2018/19 Discussion/Optimism Thread

[WVBilliken]

1 hour ago, cheeseman said:

You are right - after 2 years of short benches and no depth at a position the last thing we need is to be redshirting anybody.  

The redshirt can always be lifted in the event of injuries or other reasons.  Not advocating redshirting but of course that is Ford and the player's call.  Let all hope it can be considered next season because that would mean Welmer is healthy and we picked up two more ready play players.

[cheeseman]

6 hours ago, WVBilliken said:

The redshirt can always be lifted in the event of injuries or other reasons.  Not advocating redshirting but of course that is Ford and the player's call.  Let all hope it can be considered next season because that would mean Welmer is healthy and we picked up two more ready play players.

Technically yes the redshirt can be lifted but why would you do that?  All that does is says to the kid, we are going to burn your freshman year just so you can play in half a season because I screwed up as a coach.  No, bad plan.  You redshirt the kid you are not going to lift later in the season.  If Welmer can play then fine but I will believe it when I see it.  Ford could fill out all the remaining schollies but he has already said he will probably carry one over.  Right now we have 9 not counting Welmer who will be eligible to play.  If he can get a grad transfer then that gives us 10 and maybe Welmer.  That leaves us a little thin given that 4 are freshmen and it will take them awhile to get up to speed.  Sorry, any redshirt plan is not really feasible in my opinion.

[gobillsgo]

37 minutes ago, cheeseman said:

Technically yes the redshirt can be lifted but why would you do that?  All that does is says to the kid, we are going to burn your freshman year just so you can play in half a season because I screwed up as a coach.  No, bad plan.  You redshirt the kid you are not going to lift later in the season.  If Welmer can play then fine but I will believe it when I see it.  Ford could fill out all the remaining schollies but he has already said he will probably carry one over.  Right now we have 9 not counting Welmer who will be eligible to play.  If he can get a grad transfer then that gives us 10 and maybe Welmer.  That leaves us a little thin given that 4 are freshmen and it will take them awhile to get up to speed.  Sorry, any redshirt plan is not really feasible in my opinion.

Goodwin, Bess, Johnson, French, Foreman, Santos, Gordon, Thatch, Pearson, Jacobs.   That's 10 without Welmer or a grad transfer.

I agree though, don't redshirt anyone.

 

[Schasz]

Still need to sign at least one if not two who are good shooters from beyond the arc. Seen names of players just need CTF to get at least one.

[Pistol]

2 hours ago, gobillsgo said:

Goodwin, Bess, Johnson, French, Foreman, Santos, Gordon, Thatch, Pearson, Jacobs.   That's 10 without Welmer or a grad transfer.

I agree though, don't redshirt anyone.

This. As of right now, a redshirt isn't even possible. Even once we fill out the roster, I doubt we'll see one, barring injury. Everyone coming in fills a need.

[Pistol]

15 hours ago, brianstl said:

Thatch is going to be one of this most physically ready freshman we have had in this program.  There is no way he is redshirting.  

By the way Thatch was named the SEMO player of the year and POY in Class 4.   This article says he ended up shooting 41% from the 3.  Not sure if that is accurate or not, but he had a dominant season.

http://www.semoball.com/story/2495139.html

I still haven't seen full numbers for his season yet, but based on how many threes he was hitting (Semoball write-ups only listed made threes, not attempts), I knew he was making them at a better clip than in years past. 41% is no small achievement from a guy who was not thought to be a particularly good shooter coming into this season, and a guy who drew the most attention from opposing defenses. Thatch really put in the work. If he's got that tool coming into college, that's big for us.

[RiseAndGrind]

8 minutes ago, Pistol said:

I still haven't seen full numbers for his season yet, but based on how many threes he was hitting (Semoball write-ups only listed made threes, not attempts), I knew he was making them at a better clip than in years past. 41% is no small achievement from a guy who was not thought to be a particularly good shooter coming into this season, and a guy who drew the most attention from opposing defenses. Thatch really put in the work. If he's got that tool coming into college, that's big for us.

Yeah if Thatch is now an outside threat I see no reason he's not a starter. Slide him in between Goodwin and Bess.

Goodwin

Thatch

Bess

Gordon

French

----

Johnson

Foreman

Santos

(Graduate Transfer)

Jacobs

Pearson

(Someone else)

(Welmer?)

[Pistol]

Just now, RiseAndGrind said:

Yeah if Thatch is now an outside threat I see no reason he's not a starter. Slide him in between Goodwin and Bess.

Goodwin

Thatch

Bess

Gordon

French

----

Johnson

Foreman

Santos

(Graduate Transfer)

Jacobs

Pearson

(Someone else)

(Welmer?)

I think it's a little premature to say Thatch is a starter. I don't see that. I look at Goodwin, Bess, French, and Gordon as the only four likely starters at this point, and the fifth is TBD.

