MLS 4 the Lou

[MusicCityBilliken]

9 hours ago, davidnark said:

You are just wrong. The top MLS teams would have no problem competing with the EPL teams fighting to avoid relegation. 

Here are some world soccer rankings:

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/global-club-soccer-rankings/

MLS would be probably comfortable being a 2nd tier conference in many of the major soccer countries now. If you followed over the years the MLS rankings have improved each year. Love to see the MLS teams start playing some the Mexican & South American professional teams like they do in Europe.

[Box and Won]

HOW DO WE MAKE PEANUT BUTTER RIVER HAPPEN

[courtside]

9 hours ago, slufanskip said:

I would strongly disagree. I just don't understand not wanting to watch an event unless it's the top players in the world. I love college sports and minor league baseball. If we get an MLS team I'll be a season ticket holder from day 1

First, the important things, the answer to your peanut butter question above is smooth although I will have crunchy too, similar to different pizza styles. (I prefer NYC, but i will have New Haven, Philly, Chicago deep dish and Chicago Tavern style, Stl, etc...many others

To the soccer, a rough comparison may be womens college/pro sports. Some people don’t accept and don’t appreciate the difference between their play and men.  They can both be enjoyed and appreciated in different ways for different reasons.  Some people only watch sports at the highest level of play.  Or they watch what they have been used to for a long time. There are some people who on the opposite end like the underdog and want to be different. That they believe is part of their identity. See some not all “minor” league soccer fans. But all of these groups and other groups or types of fans old and new can be brought into the fold for a nice mix.

Competitive play, nice venue, easy access, good entertainment value, deep owner pockets $, aggressive creative marketing to the different types of fans to welcome all, and an Stl MLS team will do just fine.

[Pistol]

18 hours ago, Box and Won said:

I just looked at Cincinnati's stadium location - looks like an urban renewal site of some sort, but close to Over the Rhine?  I guess they were pretty limited in terms of available building sites.

I like the site for the STL stadium.  Removing the highway ramps at 40 and 20th Street will be great for downtown - hopefully the city will patch the street grid back together when it's all said and done..  Schlafly and Maggie O'Brien's have got to be pretty excited about this.   

Correct. It's just to the west of OTR in a neighborhood cleverly named the West End. The WE has been a pretty dead side of downtown, even as OTR has exploded in popularity (not buying property there when my wife was in law school is a great regret; I could've retired by now). But now it's starting to look to people like a natural extension of that OTR development and gentrification. It's actually fairly densely populated, just mostly low income. So it's going to be an uncomfortable, lengthy transition. I'm also not totally convinced that the people from the lily white exurbs are going to be comfortable driving down to the WE and parking. We've already seen in this thread perceptions of "the city" and "downtown" and how one person's home or place of business or favorite neighborhood is another person's bullet-ridden hellscape. And a lot of people outside the 275 loop here basically lump the stadium site in with downtown and don't like it and that's why they live where they do and rarely come down here. It's one thing to park on a college campus in the city or in a riverfront garage between two stadiums, but another to park in a corner of the city center you never ever visit.

Anyway, it'll be interesting. It's also bittersweet because Nippert Stadium is an A+ venue for this club. I understand that MLS wants soccer-specific stadiums so revenue streams are totally controlled, but man, they've got a great thing going and it's hard to give up. Hard for me, too, since I can walk to FCC games from my house.

I agree with you on the STL site, and also hope they patch the grid back up there because right now it's basically a giant hole.

[Pistol]

23 minutes ago, Box and Won said:

HOW DO WE MAKE PEANUT BUTTER RIVER HAPPEN

The Jimmy Buffett song writes itself. "I got my mug of blue Kool-Aid...with those Mexican ice cubes...floatin' down the peanut butter river..."

[JMM28]

14 hours ago, moytoy12 said:

How much peanut butter fits in the Mississippi River? Your point is nonsensical. 

If how much gold was in Scrooge McDucks vault can be answered (https://www.thebillfold.com/2012/04/how-much-money-you-need-to-realistically-recreate-the-scrooge-mcduck-gold-coin-swim/)  then this can be answered too. 

As to the crunchy or smooth discussion, @courtsidehas a good take. It doesn't have to be one or the other. I enjoy crunchy now and again. Perhaps the best idea for structural integrity would be to cover the river banks and bottoms with crunchy while filling the insides with smooth. The smooth would provide a nice swimming experience, similar to a mud bath at a high end spa. And then you can lick each other off when you're done. It would really unite folks. 

