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2021-2022 Season


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4 minutes ago, SShoe said:

This entire conversation ignores the many fans who can't yet get vaccines (kids). I'd personally like to bring my three kids who are all currently ineligible for the vaccine without having to worry about them catching it.  They'd probably be fine, but 10-day quarantines are no picnic. 

Good policy should reward good and responsible behavior.  If you don't want to get the vaccine or a negative test, fine.  Just know you could miss out on some fun stuff like a Billiken ass-kicking of Auburn.

The entire idea that we shouldn't have rules/laws because people will just break them is also silly.

I don’t get the sudden “what about the kids?” attitude that has sprung up. Nobody gave a flying fuok about kids until everyone else could get vaxxed up. Now everyone is trying to be the Wu Tang Clan(you know because Wu Tang is for the kids) 

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5 minutes ago, SShoe said:

This entire conversation ignores the many fans who can't yet get vaccines (kids). I'd personally like to bring my three kids who are all currently ineligible for the vaccine without having to worry about them catching it.  They'd probably be fine, but 10-day quarantines are no picnic. 

Good policy should reward good and responsible behavior.  If you don't want to get the vaccine or a negative test, fine.  Just know you could miss out on some fun stuff like a Billiken ass-kicking of Auburn.

The entire idea that we shouldn't have rules/laws because people will just break them is also silly.

Do you think kids should be allowed at games without a negative test result?

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2 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

I don’t get the sudden “what about the kids?” attitude that has sprung up. Nobody gave a flying fuok about kids until everyone else could get vaxxed up. Now everyone is trying to be the Wu Tang Clan(you know because Wu Tang is for the kids) 

Huh?

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1 minute ago, brianstl said:

Do you think kids should be allowed at games without a negative test result?

Yes because they don't currently have a choice in the matter.  

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3 minutes ago, SShoe said:

Huh?

Sorry NVM. I think I misunderstood. There has been a movement to being concerned for kids health with COVID after essentially ignoring them for the last year and a half. You weren’t necessarily saying that. I apologize but not for the Wu Tang Reference. That was solid.

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2 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

Sorry NVM. I think I misunderstood. There has been a movement to being concerned for kids health with COVID after essentially ignoring them for the last year and a half. You weren’t necessarily saying that. I apologize but not for the Wu Tang Reference. That was solid.

I think Delta changed the overall concern level for kids, but I can assure you that my concern level for my kids' health has always remained high.  My wife and I do not keep them out of most things (school, sports, etc.), but we also make sure to assess increased risk wherever it may be.

I clearly need to brush up on my Wu Tang.

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1 minute ago, SShoe said:

I think Delta changed the overall concern level for kids, but I can assure you that my concern level for my kids' health has always remained high.  My wife and I do not keep them out of most things (school, sports, etc.), but we also make sure to assess increased risk wherever it may be.

I clearly need to brush up on my Wu Tang.

Fair play. 

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4 minutes ago, SShoe said:

Yes because they don't currently have a choice in the matter.  

They have a choice when it comes to getting a test.  They can spread the disease just like anyone else.  I don't think they should have to provide a negative test.  That said, if you believe adults should have to do it you should demand the same of kids at the game.

This is the stuff I mean when I sat health safety theater.  Many people just want things that make them feel safer even if they don't really make a difference.  Plus, they only want those things up to the point those things start to inconvenience them.  That is not good policy making.

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We are the one of the few countries in the world masking kids.  We didn't mask them for flu season despite the flu being much more deadly to them.  My kids are vaccinated and they are highschool and older.  if I had a 5 year old i'm not sure i'd get in line to get him vaccinated because there is almost zero risk of him getting sick.  \

Given that the vaccines are not great at stopping transmission I just don't know what my families vaccination status has to do with anyone but my family.  Go to see the Bills and live your life......or not.  It's got nothing to do with me and mine.....

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1 minute ago, brianstl said:

They have a choice when it comes to getting a test.  They can spread the disease just like anyone else.  I don't think they should have to provide a negative test.  That said, if you believe adults should have to do it you should demand the same of kids at the game.

This is the stuff I mean when I sat health safety theater.  Many people just want things that make them feel safer even if they don't really make a difference.  Plus, they only want those things up to the point those things start to inconvenience them.  That is not good policy making.

I don't think we should demand the same of a 5 or 7 year old as an adult, but that's just me.  I also don't think vaccines are health safety theater.  The health checks, spray-downs, and half-mask wearing are, but vaccines are clearly not.

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Just now, SShoe said:

I don't think we should demand the same of a 5 or 7 year old as an adult, but that's just me.  I also don't think vaccines are health safety theater.  The health checks, spray-downs, and half-mask wearing are, but vaccines are clearly not.

