dayton, St. Bona, VCU, Davidson?

He feasted on weak teams in our conference. Against the good teams he's overmatched.

Again if we want to be good Thatch is the 3rd or 4th player off the bench.

If we want to be NIT flameouts then lets start Fred at PF.

This isn't a knock on Fred. It is a knock on posters awarding mediocrity.

[dlarry]

29 minutes ago, thetorch said:

What are Thatch's stats against the best teams in the league? Dayton, St. Bona, VCU, Davidson?

He feasted on weak teams in our conference. Against the good teams he's overmatched.

Again if we want to be good Thatch is the 3rd or 4th player off the bench.

If we want to be NIT flameouts then lets start Fred at PF.

This isn't a knock on Fred. It is a knock on posters awarding mediocrity.

Bonnies he avg 11 pts 7 boards in 3 games.

Dayton he avg 11 and 5

VCU he had 9 and 4

Davidson 8 and 3

 

Plus a handful of assists and steals.

Thatch is the least of our problems but I’d love to see him coming of the bench and be our Swiss Army knife. 

[Littlebill]

7 hours ago, dlarry said:

Bonnies he avg 11 pts 7 boards in 3 games.

Dayton he avg 11 and 5

VCU he had 9 and 4

Davidson 8 and 3

 

Plus a handful of assists and steals.

Thatch is the least of our problems but I’d love to see him coming of the bench and be our Swiss Army knife. 

So he hit his conference average against the best teams in the league? Interesting

[3star_recruit]

7 hours ago, thetorch said:

What are Thatch's stats against the best teams in the league? Dayton, St. Bona, VCU, Davidson?

He feasted on weak teams in our conference. Against the good teams he's overmatched.

Again if we want to be good Thatch is the 3rd or 4th player off the bench.

If we want to be NIT flameouts then lets start Fred at PF.

This isn't a knock on Fred. It is a knock on posters awarding mediocrity.

Third or fourth player off the bench?  Is there a better sixth man in the A10 that I don't know about?