As for MLS vs. better leagues - outside of the 10% of most knowledgeable fans, would anyone really know the difference between MLS, EPL,LL, ESPN, whatever? And I think that could be said for all leagues - the NBA, MLB, NFL, NHL are just well established and more known quantities in this country at this point compared to MLS. 

[moytoy12]

21 minutes ago, JMM28 said:

Perhaps the best idea for structural integrity would be to cover the river banks and bottoms with crunchy while filling the insides with smooth. The smooth would provide a nice swimming experience, similar to a mud bath at a high end spa. And then you can lick each other off when you're done. It would really unite folks. 

This is a solid take. I think we're on to something. 

[Clock_Tower]

4 hours ago, JMM28 said:

As for MLS vs. better leagues - outside of the 10% of most knowledgeable fans, would anyone really know the difference between MLS, EPL,LL, ESPN, whatever? And I think that could be said for all leagues - the NBA, MLB, NFL, NHL are just well established and more known quantities in this country at this point compared to MLS. 

Well that's simply not true.  Yes, the NBA, MLB, NFL and NHL are well established as opposed to the MLS but the NBA, MLB, NFL and NHL continue to have the top talent/athletes in their league whereas the MLS does not - and may never.  

[TJHawk]

I would like to see a USA vs. Bosnia friendly every year here.  

[JMM28]

43 minutes ago, Clock_Tower said:

 Well that's simply not true.  Yes, the NBA, MLB, NFL and NHL are well established as opposed to the MLS but the NBA, MLB, NFL and NHL continue to have the top talent/athletes in their league whereas the MLS does not - and may never.  

They do, but that wasn't my point. My point is outside of the top whatever percent of basketball fans, you could drop the Big Ten, Big 12, and ACC rosters into NBA teams and jerseys and the good majority of people wouldn't notice a difference. 

[milwaukeebill]

56 minutes ago, JMM28 said:

They do, but that wasn't my point. My point is outside of the top whatever percent of basketball fans, you could drop the Big Ten, Big 12, and ACC rosters into NBA teams and jerseys and the good majority of people wouldn't notice a difference. 

I think when they lost by 50 points people would notice.

[JMM28]

9 minutes ago, milwaukeebill said:

I think when they lost by 50 points people would notice.

I am talking about the entire league being replaced by those rosters....

[Major Majerus]

6 hours ago, JMM28 said:

If how much gold was in Scrooge McDucks vault can be answered (https://www.thebillfold.com/2012/04/how-much-money-you-need-to-realistically-recreate-the-scrooge-mcduck-gold-coin-swim/)  then this can be answered too. 

As to the crunchy or smooth discussion, @courtsidehas a good take. It doesn't have to be one or the other. I enjoy crunchy now and again. Perhaps the best idea for structural integrity would be to cover the river banks and bottoms with crunchy while filling the insides with smooth. The smooth would provide a nice swimming experience, similar to a mud bath at a high end spa. And then you can lick each other off when you're done. It would really unite folks. 

As for MLS vs. better leagues - outside of the 10% of most knowledgeable fans, would anyone really know the difference between MLS, EPL,LL, ESPN, whatever? And I think that could be said for all leagues - the NBA, MLB, NFL, NHL are just well established and more known quantities in this country at this point compared to MLS. 

Another Scrooge McDuck fan!  I still have my comics from the 50's!

[davidnark]

19 hours ago, tarheelbilliken said:

Here are some world soccer rankings:

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/global-club-soccer-rankings/

MLS would be probably comfortable being a 2nd tier conference in many of the major soccer countries now. If you followed over the years the MLS rankings have improved each year. Love to see the MLS teams start playing some the Mexican & South American professional teams like they do in Europe.

I love 5-38, and what they do with sports metrics, but this makes no sense. How can you possible try to objectively compare clubs in China with clubs in Europe, North America, and South America. There is no way Atlanta United is 100 spots below Guangzhou in China, who I have seen play. You really need common benchmarks in competitive matches to do comparisons, which don't exist.

[MusicCityBilliken]

16 minutes ago, davidnark said:

I love 5-38, and what they do with sports metrics, but this makes no sense. How can you possible try to objectively compare clubs in China with clubs in Europe, North America, and South America. There is no way Atlanta United is 100 spots below Guangzhou in China, who I have seen play. You really need common benchmarks in competitive matches to do comparisons, which don't exist.

