Compton Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 32 minutes ago, slufanskip said: The demand is there in NCAA due to the school not the individual players. Remove D1 basketball and see what demand there is. Your comparison with baseball missing the point. I'm not saying their isn't a demand for basketball. I'm saying there isn't a demand for basketball below the NBA and their minor league. And minor league baseball in general makes very little money and the average player makes peanuts. Check and see what a player in the Independent league makes. Why do dozens of schools pay $2,000,000+ to recruit and coach talent that there is no demand for? I guess by definition the talent is worth at least $2,000,000 to those schools. Strange that the coaches would get paid so much if it's only the schools, and not the individual players or coaches, that drive demand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willie Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 10 minutes ago, Compton said: Why do dozens of schools pay $2,000,000+ to recruit and coach talent that there is no demand for? I guess by definition the talent is worth at least $2,000,000 to those schools. Strange that the coaches would get paid so much if it's only the schools, and not the individual players or coaches, that drive demand. I think what Skip is saying and I agree is that I am a fan of SLU Basketball. Whether the players are Jordan Goodwin or Sam Smith it is the team that I support and am fans of. Winning of course helps. If Goodwin played for the local YMCA team in an industrial league I could care less. Now I know the University is trying to make the Universities Team the Cities Team but that is really the same thing. billiken_roy likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 18 minutes ago, Compton said: Why do dozens of schools pay $2,000,000+ to recruit and coach talent that there is no demand for? I guess by definition the talent is worth at least $2,000,000 to those schools. Strange that the coaches would get paid so much if it's only the schools, and not the individual players or coaches, that drive demand. The value that a coach presumably adds is his ability to attract the top talent of whatever pool of players is available (typically young men aged 18-22). If the top 200 players in that age group all left and played somewhere else, the college coach would still have value identifying the 201st best player and recruiting him to school. The fans of the school would likely keep coming no matter what because they root for the name on the front of the uniform, not the back. Makes is hard to argue that players 1-200 really add all that much value if they could just vanish and the value of the college game and coaches salaries don't materially change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BilliesBy40 Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 12 minutes ago, kshoe said: The value that a coach presumably adds is his ability to attract the top talent of whatever pool of players is available (typically young men aged 18-22). If the top 200 players in that age group all left and played somewhere else, the college coach would still have value identifying the 201st best player and recruiting him to school. The fans of the school would likely keep coming no matter what because they root for the name on the front of the uniform, not the back. Makes is hard to argue that players 1-200 really add all that much value if they could just vanish and the value of the college game and coaches salaries don't materially change. Do you think Chaifetz would be packed with fans if they were D2-quality players instead of D1? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnkielBreakers Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 58 minutes ago, BilliesBy40 said: Do you think Chaifetz would be packed with fans if they were D2-quality players instead of D1? Washington University draws 10,000+ fans regularly… As any former SLU student knows, our sense of school pride would not allow us to miss a game… Ha! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 52 minutes ago, BilliesBy40 said: Do you think Chaifetz would be packed with fans if they were D2-quality players instead of D1? Don't know, even though your example is basically pulling the top 4,500 players out of college basketball (13 x 350 teams). I do know that compared to 30 years ago when you had guys like Laettner, Hurley, Grant Hill stick around for 3 or 4 years, college basketball has already had a significant evaporation of talent to pay for play leagues. A quick google search tells me there were 175 early entrants from college in the 2019 NBA draft. If it was like the old days, there would probably be an extra 300-500 players in college instead of the NBA, G-League or Europe. Somehow the game has survived that exodus and arenas are largely still packed. Proving once again its the name on the front of the jersey and not the back that matters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 1 hour ago, Compton said: Why do dozens of schools pay $2,000,000+ to recruit and coach talent that there is no demand for? I guess by definition the talent is worth at least $2,000,000 to those schools. Strange that the coaches would get paid so much if it's only the schools, and not the individual players or coaches, that drive demand. there is also a factor that is worth something that having a decent D1 basketball or football team helps other areas of the school besides putting $ in the coffers for athletics or a general fund. there are all kinds of stories about enrollment having tremendous increases as the school has basketball and/or football success. and of course that enrollment increases are worth a lot more to the school than ticket revenues for the actual games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 2 minutes ago, AnkielBreakers said: Washington University draws 10,000+ fans regularly… As any former SLU student knows, our sense of school pride would not allow us to miss a game… Ha! are you sure about the wash u attendance? i dont think their gym holds that many fans. it's been a couple of decades since i went to a bears game but my memory says the gym might hold 2-3000 fans at most. i do believe they do a good percentage per game but they dont get 10,000 fans ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almaman Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 21 minutes ago, billiken_roy said: are you sure about the wash u attendance? i dont think their gym holds that many fans. it's been a couple of decades since i went to a bears game but my memory says the gym might hold 2-3000 fans at most. i do believe they do a good percentage per game but they dont get 10,000 fans ever. I 2 ? those #s, can't picture 10K @ anything @ Wash U not even ThurtenE carnival. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnkielBreakers Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 12 minutes ago, almaman said: I 2 ? those #s, can't picture 10K @ anything @ Wash U not even ThurtenE carnival. You think that the wash U part of that was the less believable? Ok. Both were meant as a joke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almaman Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 wow both jokes over my head slufanskip likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willie Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 32 minutes ago, almaman said: I 2 ? those #s, can't picture 10K @ anything @ Wash U not even ThurtenE carnival. I think I would be a billionaire if it weren’t for Thurteen Carnival. Wash U holds around 4K and is usually free. