cheeseman Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 18 hours ago, billikenfan05 said: You are taking our words and exaggerating what we're saying. There's nuance to what we're saying that you are overlooking. He's not going to be Rob Loe or Cody Ellis but if he can show the ability and willingness to take jump shots that forces his defender to play closer to him giving him more opportunity to put the ball on the floor. No I am not exaggerating what people are saying. What people are saying is Gordon should shoot more 3s. If he shoots 1 a game and misses then it will accomplish nothing, if he shoots 1 more per game and makes 17% then that also will not accomplish anything. The point is that if Gordon wants to develop his 3 shooting ability then fine but it not realistic that he will do so this year at this point. There are better candidates for this approach and at this point I would be thrilled if he could improve his FTs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyJumpUp Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 16 minutes ago, cheeseman said: No I am not exaggerating what people are saying. What people are saying is Gordon should shoot more 3s. If he shoots 1 a game and misses then it will accomplish nothing, if he shoots 1 more per game and makes 17% then that also will not accomplish anything. The point is that if Gordon wants to develop his 3 shooting ability then fine but it not realistic that he will do so this year at this point. There are better candidates for this approach and at this point I would be thrilled if he could improve his FTs. What if he shoots one more per game and continues to shoot 40%? 0%, 17%, or 40%, won't know until he does it. I also hope he improves his free throw %, along with the rest of his teammates. billikenfan05 likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 1 hour ago, JohnnyJumpUp said: What if he shoots one more per game and continues to shoot 40%? 0%, 17%, or 40%, won't know until he does it. I also hope he improves his free throw %, along with the rest of his teammates. If you shoot a very low % then why would anybody guard you? If he could shoot 40% from the 3 then he would have been shooting 3s. 17% success is not enough to make another team change their defensive approach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierPal Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 He doesn’t have to shoot 21 footers. How about a mid range jumper from the elbow or a 18 ft pick and pop. Hit those and the paint may clean up a little. Right now there is no room for French or room for our drivers to operate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 Hate to be that poster, but .... any news on our actual 2018-19 recruits to talk about over the past few days? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 Hargrove had 18 points, 14 rebounds, 5 blocks, 3 steals, and 1 assist in a win over Althoff. Follow the link in this tweet for a nice little highlight video. ESL plays Rockford East this morning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyJumpUp Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 7 minutes ago, cheeseman said: If you shoot a very low % then why would anybody guard you? If he could shoot 40% from the 3 then he would have been shooting 3s. 17% success is not enough to make another team change their defensive approach. He is shooting 40% from the 3. I know its only on a few shots, but saying "if he could" when he is shooting 40%, makes no sense. I agree, 17% success is not enough to make another team change their D, same with 10%, 5%, 0%. 17% isn't relevant at this point, when he is shooting 40% on the year. What is relevant is that even though he is shooting 40%, it's only on 5 attempts. So I could understand if you say 40% on 5 attempts is not enough to make another team change their D. I don't want him heaving up 5 threes a game or anything like that, but your numbers and point dont make sense with what he's done at SLU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBFan Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 1 minute ago, Pistol said: Hargrove had 18 points, 14 rebounds, 5 blocks, 3 steals, and 1 assist in a win over Althoff. Follow the link in this tweet for a nice little highlight video. ESL plays Rockford East this morning. Thank you Pistol for the good new about Hargrove continued success as the season progresses and getting the thread on topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, JohnnyJumpUp said: He is shooting 40% from the 3. I know its only on a few shots, but saying "if he could" when he is shooting 40%, makes no sense. I agree, 17% success is not enough to make another team change their D, same with 10%, 5%, 0%. 17% isn't relevant at this point, when he is shooting 40% on the year. What is relevant is that even though he is shooting 40%, it's only on 5 attempts. So I could understand if you say 40% on 5 attempts is not enough to make another team change their D. I don't want him heaving up 5 threes a game or anything like that, but your numbers and point dont make sense with what he's done at SLU. We're kind of going around and around in circles here. So if Gordon makes 3 of his next 12 attempts, should he continue shooting them? What's the mininum number of attempts he needs before you're convinced of the efficacy of this strategy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 Finally got some stats on St. Mary's second game in Akron, a loss to Chaminade (CA). Collins had 20, with 7 rebounds, 6 assists, and 3 steals. In a 63-60 loss to New Madrid Central at SIUC yesterday, he had 8 points, 3 rebounds, 6 assists, and 7 steals. He's averaging 20.3 points, 4.3 rebounds, 6.3 assists, and 4.0 steals through his first 3 games. He's lost his shooting form a bit after the first game (33 points) and is at a slashline of .444/.267/.567. St. Mary's will play Cairo at SIUC today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 14 minutes ago, CBFan said: Thank you Pistol for the good new about Hargrove continued success as the season progresses and getting the thread on topic. I'm not here to play traffic cop. Just don't have a strong opinion on the sub-topic and am keeping up with the recruits' seasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyJumpUp Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 13 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said: We're kind of going around and around in circles here. So if Gordon makes 3 of his next 12 attempts, should he continue shooting them? What's the mininum number of attempts he needs before you're convinced of the efficacy of this strategy? I'm not sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almaman Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 41 minutes ago, HoosierPal said: He doesn’t have to shoot 21 footers. How about a mid range jumper from the elbow or a 18 ft pick and pop. Hit those and the paint may clean up a little. Right now there is no room for French or room for our drivers to operate. 