Santos Withdraws From SLU

[Quality Is Job 1]

1 hour ago, billiken_roy said:

i dont want our bigs camping outside the 3 point line.  they need to be rebounding and putting back misses and defending the lane on defense.    look at that sentence, who is more likely to fit the solution?   welmer or santos?

Even if a big's primary contribution on offense is perimeter shooting, that does nothing to prevent him from being a strong defender in the paint on the other end of the floor.

[billiken_roy]

9 minutes ago, Quality Is Job 1 said:

Even if a big's primary contribution on offense is perimeter shooting, that does nothing to prevent him from being a strong defender in the paint on the other end of the floor.

which is what loe became his senior year and made him a star.....finally.

[slu72]

Time to call in an exorcist and drive the devil out of this program. 

[Billiken Rich]

2 hours ago, cheeseman said:

Just wondering - if it was a grade problem then an indefinite suspension makes sense and his leaving also makes sense if he just doesn't like going to school.  I understand that on 9/21 Ford was gushing about him but could it not me that he did not finish some summer work and everybody thought he would get it done but the time just passed and he didn't.  This reminds me of the Willie thing - he just could not handle school.  Now I do accept that it could be a whole set of other issues but like Pistol said, the kid screwed up somehow and now he is gone as it is suppose to be so lets just move on.

Also, I wonder if Ford was concerned about Santos regarding something and that is why he picked up KC - many thought that was an odd addition given the log jam at the front court at the time.

KC was signed immediately after Jalen Johnson left.  More JJ replacement than Santos, I think.  

 

[Billiken Rich]

3 minutes ago, slu72 said:

Time to call in an exorcist and drive the devil out of this program. 

We need Fr Eugene back or a freaking nun or something......

[ACE]

34 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

jett was good enough going to the basket to get a layup on the new york subway at rush hour.  my memory of loe is a fantastic senior year.   the first three years were pretty frustrating to watch.   and that senior year, my favorite part of loe wasnt the shooting as much as he finally decided to do his part as a big.    ellis best moments was as the greatest charge taker guarding the lane in the history of the world.  

 

 

The presence of Ellis and Loe also freed up Evans to upon up space in the middle without getting double teamed. A stretch big really helps with spacing and creating match-up problems. More driving lanes for Goodwin, Isabell and Thatch. We'll also see these guys post up at times to take advantage of a mismatch.

[cgeldmacher]

1 hour ago, billiken_roy said:

i dont want our bigs camping outside the 3 point line.  they need to be rebounding and putting back misses and defending the lane on defense.    look at that sentence, who is more likely to fit the solution?   welmer or santos?

I agree with what your are saying.  I'd rather have Santos on the team and a healthy Welmer, but isn't what you just described what Majerus did with nearly every one of his teams.  He had one big pounding the inside, and one big out by the three point line.  The outside big opened up the middle of the court for the inside big and vice versa.

[billiken_roy]

7 minutes ago, cgeldmacher said:

I agree with what your are saying.  I'd rather have Santos on the team and a healthy Welmer, but isn't what you just described what Majerus did with nearly every one of his teams.  He had one big pounding the inside, and one big out by the three point line.  The outside big opened up the middle of the court for the inside big and vice versa.

so you are asking me about anything rickma?   that probably wont end well.   i will run from responding. 

[slu72]

57 minutes ago, Billiken Rich said:

KC was signed immediately after Jalen Johnson left.  More JJ replacement than Santos, I think.  

 

More like replacing Mickey Pearson. 

[JettFlight5]

I'm pretty much ambivalent on a "clean program" (for those who knew me a long time ago this is an improvement). I think most people on here want a winning program here, so every snippet of bad news is a little scary (see any number on here preceded by a capital S). 

Coach Ford acted pretty quickly from the facts we have. 

This team will survive and be very good whether Santos is on the roster or not. 

[Old guy]

6 minutes ago, JettFlight5 said:

Coach Ford acted pretty quickly from the facts we have. 

I am pretty sure this means that Ford positively and definitely wants to avoid another Title IX process no matter what. I can only imagine what he is telling the remaining players about this issue. 

And I agree the team will survive this and will be very good. We just will never know what Santos' contribution might have been this year. This is NOT what I wanted or hoped for this year, unfortunately it is what we got.

[Quality Is Job 1]

1 minute ago, Old guy said:

I am pretty sure this means that Ford positively and definitely wants to avoid another Title IX process no matter what. I can only imagine what he is telling the remaining players about this issue. 

And I agree the team will survive this and will be very good. We just will never know what Santos' contribution might have been this year. This is NOT what I wanted or hoped for this year, unfortunately it is what we got.

What the heck!  Why are people jumping to conclusions that Title 9 or any other scandalous activity has anything to do with this!!!