Well if you are implementing a policy meant to protect people from possibly infected individuals, the policy should be the same regardless of the age of the potentially infected.  Cruise lines have the same policy for adults and children.  Cruise lines, also, put the resources needed into making sure vaccine or test status actually matches the individual in question.  That is a policy that actually makes sense.  That policy isn't theater. 

The policy you are supporting is nothing besides health safety theater.

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My otherwise completely healthy son, who was 9 months old at the time, spent time getting oxygen in a locked down floor at Children's Hospital this August because he had covid. So I am pretty firmly in the camp that kids can get pretty sick from this. I've had a few people say "well he's fine now" but that doesn't really change how we felt for that week in August and how we don't want to relive that ever again.

That all said, I realize my family was the strong exception to the rule. I don't expect SLU (or anywhere) to put precautions into place to cover 100% of the possible scenarios and eliminate all risk. We may not go to as many games as planned this year but that's an "us" decision. It sucks for us but after 20 months of this virus and almost 12 months of a vaccine, I am ready to be at a point where people make their own decisions and don't have decisions made for them. 

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The issue that no one appears to be aware of or dealing with in this discussion is RISK. People assume that control measures will bring the risk level to "0." This is plainly incorrect, the most strict set of regulations and requirements applied to any event WILL NOT BRING THE RISK LEVEL TO "0." Regardless of the level of regulations/restrictions applied, there will always be some degree of residual risk present, however minimal it may be. You have to decide for yourself and for your family if the level of risk YOU perceive is likely to be present with a given set of regulations is just too much for you or yours to take.

If you decide that the risk is too high for you or your family to take, then do not attend the event.

Having worked for the government during my career, although not at the level or for the length of time Taj did, I fully agree with his  comments about the government not knowing the answers but having to do the best they can with what they have available.

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1 minute ago, Old guy said:

The issue that no one appears to be aware of or dealing with in this discussion is RISK. People assume that control measures will bring the risk level to "0." This is plainly incorrect, the most strict set of regulations and requirements applied to any event WILL NOT BRING THE RISK LEVEL TO "0." Regardless of the level of regulations/restrictions applied, there will always be some degree of residual risk present, however minimal it may be. You have to decide for yourself and for your family if the level of risk YOU perceive is likely to be present with a given set of regulations is just too much for you or yours to take.

If you decide that the risk is too high for you or your family to take, then do not attend the event.

Having worked for the government in my life, although not at the level or for the length of time Taj did, I fully agree with his  comments about the government not knowing the answers but having to do the best they can with what they have available.

Tell that to the Chinese.

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2 hours ago, BilliesBy40 said:

I don't intend to get into a pissing match with you, but FYI, the vaccine is not experimental. mRNA technology has been studied for decades, and it is safer than other types of vaccines. 

how can we trust u, without any capitalized words? Seems SUPSPECT 2 ME

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4 minutes ago, AnkielBreakers said:

Tell that to the Chinese.

The Chinese will be less likely to believe anything I say than even the members of this board do.

It all comes to a personal decision, you either do something or you do not. At my age and my wife's age, we will not attend any games in person.

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57 minutes ago, bauman said:

Your recent pissing contest with courtside about soccer was especially enjoyable.  It was like you brought a knife to a gunfight. 

"Knife to a gunfight" should be quoted and attributed to the person who first used that phrase. We all know @billikenfan05 has a huge problem with plagiarizing courtside's 15 paragraph soccer recaps by using generic soccer terminology but we don't need everyone doing it.

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12 minutes ago, slufan13 said:

My otherwise completely healthy son, who was 9 months old at the time, spent time getting oxygen in a locked down floor at Children's Hospital this August because he had covid. So I am pretty firmly in the camp that kids can get pretty sick from this. I've had a few people say "well he's fine now" but that doesn't really change how we felt for that week in August and how we don't want to relive that ever again.

That all said, I realize my family was the strong exception to the rule. I don't expect SLU (or anywhere) to put precautions into place to cover 100% of the possible scenarios and eliminate all risk. We may not go to as many games as planned this year but that's an "us" decision. It sucks for us but after 20 months of this virus and almost 12 months of a vaccine, I am ready to be at a point where people make their own decisions and don't have decisions made for them. 

This is a good post, but I fundamentally disagree that people's decisions are being made for them here. Unvaccinated people don't have to go to Billiken games.  Vaccine mandates for sporting events are the carrot, not the stick.

