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OT: Ford’s seat getting warm


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31 minutes ago, Clocktoweraccords2004 said:

That was the excuse last year for sit 2 but it’s now the same one for next year. I just don’t want depleted rosters year after year. I am just afraid that we will run into something else “unexpected” next year and that we will ride that out as an excuse for next year. 

Still perplexed me that guys like Malik Yarborough and company would have rather played for Crews than Ford. 

Malik Yarborough? 

He has a great chance of playing in the California penal league and this is the guy you are worried about?

Take a deep breath.

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1 hour ago, dlarry said:

This is asinine. You love what he’s done but want him gone?

People need to step back from the ledge.

 

I may have been overreacting a little bit after the loss but where are we going this season, we really have some stud athletes but can’t seem to run an offense if there lives depended on it. I say we give Ford one more year and if turns out like this one or worst we really have start looking at other options. 

 

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17 minutes ago, BillIkenFan_Dan said:

I may have been overreacting a little bit after the loss but where are we going this season, we really have some stud athletes but can’t seem to run an offense if there lives depended on it. I say we give Ford one more year and if turns out like this one or worst we really have start looking at other options. 

 

We have gifted athletes with subpar skill

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3 hours ago, The Valley Sucks said:

As long as the team makes progress from last year that’s all you can ask. Win more games than you did last year and keep building. Need to win some games and make the NIT that would be a good year and an improvement. 

We finished at 148 in Pomeroy’s rankings last season. We are at 130 right now.

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7 hours ago, Clocktoweraccords2004 said:

These same guys minus Gordon beat Seton Hall, Butler and Oregon State, then won 5 straight in A10 and now are on a 4 game losing streak... something has happened behind the scenes 

 

Gordon left, Jacobs got hurt, Hankton was hurt last night, They are playing with a 7 man rotation.

Bess plays 40 minutes against Duquesne and can’t score the next game.

The lack of depth, which is partly on Ford, is killing this team. They have lost their legs and they can’t recover.

The lack of skill 05 keeps referring to is also catching up to them. They were able to cover it up the beginning of the year but now it’s being exposed.

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When you get into conference, the mounds of tape get deeper and you are scouted better and your tendencies and weaknesses get exposed.  Everyone knows about our lack of skills now and the rest of the season will be zone defenses with overt attention payed to stopping Javon Bess.

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I pray these incoming freshmen are legit offensive threats.  My problem is Thatch, Isabell and Jacobs were all touted as offensive weapons before they put on a uniform. So far, kind of a bust.  It's almost as if we are stressing defense so much that we are robbing them of their offensive talents...idk, I feel lost with this team.  

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1 hour ago, EssEllYou said:

I pray these incoming freshmen are legit offensive threats.  My problem is Thatch, Isabell and Jacobs were all touted as offensive weapons before they put on a uniform. So far, kind of a bust.  It's almost as if we are stressing defense so much that we are robbing them of their offensive talents...idk, I feel lost with this team.  

Pretty much every guard is an offensive weapon in high school.  The question is how do those skills translate in college?  Did they score most of their points in transition in high school?  Off of straight line drives?  That stuff matters.  In college, the vast major of your scoring is going to come in the halfcourt with defenses set up to cut off straight line drives.  So you either need to be a 1) really good perimeter shooter, 2) really good mid-range shooter or a 3) penetrator with a tight handle to be an offensive weapon as a guard at this level.

Thatch is a straight line driver, Jacobs is a straight line driver and Isabell is a penetrator with a sloppy handle.  Thatch has potential to be an effective spot up shooter but I don't think he will ever be an effective jump shooter off the bounce.  Jimerson can spot up and shoot off the dribble.  Yes it's against prep school competition, but unlike those other guys he actually possesses those skills.  He just needs to adjust to the speed of D-1 basketball.

Yuri can penetrate.  He is not a shooter.  His value will be in breaking down his man and attracting a 2nd defender.  Then our drivers will have room to drive.  And he actually knows how to run a fast break so expect a better conversion rate in transition.  Yuri is a surprisingly effective finisher at the rim at 5'10, using the basket as a shield against the defender.  We need at least one other guy on the roster with a similar skill set IMO.  If that guy can shoot from outside even better.

 

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while i like yuri collins, i think you are over pumping what he will accomplish.   that diminitive size will hurt him at the A10 and above level (we care about the above if we expect to make ncaa tourney and win games in multiple rounds).   plus his mediocre at best shooting wont help as well.   he better be on the same outside shooting quest training that i expect goodwin, thatch, and collins on in the offseason.   

right now my confidence on this season and future isnt the best.   we've been robbed of a vision imo.   at least badly fragmented.   i feel horrible for bess that he came here, worked his butt off to make himself a player and wont get a damn thing out of it from a college perspective.   hopefully someone gives him a peek at the next level.  

