Five observations from the Seton Hall woodshed

[Bills_06]

6 minutes ago, jonny karate said:

Yesterday was the place to be in st louis. Wish we had a more competitive score. Better free throw % would have done it. Hope it did not scare the new folks away. Colton parayko was there! 

Is he dating somebody that goes to SLU or does he have some other connection?  I saw a picture on twitter he was at a SLU women's volleyball game and he was the player last year when we made the tournament that was wearing a SLU hat before the Blues game.  

[wgstl]

17 minutes ago, Bills_06 said:

Is he dating somebody that goes to SLU or does he have some other connection?  I saw a picture on twitter he was at a SLU women's volleyball game and he was the player last year when we made the tournament that was wearing a SLU hat before the Blues game.  

He’s just a big fan of sports. He goes to a handful of mizzou football games Too

[SLU_Nick]

I am not sure why Thatch did not draw Powell on defense and Ford assigned Powell to Yuri.  That probably wasnt the initial plan but then when we needed offense, it was forced to happen.

After the opening 6 minute blitz, it all sort of felt like a loose scrimmage to me...not unlike how we toyed with FGCU.

I agree with @billiken_roy that there is really nothing to take away from this game.  

French getting his empty stats (14, 10, 5 blocks) and Jimmer getting 12 points on 50% from three should be basically ignored because Seton Hall was just running out the clock.

Also those who lament our free throw shooting and blame Ford as the architect of the systematic failure should look at the box score. It is almost all French hovering at 30%.  That is just so terrible.  No one on here seems that mad because we were supposed to lose.

I don't look forward to the day where a savvy coach puts French on the line over and over and forces empty possessions for us.  Pitt did it last year if I remember correctly...I would think a team with inferior talent to us would employ that sometime this season.  

 

 

[moytoy12]

3 minutes ago, SLU_Nick said:

 

I agree with @billiken_roy that there is really nothing to take away from this game.  

 

The one thing I'm taking away from the game is the improved play from Jimmy Bell and not all of that was in garbage time. In fact, he performed well when we were theoretically still in the game.  I think this game will give him a lot of confidence going forward.  

[wgstl]

8 minutes ago, SLU_Nick said:

and Jimmer getting 12 points on 50% from three should be basically ignored because Seton Hall was just running out the clock

 

 

I don’t think it’s fair to criticize Jimersons shooting on this. 50% from 3, open or contested is big.

[wgstl]

6 minutes ago, moytoy12 said:

The one thing I'm taking away from the game is the improved play from Jimmy Bell and not all of that was in garbage time. In fact, he performed well when we were theoretically still in the game.  I think this game will give him a lot of confidence going forward.  

+100

 

If jimmy had any game to have a valid excuse for it was this game, but he didn’t shy away. 

[HoosierPal]

The attendance of 9,611 was the 18th largest crowd at Chaifetz.  I was somewhat disappointed in that number, as the 'internet information' lead me to believe that there were less than 800 tickets available on Friday. This was about 50 attendee's larger than last years crowd against Butler.  We have sold the Jewel out (10,600+) only four times.

[RiseAndGrind]

13 minutes ago, SLU_Nick said:

I am not sure why Thatch did not draw Powell on defense and Ford assigned Powell to Yuri.  That probably wasnt the initial plan but then when we needed offense, it was forced to happen.

After the opening 6 minute blitz, it all sort of felt like a loose scrimmage to me...not unlike how we toyed with FGCU.

I agree with @billiken_roy that there is really nothing to take away from this game.  

French getting his empty stats (14, 10, 5 blocks) and Jimmer getting 12 points on 50% from three should be basically ignored because Seton Hall was just running out the clock.

Also those who lament our free throw shooting and blame Ford as the architect of the systematic failure should look at the box score. It is almost all French hovering at 30%.  That is just so terrible.  No one on here seems that mad because we were supposed to lose.

I don't look forward to the day where a savvy coach puts French on the line over and over and forces empty possessions for us.  Pitt did it last year if I remember correctly...I would think a team with inferior talent to us would employ that sometime this season.  