[billikenfan05]

3 minutes ago, Old guy said:

I am pretty sure this means that Ford positively and definitely wants to avoid another Title IX process no matter what. I can only imagine what he is telling the remaining players about this issue. 

And I agree the team will survive this and will be very good. We just will never know what Santos' contribution might have been this year. This is NOT what I wanted or hoped for this year, unfortunately it is what we got.

How do you get that it was a sexual offense from that.

[almaman]

1 hour ago, billiken_roy said:

which is what loe became his senior year and made him a star.....finally.

Still p*ssed RM used Ellis for a few games that first year. 

[majerus mojo]

 

4 hours ago, Pistol said:

I'm also seeing a lot of people starting to get upset with Ford and imply he's losing control or recruiting low-character players. He suspended a guy for breaking a rule. Isn't that how it's supposed to work? Isn't that what shows he's indeed in control? If he did nothing, that's where it becomes a problem. Also, I made the point in the previous paragraph, but no one who has left the program on his watch had a history of bad behavior coming in. None of them publicly came off as bad guys. I'm just not seeing what Ford is doing wrong here.

Good post. Kind of lame to toss this incident into the S2 basket as some sort of referendum on Ford’s recruits — didn’t most of us reach the conclusion that our guys didn’t do anything wrong there? (If you disagree that’s fine.. definitely not a discussion I care to revisit.) Though from an outsider’s prospective, yea this is going to be another blemish. 

Based on TheOne’s reference to whatever Santos did, it sounds like Ford was pretty quick to drop the hammer with the suspension/psuedo-boot? That’s good. 

[Coach314]

1 minute ago, Quality Is Job 1 said:

What the heck!  Why are people jumping to conclusions that Title 9 or any other scandalous activity has anything to do with this!!!

Lol.  Weird how they keep coming back to that.  I was thinking the same thing

[White Pelican]

7 minutes ago, almaman said:

Still p*ssed RM used Ellis for a few games that first year. 

My memory is (and I was there) that he finally became eligible (thank you NCAA, you dicks) in time for the conference season. I would have used him too.

[RUBillsFan]

3 hours ago, ACE said:

You don't think stretch bigs like Loe and Ellis created a lot of driving room for guys like Jett and Mitchell?

 

3 hours ago, billiken_roy said:

jett was good enough going to the basket to get a layup on the new york subway at rush hour.  my memory of loe is a fantastic senior year.   the first three years were pretty frustrating to watch.   and that senior year, my favorite part of loe wasnt the shooting as much as he finally decided to do his part as a big.    ellis best moments was as the greatest charge taker guarding the lane in the history of the world.  

Ellis and Loe being threats to shoot probably did open up driving room for guys like Jett.  However, watch Dwayne Evans in the link below and observe how many times he sets a pick or clears the lane for Jett (Loe did this in a few of the highlights as well - he got much better at it later in his career - which has little to do with his shooting).  Neither Evans nor Jett were really threats to shoot, but they could still play off each other to get Jett space.  DE needs more praise for doing this type of thing that doesn't show up anywhere in the stat sheet.

Edit: I know Loe (and presumably Ellis) played a part in Jett being open as well.  I was more trying to point out / appreciate DE's work in freeing up Jett.  These guys were all doing their part / working as a team and it is easy to miss the individual contributions if you aren't paying attention.

 

Edited September 26, 2018 by RUBillsFan

[billikenfan05]

4 minutes ago, RUBillsFan said:

 

Ellis and Loe being threats to shoot probably did open up driving room for guys like Jett.  However, watch Dwayne Evans in the link below and observe how many times he sets a pick or clears the lane for Jett (Loe did this in a few of the highlights as well - he got much better at it later in his career - which has little to do with his shooting).  Neither Evans nor Jett were really threats to shoot, but they could still play off each other to get Jett space.  DE needs more praise for doing this type of thing that doesn't show up anywhere in the stat sheet.

 

The first play against St. Bona, watch Loe when he recognizes Jett is going to drive. He moves his man as far away from the lane as possible.

[RUBillsFan]

Just now, billikenfan05 said:

The first play against St. Bona, watch Loe when he recognizes Jett is going to drive. He moves his man as far away from the lane as possible.

Good observation.  Those Majerus teams (I realize this was after he passed - they were still his teams) were so good at playing as a team / every player doing his part for the play to work.

It is very easy to focus on Jett in the highlights (he's flashy & so so good) and miss all of actions by the other players that contribute to his scoring.

[ACE]

14 minutes ago, RUBillsFan said:

 

Ellis and Loe being threats to shoot probably did open up driving room for guys like Jett.  However, watch Dwayne Evans in the link below and observe how many times he sets a pick or clears the lane for Jett (Loe did this in a few of the highlights as well - he got much better at it later in his career - which has little to do with his shooting).  Neither Evans nor Jett were really threats to shoot, but they could still play off each other to get Jett space.  DE needs more praise for doing this type of thing that doesn't show up anywhere in the stat sheet.