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30 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

while i like yuri collins, i think you are over pumping what he will accomplish.   that diminitive size will hurt him at the A10 and above level (we care about the above if we expect to make ncaa tourney and win games in multiple rounds).   plus his mediocre at best shooting wont help as well.   he better be on the same outside shooting quest training that i expect goodwin, thatch, and collins on in the offseason.   

I am optimistic about the team's chances for improvement because I think good ballhandling and decision making would do wonders for our offensive spacing.  It will still be up to the guys who are already here plus Perkins and Jimerson to get the ball in the basket.  I agree that Yuri's current level of shooting puts a ceiling on his potential.  But simply breaking down defenses and delivering the ball where it needs to go would make him an upgrade over Isabell.  

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2 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

I am optimistic about the team's chances for improvement because I think good ballhandling and decision making would do wonders for our offensive spacing.  It will still be up to the guys who are already here plus Perkins and Jimerson to get the ball in the basket.  I agree that Yuri's current level of shooting puts a ceiling on his potential.  But simply breaking down defenses and delivering the ball where it needs to go would make him an upgrade over Isabell.  

I agree collins will be a point guard upgrade over isabell.  

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Free throw shooting is the last thing we need to worry about fixing offensively. It isn’t costing us as many points as turnovers and not having a decent FG% are.  

We shoot what an average free throw shooting team shoots (right around 71%) yesterday from the line yesterday we add 5 points. We keep the turnovers even, we reduce yesterday’s deficit by over ten. We shoot what an average team does from the 2 and the 3 yesterday we add 7 points. Working on fixing the free throw percentage in practice right now is the least efficient use of resources when it comes to helping the team.

That is why all the moaning about free throw shooting is really starting to piss me off.  It is the least of our problems offensively. It shows an inability of some people to see the big picture of what is wrong with this team presently.

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6 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

I am optimistic about the team's chances for improvement because I think good ballhandling and decision making would do wonders for our offensive spacing.  It will still be up to the guys who are already here plus Perkins and Jimerson to get the ball in the basket.  I agree that Yuri's current level of shooting puts a ceiling on his potential.  But simply breaking down defenses and delivering the ball where it needs to go would make him an upgrade over Isabell.  

Unfortunately Isabell is not a good ballhandler, is not a good defender, and now is not scoring. With 7 healthy bodies he has to play. If you put the incoming freshman with Goodwin and French i think they would have been as good as if not better then what we had playing yesterday.  Bess obviously was not himself.

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Hargrove and Perkins are the slashing forwards that Collins will need as finishers when he penetrates. 

Ford has always wanted athletic combo forwards with significant hops to be his wing scorers. Next year he will have two, plus a stretch shooter. He just needs to find a backup point guard with serious speed, because we routinely are getting beat on back door cuts, and getting beat when guards successfully turn the corner and get a shoulder past our current guards.

We have only been out of one game this year, so I expect our superior defense to continue into next season as well. Thatch and Hankton are both going to get an earful from Ford how to improve themselves over the offseason, and Thatch with 10 lbs added muscle, and Hankton with fifteen added pounds will both be a load for Sophs.

some folks are forgetting our young players were leaders and state champs in high school. I witnessed three national high school champs a couple decades ago, that did not have immediate college success, but had the mental toughness to be college studs their jr and sr years.

Ford has turned turned our recruiting around. Goodwin and French are blue chippers, Thatch is  a development year ahead of Bess at this point, Hankton can handle 10-14 minutes a game at small forward. Next year Perkins, Hargrove, and Collins will all get into the rotation, and I expect Hargrove to be popping above Hankton early into the season.

Ford is getting recruits who can start their fresh year; We no longer have to worry about Vashon Newborne or Virgil Cobbin being our stud.

 

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Hargrove and Perkins are the slashing forwards that Collins will need as finishers when he penetrates. 

Ford has always wanted athletic combo forwards with significant hops to be his wing scorers. Next year he will have two, plus a stretch shooter. He just needs to find a backup point guard with serious speed, because we routinely are getting beat on back door cuts, and getting beat when guards successfully turn the corner and get a shoulder past our current guards.

We have only been out of one game this year, so I expect our superior defense to continue into next season as well. 

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Of course I am optimistic. We desperately need a second point guard in the fold, and two more bigs. Ford his his assts have proven capable of recruiting three and four star recruits, both local and distant. 

We have seen an uptick in the back end of the recruiting classes from the eras of Romar, Soderberg,    Crews, and even majerus. Once the hemorrhaging from the front end of the recruiting/transfer classes ends, we will see the bounce.

