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Sheltiedave

Five observations while beaching Belmont

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This was a fairly ugly game, but stubborn defensive games are battles, and battles are won in the trenches. We excelled in the trenches tonight, so we won.

With ugly all around at times, it is easier to point out some specific player observations for most of the five observations. Here for your enjoyment:

1) Right off the bat, Bell was open under the basket, so Collins slow tossed him a dime that became turnover #1. If Bell took a right foot step to meet the ball, he would have the pass in hand for a dunk, having blocked the defender’s access to the ball. If you don’t seal off D, it can leak around to tip or steal.

2) Early on, we again had a couple silly fouls, one on a deep two as time expired, and an offensive moving screen foul on Bell. Contesting frantic shots are nono if you cannot elevate straight up; it is better to get in great position for the rebound over giving up a bailout foul. In like manner, don’t extend or move hands, feet, knees or butt after you set.

3) Ford said we were going to play faster, and we are picking up 2-4 plays a game where we manage a break really well. Tonight Collins had a brilliant one step dribble and pass again to the release man following a missed three. He also had an assist to Jimerson for a three from bandland(sigh.) Freshmen Also, he is really, really right hand dominant. Teams with strong speedy guards are going to start forcing him left with his left hand.

4) While Belmont wrote a treatise on how to cover and totally negate Jimerson from 3 pt land, he added to his scoring repertoire by twice doing seam cuts for baskets in the lane. Hopefully Hargrove and Perkins watch this film, because they both need this skill in their kit bag.

5) When Belmont was showing their fatigue mid late in the second half, Ford threw his junkyard defense on the court, and they started hound dogging the B guards. It didn’t initially work, but it turned the tide in the end. We had roadrunners, and they were the overwhelmed coyotes. French says
Beep beep.

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My 5: 

1) we won. Belmont's not SH but they ain't chopped liver. 

2) Learning game for Yuri. He'll get it 'cause he wants it. 

3) Has played the game of his career. 

4.) We made it ugly because we focused on D and boards. Toughness? I guess so. 

5) Do we know how to set any screens? Jimmerson and Perkins are on their own until we do. That ain't good. 

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1 minute ago, slu72 said:

 

5) Do we know how to set any screens? Jimmerson and Perkins are on their own until we do. That ain't good. 

Bell set a great one tonight, but then got called for the foul when he ran the guy over right after it. The screen was good, he just decided to go straight through the guy after he hit the screen,

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1 minute ago, brianstl said:

Bell set a great one tonight, but then got called for the foul when he ran the guy over right after it. The screen was good, he just decided to go straight through the guy after he hit the screen,

One! Did you see many more? I didn't. 

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6 minutes ago, slu72 said:

One! Did you see many more? I didn't. 

I wasn’t trying to imply we set a bunch of quality screens tonight.

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2 minutes ago, SLU_Nick said:

Did we confirm that Thatch is still sick?

Didn’t see anything but he wore the I am sick tee shirt under his jersey. 

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Has was amazing. I told my son that he probably just witnessed the best individual performance he will ever see in a D1 basketball game. 
 

I also observed that Gibson’s, and to a lesser extent, Weaver’s presence on the wing has created the spacing that enabled Has to dominant the paint. 

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7 minutes ago, davidnark said:

Has was amazing. I told my son that he probably just witnessed the best individual performance he will ever see in a D1 basketball game. 
 

I also observed that Gibson’s, and to a lesser extent, Weaver’s presence on the wing has created the spacing that enabled Has to dominant the paint. 

That’s a great observation about the spacing. I was telling my friend tonight before the game i expected Gibson to struggle because he’s now part of the scout and they’ll be watching for him and he won’t get any open looks. 

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Has's game is all the more remarkable when you consider he had one of his worst efforts up to about the 14 minute mark in the first half.  2 TOs, 3 misses, foul on a deep 2, contributed to two more TOs, wasn't running down the court.  He dominated the 2nd half like nothing I have ever seen.  His double spin move was one of the best plays by a Billiken I have ever witnessed.  This game is right there with Bonner vs Loyola (I was there with about 900 other people) and Larry against Marquette as the best individual performances I have witnessed.  Has also held his man to 1-9 shooting, he had been over 60% from the field prior to this game.

 

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10 minutes ago, kshoe said:

That’s a great observation about the spacing. I was telling my friend tonight before the game i expected Gibson to struggle because he’s now part of the scout and they’ll be watching for him and he won’t get any open looks. 