I agree with that & as I suggested have inter-league play with other Latin American clubs as a start. They do it in Europe with the UEFA cup. Did you catch the MLS All-Star game with Juventus (globally rated 5th)? MLS held its own with a 1-1 tie. Don't know how serious Juventus took it.  Actually I like the MLS and caught the Atlanta United fever, problem is it's a hot ticket and refuse to pay over $70 or $140 if I take the wife for a game.

[wgstl]

53 minutes ago, davidnark said:

I love 5-38, and what they do with sports metrics, but this makes no sense. How can you possible try to objectively compare clubs in China with clubs in Europe, North America, and South America. There is no way Atlanta United is 100 spots below Guangzhou in China, who I have seen play. You really need common benchmarks in competitive matches to do comparisons, which don't exist.

All I know is we're sitting pretty at #1

[cheeseman]

Not to throw water on this parade but San Diego's upcoming vote I just discovered is only to approve the sale of Qualcom Stadium - no tax is part of it.  Since the Chargers left the city is stuck with the stadium.  SDS wants the property - now do they have the money to buy it I don't know.  The stadium is not in an urban setting but before we get to excited neither would be Las Vegas.  With two mid western expansions already in the book will the MLS want to give another one to the mid west or keep the next two out west?  Just wondering that is all.

[slufan13]

My guess is that if St Louis has a viable plan for a team, the MLS will find a way to get them one (expansion, relocation, break their own rules, whatever)

[cheeseman]

30 minutes ago, slufan13 said:

My guess is that if St Louis has a viable plan for a team, the MLS will find a way to get them one (expansion, relocation, break their own rules, whatever)

I hope you are correct but I do think we need to be a bit more cautious and keep an eye on what is happening elsewhere.

[wgstl]

45 minutes ago, slufan13 said:

My guess is that if St Louis has a viable plan for a team, the MLS will find a way to get them one (expansion, relocation, break their own rules, whatever)

This is pretty much what has been said from the people in the know. 

[HoosierPal]

50 minutes ago, slufan13 said:

My guess is that if St Louis has a viable plan for a team, the MLS will find a way to get them one (expansion, relocation, break their own rules, whatever)

'Dat true.  Yes, the MLS has stated they intend to stop at 28 teams......but they have never said, "Kaput, End of game, No mas".  They have said they will stop at 28, but have not said "forever". 

28 is somewhat arbitrary. The NFL has 32 teams, the NHL 31 teams (likely to be 32 with Seattle) and the NBA 30 teams.  All work in this country. There is no reason that 28 is a magic number.  If the money is there, MLS will expand past 28. 

[RiseAndGrind]

I am very confident that once the Board of Alderman approves the Amusement Tax Rebate & the State approves the tax credits, a team will be announced. MLS will not be the hold up. 

[Littlebill]

48 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

'Dat true.  Yes, the MLS has stated they intend to stop at 28 teams......but they have never said, "Kaput, End of game, No mas".  They have said they will stop at 28, but have not said "forever". 

28 is somewhat arbitrary. The NFL has 32 teams, the NHL 31 teams (likely to be 32 with Seattle) and the NBA 30 teams.  All work in this country. There is no reason that 28 is a magic number.  If the money is there, MLS will expand past 28. 

And the PL and La Liga is at 20, and Bundesliga is at 18. MLS isn’t apples to apples with American sports. If they decide to expand past thirty, IMO it would be for some sort of pro/rel

[wgstl]

1 hour ago, HoosierPal said:

'Dat true.  Yes, the MLS has stated they intend to stop at 28 teams......but they have never said, "Kaput, End of game, No mas".  They have said they will stop at 28, but have not said "forever". 

28 is somewhat arbitrary. The NFL has 32 teams, the NHL 31 teams (likely to be 32 with Seattle) and the NBA 30 teams.  All work in this country. There is no reason that 28 is a magic number.  If the money is there, MLS will expand past 28. 

I know a lot of people arent happy with going past 26 this soon because of the talent pool.  There's still a lack of talent in the MLS and many feel the extra teams dilutes it even more.  I do agree there's a lack of talent, but also bringing in more money should help allow teams to spend more on quality overseas players.

[wgstl]

14 minutes ago, Littlebill said:

And the PL and La Liga is at 20, and Bundesliga is at 18. MLS isn’t apples to apples with American sports. If they decide to expand past thirty, IMO it would be for some sort of pro/rel

One thing to watch is the  USL, not kidding.  Its trend upwards wasn't seen coming.  If it continues the way it has it'll be interesting what the MLS does as to maybe going with relegation.