 

 

Bell missing the first two free throws and then the others missing the front end of 1 and 1s was also brutal. And it’s not just this game. It has just simmered over for me

[slufan13]

Shooting 100 free throws at a time is not really a helpful exercise. That doesn't replicate game situations at all. I mean I guess it probably helps a guy like French who probably needs to go back to the fundamentals, but making like 65 out of 100 free throws is just not going to translate to a game. 

I'm honestly tired of hearing how our guys make free throws in practice. I was assuming it's just a confidence booster for the guys but if you aren't making them in the games, I'm not sure it matters. Yesterday's game wasn't lost at the line but the early misses definitely took us out of it

[wgstl]

1 minute ago, slufan13 said:

Shooting 100 free throws at a time is not really a helpful exercise. That doesn't replicate game situations at all. I mean I guess it probably helps a guy like French who probably needs to go back to the fundamentals, but making like 65 out of 100 free throws is just not going to translate to a game. 

I'm honestly tired of hearing how our guys make free throws in practice. I was assuming it's just a confidence booster for the guys but if you aren't making them in the games, I'm not sure it matters. Yesterday's game wasn't lost at the line but the early misses definitely took us out of it

What worry’s me, and like last year, I see just how bad we struggle on hoops we’re used too.  It’s even more mental to hit these on the road.

[moytoy12]

That second foul on Has was a real momentum changer too.  It was a five point swing just when we looked like we were getting back into the game.  Then add the poor finish of the half and boom, we’re down 15.  

[moytoy12]

If we have to hear about SLU getting beat, I want to hear it from her...

 

[SLU_Nick]

13 minutes ago, wgstl said:

I don’t think it’s fair to criticize Jimersons shooting on this. 50% from 3, open or contested is big.

I am happy he can shoot.  Not meant to criticize at all.  

I am just saying pump the brakes on those wanting to send Thatch to the bench based on the hope that we can just plug Jimmer in and he will hit 4-8 when then pressure is on in a tight game.  

[TheChosenOne]

9 hours ago, ninedollarbeers said:

Nerves got the best of the bills early, and if you get rid of a shaky (at best) first 8 minutes, SHU only outscored SLU 65-63. This doesn't account for garbage time, but with how ugly we all think the Bills were, it's important to see that we stuck around.

I mean they blew us out pretty much the entire game outside of garbage time (they were up 29 at the under 8 timeout). I’m all for moving on since we are a young team still coming together that ran into a juggernaut, but we weren’t competitive yesterday. Hopefully guys gained some valuable experience from it. We will again see how we measure up when we play teams like Belmont, Boston College, Auburn, and Kansas State. I love our team and yesterday doesn’t change that, just a measuring stick that told us we aren’t a Final 4 caliber type team at this point (I assume we all knew that though). To whoever does the schedule, great job scheduling that series, both games were really good tests early in the season.

[HoosierPal]

Several posters have commented that French's stats were 'empty' or 'in garbage time'.  Please fill me in on this.  (I had to leave early.)  If you look at the play by play, both Powell and Mamu were in the game when French scored the bulk of his second points. McKnight was in for most of them.  (Powell was out for 43 seconds.)  Powell, Mamu and French all departed the game for good at the same time, 2:34 left in the second half.  So did Powell and Mamu also pad their stats in garbage time? Collins, Jimerson, Goodwin and Hargrove were in the game for most of this time period I'm focused on.  I trust the posters aren't calling Hargrove's minutes garbage by definition. 

[moytoy12]

Just now, HoosierPal said:

Several posters have commented that French's stats were 'empty' or 'in garbage time'.  Please fill me in on this.  (I had to leave early.)  If you look at the play by play, both Powell and Mamu were in the game when French scored the bulk of his second points. McKnight was in for most of them.  (Powell was out for 43 seconds.)  Powell, Mamu and French all departed the game for good at the same time, 2:34 left in the second half.  So did Powell and Mamu also pad their stats in garbage time? Collins, Jimerson, Goodwin and Hargrove were in the game for most of this time period I'm focused on.  I trust the posters aren't calling Hargrove's minutes garbage by definition. 