Gibby Perkins and weaver need to play more. That means less minutes for jacobs and Thatch but I’ll take it 

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8 minutes ago, RiseAndGrind said:

Gibby Perkins and weaver need to play more. That means less minutes for jacobs and Thatch but I’ll take it 

Gibson at 30+ seems fine. I completely agree with Weaver needing an increase in minutes. 

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12 minutes ago, RiseAndGrind said:

Gibby Perkins and weaver need to play more. That means less minutes for jacobs and Thatch but I’ll take it 

I'll give you Gibson but not Perkins or Weaver.  Weaver is a spot up shooter on offense, he can do nothing else.  Perkins ruins as many plays as he executes.  He takes too many plays off.

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18 minutes ago, thetorch said:

I'll give you Gibson but not Perkins or Weaver.  Weaver is a spot up shooter on offense, he can do nothing else.  Perkins ruins as many plays as he executes.  He takes too many plays off.

Perkins had 10 points in just 15 minutes. 

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21 minutes ago, thetorch said:

I'll give you Gibson but not Perkins or Weaver.  Weaver is a spot up shooter on offense, he can do nothing else.  Perkins ruins as many plays as he executes.  He takes too many plays off.

Disagree on Perkins. 

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3 minutes ago, BIG BILL FAN said:

Perkins had 10 points in just 15 minutes. 

That is fine.  His usage rate is really high.  If he gets the ball he shoots it.  He missed 2 wide open 3s and another couple mid range shots.  When he doesn't have the ball he pretty much walks off the court.  His defense comes and goes.  He doesn't play team ball yet, I think we play worse with him on the floor.  If Thatch wasn't so bad I doubt Perkins plays much.

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16 minutes ago, thetorch said:

That is fine.  His usage rate is really high.  If he gets the ball he shoots it.  He missed 2 wide open 3s and another couple mid range shots.  When he doesn't have the ball he pretty much walks off the court.  His defense comes and goes.  He doesn't play team ball yet, I think we play worse with him on the floor.  If Thatch wasn't so bad I doubt Perkins plays much.

Disagree with the notion we play worse. He was a key part of the group that got us back into spitting distance of SHU. I thought he was effective again tonight and a net positive. 

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https://slubillikens.com/sports/mens-basketball/stats/2019-20?path=mbball

Individual stats to date.

If you think Perkins has been productive, your eyes are deceiving you. For example we all feel like Fred Thatch is shooting poorly. Perkins is shooting almost exactly the same plus he commits more fouls per minute than anyone on the team besides Bell. He takes more shots per minute than Goodwin or French with his .341 from the field and .188 from 3. He's taken the 3rd most 3's on the team despite being 7th in minutes and 6th among guards/forwards. He literally shoots 3's at a higher rate than everyone on the team except Jimerson and he's not far off from him. Jimerson shoots a 3 every 4 min 54 seconds. Perkins every 5 min 15 seconds, however Jimerson hits 41% not 19%.

 

Perkins takes the most shots at 1 every 2:03 @ 34%

French every 2:24 / 53%

Goodwin every 2:33 / 53%

Jimerson every 3:16 / 49%

Thatch every 3:23 / 35%

Hankton every 3:44 / 36%

Jacobs every 4:26 / 47%

Weaver every 5:15 / 53%

Yuri every 5:45 / 37%

Bell every 6:16 / 36% 

That's everyone averaging over 10 min per game. It's ludicrous that Perkins shoots more often per minute than French, Goodwin, Jimerson, or Jacobs, and by the looks of it Weaver

 

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French’s double spin move was every bit as get off you azz exciting as Hughes baseline spin move he dropped on Wardle in the Marquette game.

The mere threat that two wing 3 pt shooters provide force the D to stay within two steps of their shooter. If we had another forward that had the same seam recognition that Goodwin and Jimerson have, French could pick up dimes. Without this player, French is capable of putting on dribble drive clinics, most often to his right.

Perkins game is not 3 pt land, it is from the lane elbows to the basket, and getting brush picks in the rinse circle motion for Jimerson and Weaver. I’m sure Ford is working the pgs towards having an option to either pass to French on one high elbow for a give and go/drive, or Perkins on the opposing elbow for the pop.

Perkins on D is a significant project - he was a top five scorer in juco because he exerted minimal effort on D. His default habit on both ends is to glide and conserve energy, and then show a little burst on O and rack up another basket. In one sense, he has even more work on his game than Bell, as his tendencies are deeply rooted rather than just forming.

Just like Bell, he has to get minutes to aid his development and improvement. Both their play times will reflect how well they are picking up needed skills.