[slu72]

One possible solution to improving our perimeter game is hard work over the summer. I recall Adam Morrison, former All American from Gonzaga, saying he improved his 3 pt game by taking about 500 3s  everyday during the offseason. Sounds like overkill but the lesson is clear improvement can be had in the off season. Remember Tommy Lidell worked w/ Brad on his 3 pt shot that one summer and was much improved his SO season. Bess and Goodwin should be working hard on improving their long game this summer. First, since both are pretty good at getting to the rim already adding that outside shot will give them better opportunities at getting to the rim. Also, Ford was pretty good from beyond the arc at KY, so he should be passing along his expertise. That said, I'm still hoping to see us land a Henriquez clone and a backup PG to complete this roster.  

[billiken_roy]

i am curious why so many are not talking about foreman.   i think the second half of the season foreman did a nice job and with continued recovery from his surgery should only get better.   is he going to start?   he might.   more likely will be the first big off the bench but i wouldnt discount his abilities at all.  

[RiseAndGrind]

3 minutes ago, Pistol said:

I think it's a little premature to say Thatch is a starter. I don't see that. I look at Goodwin, Bess, French, and Gordon as the only four likely starters at this point, and the fifth is TBD.

It’s the off-season, recruiting news is slow, and it’s a Friday. Let me believe Thatch has turned into a reliable outside threat while maintaining his overall bulldog attitude! 😁

[slu72]

5 minutes ago, RiseAndGrind said:

Yeah if Thatch is now an outside threat I see no reason he's not a starter. Slide him in between Goodwin and Bess.

Goodwin

Thatch

Bess

Gordon

French

----

Johnson

Foreman

Santos

(Graduate Transfer)

Jacobs

Pearson

(Someone else)

(Welmer?)

As I understood it Pearson was a better 3 pt shooter than Thatch. Maybe that's changed, but I really hope we're not putting all our perimeter eggs into the baskets of two FR. By the way is Pearson 6'8"? If he is and can pop from deep, we've got ourselves the updated version of Harry Rogers. That ain't shabby.

[wgstl]

1 minute ago, billiken_roy said:

i am curious why so many are not talking about foreman.   i think the second half of the season foreman did a nice job and with continued recovery from his surgery should only get better.   is he going to start?   he might.   more likely will be the first big off the bench but i wouldnt discount his abilities at all.  

I may be the biggest Foreman fan out there, but his inconstancy is a big issue. Plus, he needs to be a better rebounder. 

[wgstl]

between Goodwin, Thatch, Johnson, Pearson, Gordon, Santos, and French, I have to think SLU may be one of the best rebounding teams in the country. All could average 6+ boards. 

[Pistol]

5 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

i am curious why so many are not talking about foreman.   i think the second half of the season foreman did a nice job and with continued recovery from his surgery should only get better.   is he going to start?   he might.   more likely will be the first big off the bench but i wouldnt discount his abilities at all.  

I like Foreman coming off the bench for this team. Energy and high-percentage scoring, but too inconsistent and foul-prone, and not a particularly strong rebounder. He's no French or Gordon, either. Maybe we go big and start him alongside those two against certain opponents (or Santos as a 5 with Gordon and French), but I like him in the 6-8 spot of the rotation.

[billiken_roy]

2 minutes ago, wgstl said:

I may be the biggest Foreman fan out there, but his inconstancy is a big issue. Plus, he needs to be a better rebounder. 

i believe foreman was the catalyst to the second half of the season.   no doubt he was inconsistent but some of that might be a result of his redshirt/recovery year off.   he is extremely quick for his size and you wonder if that hip was still in recovery mode, will he get even better?   again, likely not a starter, but i believe he will play a lot.  likely a top 7 in minutes this coming season imo.  

[RiseAndGrind]

Gordon will be First Team All A-10. Discuss. 

[wgstl]

Just now, billiken_roy said:

i believe foreman was the catalyst to the second half of the season.   no doubt he was inconsistent but some of that might be a result of his redshirt/recovery year off.   he is extremely quick for his size and you wonder if that hip was still in recovery mode, will he get even better?   again, likely not a starter, but i believe he will play a lot.  likely a top 7 in minutes this coming season imo.  

As @Pistol said, I love his grandy glaze type role more.  Bring that energy on the court when the defense starts to get tired. 

[billiken_roy]

2 minutes ago, Pistol said:

I like Foreman coming off the bench for this team. Energy and high-percentage scoring, but too inconsistent and foul-prone, and not a particularly strong rebounder. He's no French or Gordon, either. Maybe we go big and start him alongside those two against certain opponents (or Santos as a 5 with Gordon and French), but I like him in the 6-8 spot of the rotation.

some of his rebounding shortness might be a result of typically playing on the point of the 1-3-1 defense that by years end was pretty much our primary defense.  hard to rebound from the top of the key.  