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2 hours ago, brianstl said:

Free throw shooting is the last thing we need to worry about fixing offensively. It isn’t costing us as many points as turnovers and not having a decent FG% are.  

We shoot what an average free throw shooting team shoots (right around 71%) yesterday from the line yesterday we add 5 points. We keep the turnovers even, we reduce yesterday’s deficit by over ten. We shoot what an average team does from the 2 and the 3 yesterday we add 7 points. Working on fixing the free throw percentage in practice right now is the least efficient use of resources when it comes to helping the team.

That is why all the moaning about free throw shooting is really starting to piss me off.  It is the least of our problems offensively. It shows an inability of some people to see the big picture of what is wrong with this team presently.

You’re ignoring the free throw problem is pissing me off. Ford said free throws cost us yesterday’s game. It’s not simple math. Missing free throws is a turn over. As I replied to you yesterday it changes the game. Empty possession just like a turnover. It is not the least of our problems. Opposing coaches if they are worth a damn will continue to put French on the line. 

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On ‎2‎/‎2‎/‎2019 at 8:50 PM, Clocktoweraccords2004 said:

That was the excuse last year for sit 2 but it’s now the same one for next year. I just don’t want depleted rosters year after year. I am just afraid that we will run into something else “unexpected” next year and that we will ride that out as an excuse for next year. 

You're right.  Next will not go perfectly.   Not trying to make excuses this year for next year -- but I just still don't believe we will have a full roster again next year.  Again, people truly understand how much S2 hurt this program.

S1 and S2 were similar in that RM lost but got KM back and Ford lost but got JG back.  But unlike S1 where RM lost some lesser/non-starters, we lost our experienced PG (Bishop), our backup PG (Graves) and a proven perimeter shooter (Henriquez).   And why?  If they did anything so bad, they would have been let go immediately in the Fall and/or prosecuted -- but they weren't.  In fact, they were the victims of an administrative hearing conducted by outside experts in the field -- who I understand voted to clear and re-instate them but that SLU's Title IX do gooders then chose not to accept the decision of the outside experts and voted to expel these three (3).  And they expelled them in the Spring -- making it difficult for Ford to replace them --- especially b/c Bishop had experience in that he already played for us, Graves had sat this one (1) year out from Boston College with us and would have been a JR this year and Henriquez had already sat out his year as well and would have been a JR with us last year and a Senior this year. How would JG and our team be different with Bishop and Graves this year.  And with Henriquez and Bess as well.  

Three guys with talent and experience are tough to replace -- hence the gamble Coach Ford took with Isabell and Wiley for this year.   But for S2, Coach Ford doesn't take a chance on these guys.  Next year, we will have much needed help from Yuri, Jimerson, Perkins, Hargrove and more as well - hopefully some bigs.  A the same time, we lose not only Isabell and Wiley but also Bess and Foreman --- some big holes to fill.  Also, more holes unexpectedly appeared with the departure of Santos and Gordon (who were supposed to be returning veterans for us next year as well as Thor.  And the fact that Jacobs isn't playing even though medically cleared and Welmer is again injured and missing another year, also does not bode well.  In short, that's 5 more guys for even a greater recruiter to fill -- and to fill in the Spring.  In short, with no Seniors next year and this many holes in the roster, I just don't we will have a full roster again next year.  

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5 hours ago, willie said:

You’re ignoring the free throw problem is pissing me off. Ford said free throws cost us yesterday’s game. It’s not simple math. Missing free throws is a turn over. As I replied to you yesterday it changes the game. Empty possession just like a turnover. It is not the least of our problems. Opposing coaches if they are worth a damn will continue to put French on the line. 

Missing a shot changes the game. It is an empty procession.  Turning the ball over changes the game even more than a normal empty possession because they often lead to transition opportunities for the other team.

If we were shooting the mean percentage for all D1 teams at the line (70%), we would have 52 extra points on the season.  Add a generous extra 10 points for what you would  get in extra points from missed front ends in a 1and 1 situation, you add 62 extra points for the whole season.  If we shot the mean on both 2 and 3 point shots, the team has a 102 extra points on the season.

Being a bad free throw shooting will cost you a 2 or 3 games over the course of the season. Being a bad shooting team from the floor and turning the ball over at a high rate will cost you a double digit total of games over a year.  We all notice this missed free throws because the nature of the shot focuses you attention on them. As result we tend to give them more weight than they deserve.  You aren’t as focused on the two lay ups and that extra 3 you would have hit in the game if you were an average shooting team, but those 7 points are more than you would get by being an average free throw shooting team.

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