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1 hour ago, Sheltiedave said:

French’s double spin move was every bit as get off you azz exciting as Hughes baseline spin move he dropped on Wardle in the Marquette game.

The mere threat that two wing 3 pt shooters provide force the D to stay within two steps of their shooter. If we had another forward that had the same seam recognition that Goodwin and Jimerson have, French could pick up dimes. Without this player, French is capable of putting on dribble drive clinics, most often to his right.

Perkins game is not 3 pt land, it is from the lane elbows to the basket, and getting brush picks in the rinse circle motion for Jimerson and Weaver. I’m sure Ford is working the pgs towards having an option to either pass to French on one high elbow for a give and go/drive, or Perkins on the opposing elbow for the pop.

Perkins on D is a significant project - he was a top five scorer in juco because he exerted minimal effort on D. His default habit on both ends is to glide and conserve energy, and then show a little burst on O and rack up another basket. In one sense, he has even more work on his game than Bell, as his tendencies are deeply rooted rather than just forming.

Just like Bell, he has to get minutes to aid his development and improvement. Both their play times will reflect how well they are picking up needed skills.

I keep hearing how inconsistent Perkins D is but upon closer inspection, his man rarely scores on him.  I think people look at Perkins' gliding style and jump to conclusions about his effectiveness on defense.  The only thing I would change about how he plays is to stop jacking up so many threes, which I suspect he's doing because he's been told a long two is a bad shot.  But a long two is good percentage shot for him.

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Ther are Two elements that need a little follow up with Collins.

First, he needs to start incorporating his left hand more, and setting up operations on the left side as well as the right side. Changing attack angles within a single possession makes a defense work > twice as hard, as the bigs have to rotate which side to front or body French, and the guards have to track fresh 3 pt shooters cross court.

Second, in order for Collins to be effective within a beautiful game concept, he needs 3-5 good double screens a game, while the screeners roll after a good pick. The guards rolling to the basket are moot outside of Goodwin and Jimerson, while French is dynamite.

Collins is strong enough to get a shoulder past his man on a static pick, and skilled enough to drop an over the top, chest pass or bounce pass into the lane. All the plays currently are inside rolls to French, compared to the outside cut that Goodwin worked with Jacobs in an earlier game. Creating inside and outside rolls and cut curls inside the paint will ease Collins’ playmaking burden.

With our less dominant physical players, getting these motion screens and picks added to their game will be critical as the season progresses. There is little more tiring then having to dodge three sets of screens a possession, only to have your man score with a easy bucket.

3 star, I haven’t really tracked who Perkins gets tagged with on D, but my impression is he is mainly covering the third option so far. I have noticed he has become much more aggressive jumping a pick switch, to his credit. Jumping out hard and overplaying the guard forces a pass, which is highly preferred against most teams.

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8 hours ago, moytoy12 said:

Disagree with the notion we play worse. He was a key part of the group that got us back into spitting distance of SHU. I thought he was effective again tonight and a net positive. 

I agree without the disagreement. Perkins is an offensive threat.  He is still adjusting and shots will start falling more.  His defense is getting better.  He had three plays within the offense that he scores because of his agility and adeptness.  1)  Yuri fires a pass at his feat, he short hops it and puts it in,  2) French had a nice assist to him but the pass was a bullet, not even a bobble, and the last one a drive to the left of the lane bodied up by his defender and shoved still had the body control to get the ball upon the glass and in.  Should have been an And One !!

He needs to play with defensive intensity but I think he is improving..

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Perkins might not be in the best defensive stance all the time, but if they guy he is guarding isn’t torching us or everyone is being forced to help him on defense, then it can’t be all the bad.

I prefer players like Perkins in the game looking to attack as opposed to the offense of last year where we pass the ball around the arc hoping that a miracle lay up will materialize.

We need Thatch to step up.  I thought there was no way we’d beat Belmont without Fred playing major minutes.

what a great win 

 

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Belmont is a veteran team that is very well coached, which showed with their stout defense on Collins. They Read his book thoroughly, and adeptly jumped his available passing lanes to create turnovers.

We can rant and rage about the poor game Collins played. Take a look back to the last season where we had to play rookies this much time, with Claggett, Highmark, Winfield, etc. What were we, 5-26 at the end of the season? What are we now, 6-1 and have played two team that will play in the dance, if without catastrophic circumstances.

Like it or not, Collins turbocharges our team in a vital fashion. When our rookies finally learn off ball screens and effective motion, the combination of speed, motion, 3 pt threats, power in the paint, and offensive rebounds can negate our  lack of height against most teams.

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