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8 hours ago, Spoon-Balls said:

Roughly half the study participants were given a dose of 450 milligrams of chloroquine twice daily for five days, while the rest were prescribed a higher dose of 600 milligrams for 10 days. Within three days, researchers started noticing heart arrhythmias in patients taking the higher dose. By the sixth day of treatment, 11 patients had died, leading to an immediate end to the high-dose segment of the trial.

 

did they die of the virus or arrythmias?  Was the lower dose segment of the trial ended?

 

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36 minutes ago, Spoon-Balls said:

Chloroquine is not hydroxychloroquine.

One thing I don't understand is not being positive about possible treatments. There is anecdotal evidence of this working but still a lot of push back against it.

 

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My pushback is caused  by knowing trump and his whole gang hates science. once this sh*t started it was prudent to be concerned same as it would be prudent to be concerned if your school hired Crews as their new coach.Predictable as the sun that he stared at on national tv right after being told that's numero uno thing NOT TO DO during a total eclipse rising he has mangled it from day one. It is so utterly predictable as this virus was. Rushing out something unproven has seldom been the M O of the medical community and for good reason. 

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8 hours ago, NoCoBillsFan said:

Once it became clear that it wasn’t just the flu,

just the flu?  the flu kills more every year than this chinese flu virus will kill.  

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9 hours ago, almaman said:

Your cap button gone hoarse?

Same old tactic, trash the messenger, ignore the message.. telling that none of you deny what I said... because you can’t, the facts tell the story... the cap button is apparently very effective in bringing out the haters and frauds....

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11 hours ago, moytoy12 said:

Old guy is wrong. Old guy has no clue what he is talking about. Old guy might actually contribute to the deaths of others. 

Really, you are blaming deaths on a board member?? You really are a disgusting individual and should be removed from this board.

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3 hours ago, billiken_roy said:

just the flu?  the flu kills more every year than this chinese flu virus will kill.  

Its sentiments like this that are extremely frustrating. My mother in law is an icu nurse who has had coworkers die, 30 year old otherwise healthy individuals on ventilators, and area police officers and firefighters being cared for having covid19. This does not happen with the normal flu.

Furthermore, average deaths from the flu in a single year (12 months) are 56000/year per the cdc. There have been 26000 deaths since Feb 29th ( < 2months) due to covid19. Do the math. Goodness sakes.

I hope that we don't get near 56000 deaths. The way we can avoid the mass deaths that would happen is to continue social distancing, etc. People that put dollars over human lives need to reconsider their priorities.

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14 hours ago, moytoy12 said:

Old guy is wrong. Old guy has no clue what he is talking about. Old guy might actually contribute to the deaths of others. 

Look, this is way over the top. OldGuy has made it clear on dozens of occasions that he is not a doctor. He basically went to Med School, but either didn’t finish, or moved into a non practicing role in medicine. Anyone who takes his opinion on chloroquine or on this disease seriously has only themselves to blame. 

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5 minutes ago, bleedtheblue said:

Its sentiments like this that are extremely frustrating. My mother in law is an icu nurse who has had coworkers die, 30 year old otherwise healthy individuals on ventilators, and area police officers and firefighters being cared for having covid19. This does not happen with the normal flu.

Furthermore, average deaths from the flu in a single year (12 months) are 56000/year per the cdc. There have been 26000 deaths since Feb 29th ( < 2months) due to covid19. Do the math. Goodness sakes.

I hope that we don't get near 56000 deaths. The way we can avoid the mass deaths that would happen is to continue social distancing, etc. People that put dollars over human lives need to reconsider their priorities.

Agreed. It's such a brainless take to say this is the same as the flu.  I mean...we have 26000 deaths in 1-2 GOTDAMN MONTHS!!  And the only reason it isn't drastically worse is because of the extreme social distancing.  

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1 minute ago, AnkielBreakers said:

Look, this is way over the top. OldGuy has made it clear on dozens of occasions that he is not a doctor. He basically went to Med School, but either didn’t finish, or moved into a non practicing role in medicine. Anyone who takes his opinion on chloroquine or on this disease seriously has only themselves to blame. 

You know, that's a fair way to put it.  

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not saying it is the same as the flu.   saying we have more or at minimum same deaths as the flu.    yet we shut down the world for this and do nothing each year for the flu.  i am upset about the media and political reaction.  not the virus.   

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16 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

not saying it is the same as the flu.   saying we have more or at minimum same deaths as the flu.    yet we shut down the world for this and do nothing each year for the flu.  i am upset about the media and political reaction.  not the virus.   