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1 hour ago, billiken_roy said:

first off, i have had both of the first two shots and once allowed will have the booster.   i have always been a believer of the vaccines and shots and i get em all, shingles, flu, chinese flu virus, etc.  i believe if someone doesnt get it they are wrong and only endangering themselves, however, i also believe that in America, it should be the individual's own decision.  Mandates and laws to "protect me from myself" really p!ss me off.  If i choose to be reckless and endanger my own life my decision.   A number of you are going to say unvaccinated people are endangering others.   Well barely if the others all have their shots.   and those that dont have their shots made that choice.  respect their decision to live on the edge even if it is for totally fairy tale reasons.   it's their life. 

second point, how much are the walgreens paper masks and the masks your mother made out of old sheets and elastic really helping.   probably not much if anything.   this is what is really making me mad more than the vaccine demands.   the masks are pretty much worthless and imo are being used for political purposes.   now if we were all wearing the N95 masks and sitting 6 feet apart, maybe that reduces risk, but very few people will be at the game wearing such and there has been nothing said about social distancing.   

this whole thing is on the politicians.   either go all out insisting on the above paragraph or else knock off the fear factoring and controlling attempt.   

I'm sick of the whole thing.   i am tired of being expected to live in fear and not being able to enjoy life.   if i have to live the rest of my days living in my basement not working etc.   i might as well be dead.   Look i have now almost died twice in the last 7 years and I refuse to continue this nonsense much longer.   we dont know when the day is coming and it seems to me by all i have read, the main thing is the vaccines.   i have mine and will continue to update accordingly.   that should put me in the best possible situation.  sure i might still be in danger, but probably no more than being killed by a drunk driver, or falling off a ladder putting up christmas lights, or eating poison mushrooms at that upcoming family thanksgiving.  so dont make me live my life wearing a napkin on my face when we all know it is nothing more than a political ploy.

again i dont blame SLU.  this is on St Louis and this looney new mayor.  

 

Billiken Roy,

I want to thank you for expressing my thoughts. I am 75 and had two  shots in Febuary and the booster shot two weeks ago.  

I don't want to have to wear a mask. But I will and can't wait until they eliminate this foolish policy.

Thanks again.

DRKELSEY55

 

 

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34 minutes ago, slufan13 said:

My otherwise completely healthy son, who was 9 months old at the time, spent time getting oxygen in a locked down floor at Children's Hospital this August because he had covid. So I am pretty firmly in the camp that kids can get pretty sick from this. I've had a few people say "well he's fine now" but that doesn't really change how we felt for that week in August and how we don't want to relive that ever again.

That all said, I realize my family was the strong exception to the rule. I don't expect SLU (or anywhere) to put precautions into place to cover 100% of the possible scenarios and eliminate all risk. We may not go to as many games as planned this year but that's an "us" decision. It sucks for us but after 20 months of this virus and almost 12 months of a vaccine, I am ready to be at a point where people make their own decisions and don't have decisions made for them. 

So, this is a great example of the problem many people have had during COVID. It is not fair to parents if there is no vaccine mandate. There are a lot of people complaining about their personal rights, but parents don’t have that liberty. The Delta variant is particularly harder on the young population. Any parent could go to a game, that is there right, but who could live with themselves if their child  has to fight for their lives in two weeks because of that choice. It’s just not worth it. Once the kids can get vaccinated, then I think this can change, but for now, I think vaccine mandates are fair.

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45 minutes ago, A10Ref said:

I really think TJ is going to be the x factor fringe A-10 first team player

It's just hard to say who's going to shine bright.  We have an embarrassment of riches as Earl Austin Jr would say.  There are a bunch of covid year kids that are clogging up playing time all over the NCAA.  I'd like to see what Markhi can do with some playing time too.  Ford has his work cut out for him.

TJ would've started and played 30-40 min per game on a several Billiken teams in recent memory......who the hell knows this year....

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56 minutes ago, Billiken Rich said:

We are the one of the few countries in the world masking kids.  We didn't mask them for flu season despite the flu being much more deadly to them.  My kids are vaccinated and they are highschool and older.  if I had a 5 year old i'm not sure i'd get in line to get him vaccinated because there is almost zero risk of him getting sick.  \

Given that the vaccines are not great at stopping transmission I just don't know what my families vaccination status has to do with anyone but my family.  Go to see the Bills and live your life......or not.  It's got nothing to do with me and mine.....

The masks aren't really about preventing the wearer from getting sick but rather from preventing the spread of the virus, which 100% relies on human hosts to spread and mutate. Without vaccines for kids, this is the only tool available to prevent kids from spreading the vaccine. However, once a person is fully vaccinated the masks admittedly deliver diminishing returns. When properly worn, mask are shown to add between 40 and 50% incremental protection. If you aren't vaccinated at all, that 40-50% protection is significant. If you are double-vaccinated with Moderna or have gotten a booster, that increment is a rounding error. 

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