2020-21 Season

[bauman]

50 minutes ago, brianstl said:

Eric Halsam night be smarter.

http://haslametrics.com/ratings.php

Halsam and Moore's stats just go to show you how badly relying on stats can be,  I think it is pretty clear to even us Billiken hardcore fans, that we are no where near the 2nd or 3rd best team in the country.  I'm drinking the kool-aid but not smoking the weed.  Top 15-20 ?  Yes.  Top 5?  No.

As OG would say, "I could be right or I could be wrong."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[wgstl]

30 minutes ago, SShoe said:

Hopefully that changes.  Richmond is a good team and we need their metrics to reflect that.

Not much can change at this point.  Loyola if roughly 50th in a few ratings I looked at, this is their last chance, after that they will need to dominate the A10. 

[SShoe]

5 minutes ago, wgstl said:

Not much can change at this point.  Loyola if roughly 50th in a few ratings I looked at, this is their last chance, after that they will need to dominate the A10. 

Well, I think it depends on how much better Kentucky gets by the end of the season.  They often aren't very good in November/December, but are rolling by the end of the season.  If that happens, and Northern Iowa gets healthy and rolls through the Valley, their stock could rise.

[wgstl]

6 minutes ago, SShoe said:

Well, I think it depends on how much better Kentucky gets by the end of the season.  They often aren't very good in November/December, but are rolling by the end of the season.  If that happens, and Northern Iowa gets healthy and rolls through the Valley, their stock could rise.

True, But also would computers hold on to the fact that UK was simply a bad team at the time of the UK/Richmond game? I could see that happening.  

 

Also I really think LSU and NC state will both be top 35 teams.  LSU has a really good chance of top 25 

[Littlebill]

18 minutes ago, SShoe said:

Well, I think it depends on how much better Kentucky gets by the end of the season.  They often aren't very good in November/December, but are rolling by the end of the season.  If that happens, and Northern Iowa gets healthy and rolls through the Valley, their stock could rise.

AJ Green is out for the season and the Valley presents only one decent chance at a Q1/2 win. They'd essentially have to go undefeated in the valley

[RUBillsFan]

35 minutes ago, slu72 said:

Great to be rated that high, but MSU comes in at 38 and they're undefeated. That's hard to figure. 

He has Duke at 65 which is MSU's only top 100 win and only road win.  The others are Eastern MIch #233, ND #107, Detroit #170, Wesern Mich #207, and Oakland #258.  Margin of victory can be kind of fickle, but none of MSU's wins have been real laughers.  Their highest margins were 18 vs Oakland & Western Mich and Eastern Mich by 16.  They only beat Detroit by 7.  

[SShoe]

17 minutes ago, wgstl said:

True, But also would computers hold on to the fact that UK was simply a bad team at the time of the UK/Richmond game? I could see that happening.  

 

Also I really think LSU and NC state will both be top 35 teams.  LSU has a really good chance of top 25 

Some ranking systems might, but the ones that count don't give earlier games any less weight.

I think when it's all said and done, the computers are going to love our wins vs. LSU and NC State. 

[SShoe]

12 minutes ago, Littlebill said:

AJ Green is out for the season and the Valley presents only one decent chance at a Q1/2 win. They'd essentially have to go undefeated in the valley

yuck, didn't realize he was out for the whole season.

[White Pelican]

1 minute ago, SShoe said:

Some ranking systems might, but the ones that count don't give earlier games any less weight.

I think when it's all said and done, the computers are going to love our wins vs. LSU and NC State. 

Agreed.

[brianstl]

56 minutes ago, bauman said:

Halsam and Moore's stats just go to show you how badly relying on stats can be,  I think it is pretty clear to even us Billiken hardcore fans, that we are no where near the 2nd or 3rd best team in the country.  I'm drinking the kool-aid but not smoking the weed.  Top 15-20 ?  Yes.  Top 5?  No.

As OG would say, "I could be right or I could be wrong."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I have little doubt we are among the top 12 teams in the country.  We are better than Dayton was last year.  We are a legit Final Four contender and could very well be among the top 5 teams in the country.

[billiken_roy]

6 minutes ago, brianstl said:

I have little doubt we are among the top 12 teams in the country.  We are better than Dayton was last year.  We are a legit Final Four contender and could very well be among the top 5 teams in the country.

we lack a weapon the magnitude of obi.   not sure that can be "offset" with a collective "well the rest are better viewpoint.   obi was dayton's once in a lifetime talent.      

[willie]

6 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

we lack a weapon the magnitude of obi.   not sure that can be "offset" with a collective "well the rest are better viewpoint.   obi was dayton's once in a lifetime talent.      

How about Don May in 1964? 

[brianstl]

11 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

we lack a weapon the magnitude of obi.   not sure that can be "offset" with a collective "well the rest are better viewpoint.   obi was dayton's once in a lifetime talent.      

