MLS AND SLU

[wgstl]

12 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

I’ll get on my soapbox and say that low attendance for STLFC is the bleacher seating but I hate bleachers, so.....

Are bleachers in the plans?

[billikenfan05]

26 minutes ago, wgstl said:

Are bleachers in the plans?

Nope, excited about that.

[Box and Won]

13 hours ago, gobillsgo said:

I’d say it’s more about the mediocrity (relative to the competition) of the product. This year so far has been an exception, obviously, with the team in first place. If they can keep it up closer to playoff time, I’d expect bigger crowds. 

To me, it's the fact that they play at Soccer Park.

[Slu let the dogs out?]

19 hours ago, brianstl said:

For those that have been to Craven Cottage, did you go to McBride's?

I was there in 2004 when both McBride and Bocanegra were on the team. I'm guessing it wasn't there quite yet...\

Somewhat related but can you drink in your seats in most of the stadiums? When I was at Craven Cottage, you had to crush your beverage outside of your seat before returning. 

[wgstl]

23 minutes ago, Slu let the dogs out? said:

I was there in 2004 when both McBride and Bocanegra were on the team. I'm guessing it wasn't there quite yet...\

Somewhat related but can you drink in your seats in most of the stadiums? When I was at Craven Cottage, you had to crush your beverage outside of your seat before returning. 

dont think you can.  Pretty sure its a PL rule.  we went in December and my wife is a slow drinker so we were missing some of the match. smh

[Clock_Tower]

We don't yet have our team - but all signs look like expansion is going to include STL, Sacremento and 1 other market -- a total of 30 teams in the US.   As the league grows, game attendance is 20k per game average?, as TV ratings increase, then I assume the league owners will have more money to spend on good players.  I understand that the MLS is not on par with those in England, Italy, Spain, etc. but I, as a casual soccer fan, am reading a diverse view of thoughts on this thread.  I lived through the days when attendance/league appeared to cater to local highschool/college talent, when reliance on ticket sales was shifted upon local CYC soccer teams run by Moms & Dads and the American sports fan laughed at all things soccer and complained of too many unknown foreigners.  No team in STL (or in the MLS) will thrive based upon the same -- all those teams/leagues soon went out of business - even when those teams had success on the field.

No, we appear to be on the verge of something I have not seen in my lifetime -- acceptance and support by the local sports fan and not limited to the soccer die hards.   There simply are not enough soccer die hards to average 20k per game.  The rest of the MLS does not appear to be relying upon CYC team attendance to watch their local high school players.

With all this said, where does the MLS currently rank compared to the better soccer leagues.  And how will further expansion - to 30 teams - affect the MLS?  How many good soccer players are even out there?  Having a hard time believing the supply of good players will be there for 30 US teams while knowing that the best kids around (including locals) jump at any chance they get for the Premier League, the Budesliga, etc

[cheeseman]

46 minutes ago, Clock_Tower said:

We don't yet have our team - but all signs look like expansion is going to include STL, Sacremento and 1 other market -- a total of 30 teams in the US.   As the league grows, game attendance is 20k per game average?, as TV ratings increase, then I assume the league owners will have more money to spend on good players.  I understand that the MLS is not on par with those in England, Italy, Spain, etc. but I, as a casual soccer fan, am reading a diverse view of thoughts on this thread.  I lived through the days when attendance/league appeared to cater to local highschool/college talent, when reliance on ticket sales was shifted upon local CYC soccer teams run by Moms & Dads and the American sports fan laughed at all things soccer and complained of too many unknown foreigners.  No team in STL (or in the MLS) will thrive based upon the same -- all those teams/leagues soon went out of business - even when those teams had success on the field.

No, we appear to be on the verge of something I have not seen in my lifetime -- acceptance and support by the local sports fan and not limited to the soccer die hards.   There simply are not enough soccer die hards to average 20k per game.  The rest of the MLS does not appear to be relying upon CYC team attendance to watch their local high school players.