SHU had definitely let up in intensity when French scored the bulk of his points. It was really weird that SHU had a theoretically hurt Powell in the game at that point. I mean, if that dude re-injured his ankle with 5 min left when they're up 30ish, I would be one pissed off SHU fan. 

[HoosierPal]

15 minutes ago, moytoy12 said:

SHU had definitely let up in intensity when French scored the bulk of his points. It was really weird that SHU had a theoretically hurt Powell in the game at that point. I mean, if that dude re-injured his ankle with 5 min left when they're up 30ish, I would be one pissed off SHU fan. 

So French was the only one playing with intensity?  Sounds like a good thing to me.  He didn't give up.

[moytoy12]

3 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

So French was the only one playing with intensity?  Sounds like a good thing to me.  He didn't give up.

Honestly, yes. That's how it appeared to me. 

[CBFan]

Some posters think there was nothing to take away from this game I thought there was plenty to take away from this game.

1) This game was lost at the beginning of both halves when Seton Hall scored and we could not.

2) Our team forced the scoring at the post and did not kick out enough to our shooters who have shown the ability to hit 3 point jump shots.

3) I watched French at the shoot around hit almost every free throw, IMO this is a mental thing during games.

4) Going back to the Grawer days the whole team would practice free throws.  The team was in a circle and the player shooting got 1 clap for a miss 2 claps for a made shot.  I wish couch Ford would do something like that for the shoot around.  I think it is harder to make a shot when your peers are watching.

5) SH exposed our weaknesses and I believe enough in our players and coaches that this learning experience will improve our team.  Our coach has shown consistently that he will have our team playing its best in February.

6) After a slow start Jimmy Bell played a lot better and gives me hope he will be the solid contributor we need him to be.

7) French never gave up played hard and I disagree that he was intimidated by a block, on the GDT.  I watched French in the first half constantly attack the basket he just did not score and he did not kick out enough to our shooters.  If the game goes bad then the only thing that I can watch and enjoy is effort.  The whole team never gave up.

 8 We are not getting enough scoring from Perkins, he has got to get better or play Hargrove over him.

9) Our town love Hargrove a big ovation when he came in.

My wife I stood over the tunnel when coaches and the team left the floor.  Coach Ford looked down the whole time visibly upset but we kept yelling encouragement to him.  I am sure the big crowd with a bad result was one of the things bothering him along with the obvious.

My wife and I did our best yelling encouragement to the players as they walked off the court, the players all looked very upset.

[wgstl]

We also can’t have a 7 minute stretch without a point. That will hurt you against anyone, especially a top 15 team. 

[moytoy12]

1 minute ago, CBFan said:

Some posters think there was nothing to take away from this game I thought there was plenty to take away from this game.

1) This game was lost at the beginning of both halves when Seton Hall scored and we could not.

2) Our team forced the scoring at the post and did not kick out enough to our shooters who have shown the ability to hit 3 point jump shots.

3) I watched French at the shoot around hit almost every free throw, IMO this is a mental thing during games.

4) Going back to the Grawer days the whole team would practice free throws.  The team was in a circle and the player shooting got 1 clap for a miss 2 claps for a made shot.  I wish couch Ford would do something like that for the shoot around.  I think it is harder to make a shot when your peers are watching.

5) SH exposed our weaknesses and I believe enough in our players and coaches that this learning experience will improve our team.  Our coach has shown consistently that he will have our team playing its best in February.

6) After a slow start Jimmy Bell played a lot better and gives me hope he will be the solid contributor we need him to be.

7) French never gave up played hard and I disagree that he was intimidated by a block, on the GDT.  I watched French in the first half constantly attack the basket he just did not score and he did not kick out enough to our shooters.  If the game goes bad then the only thing that I can watch and enjoy is effort.  The whole team never gave up.

