Recruiting - 2021

[almaman]

1 hour ago, BilliesBy40 said:

Except that’s nowhere near the full list of misses. He also missed in some capacity on Jeremiah Tilmon and Javon Pickett to name a few. Frank’s problem is he gets too excited and tries to break leans and commitments when he has very limited information. He’s a good cheerleader for the problem, but he’s not nearly as plugged in as some believe.

sounds like a lot of us

[billiken_roy]

8 hours ago, BilliesBy40 said:

Except that’s nowhere near the full list of misses. He also missed in some capacity on Jeremiah Tilmon and Javon Pickett to name a few. Frank’s problem is he gets too excited and tries to break leans and commitments when he has very limited information. He’s a good cheerleader for the problem, but he’s not nearly as plugged in as some believe.

the was a brief run at tillmon, but they jumped out of that pretty quick.   i do not think there was a serious run at pickett.  pickett showed more interest in the billikens than the billikens showed in pickett.  

[3star_recruit]

3 hours ago, billiken_roy said:

the was a brief run at tillmon, but they jumped out of that pretty quick.   i do not think there was a serious run at pickett.  pickett showed more interest in the billikens than the billikens showed in pickett.  

Exactly.  When you compare Frank's coverage of those two players vs the "a commitment is imminent" speculation that went on the board, it was wayyyy out of proportion. 

Frank never claimed that Pickett would be a Billiken, just that there was interest and he was on campus for a visit.   The esteemed Glorydays did tell us Pickett was a done deal, though.  And there was at least one poster stalking player tweets to get a read on the situation.

And Frank said that we were among Tilmon's options after he decommitted from Illinois, not that we were the favorite.  Mutual interest was all we needed to hear about a top 40 recruit.  The rest we manufactured ourselves.

 

 

[billiken_roy]

17 minutes ago, 3star_recruit said:

Exactly.  When you compare Frank's coverage of those two players vs the "a commitment is announcement" speculation that went on the board, it was wayyyy out of proportion. 

Frank never claimed that Pickett would be a Billiken, just that there was interest and he was on campus for a visit.   The esteemed Glorydays did tell us Pickett was a done deal, though.  And there was at least one poster stalking player tweets to get a read on the situation.

And Frank said that we were among Tilmon's options after he decommitted from Illinois, not that we were the favorite.  Mutual interest was all we hear needed to hear about a top 40 recruit.  The rest we manufactured ourselves.

 

 

and for the record, imo tillmon is one of the most underachieving players i have ever seen.   and there isnt a single wing on the billikens that is less the player than pickett.   i.e.  he doesnt help this roster had ford truly wanted him.  

[Billiken4life5]

56 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

and for the record, imo tillmon is one of the most underachieving players i have ever seen.   and there isnt a single wing on the billikens that is less the player than pickett.   i.e.  he doesnt help this roster had ford truly wanted him.  

Man did that team Pickett was on at Belleville East underachieve.  Most evident when the PG transferred to West the next year. 

[billiken_roy]

26 minutes ago, Billiken4life5 said:

Man did that team Pickett was on at Belleville East underachieve.  Most evident when the PG transferred to West the next year. 

give credit to the fact that malachi smith moved to west and got to play alongside a 2 time illinois mr basketball.    while at east, smith was a little more the focus of opposing defenses.  

[dlarry]

12 hours ago, BilliesBy40 said:

Agreed. However, Frank is the one who jumps to conclusions. I love the guy, but he needs to know his lane.

I think the Nesbit recruitment shows us how in the loop Frank C. really is.

He heard Nesbit was a good possibly and reported it. All the national guys heard the same thing and it showed in their crystal ball predictions.

Then Frank said it wasn’t looking good anymore and all the crystal ball predictions started to change. 
 

That kind of shows he is getting good info from someone .

[Aquinas]

For what it is worth, Kern is rated as a 3 Star recruit by 247 and Rivals.

[SLU let the dogs out?!]

22 hours ago, 3star_recruit said:

Hits: Goodwin, Gordon, Yuri, Hargrove, Russell

Miss:Nesbitt

5/6

Didn’t Frank the tank also drop the Mike Lewis II news as well?

[SLURadioBoy]

15 minutes ago, SLU let the dogs out?! said:

Didn’t Frank the tank also drop the Mike Lewis II news as well?

Yes, he did. Good memory.