[wgstl]

1 minute ago, billiken_roy said:

some of his rebounding shortness might be a result of typically playing on the point of the 1-3-1 defense that by years end was pretty much our primary defense.  hard to rebound from the top of the key.  

this is true. But not like he was money as an offensive rebounder either. Also seemed like a ton of his fouls came from rebounding. 

[billiken_roy]

2 minutes ago, RiseAndGrind said:

Gordon will be First Team All A-10. Discuss. 

i will be surprised if he is an all A-10 pick.   all freshmen team, better probability.   if he is all A10 that means he is likely the best player on the team all season long.   we have far too many returning players that will likely fill that role this coming season before gordon imo.   after thought, i am also still skittish about gordon's deportment he exhibited his senior year in high school.   better learn to control that before coming to slu.  

[Pistol]

3 minutes ago, slu72 said:

As I understood it Pearson was a better 3 pt shooter than Thatch. Maybe that's changed, but I really hope we're not putting all our perimeter eggs into the baskets of two FR. By the way is Pearson 6'8"? If he is and can pop from deep, we've got ourselves the updated version of Harry Rogers. That ain't shabby.

Pearson is indeed a very good shooter with a ton of range. He is also about 6-8 now; I think he was 6-6 when we started recruiting him. He's looooong, too. He won't be ready for the speed and size of the D-I game immediately, but I remain very high on this kid and his ceiling is one of the few highest on the team. Major, major potential.

Just now, wgstl said:

between Goodwin, Thatch, Johnson, Pearson, Gordon, Santos, and French, I have to think SLU may be one of the best rebounding teams in the country. All could average 6+ boards. 

SLU was 4th in the A10 in rebounding this season with a depleted roster, but I believe this team would've been more like #2 if they played at a faster pace and #1 with a full roster. I don't see anyone in the A10 being a stronger rebounding team in 2018-2019. We didn't really lose much from a rebounding standpoint, and we bring in some excellent rebounders, and not just the bigs. Thatch is one of the best rebounding guards I've seen in HS. Pearson might be 6-8 but isn't a true big, and averaged 11 boards a game. Jacobs is a very good rebounding 2-guard. And we all know what Gordon is capable of. Not to mention Santos becoming eligible and he's got a gigantic frame. We're strong, tough, and physical at every position. I would hate to have to rebound against this team.

[billiken_roy]

2 minutes ago, wgstl said:

this is true. But not like he was money as an offensive rebounder either. Also seemed like a ton of his fouls came from rebounding. 

......as he came running to the basket from the head of the key to try to rebound.  not a great excuse for a foui but if he is late to the rebound opportunity if he is trying he is likely going to be fouling.   my point is choose your poison.   do you want foreman on the point of that agressive 1-3-1 with his height and relative quickness disrupting the opposition guards trying to initiate offense or do you want foreman under the basket waiting for a missed shot?   personally i wonder if his out front defense positioning reduced the opponents number of shots more than what he would have gotten in rebounds.   i'll take foreman and johnson on the point of the defense when they are in the game every time.  

[slu72]

3 minutes ago, Pistol said:

Pearson is indeed a very good shooter with a ton of range. He is also about 6-8 now; I think he was 6-6 when we started recruiting him. He's looooong, too. He won't be ready for the speed and size of the D-I game immediately, but I remain very high on this kid and his ceiling is one of the few highest on the team. Major, major potential.

SLU was 4th in the A10 in rebounding this season with a depleted roster, but I believe this team would've been more like #2 if they played at a faster pace and #1 with a full roster. I don't see anyone in the A10 being a stronger rebounding team in 2018-2019. We didn't really lose much from a rebounding standpoint, and we bring in some excellent rebounders, and not just the bigs. Thatch is one of the best rebounding guards I've seen in HS. Pearson might be 6-8 but isn't a true big, and averaged 11 boards a game. Jacobs is a very good rebounding 2-guard. And we all know what Gordon is capable of. Not to mention Santos becoming eligible and he's got a gigantic frame. We're strong, tough, and physical at every position. I would hate to have to rebound against this team.

To Win: Defend and Rebound- Rick Majerus

[slu72]

4 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

......as he came running to the basket from the head of the key to try to rebound.  not a great excuse for a foui but if he is late to the rebound opportunity if he is trying he is likely going to be fouling.   my point is choose your poison.   do you want foreman on the point of that agressive 1-3-1 with his height and relative quickness disrupting the opposition guards trying to initiate offense or do you want foreman under the basket waiting for a missed shot?   personally i wonder if his out front defense positioning reduced the opponents number of shots more than what he would have gotten in rebounds.   i'll take foreman and johnson on the point of the defense when they are in the game every time.  

I liked the 1-3-1 w/ Foreman at the point. If memory serves, he disrupted a lot of passes and stopped penetration.