PD Article on Team Offense

[Sheltiedave]

The PD cares so much about the Billikens that it allows five sock puppets of a single deranged individual to run amok, unfettered and unmoderated, on their flagship media forum.

They cared so little about honest, unbiased reporting that they had Jose, or whatever he called himself, write negative screeds during S2.

They appointed Mike Smith as one of the forum moderators, and his every interaction was framed like he was writing from the middle of the Antlers, four beers deep into a Friday night, with Mizzou up eight on Kansas.

Click on the PD articles? I cancelled our script five years ago for cause, and the paper has not improved since then. There are more insights, analysis, and information here than there, so no, I see zero need to funnel anyone to the Post. We can carry on more knowledgeable conversations here than with anyone at the Post on basketball; there are some smart roundheads here.

[Brighton]

47 minutes ago, bauman said:

LB and 05, you two are hard to understand.  We all want the Billikens to become THE St. Louis team, yet you seem to take the position that going to a Twiter account (Chapley) with very few followers-all of whom are already likely Billiken season ticket holders - or a podcast of a couple of fanboys, which, again is probably only listened to by hardcore Bills' fans, is going to get us any additional fans/game attendees.  A pretty narrow and misguided viewpoint in my opinion.  Are you saying the PD need not even cover us?  If so, I couldn't disagree more.  Any reasonable PD coverage is a good thing and more is better!

For example: 

 

[glazedandconfused]

13 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

We got plenty of coverage when Spoonball was at its peak.  I guarantee you we will get covered in a major way when we we string together 25 win seasons and tournament appearances with local players, whether MBMs click PD links or not. This is the town where local high school ball has a stronger following than the local college team, after all.

Ford has a better relationship with the local media and high schools than Majerus ever did. But other than a late run last March, we have not been a major news story.

Also, mid-major programs have to do more than the state flagship school to get substantial coverage.  It's like that in virtually every major market.  I can count the exceptions on one hand.

I couldn't agree more. If SLU has sustained success (NCAA tourney appearances, maybe a Top 25 ranking for a week or two),  local interest will increase organically. Otherwise, there isn't going to be much change. 

 

Edit: That doesn't mean clicking links/reading articles is bad, just not going to have the substantial impact that having a successful program will bring. 

 

[cheeseman]

38 minutes ago, Littlebill said:

This isn't "hard to understand"

Man too old to understand podcasts doesn't understand how to grow a brand in 2019.

Same man doesn't understand that more coverage in our paper doesn't lead to any new attendees. Word of mouth does more for a brand than a newspaper does. How is a black and white, underwhelming beat article going to grow the fanbase? 

In a totally surprising turn of events, childish other man who irrationally hates other posters passive-aggressively likes the illogical post. Are we part of the new media deep state?

Why does it have to be mutually exclusive.  Both can exist without degrading the other. 

[3star_recruit]

46 minutes ago, Littlebill said:

This isn't "hard to understand"

Man too old to understand podcasts doesn't understand how to grow a brand in 2019.

Same man doesn't understand that more coverage in our paper doesn't lead to any new attendees. Word of mouth does more for a brand than a newspaper does. How is a black and white, underwhelming beat article going to grow the fanbase? 

In a totally surprising turn of events, childish other man who irrationally hates other posters passive-aggressively likes the illogical post. Are we part of the new media deep state?

The funny thing is that the word of mouth buzz you mentioned will drive the PD to increase their coverage. So the folks you're debating will get what they want anyway. 

[willie]

win and they will come

[RUBillsFan]

2 hours ago, billikenfan05 said:

How often does STLtoday's main twitter account share our articles?

 

I understand this point, but isn't this why we're having the discussion about making sure to click the article.  It is important to show the PD that there is a market for Billiken content.  The more they see that, the more resources they'll put into it. 

You seem to be arguing that they should put more resources into it if they want more clicks.  It's sort of a chicken-egg thing - do articles get promoted because they think they'll be popular or are the popular because they're better promoted?  Given the other sports articles the main account shares (mostly Cardinals and Blues), it seems like they're only promoting things that they already know will be popular.

Edit: I don't think anyone is saying NOT to follow / read Chapley.  He's excellent and I agree that his SLU coverage is better than the PD coverage.  I'm arguing that Chapley writing SLU articles isn't doing much to potentially expand the fan base.  Articles in the PD on the other hand very well might.  Enough clicks on articles in the PD will probably lead to more PD articles, so doing so even if the article isn't as good as Chapley's makes sense.  Honestly, I usually read / listen to just about any Billikens content out there no matter how bad it is.  There just isn't much out there and I'd rather read a SLU article than something else.