With all this said, where does the MLS currently rank compared to the better soccer leagues.  And how will further expansion - to 30 teams - affect the MLS?  How many good soccer players are even out there?  Having a hard time believing the supply of good players will be there for 30 US teams while knowing that the best kids around (including locals) jump at any chance they get for the Premier League, the Budesliga, etc

The third team I believe is Austin. 

[Speyburn]

5 minutes ago, cheeseman said:

The third team I believe is Austin. 

https://www.goal.com/en-us/news/mls-expansion-ranking-the-remaining-potential-markets/1r8xo6ok3s4ee1p5ob31e779pf

[Littlebill]

10 minutes ago, cheeseman said:

The third team I believe is Austin. 

that was team #27

[davidnark]

54 minutes ago, Clock_Tower said:

With all this said, where does the MLS currently rank compared to the better soccer leagues.  And how will further expansion - to 30 teams - affect the MLS?  How many good soccer players are even out there?  Having a hard time believing the supply of good players will be there for 30 US teams while knowing that the best kids around (including locals) jump at any chance they get for the Premier League, the Budesliga, etc

Depending upon metrics, the MLS is somewhere between 7 and 15 in the world.  It is around 10 in total revenue, top 10 in average attendance, and somewhere between 10 and 15 in talent.

Expansion will have zero dilution on talent as it is a global market and there are over 30,000 global registered soccer players, so the talent pool is almost limitless. The level of talent will only be limited by MLS salary rules. The US almost certainly has the fastest growing youth talent pool in the world fueled by the increased popularity and growing development academies. Over half the players in MLS are not American or Canadian. 

[wgstl]

2 minutes ago, Littlebill said:

that was team #27

correct, it seems to be PHX, , Vegas(would be awful during summer and an indoor stadium would be just as bad), and Detroit 

[billikenfan05]

2 minutes ago, wgstl said:

correct, it seems to be PHX, , Vegas(would be awful during summer and an indoor stadium would be just as bad), and Detroit 

I don't know, I would have faith Vegas would figure out how to make it cool.

[wgstl]

13 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

I don't know, I would have faith Vegas would figure out how to make it cool.

if anyone could it would be Vegas, but still the idea just sound weird. 

[billikenfan05]

19 minutes ago, wgstl said:

if anyone could it would be Vegas, but still the idea just sound weird. 

Atlanta might as well be inside.

[davidnark]

Austin 27. STL and Sacramento 28 and 29.

30 = TBD. Candidates include Detroit, Phoenix, San Diego, Charlotte, and Raleigh-Durham.  

[HoosierPal]

2 hours ago, davidnark said:

Austin 27. STL and Sacramento 28 and 29.

30 = TBD. Candidates include Detroit, Phoenix, San Diego, Charlotte, and Raleigh-Durham.  

Since you have included some long shots, put Indy on the list.  They all but have funding for a stadium nailed down (City-County has to sign off on a no tax increase funding bill passed by the Indy General Assembly), have two stadium locations being studied, have expanded their ownership group, and lead the USL in attendance.  Three years ago Nashville and Cincy would not have been on a TBD list.  Now they have franchises.  Indy is a long shot, but no longer than some of the other candidates.

https://soccerstadiumdigest.com/2019/04/handicapping-the-next-mls-expansion-round-april-2019-edition/

 

[davidnark]

2 hours ago, HoosierPal said:

Since you have included some long shots, put Indy on the list.  They all but have funding for a stadium nailed down (City-County has to sign off on a no tax increase funding bill passed by the Indy General Assembly), have two stadium locations being studied, have expanded their ownership group, and lead the USL in attendance.  Three years ago Nashville and Cincy would not have been on a TBD list.  Now they have franchises.  Indy is a long shot, but no longer than some of the other candidates.

https://soccerstadiumdigest.com/2019/04/handicapping-the-next-mls-expansion-round-april-2019-edition/

 

Indy's odds are probably as good or better than Charlotte and R-D. The good money is on Phoenix or Detroit. 

[Slu let the dogs out?]

4 minutes ago, davidnark said:

Indy's odds are probably as good or better than Charlotte and R-D. The good money is on Phoenix or Detroit. 