Yea. I get that.  The fact that you still question why the shutdown was necessary baffles me.

The virus is different than the flu making it potentially worse. We don't shut down the world due to the flu because we have vaccines, herd immunity, treatments and it is less infectious... Our healthcare system is ready to deal with the flu to the best of its ability. It sucks that people still die because of the flu, but we as a society due what we can to mitigate it. It is kept at Bay for the most part.

The virus is a complete unknown... Higher infectious rate, no vaccine thus no herd immunity, no know treatment yet, and the healthcare system was not equipped to deal with the overload of patients. IT IS deadlier than the flu if we allow it to spread unchecked. NOT less or same deaths as you said above.

If you still don't understand why we halted everything due to covid 19 and not for the flu I'm not sure what to tell you. Keep living in that bubble. Must be nice.

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14 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

not saying it is the same as the flu.   saying we have more or at minimum same deaths as the flu.    yet we shut down the world for this and do nothing each year for the flu.  i am upset about the media and political reaction.  not the virus.   

Flu data is over the course of a 12 month year. COVID-19 data has been about two months worth of data (long way to go) including a shutdown of much of the country the past month or more. If no shutdown, the COVID-19 numbers skyrocket even more. Even with the shutdown, we are at anywhere from 26k plus to about 40,000k and counting today. Death totals have been vastly underreported as I showed in a previous post.

We also do not have a vaccine yet, nor any proven effective long term treatments for COVID-19. We have some of those things for the flu. COVID-19 is showing signs of future long term health problems for many people that is less common with the flu.

We are trying to prevent hundreds of thousands and millions of deaths in a short amount of time. Mitigation, social distancing, staying home has helped slow deaths. 

Either you don't understand basic math, or you are being disingenuous. 

 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, bleedtheblue said:

Yea. I get that.  The fact that you still question why the shutdown was necessary baffles me.

The virus is different than the flu making it potentially worse. We don't shut down the world due to the flu because we have vaccines, herd immunity, treatments and it is less infectious... Our healthcare system is ready to deal with the flu to the best of its ability. It sucks that people still die because of the flu, but we as a society due what we can to mitigate it. It is kept at Bay for the most part.

The virus is a complete unknown... Higher infectious rate, no vaccine thus no herd immunity, no know treatment yet, and the healthcare system was not equipped to deal with the overload of patients. IT IS deadlier than the flu if we allow it to spread unchecked. NOT less or same deaths as you said above.

If you still don't understand why we halted everything due to covid 19 and not for the flu I'm not sure what to tell you. Keep living in that bubble. Must be nice.

i am questioning why the flu, pneumonia, cancer, heart disease, etc which kill more than this chinese virus have never had the reaction and panic that this chinese virus does.   you talk about the chinese flu being more dangerous, but every day it appears that isnt the case and the final numbers appear will be less.   much less than the millions that the press and "experts" were throwing around originally.  much less than the 240,000+ that was being talked about just a couple of weeks ago.   

the shutdown by each state should have been an attempt to quarantine the people that are more inclined to give in to the virus (over 90% of the reported deaths had underlying issues like obesity, cancer, flu, pneumonia, recovering from recent surgery, etc)  instead of an across he board, everyone stay home.   

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15 minutes ago, courtside said:

Either you don't understand basic math, or you are being disingenuous

 

 

 

It’s this one. The basics have been explained to these knuckleheads repeatedly.  For whatever reason, they refuse to acknowledge the obvious.

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14 minutes ago, courtside said:

Flu data is over the course of a 12 month year. COVID-19 data has been about two months worth of data (long way to go) including a shutdown of much of the country the past month or more. If no shutdown, the COVID-19 numbers skyrocket even more. Even with the shutdown, we are at anywhere from 26k plus to about 40,000k and counting today. Death totals have been vastly underreported as I showed in a previous post.

We also do not have a vaccine yet, nor any proven effective long term treatments for COVID-19. We have some of those things for the flu. COVID-19 is showing signs of future long term health problems for many people that is less common with the flu.

We are trying to prevent hundreds of thousands and millions of deaths in a short amount of time. Mitigation, social distancing, staying home has helped slow deaths. 

Either you don't understand basic math, or you are being disingenuous. 