Edited December 27, 2019 by RUBillsFan

[johnbj14]

Two unrelated points. First, additional clicks on the PD article will likely not amount to additional coverage. Winning consistently will lead to enhanced regional coverage. Second, relying on traditional print media (and its online editions) to create additional interested fans is counterintuitive in 2019. Blogs, podcasts, social media, etc. create more impressions in today's world AND are more likely to reach future generations of fans, which is the end goal. 

[Littlebill]

21 minutes ago, willie said:

win and they will come

At the end of the day - this is the only thing that matters. It is what will get more butts in seats. Nothing else.

[RUBillsFan]

7 minutes ago, johnbj14 said:

Two unrelated points. First, additional clicks on the PD article will likely not amount to additional coverage. Winning consistently will lead to enhanced regional coverage. Second, relying on traditional print media (and its online editions) to create additional interested fans is counterintuitive in 2019. Blogs, podcasts, social media, etc. create more impressions in today's world AND are more likely to reach future generations of fans, which is the end goal. 

I understand these points, but I think you're overlooking some things:

1. Winning consistently will likely lead to more clicks on SLU PD articles which will lead to enhanced regional coverage.  The Wash U Bears women's basketball team has a winning history.  Very few people care about them and they aren't going to get much PD coverage because of that.  On the flip side, when the Rams were here, they sucked during their last several years, but they still got ample coverage because there was an audience.  A massive amount of clicks shows the PD there is an audience for the content, that very likely leads to more coverage win or lose.

2. Traditional print media (PD/Stltoday) isn't mutually exclusive from blogs, podcasts, social media, etc.  The PD has a sizable presence on social media as well as its own blogs and podcasts.  If StlToday started a Billikens podcast for example, it would reach a much wider audience than The House That Rick Built (no offense, I love THTRB).

[glazedandconfused]

7 minutes ago, RUBillsFan said:

I understand these points, but I think you're overlooking some things:

1. Winning consistently will likely lead to more clicks on SLU PD articles which will lead to enhanced regional coverage.  The Wash U Bears women's basketball team has a winning history.  Very few people care about them and they aren't going to get much PD coverage because of that.  On the flip side, when the Rams were here, they sucked during their last several years, but they still got ample coverage because there was an audience.  A massive amount of clicks shows the PD there is an audience for the content, that very likely leads to more coverage win or lose.

2. Traditional print media (PD/Stltoday) isn't mutually exclusive from blogs, podcasts, social media, etc.  The PD has a sizable presence on social media as well as its own blogs and podcasts.  If StlToday started a Billikens podcast for example, it would reach a much wider audience than The House That Rick Built (no offense, I love THTRB).

1. Yes, obviously a bad NFL team will garner more attention than a good D-whatever women's college basketball team. But us manufacturing an additional 50 clicks per article isn't going to move the needle. Winning will get a bigger audience. We can hustle as much as we want, but a losing SLU program will never have major local interest. 

 

2. All these different media outlets are a reflection of local interest, they don't drive local interest. If the team gets better and garners more local interest, you will see more SLU articles/blogs/etc.  I see it as a supply/demand thing. There's a bigger market for winning D-1 college basketball teams than losing ones. 

[johnbj14]

21 minutes ago, RUBillsFan said:

I understand these points, but I think you're overlooking some things:

1. Winning consistently will likely lead to more clicks on SLU PD articles which will lead to enhanced regional coverage.  The Wash U Bears women's basketball team has a winning history.  Very few people care about them and they aren't going to get much PD coverage because of that.  On the flip side, when the Rams were here, they sucked during their last several years, but they still got ample coverage because there was an audience.  A massive amount of clicks shows the PD there is an audience for the content, that very likely leads to more coverage win or lose.

2. Traditional print media (PD/Stltoday) isn't mutually exclusive from blogs, podcasts, social media, etc.  The PD has a sizable presence on social media as well as its own blogs and podcasts.  If StlToday started a Billikens podcast for example, it would reach a much wider audience than The House That Rick Built (no offense, I love THTRB).

On point 1, it is extremely hard to gather social impressions when the main PD account, the one with the most reach, does not share articles about the Billikens. On point 2, I understand that traditional media is not mutually exclusive from newer age distribution methods. However, I find it extremely hard to believe that the PD would allocate any resources to this for the Billikens. They are fine with the bare minimum of just Stu. 