18 footers get you on the bench if I'm coaching. only if shot clock is expiring should anyone launch on from just inside 3 point line. SLU_Lax likes this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierPal Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 1 minute ago, almaman said: 18 footers get you on the bench if I'm coaching. only if shot clock is expiring should anyone launch on from just inside 3 point line. Well coach I’ll take 2 points over 0 any day. Would 17 footer make you feel better? That’s 4 feet in front of the line. And you missed my point. It doesn’t have to be a three pointer. I’m looking at ways to get the paint unclogged. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almaman Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 Way hip to the 2 is better than 0 just saying the reason 3s are 3s is because they are harder to make because farther away. If one shoots from 18 or 17 feet they score as much as a dunk. so distance wise it stands to reason the 18' shot is worse one can make in terms of likely results. If we had someone who was 75% then we've pretty much solved all our issues and are tournament bound. Anyone watching so far this year knows how off that is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlebill Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 5 minutes ago, HoosierPal said: Well coach I’ll take 2 points over 0 any day. Would 17 footer make you feel better? That’s 4 feet in front of the line. And you missed my point. It doesn’t have to be a three pointer. I’m looking at ways to get the paint unclogged. I think someone did some research over the last couple years - that the expected points taking 100 17 footers is considerably lower than 100 21 footers. Similar difficulty, you get more points for the other. There's a reason you don't see the Warriors taking many long 2's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almaman Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 42 minutes ago, Littlebill said: There's a reason you don't see the Warriors taking many long 2's Yep they are smart and good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quality Is Job 1 Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 1 hour ago, Pistol said: Finally got some stats on St. Mary's second game in Akron, a loss to Chaminade (CA). Collins had 20, with 7 rebounds, 6 assists, and 3 steals. In a 63-60 loss to New Madrid Central at SIUC yesterday, he had 8 points, 3 rebounds, 6 assists, and 7 steals. He's averaging 20.3 points, 4.3 rebounds, 6.3 assists, and 4.0 steals through his first 3 games. He's lost his shooting form a bit after the first game (33 points) and is at a slashline of .444/.267/.567. St. Mary's will play Cairo at SIUC today. 56.7% free-throw shooting? He'll fit right in. (Sigh.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
almaman Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 18 minutes ago, Quality Is Job 1 said: 56.7% free-throw shooting? He'll fit right in. (Sigh.) ho ho! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 2 hours ago, JohnnyJumpUp said: He is shooting 40% from the 3. I know its only on a few shots, but saying "if he could" when he is shooting 40%, makes no sense. I agree, 17% success is not enough to make another team change their D, same with 10%, 5%, 0%. 17% isn't relevant at this point, when he is shooting 40% on the year. What is relevant is that even though he is shooting 40%, it's only on 5 attempts. So I could understand if you say 40% on 5 attempts is not enough to make another team change their D. I don't want him heaving up 5 threes a game or anything like that, but your numbers and point dont make sense with what he's done at SLU. This way to small of a sample size to draw any intelligent conclusion regarding his ability to consistently hit the 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billikenfan05 Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 11 minutes ago, cheeseman said: This way to small of a sample size to draw any intelligent conclusion regarding his ability to consistently hit the 3. Only one way to get a larger sample size. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierPal Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 2 hours ago, Littlebill said: I think someone did some research over the last couple years - that the expected points taking 100 17 footers is considerably lower than 100 21 footers. Similar difficulty, you get more points for the other. There's a reason you don't see the Warriors taking many long 2's Okay make it a 16 footer. Unclog the lane!! That’s the point. Move bodies out of the lane. Let Bess, Goodwin and Foreman have space to drive. Let French (or Gordon) have a chance to move. Having two to three defenders in the lane hasn’t worked all that well for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyJumpUp Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 49 minutes ago, cheeseman said: This way to small of a sample size to draw any intelligent conclusion regarding his ability to consistently hit the 3. Agreed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 Pet peeve: EVERYONE on Twitter misspells Hargrove's name. It's Terrence, not Terrance. But when searching for the correct name actually leads to less results a lot of the time. Today, there are 9 tweets in the last 2 hours about Terrance Hargrove, and 5 about Terrence, all from the same guy. These are usually press people getting it wrong, too (including Earl). Anyway, he had a big game in a loss. More dunk highlights coming soon. Edit: Hargrove ended up with 28 points, 9 rebounds, 1 assist, 1 block, and 1 steal on 9-22 shooting (0-1 from 3, 10-12 FT). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Box and Won Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 3 hours ago, Pistol said: St. Mary's will play Cairo at SIUC today. I’m amazed that Cairo has enough kids to put a team on the court. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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