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almaman Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 40 minutes ago, willie said: I think I would be a billionaire if it weren’t for Thurteen Carnival. Wash U holds around 4K and is usually free. and raining. willie likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 Does Wash U still have WILD? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 24, 2021 Share Posted June 24, 2021 15 hours ago, BilliesBy40 said: Do you think Chaifetz would be packed with fans if they were D2-quality players instead of D1? attendance might fall off a little with the casual fans (you know the billy bob's wearing their mi$$ouri jackets and cardinal hats) probably arent coming. but us real billiken fans are coming regardless of the players or level of play willie, AGB91, drkelsey55 and 1 other like this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnkielBreakers Posted June 24, 2021 Share Posted June 24, 2021 2 hours ago, billiken_roy said: attendance might fall off a little with the casual fans (you know the billy bob's wearing their mi$$ouri jackets and cardinal hats) probably arent coming. but us real billiken fans are coming regardless of the players or level of play Would that pay the mortgage on Chaifetz? Would it pay to keep the lights on? Frankly, no University has the confidence to take that chance. They are all jammed into a difficult situation. So, they will pay players and stick inside of their budgets, and our college sports system will move into a new era. BilliesBy40 likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted June 24, 2021 Share Posted June 24, 2021 16 minutes ago, AnkielBreakers said: Would that pay the mortgage on Chaifetz? Would it pay to keep the lights on? Frankly, no University has the confidence to take that chance. They are all jammed into a difficult situation. So, they will pay players and stick inside of their budgets, and our college sports system will move into a new era. someone better informed can probably speak to this better, but i believe biondi leased the arena to a management company and the billikens are only a preferred tenant with preferred treatment per their lease agreement. the management company is only slightly concerned with billiken attendance and truthfully cares more about carrie underwood, rappers, commedians speaker tours, etc. i.e. saint Louis University get paid for the arena regardless of our attendance and that attendance shouldnt matter on "paying the mortgage". now as to the athletic department budget needs, that's a whole different scenario then paying the mortgage and keeping the lights on. and i would definitely be way over my head speculating on that. our resident BoT mbm could speak to that much better than i could. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brighton Posted June 24, 2021 Share Posted June 24, 2021 2020 SLU drops to two behind Dayton and three behind ILL and MU. https://www.three-man-weave.com/3mw/college-basketball-budgets-2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenHudDude Posted June 25, 2021 Share Posted June 25, 2021 2 hours ago, Brighton said: 2020 SLU drops to two behind Dayton and three behind ILL and MU. https://www.three-man-weave.com/3mw/college-basketball-budgets-2020 If Belmont was in the Atlantic 10 they would have the 6th highest budget. Let’s bring them in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brighton Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 NCAA officially clears student-athletes to pursue name, image and likeness. What big Missouri based companies can we get to strike some endorsement deals with recruits? Anheuser Busch can only market their non-alcoholic beverages. Rawlings Sporting Goods Edward Jones O'Reilly Auto Parts Express Scripts Veterans United Centene Imo's Schnucks Dierbergs Bass Pro Shops Enterprise Holdings Energizer Holdings Hallmark Tums Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiken Rich Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brighton Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 Well, let's just shut down the program and tear down Chaifetz then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taj79 Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 Kids might be able to go to a car dealership for a fee and sign autographs. Their image and likeness means nothing without a SLU jersey on their backs. The University of Dayton just sent out a letter to all boosters saying kids can't wear their Dayton uniforms for such activities. If it takes a few years for a kid to get known like an Obi Toppin or a Jordan Goodwin then they, at best, could then maybe stand alone and be recognized. But it would be Goodwin or Tatum (a local kid) selling Imo's pizza (a local product) on late night St. Louis TV (a local station) for that to work. Jordair might have been able to sell his dreadlocks shadow image on t-shirts but they wouldn't sell much outside the Chaifetz arena. You need your name to sell things or market things and there are no real "names" on the SLU roster with that kind of recognition ability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnkielBreakers Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 1 hour ago, Taj79 said: Kids might be able to go to a car dealership for a fee and sign autographs. Their image and likeness means nothing without a SLU jersey on their backs. The University of Dayton just sent out a letter to all boosters saying kids can't wear their Dayton uniforms for such activities. If it takes a few years for a kid to get known like an Obi Toppin or a Jordan Goodwin then they, at best, could then maybe stand alone and be recognized. But it would be Goodwin or Tatum (a local kid) selling Imo's pizza (a local product) on late night St. Louis TV (a local station) for that to work. Jordair might have been able to sell his dreadlocks shadow image on t-shirts but they wouldn't sell much outside the Chaifetz arena. You need your name to sell things or market things and there are no real "names" on the SLU roster with that kind of recognition ability. Ha! Schools will break when a big name player transfers because they won’t let the player wear a jersey. Schools should have some standards. You cannot sign just anywhere. That said, they will not be a major block. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quality Is Job 1 Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 19 minutes ago, AnkielBreakers said: Ha! Schools will break when a big name player transfers because they won’t let the player wear a jersey. Schools should have some standards. You cannot sign just anywhere. That said, they will not be a major block. I'm sure the schools and the NCAA will put language in the letters of intent and scholarship paperwork that will prevent players from being able to consider the prohibition on using schools' marks as a grievance that would permit them to transfer. And for a school to allow athletes to profit from their marks should be an impermissible benefit, resulting in sanctions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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