[billiken_roy]

i used to passionately fight for billiken coverage at the PD.   i have since given up and accept it is what it is.   I get along fine with Stu and believe he is doing what he is told and these days a beat reporter full time job is likely hard to get so who can blame him for doing his job as he's told to do it.  

that all said, i cant see where ignoring and not opening a billiken story is positive to our program.   i basically read and listen and watch anything billiken related for the most part.   well unless i strongly detest one of the actors.  then sorry i wont partake.   

[3star_recruit]

2 hours ago, glazedandconfused said:

1. Yes, obviously a bad NFL team will garner more attention than a good D-whatever women's college basketball team. But us manufacturing an additional 50 clicks per article isn't going to move the needle. Winning will get a bigger audience. We can hustle as much as we want, but a losing SLU program will never have major local interest. 

 

2. All these different media outlets are a reflection of local interest, they don't drive local interest. If the team gets better and garners more local interest, you will see more SLU articles/blogs/etc.  I see it as a supply/demand thing. There's a bigger market for winning D-1 college basketball teams than losing ones. 

 

2 hours ago, RUBillsFan said:

I understand these points, but I think you're overlooking some things:

1. Winning consistently will likely lead to more clicks on SLU PD articles which will lead to enhanced regional coverage.  The Wash U Bears women's basketball team has a winning history.  Very few people care about them and they aren't going to get much PD coverage because of that.  On the flip side, when the Rams were here, they sucked during their last several years, but they still got ample coverage because there was an audience.  A massive amount of clicks shows the PD there is an audience for the content, that very likely leads to more coverage win or lose.

2. Traditional print media (PD/Stltoday) isn't mutually exclusive from blogs, podcasts, social media, etc.  The PD has a sizable presence on social media as well as its own blogs and podcasts.  If StlToday started a Billikens podcast for example, it would reach a much wider audience than The House That Rick Built (no offense, I love THTRB).

The bolded is what we've been saying.  It's the winning that will lead to increased interest by thousands of casual fans and hundreds more clicks, not a tiny group of MBMs trying to game the system.

[billikenfan05]

Looks like Stu reads the board. hahaha

[RiseAndGrind]

The post dispatch is terrible in all respects, so it’s bad Billiken coverage is not unexpected. 

[johnbj14]

11 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

Looks like Stu reads the board. hahaha

Was literally thinking that 

 

[RUBillsFan]

2 hours ago, 3star_recruit said:

 

The bolded is what we've been saying.  It's the winning that will get lead to increased interest by thousands of casual fans and hundreds more clicks, not a tiny group of MBMs trying to game the system.

I guess I'm saying that without our tiny group of MBMs, we may not have any coverage at all in the PD, so go click on the the article.

In the end, what can we MBMs (without gobs of cash) really do to actually help the program get better?  My best answer is to show our interest in the program so that it maybe gets more coverage / attention from media, recruits, etc. - go to home games, buy/wear SLU gear, click / read articles, share stuff on social media, etc.  If anyone has better ideas, feel free to share them.

[billikenfan05]

https://t.co/bL5dIYoMuK?amp=1

bizarre stuff from Ben Fred

[kmbilliken]

9 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

https://t.co/bL5dIYoMuK?amp=1

bizarre stuff from Ben Fred

I thought it was a good article for both Taylor and the Bills.

[billikenfan05]

11 minutes ago, kmbilliken said:

I thought it was a good article for both Taylor and the Bills.

Its a bizarre suggestion to have a high school player going to a 2-10 program give a pep talk to college kids. It furthers the notion that the PD can’t just talk about the Billikens. 

[HoosierPal]

Fun article. Kudos to the PD.
 

I chuckle that some of our harsh PD critics still bother to click on their articles. 

[meerkat]

On 12/28/2019 at 10:32 AM, billikenfan05 said:

https://t.co/bL5dIYoMuK?amp=1

bizarre stuff from Ben Fred

Really feel like we're gonna regret not offering Taylor. Good all-around player and can shoot free throws.

[billikenfan05]

7 hours ago, meerkat said:

Really feel like we're gonna regret not offering Taylor. Good all-around player and can shoot free throws.

I liked RayShawn alot in that ESL/Collinsville game but we already have a logjam at the guard position. I actually would really like to see what TJ's former teammate Richard Robinson is upto at JUCO. I think he would be a nice depth player in our front court if he's available next year.

[3star_recruit]

4 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

I liked RayShawn alot in that ESL/Collinsville game but we already have a logjam at the guard position. I actually would really like to see what TJ's former teammate Richard Robinson is upto at JUCO. I think he would be a nice depth player in our front court if he's available next year.

8.2 ppg 5.6 rpg on 37% shooting at Kaskaskia as a freshman.  Robinson's got another year to go since he didn't qualify out of high school.