Is Detroit back to building a SSS or are their plans to play at Ford Field still?

[hoppybeer]

1 minute ago, Slu let the dogs out? said:

Is Detroit back to building a SSS or are their plans to play at Ford Field still?

The plan is to play at Ford Field.

[wgstl]

Anybody know if there are plans for additional retail/restaurant/office space in, near, or around the purposed stadium?  Also i cant help but be thrilled for the people at maggie O'briens. 

[hoppybeer]

6 minutes ago, wgstl said:

Anybody know if there are plans for additional retail/restaurant/office space in, near, or around the purposed stadium?  Also i cant help but be thrilled for the people at maggie O'briens. 

Yes, an area for pop up retail stores, restaurants and places to gather before and after the game. With the new aquarium opening this fall, there will hopefully be even more development right in that area.

[Box and Won]

14 minutes ago, wgstl said:

Anybody know if there are plans for additional retail/restaurant/office space in, near, or around the purposed stadium?  Also i cant help but be thrilled for the people at maggie O'briens. 

There has been a vague mention of mixed-use development near the stadium, but no real details as to what it will be and who's doing the developing.  There are plenty of vacant lots north of Market Street.

There are several small projects in the works in and around Downtown West - likely in anticipation of the soccer stadium and the new NGA headquarters.  This one, for example is just a few blocks north of the stadium site:

[Slu let the dogs out?]

4 minutes ago, hoppybeer said:

Yes, an area for pop up retail stores, restaurants and places to gather before and after the game. With the new aquarium opening this fall, there will hopefully be even more development right in that area.

Also a lot of development taking place just west of Jefferson on the eastern portion of Midtown. Pretty soon we will have life stretching form downtown all the way to CWE!

[hoppybeer]

15 minutes ago, Slu let the dogs out? said:

Also a lot of development taking place just west of Jefferson on the eastern portion of Midtown. Pretty soon we will have life stretching form downtown all the way to CWE!

I still remember heading downtown on a weekend day for the first time when i got here in the early 90's. There wasn't anyone wandering around, it seemed like the entire area was abandoned. I always felt like I was in some post apocalyptic movie when I'd have to head downtown for something during the day on the weekends.

I grew up around Memphis and there was always something going on down by the riverfront. Mud Island was always packed full of people, the area between Beale Street and Rendezvous (and the baseball stadium later) would always have people wandering around. Memphis in May always packed downtown full of people as well.

[courtside]

6 hours ago, HoosierPal said:

Since you have included some long shots, put Indy on the list.  They all but have funding for a stadium nailed down (City-County has to sign off on a no tax increase funding bill passed by the Indy General Assembly), have two stadium locations being studied, have expanded their ownership group, and lead the USL in attendance.  Three years ago Nashville and Cincy would not have been on a TBD list.  Now they have franchises.  Indy is a long shot, but no longer than some of the other candidates.

https://soccerstadiumdigest.com/2019/04/handicapping-the-next-mls-expansion-round-april-2019-edition/

 

Billionaire money plus connections plus people skills equals team.

Example: Nashville

Nashville started a 4th tier team about a half dozen years ago. Eventually two local businessmen/politicians led the community charge to get an MLS team. 

Things changed in a big way when local billionaire John Ingram joined the project. He is well liked in those circles, understated, has sports experience. He moved quickly and he put up his money right away.  

The two guys that recruited Ingram, and led the Nashville group to get an MLS team, were the United States Ambassador to Japan, Bill Hagerty, and Will Alexander son of U.S. Senator from Tennessee Lamar Alexander.  Hagerty and Alexander sought out advice and connections to get an MLS team.  (Hagerty, Alexander’s dad Lamar, and Ingram, also all have degrees from Vanderbilt and are involved there.)

 MLS commisioner Don Garber worked many years under Paul Tagliabue for the NFL. Tagliabue’s friend and NYU Law classmate is Lamar Alexander, Will’s father. They all worked together getting Nashville’s team. Will Alexander is now Chief Revenue Officer of the Ingram owned Nashville MLS team.