 

 

 

"flu season" is not a true 12 month event.  more like 4 typically.   

whatever on your "underreported b.s."   of course the "experts dont mention the underlying issues that the vast majority of the chinese virus deaths had.   the vast majority of the people testing positive recover just fine.  

what good does the vaccine promise?   each year we take a flu shot vaccine and then 10's of thousands die anyway.  we hear about different strains.   so why wont the chinese virus be different strains as well?

you need to catch up on the "hundreds of thousands and millions of deaths" thing.   in the last couple of weeks even the "experts" arent saying that any longer.  

you just keep on hiding in your basement.   hopefully you can find some good soccer to watch on your TV.   I will continue to earn a living and provide for my family.

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7 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

i am questioning why the flu, pneumonia, cancer, heart disease, etc which kill more than this chinese virus have never had the reaction and panic that this chinese virus does.  

Flu is less infectious and less deadly, .

Bacterial pneumonia we have vaccines for the most dangerous infectious (H. flu, Strep. pneumo, etc). People who get pneumonia now are typically getting it because they're immunocompromised in some way or have non-infectious risk factors (CF, COPD, etc)

Cancer and heart disease aren't infectious, and kill you over decades/years/months, not days.

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5 minutes ago, moytoy12 said:

It’s this one. The basics have been explained to these knuckleheads repeatedly.  For whatever reason, they refuse to acknowledge the obvious.

mark down who started name calling first here.   

by the way the only thing i am asking and nobody answers is why the hysterical panic overeaction.   i have never denied the virus and the serious aspect.   just why other medical situations that kill more are not taken as serious.   no one has explained why less justifies more.  

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1 hour ago, moytoy12 said:

Agreed. It's such a brainless take to say this is the same as the flu.  I mean...we have 26000 deaths in 1-2 GOTDAMN MONTHS!!  And the only reason it isn't drastically worse is because of the extreme social distancing.  

I reached a conclusion last night that I have been building to for a long time after reading even more stuff on this virus.  We have to have a really honest conversation about this virus.  We won't have that conversation because of politics and people don't want to admit what the awful truth actually is.  

We need to stop thinking of the death total as a scoreboard in which we can keep the score of COVID deaths lower by playing better defense.  The death total is actually a timer and it is going to keep ticking up until we reach a total that equals the death rate of this virus across society.  The virus can be slowed, but it spreads way too easily, has way too many asymptomatic carriers and we live in world that is far too interconnected even in a shutdown to contain it at a level that will stop the spread.  We are playing out the clock and our shutdowns are just timeouts before their are no more ticks on the clock.  It just delays the inevitable.  We are talking 600,000 to 2 million (maybe more) deaths depending on what the death rate of this virus actually is.  Those 26,000 thousands deaths we have already haven't been preventable since this thing broke from a small group in Wuhan sometime probably back in November.  Since then they were going to die of virus, it was just a question of when.

We need to admit that really no matter what we do going forward the death toll from this is going to be massive because it is a novel virus and we have will have no vaccine for a very long time.  We need to stop talking like their is a legitimate possibility for a safe and effective vaccine in 18 months.  It would be great if there was a vaccine in that time period, but history suggest it will more likely be years or even decades before we have one. 

The conversation needs to be about going forward with those realities.  

 

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1 minute ago, GBL_Bills said:

Flu is less infectious and less deadly, .

Bacterial pneumonia we have vaccines for the most dangerous infectious (H. flu, Strep. pneumo, etc). People who get pneumonia now are typically getting it because they're immunocompromised in some way or have non-infectious risk factors (CF, COPD, etc)

Cancer and heart disease aren't infectious, and kill you over decades/years/months, not days.

less deadly.........even though more will die this year from the flu than the chinese virus.   got it. again, less = more.   is this an example of the new math?

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1 minute ago, billiken_roy said:

i am questioning why the flu, pneumonia, cancer, heart disease, etc which kill more than this chinese virus have never had the reaction and panic that this chinese virus does.   you talk about the chinese flu being more dangerous, but every day it appears that isnt the case and the final numbers appear will be less.   much less than the millions that the press and "experts" were throwing around originally.  much less than the 240,000+ that was being talked about just a couple of weeks ago.   

the shutdown by each state should have been an attempt to quarantine the people that are more inclined to give in to the virus (over 90% of the reported deaths had underlying issues like obesity, cancer, flu, pneumonia, recovering from recent surgery, etc)  instead of an across he board, everyone stay home.   

First of all... Cancer, pneumonia and heart disease ARE NOT CONTAGIOUS so nice try but that argument fails to support anything you are saying.

Second of all, we lost our opportunity to quartentine specific groups of people when we did nothing in the month of February.

Third of all, regardless if people who have underlying conditions have a higher risk of death, healthy and asymptomatic individuals can carry and spread it to those individuals. 

 

 

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