Major Development in Men’s college soccer

[Bobby Metzinger]

6 east coast teams will participate in a “spring soccer” slate of games under the guidance of the USMNT and its development wing. 

Would be great to see this move from the east coast 6 to the Midwest next year and include SLU, IU, Akron, Notre Dame, Marquette and Northwestern.

https://www.starsandstripesfc.com/platform/amp/2018/2/8/16989162/us-soccer-2018-spring-mens-college-soccer

[HoosierPal]

Article doesn’t say if the NCAA is endorsing this. Interesting. 

[Clock_Tower]

28 minutes ago, HoosierPal said:

Article doesn’t say if the NCAA is endorsing this. Interesting. 

No.  It sure doesn't.  If I were SLU, I would not only apply 2019 but I would try to schedule games this Spring (against IU, Akron, Notre Dame, Marquette and Northwestern as previously mentioned would be great but, if not, then anyone else).  I don't see the NCAA penalizing these participating schools and therefore these participating schools either have received NCAA approval or the NCAA will tacitly allow the same.  Therefore, once the NCAA allows Spring games for one NCAA school, it has to mean they are allowed for all NCAA schools. 

Coach Kalish:  Just schedule, invite US Soccer to watch and play!!  Production costs cannot be much and revenue might actually be made!!

[BillikenBoy10]

2 minutes ago, Clock_Tower said:

No.  It sure doesn't.  If I were SLU, I would not only apply 2019 but I would try to schedule games this Spring (against IU, Akron, Notre Dame, Marquette and Northwestern as previously mentioned would be great but, if not, then anyone else).  I don't see the NCAA penalizing these participating schools and therefore these participating schools either have received NCAA approval or the NCAA will tacitly allow the same.  Therefore, once the NCAA allows Spring games for one NCAA school, it has to mean they are allowed for all NCAA schools. 

Coach Kalish:  Just schedule, invite US Soccer to watch and play!!  Production costs cannot be much and revenue might actually be made!!

I mean I doubt NCAA can really do anything.  Teams normally play Spring games, but this seems to be a little more organized

[brianstl]

I think this shows at least certain schools are willing to risk having to step away from the NCAA when it comes to soccer.  Division 1 soccer has to go to a set up like this with or without the NCAA if it wants to remain relevant in anyway.

Don't know if we should read anything into Georgetown being the only non ACC in the group.  

[Pistol]

4 minutes ago, brianstl said:

I think this shows at least certain schools are willing to risk having to step away from the NCAA when it comes to soccer.  Division 1 soccer has to go to a set up like this with or without the NCAA if it wants to remain relevant in anyway.

Don't know if we should read anything into Georgetown being the only non ACC in the group.  

This is absolutely true. Soccer needs to go year-round to stay (become?) relevant, among other changes.

[Littlebill]

Soccer already plays games in the spring.  They're more exhibitions, but teams will play a handful of games. That part isn't what is significant - it is that it is associated with US Soccer.

[Bobby Metzinger]

1 hour ago, Littlebill said:

Soccer already plays games in the spring.  They're more exhibitions, but teams will play a handful of games. That part isn't what is significant - it is that it is associated with US Soccer.

Feeder programs/academies. This will be a huge recruiting tool for schools that don’t need any more help recruiting. Hopefully this experiment by US Soccer moves from region to region annually. Would have been better to include Howard than Georgetown as historically Howard has been the DC soccer power. 

Will also help US Soccer scout any of the foreign-born talent that might be coming through the ranks. Perhaps a brilliant soccer/espionage move by Tab Ramos!

[Bills71]

How about asking, Xavier, Butler, Marquette, Villanova, etc, 

or Dayton VCU etc.

[Clock_Tower]

7 hours ago, Littlebill said:

Soccer already plays games in the spring.  They're more exhibitions, but teams will play a handful of games. That part isn't what is significant - it is that it is associated with US Soccer.

Yes and no.   US Soccer is lending its name but not its coaches and facilities.  This will still be regular college soccer (college coaches, players, facilities) but playing with International rules (clock, limited roster and no re-entry).  And a coaching clinic for the college coaches.  Sorry, but I see nothing to indicate these will be any feeder teams or that kids will now want to go to 1 of these 6 schools to be scouted by a US Soccer scout.  The US Soccer scouts are already scouting college teams.  Now, putting together the final matches at Wake Forest will sure make it easier for scouts to see more.

Now, if US Soccer wants to invite the top 216 college soccer players (12 teams with 18 on each team) to US Soccer facilities, have the kids train with the US Soccer coaches, have the US Soccer coaches coach the kids, play alot of games each weekend in the Spring, ... then this would a real US Soccer event.