[Aquinas]

With quality depth at every position Ford can be picky.  We missed a high impact freshman in Nesbitt. With the growing transfer market however, Ford can wait and see if our younger players continue to develop. If our season is as good as we expect it to be, SLU will be easier to sell to high school recruits and transfers, especially if we spend time in the top 25. 

[billiken_roy]

it struck me this morning that what if the ncaa grants the extra year of eligibility and ford has already talked to goodwin, french and perkins and any of the three or maybe all three have expressed they may stay?   if so, and he ncaa doesnt allow the rosters to expand, this whole recruiting season might be null.   thoughts?

[3star_recruit]

My sense is that the proposed extra year of eligibility is a contingency if the season does not unfold as expected.  It's not a decision that players have to make now.  In other words, what if we have multiple Covid outbreaks and only play half the scheduled games? Then I suspect there may be players, including some seniors, that want another season since they got cheated out of this one.

If we're a top 25 team and make a deep tournament run, it will be because our seniors have outplayed their higher ranked counterparts on P6 teams.  What better time to leave?

[ACE]

On 10/3/2020 at 2:42 PM, SLU let the dogs out?! said:

Didn’t Frank the tank also drop the Mike Lewis II news as well?

Frank has been very reliable on his info in the Ford era. I suspect Tate is his source. I don't doubt we were in a strong position with Nesbitt. Obviously something changed near the end - Memphis made a strong pitch, perhaps one of his h.s. coach or handlers convinced him Penny was big time. I don't entirely trust those associated with his high school program - seems a bit like a basketball factory.

[bauman]

I don't know the relationship of C Fletcher with Russell and, hopefully Kern, but I just finished reading J Rothstein's SEC analysis and found it interesting that he classified 5 KY Freshmen as impact FR (not CF) and another 5 Conference frosh as potential impact (not sure those are the right terms) and Fletcher was not one of those either.  He might be a player looking to come home if he just sees himself being recruited over every year at UK.

Speaking of players wanting to transfer back to SLU, I would not offer that possibility to Nesbit (sp).  I think Fletcher was honest from the get-go with Ford and Tate.  However, I think Nesbit was playing SLU all along and was far less than honest.  To be quoted at signing day that we were not even in his top two says a lot to me and was a shot at the entire SLU program.  Good luck to him after spending 4 years, not one, at a glorified JUCO with a degree that will be of little value.  I hope he really likes Memphis as his new home.  Ya, I guess I'm a little bitter!

[willie]

I have a rather negative few of all college recruiting. I would like to believe that we are perfectly clean but I don't know that. It would not surprise me that Memphis came in and made his family an offer  they couldn't refuse. 

[RUBillsFan]

2 hours ago, ACE said:

Frank has been very reliable on his info in the Ford era. I suspect Tate is his source. I don't doubt we were in a strong position with Nesbitt. Obviously something changed near the end - Memphis made a strong pitch, perhaps one of his h.s. coach or handlers convinced him Penny was big time. I don't entirely trust those associated with his high school program - seems a bit like a basketball factory.

With no insider knowledge whatsoever that is exactly my 1,000 foot read on what happened here.  Likely Nesbitt's HS coach (or a possibly a parent) pushed him toward Memphis after strong pitch from Penny.

I'm not sure Ford can totally close off recruiting St. Louis Christian, but I'd be much more wary of going hard after STLCA recruits after the way this played out.

[Cowboy]

49 minutes ago, bauman said:

I don't know the relationship of C Fletcher with Russell and, hopefully Kern, but I just finished reading J Rothstein's SEC analysis and found it interesting that he classified 5 KY Freshmen as impact FR (not CF) and another 5 Conference frosh as potential impact (not sure those are the right terms) and Fletcher was not one of those either.  He might be a player looking to come home if he just sees himself being recruited over every year at UK.

Speaking of players wanting to transfer back to SLU, I would not offer that possibility to Nesbit (sp).  I think Fletcher was honest from the get-go with Ford and Tate.  However, I think Nesbit was playing SLU all along and was far less than honest.  To be quoted at signing day that we were not even in his top two says a lot to me and was a shot at the entire SLU program.  Good luck to him after spending 4 years, not one, at a glorified JUCO with a degree that will be of little value.  I hope he really likes Memphis as his new home.  Ya, I guess I'm a little bitter!