 8 We are not getting enough scoring from Perkins, he has got to get better or play Hargrove over him.

9) Our town love Hargrove a big ovation when he came in.

My wife I stood over the tunnel when coaches and the team left the floor.  Coach Ford looked down the whole time visibly upset but we kept yelling encouragement to him.  I am sure the big crowd with a bad result was one of the things bothering him along with the obvious.

My wife and I did our best yelling encouragement to the players as they walked off the court, the players all looked very upset.

I thought Perkins was one of our better players on the court in the first half. Although he missed some shots, I thought he was a positive on both ends of the court. He was very calm and didn't seem overwhelmed by the environment. 

[BIG BILL FAN]

33 minutes ago, SLU_Nick said:

I am happy he can shoot.  Not meant to criticize at all.  

I am just saying pump the brakes on those wanting to send Thatch to the bench based on the hope that we can just plug Jimmer in and he will hit 4-8 when then pressure is on in a tight game.  

i like Jimerson's chances of doing that a lot more than Thatch's..... it's about balance on the court and matchups.....i'm not down on Thatch at all, but we can't have a lineup with 4 guys who can't shoot.....

[3star_recruit]

4 minutes ago, CBFan said:

Some posters think there was nothing to take away from this game I thought there was plenty to take away from this game.

1) This game was lost at the beginning of both halves when Seton Hall scored and we could not.

2) Our team forced the scoring at the post and did not kick out enough to our shooters who have shown the ability to hit 3 point jump shots.

3) I watched French at the shoot around hit almost every free throw, IMO this is a mental thing during games.

4) Going back to the Grawer days the whole team would practice free throws.  The team was in a circle and the player shooting got 1 clap for a miss 2 claps for a made shot.  I wish couch Ford would do something like that for the shoot around.  I think it is harder to make a shot when your peers are watching.

5) SH exposed our weaknesses and I believe enough in our players and coaches that this learning experience will improve our team.  Our coach has shown consistently that he will have our team playing its best in February.

6) After a slow start Jimmy Bell played a lot better and gives me hope he will be the solid contributor we need him to be.

7) French never gave up played hard and I disagree that he was intimidated by a block, on the GDT.  I watched French in the first half constantly attack the basket he just did not score and he did not kick out enough to our shooters.  If the game goes bad then the only thing that I can watch and enjoy is effort.  The whole team never gave up.

 8 We are not getting enough scoring from Perkins, he has got to get better or play Hargrove over him.

9) Our town love Hargrove a big ovation when he came in.

My wife I stood over the tunnel when coaches and the team left the floor.  Coach Ford looked down the whole time visibly upset but we kept yelling encouragement to him.  I am sure the big crowd with a bad result was one of the things bothering him along with the obvious.

My wife and I did our best yelling encouragement to the players as they walked off the court, the players all looked very upset.

In a game where Perkins was our leading scorer in the first half before Seton Hall put on the afterburners and put us away, this is a strange observation.  If anything, this game demonstrated Perkins is one of our best players at creating his own offense.

[billiken_roy]

goodwin is now shooting 50% from the floor (and has shot the most shots on the team) 44% from 3 point land (only 3 players have shot more 3's than jordan and none of them have a higher 3 point percentage) and his free throw percentage is at 64% which is 4th best on the team.   maybe jordan soon can be taken out of the "cant shoot" group.  

[HoosierPal]

2 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

goodwin is now shooting 50% from the floor (and has shot the most shots on the team) 44% from 3 point land (only 3 players have shot more 3's than jordan and none of them have a higher 3 point percentage) and his free throw percentage is at 64% which is 4th best on the team.   maybe jordan soon can be taken out of the "cant shoot" group.  

Just stop right now!  We can't have posters putting positive comments on this board.  I'm sure Goodwin's current shooting has nothing to do with Coach Ford working with him, nor any hard work Jordan has put in.  Likely it has everything to do with the scathing post Taj put up after last season.  (Blue font not necessary.)