Back to college soccer, though, it only makes sense to play each Fall and Spring.  Why not? Not sure how great of opportunities the kids have to play after they enroll in college.  The heat of summer is not good for development.  You have high level coaches, players and facilities (D1 soccer) so why not play in the Spring?  Again, everything I have read is that the American soccer player is the best in the world thru age 13 or 14, that the American soccer player starts to lose ground during the high school years and that the American college player who stays all 4 years is well behind the rest of the world.

Unlike football, there is no concern of too many college soccer games and strain/abuse placed upon their bodies/injuries.  Same with baseball.  Why play only a shortened, rainy, cold Spring of baseball.  Play baseball games in the Fall AND Spring to offset the advantage kids have who leave high school and play professionally -- Spring thru Summer and then winter ball if desired. And if academics are still important, seems like college athletes would be better served academically by more evenly spreading their games over both semesters rather than trying to cram a huge schedule of games/practices all in only 1 semester.

[Littlebill]

1 hour ago, Clock_Tower said:

Yes and no.   US Soccer is lending its name but not its coaches and facilities.  This will still be regular college soccer (college coaches, players, facilities) but playing with International rules (clock, limited roster and no re-entry).  And a coaching clinic for the college coaches.  Sorry, but I see nothing to indicate these will be any feeder teams or that kids will now want to go to 1 of these 6 schools to be scouted by a US Soccer scout.  The US Soccer scouts are already scouting college teams.  Now, putting together the final matches at Wake Forest will sure make it easier for scouts to see more.

Now, if US Soccer wants to invite the top 216 college soccer players (12 teams with 18 on each team) to US Soccer facilities, have the kids train with the US Soccer coaches, have the US Soccer coaches coach the kids, play alot of games each weekend in the Spring, ... then this would a real US Soccer event.

Back to college soccer, though, it only makes sense to play each Fall and Spring.  Why not? Not sure how great of opportunities the kids have to play after they enroll in college.  The heat of summer is not good for development.  You have high level coaches, players and facilities (D1 soccer) so why not play in the Spring?  Again, everything I have read is that the American soccer player is the best in the world thru age 13 or 14, that the American soccer player starts to lose ground during the high school years and that the American college player who stays all 4 years is well behind the rest of the world.

Unlike football, there is no concern of too many college soccer games and strain/abuse placed upon their bodies/injuries.  Same with baseball.  Why play only a shortened, rainy, cold Spring of baseball.  Play baseball games in the Fall AND Spring to offset the advantage kids have who leave high school and play professionally -- Spring thru Summer and then winter ball if desired. And if academics are still important, seems like college athletes would be better served academically by more evenly spreading their games over both semesters rather than trying to cram a huge schedule of games/practices all in only 1 semester.

Did you quote the wrong post? Did you not read mine?

[Clock_Tower]

34 minutes ago, Littlebill said:

Did you quote the wrong post? Did you not read mine?

Nope.  Doesn't appear to be very significant.  US Soccer scouts will attend some games?  6 MId Atlantic colleges which are close to each other?  

[William Iken]

18 hours ago, Littlebill said:

Soccer already plays games in the spring.  They're more exhibitions, but teams will play a handful of games. That part isn't what is significant - it is that it is associated with US Soccer.

I don't think much has changed, it may be a way to garner more publicity and to get word out that in the fact the players do play more than 15-20 matches a year. Scouts were always there, if the player was good enough. But the link with US Soccer is interesting and rule changes (experimental) sensible and long overdue. I really hate watching all the subs in college soccer, it ruins the game. And I played it.

[Tilkowsky]

College soccer are getting the scraps of what is left over.

In the last U-20 World Cup 4 of 21 players were playing in college. Of those four two have already gone pro.

Look at Jordan Morris who was probably the last big college star to hit it big. If my memory serves me correct he was left out of the last two match days in World Cup Qualifying.

Players need to go overseas to Europe and skip college and MLS.

 

[BillikenBoy10]

3 minutes ago, Tilkowsky said:

College soccer are getting the scraps of what is left over.

In the last U-20 World Cup 4 of 21 players were playing in college. Of those four two have already gone pro.

Look at Jordan Morris who was probably the last big college star to hit it big. If my memory serves me correct he was left out of the last two match days in World Cup Qualifying.

Players need to go overseas to Europe and skip college and MLS.

 

An MLS hater, you get better each day

[Bobby Metzinger]

1 minute ago, BillikenBoy10 said:

An MLS hater, you get better each day

Wouldn't surprise me if Tilk was an initial shareholder in Big Baller Brand, either. 

 

[Clock_Tower]

4 hours ago, William Iken said:

I don't think much has changed, it may be a way to garner more publicity and to get word out that in the fact the players do play more than 15-20 matches a year. Scouts were always there, if the player was good enough. But the link with US Soccer is interesting and rule changes (experimental) sensible and long overdue. I really hate watching all the subs in college soccer, it ruins the game. And I played it.