 

Look at Loe in the first two Jett buckets. First one, Loe come out to the 3-point line for a pick and pop - their big has to respect it so he vacates the lane. Second one, the guy guarding Loe has to account for him at the 3-point line, which opens up the driving lane for Jett.

[Tonka]

3 hours ago, TheOne said:

This.

The Santos loss stings, but it doesn’t burn.  I don’t believe this impacts the teams ability to crack the Top 25 this season, but it could create problems during a potential 2nd round tourney matchup against a Power 5 team with a 6’9+ rock solid big man.  Many in/around the program felt Santos’ combo of quickness/size/strength offered him a chance to play in the NBA.  (Disclaimer: I dont necessarily agree nor disagree with that take).  

Fortunately, the loss takes place at arguably our deepest position.  This will give French and CG the opportunity to really shine here, and be an unstoppable big man duo in the A10. CAG has an immediate opportunity for the big time minutes he was looking for as a Top 10 recruit in the nation.  We’ve known how hard he has been working. Time to show it off baby!

Someone mentioned that there hasn’t been as much support for Santos on social media, etc. as there has been during past incidents of players leaving and/or being removed from the team.  My only comment on that front is that the policy which was broken is one that the team doesn’t have much tolerance for, and the players, staff, and personnel understood and respected the decision to address this problem as swiftly as possible.

The bright side is that this case is isolated and only involved one player.  

 

 

2

SANTOS had a picture of Crews in his locker??? 

[Old guy]

1 hour ago, Quality Is Job 1 said:

What the heck!  Why are people jumping to conclusions that Title 9 or any other scandalous activity has anything to do with this!!!

This is the cause, as posted by Spoon-Balls in the first page of this thread, post #8:

"Posted 19 hours ago

Wonder if it had to do with the DPS email that was sent 3 days ago? 

 

All, 

This afternoon, the St. Louis Metropolitan Police Department notified the University’s Department of Public Safety that a non-SLU student has reported she was sexually assaulted in an on-campus residence during the night of September 22, 2018. The University is launching a response through its Office of Institutional Equity and Diversity, in accordance with institutional policies, and the St. Louis Metropolitan Police Department is investigating. This information is being released in accordance with the federal Jeanne Clery Disclosure of Campus Security Policy and Campus Crime Statistics Act, commonly known as the Clery Act. You can learn more about Clery's requirements at https://clerycenter.org.

 

Also, it was almost exactly a year ago when S2 happened. It appears S3 is right on schedule."

If this is incorrect or does not refer to Santos it is my bad to have made the inference and I apologize

 

[Glorydays2013]

44 minutes ago, Old guy said:

This is the cause, as posted by Spoon-Balls in the first page of this thread, post #8:

"Posted 19 hours ago

Wonder if it had to do with the DPS email that was sent 3 days ago? 

 

All, 

This afternoon, the St. Louis Metropolitan Police Department notified the University’s Department of Public Safety that a non-SLU student has reported she was sexually assaulted in an on-campus residence during the night of September 22, 2018. The University is launching a response through its Office of Institutional Equity and Diversity, in accordance with institutional policies, and the St. Louis Metropolitan Police Department is investigating. This information is being released in accordance with the federal Jeanne Clery Disclosure of Campus Security Policy and Campus Crime Statistics Act, commonly known as the Clery Act. You can learn more about Clery's requirements at https://clerycenter.org.

 

Also, it was almost exactly a year ago when S2 happened. It appears S3 is right on schedule."

If this is incorrect or does not refer to Santos it is my bad to have made the inference and I apologize

 

Jesus old man. Read the previous posts. This is not related. 

The news of this was known to at least the one almost a month ago

[Spoon-Balls]

4 hours ago, TheOne said:

The Santos loss stings, but it doesn’t burn.  I don’t believe this impacts the teams ability to crack the Top 25 this season, but it could create problems during a potential 2nd round tourney matchup against a Power 5 team with a 6’9+ rock solid big man.  Many in/around the program felt Santos’ combo of quickness/size/strength offered him a chance to play in the NBA.  (Disclaimer: I dont necessarily agree nor disagree with that take).  

This is pretty much my main concern with losing Santos. Indeed, a front court of Gordon, French, and Foreman (possibly Welmer) is going to dominate every team on our regular season schedule. But losing Santos puts a damper on our ability to defend against some of the better Power 5 bigs we will inevitably face in the Big Dance. 

Regardless, I have to believe we will still be a top 25 team with this current roster, barring any major injuries. Ford will likely recruit another big man for next year who can eat up some minutes coming off the bench. We already have a great 2019 recruiting class with Hargrove and Collins. Ford will not let this slow the momentum. Looking forward to seeing the boys in action on Friday.