-I trust CFord and the staff to know if this was the case or not

-as to Fletcher, given the number of games he attended this past season it would not shock me IF he leaves UK and came to SLU but I hope he has good experience wherever he is

[slu72]

I have always thought that stellar recruits are influenced more by the “status” of schools recruiting them. I compare them to stellar scholars who are hung up on getting into elite schools, ie I go to Harvard carries a certain gravitas vs I go to State U. Same applies to high profile athletes. They want to impress their peers. This may explain why a Tatum chose Duke over SLU. If he chose SLU, he might not get the respect or prestige from his peers. Now, why Nesbitt chose Messphis over UI or even SLU goes against my theory a bit. Messphis ain’t elite. In fact, UI has more cred than the Tigers. So, I’m a little baffled by his choice. If he had gone to a UNC or a UK, it would make sense, but Messphis? It doesn’t jive w/ my peer status theory. 

[3star_recruit]

58 minutes ago, RUBillsFan said:

With no insider knowledge whatsoever that is exactly my 1,000 foot read on what happened here.  Likely Nesbitt's HS coach (or a possibly a parent) pushed him toward Memphis after strong pitch from Penny.

I'm not sure Ford can totally close off recruiting St. Louis Christian, but I'd be much more wary of going hard after STLCA recruits after the way this played out.

This roller coaster is what a mid-major competing for a top 75 recruit typically looks like.  Goodwin and Gordon were aberrations.  If Nesbitt was ranked 250, Penny never would have come sniffing around and this recruitment would have been a lot more straightforward.  

If you want us to sign blue chippers in the future, prepare for the rollercoaster.  It doesn't matter what school they're from.  It's part of the territory.

[3star_recruit]

5 minutes ago, slu72 said:

I have always thought that stellar recruits are influenced more by the “status” of schools recruiting them. I compare them to stellar scholars who are hung up on getting into elite schools, ie I go to Harvard carries a certain gravitas vs I go to State U. Same applies to high profile athletes. They want to impress their peers. This may explain why a Tatum chose Duke over SLU. If he chose SLU, he might not get the respect or prestige from his peers. Now, why Nesbitt chose Messphis over UI or even SLU goes against my theory a bit. Messphis ain’t elite. In fact, UI has more cred than the Tigers. So, I’m a little baffled by his choice. If he had gone to a UNC or a UK, it would make sense, but Messphis? It doesn’t jive w/ my peer status theory. 

Memphis is technically a high mid major but Penny is regarded by media and recruits as a rock star.  

[CBFan]

1 hour ago, Cowboy said:

-I trust CFord and the staff to know if this was the case or not

-as to Fletcher, given the number of games he attended this past season it would not shock me IF he leaves UK and came to SLU but I hope he has good experience wherever he is

I think you can add Nesbitt to that big IF.  Nesbitt might get to see the possibility of Penny running off recruits because there are not enough scholarships and being played over by a 5 star recruit.

Coach Ford will find good players so there won’t be any room for them.

[AnkielBreakers]

Nesbit is an 18 year old kid who changed his mind at the last minute. He probably burned the SLU coaches pretty bad. It is totally reasonable that this would happen, and happens every year hundreds of times. Let’s just move on. Can we get a New commitment to focus on?

[cheeseman]

3 hours ago, bauman said:

I don't know the relationship of C Fletcher with Russell and, hopefully Kern, but I just finished reading J Rothstein's SEC analysis and found it interesting that he classified 5 KY Freshmen as impact FR (not CF) and another 5 Conference frosh as potential impact (not sure those are the right terms) and Fletcher was not one of those either.  He might be a player looking to come home if he just sees himself being recruited over every year at UK.

Speaking of players wanting to transfer back to SLU, I would not offer that possibility to Nesbit (sp).  I think Fletcher was honest from the get-go with Ford and Tate.  However, I think Nesbit was playing SLU all along and was far less than honest.  To be quoted at signing day that we were not even in his top two says a lot to me and was a shot at the entire SLU program.  Good luck to him after spending 4 years, not one, at a glorified JUCO with a degree that will be of little value.  I hope he really likes Memphis as his new home.  Ya, I guess I'm a little bitter!

I think that it was the Memphis produced article that alluded to us coming in 3rd.  Not sure that Nesbitt specifically said that.

[SLU_Nick]

23 minutes ago, cheeseman said:

I think that it was the Memphis produced article that alluded to us coming in 3rd.  Not sure that Nesbitt specifically said that.

We need to confirm this...

If true then I cannot wait to play and beat Memphis.