How do the college subs ruin the game?

[Tilkowsky]

21 hours ago, Clock_Tower said:

How do the college subs ruin the game?

The pace of play in college soccer is too fast. Players don't learn to pace themselves. Coaches can bring in fresh players halfway through a half.

College soccer needs to go to three substitutions no re-entry.

There would be no need for rosters to be as big as they are. Rosters are too big as currently constructed.

MLS showed the lack of American talent by failing to qualify for the World Cup.

10 of the 14 players (who made it into the game)who failed to beat Trinidad & Tobago's C team were from MLS.

Shows the lack of quality in the American talent in MLS.

The USMNT that failed to qualify was also coached by a former MLS coach.

 

[William Iken]

On 2/10/2018 at 3:22 AM, Clock_Tower said:

How do the college subs ruin the game?

Soccer is a marathon. It becomes a frantic, headless chicken sprint with subs. Less tactical, and strategic, in a lot of ways. Like the DH in baseball. Just changes it. There is something beautiful to seeing one team slowly wear down the opponent to the point of breaking, and it's not seen in the US college game because of the subs. Can switch formations, players, etc too much. Call me a purist.

[William Iken]

On 2/11/2018 at 1:08 AM, Tilkowsky said:

The pace of play in college soccer is too fast. Players don't learn to pace themselves. Coaches can bring in fresh players halfway through a half.

College soccer needs to go to three substitutions no re-entry.

There would be no need for rosters to be as big as they are. Rosters are too big as currently constructed.

MLS showed the lack of American talent by failing to qualify for the World Cup.

10 of the 14 players (who made it into the game)who failed to beat Trinidad & Tobago's C team were from MLS.

Shows the lack of quality in the American talent in MLS.

The USMNT that failed to qualify was also coached by a former MLS coach.

 

I agree with the first few points, but then you had to ruin the post by switching topics to MLS and calling it T&T's "C" team... I don't think you can blame MLS - better quality now than in the past, esp given the US team in the past few WCs was also based on domestic players. And to be clear, I am not even American, do not like the US national team, and therefore have no vested interest in defending the US team. But the leap from college subs to MLS/US WC failings is too great.

[Clock_Tower]

Same argument was made in basketball when Nolan Richardson kept putting out athlete after athlete. Now, VCU and Kentucky and much of the rest of college basketball do the same. It’s now called a deep bench. Basketball is no longer a game of my 5. (Or 6) and your 5 (or 6).  4 fouls on 1 of your equally good centers no longer means anything. 

[Clock_Tower]

Pace yourself means stand and walk a little and not run after every ball right?  Because it’s a tough pace to keep for the whole game right?

Guess middle relievers have ruined the game of baseball as well. Much more fun to watch a pitcher struggle for the whole 9 innings. 

[William Iken]

25 minutes ago, Clock_Tower said:

Pace yourself means stand and walk a little and not run after every ball right?  Because it’s a tough pace to keep for the whole game right?

Guess middle relievers have ruined the game of baseball as well. Much more fun to watch a pitcher struggle for the whole 9 innings. 

No and no. Different views and values, obviously. Strategy and endurance or athleticism. Whatever. Some love indoor soccer, others think it's not even soccer. To each their own.

[Tilkowsky]

1 hour ago, William Iken said:

I agree with the first few points, but then you had to ruin the post by switching topics to MLS and calling it T&T's "C" team... I don't think you can blame MLS - better quality now than in the past, esp given the US team in the past few WCs was also based on domestic players. And to be clear, I am not even American, do not like the US national team, and therefore have no vested interest in defending the US team. But the leap from college subs to MLS/US WC failings is too great.

Without going back and looking at the rosters I would bet that there were more foreign based players in Brazil and South Africa.

Michael Bradley, Tim Howard, Jozy Altidore, Clint Dempsey were all foreign based players in those WC's. 

Dempsey, Altidore, Bradley all got paid (big contracts) yet their playing careers have been in a downward spiral since coming to MLS. Problem is there is no pressure on them to perform in MLS. In Europe there is far more pressure every day for your spot.

Young players in MLS need to go overseas. Look at Weston McKinnie, Josh Sargent (now training with the first team), and of course Christian Pulisic.

There really weren't any young players from MLSthat made an impact during qualifying.

[Glorydays2013]

With the MLS expanding and getting more international, I don't think US soccers best young talent will be going to college anymore. Much better to go abroad and focus on soccer and maybe come back to the MLS later once the money starts pouring in. No more Jordan Morris's, and probably no more Robby Kristos

Sargent turns 18 in week or 2 and is about to sign a multi million dollar deal with Werder. College soccer will be in a slump for sometime until they become more of a developmental academy rather than just a university's D1 team