Roy, go look at Toppin's offensive numbers last season and then look at Perkin's numbers so far this season.  Now tell me what you see?

 

[Reinert310]

1 minute ago, brianstl said:

Roy, go like at Toppin's offensive numbers last season and then look at Perkin's numbers so far this season.  Now tell me what you see?

 

I don’t think Roy’s point was as much about the numbers as the matchup problem he created. We don’t have a guy who creates a matchup problem no matter who is guarding him.

[SShoe]

3 minutes ago, brianstl said:

Roy, go like at Toppin's offensive numbers last season and then look at Perkin's numbers so far this season.  Now tell me what you see?

 

I love Perkins, but Toppin required soooo much attention from defenses.  Jalen Crutcher is clearly a good player, but he's already showing how much Toppin meant to that team.

[slufanskip]

Can't help myself. Call illegal screens and Obi only averages 8 minutes a game as I've never seen a game where he hasn't set 5 of them in the 1st 8 minutes. Ok, I'm done. 

[brianstl]

1 minute ago, Reinert310 said:

I don’t think Roy’s point was as much about the numbers as the matchup problem he created. We don’t have a guy who creates a matchup problem no matter who is guarding him.

I think we have are own match up nightmare on this team, but you are free to disagree.

[slufanskip]

I take this years SLU over last years Dayton. Yep, Obi was a matchup nightmare which in effect made Crutcher a better player, but we've added Jimerson and we were right there both games. Jimerson changes the way teams have to defend us. We can just attack teams so many different ways. Our defense keeps us in games when things are firing on all cylinders as evidenced last night. I don't think it's a gimme, but if I'm forced to make a bet with even odds. I'm taking the Bills

[Clocktoweraccords2004]

rankings shouldn’t exist until game 8 imo 

gives a false sense of good wins before teams even have a resume to determine who was over or underrated. 
 

we may be top though. I wouldn’t discount it. There seems to be huge conference bias in the rankings for big 10, SEC and ACC where teams are highly overanked. 

21 turnovers would cost us against a healthy team. Not discounting the win but NC state is without 2 of their top 6 and had a small bench which we clearly capitalized on. A win against Minnesota however will solidify us 

[BIG BILL FAN]

1 hour ago, bauman said:

Halsam and Moore's stats just go to show you how badly relying on stats can be,  I think it is pretty clear to even us Billiken hardcore fans, that we are no where near the 2nd or 3rd best team in the country.  I'm drinking the kool-aid but not smoking the weed.  Top 15-20 ?  Yes.  Top 5?  No.

As OG would say, "I could be right or I could be wrong."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Don’t put me in that group, I think this team can compete well with anyone...

[Clocktoweraccords2004]

Also another big like linneson is the game changer for us. He can subtly put up double digits and take French away from foul trouble without sloppy play from Bell who still needs time.... the what if’s for Gordon will bug me for some time

[slufanskip]

1 minute ago, Clocktoweraccords2004 said:

rankings shouldn’t exist until game 8 imo 

gives a false sense of good wins before teams even have a resume to determine who was over or underrated. 
 

we may be top though. I wouldn’t discount it. There seems to be huge conference bias in the rankings for big 10, SEC and ACC where teams are highly overanked. 

21 turnovers would cost us against a healthy team. Not discounting the win but NC state is without 2 of their top 6 and had a small bench which we clearly capitalized on. A win against Minnesota however will solidify us 

Can't argue missing two of their top 6, but we basically played with 7 players just like they did

[slufanskip]

Just now, Clocktoweraccords2004 said:

Also another big like linneson is the game changer for us. He can subtly put up double digits and take French away from foul trouble without sloppy play from Bell who still needs time.... the what if’s for Gordon will bug me for some time

Linssen. It can't be that hard. 

[brianstl]

3 minutes ago, SShoe said:

I love Perkins, but Toppin required soooo much attention from defenses.  Jalen Crutcher is clearly a good player, but he's already showing how much Toppin meant to that team.

We have way more threats than that Dayton team.  Toppin demanded a ton of attention, but we have four players that demand attention or they will drop 20+ on you no problem (some may want to add Jacobs to that group).  I am not saying Perkins is Toppin.  Toppin was national player of the year caliber, but Perkins is as effective on his team offensively as Toppin was on his.

That offensive depth is why it is so important to stack recruiting classes.  Most Final Four teams don't have a National POY, but they have guys that can be just as effective as a Toppin surrounded by the other talent on their team.

[3star_recruit]

After Baylor, Gonzaga and Iowa there's not much separation between the #4 team and the #15 team.  It's about matchups.  For example, we match up better with #4 Michigan State, IMO, than the long greyhounds at #15 Florida State.  If we take care of business on Sunday, we're definitely in the mix for that extremely large second tier.