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SLU v. Alabama A&M - Game Day Thread


SluSignGuy
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I could understand the "both sides do it" argument if the volume had been remotely equal. But if one side is posting 5 negative comments for every positive one, that's not a compelling argument. Hell, we've had entire threads derailed by folks who just wanted to take a potshot at the coach.

It's just a reflection of what's going on at the moment.

During the 2013-2014 season, it was the opposite ratio for most:

Jordair is a boss.

This win streak is amazing.

These seniors are going to go down as one of our best classes ever.

We might make some noise in the Tournament.

Back-to-back A10 titles!

And:

Uh, do you think Crews might be mismanaging minutes by overplaying the seniors down the stretch? They're starting to look exhausted...

That ratio would be completely fair, too.

Simply making 100% positive comments no matter what would be to ignore much of what's going on. Doing the same with negative comments, well, those people usually end up on my Ignore list. I'm just not sure how a rational observer could be pleased with the overall picture right now.

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I'm optimistic about the long term future of this team. About the short term future of this board, not so much. Some folks have adopted a narrative that we are a team with poor talent and an even worse coach, and they are going to remind us of that narrative at every opportunity.

If the team finishes above .500, it's not like these posters are going to held accountable for the last 9 months worth of posts. They'll just move the goalposts back and start a new line of criticism. The narrative of the clueless coach who can't recruit or develop talent won't change. And that's their prerogative. Contrary to their belief, a high volume of forum posts isn't necessary to field a decent basketball team.

Of course I agree with 3star.

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It's just a reflection of what's going on at the moment.

During the 2013-2014 season, it was the opposite ratio for most:

Jordair is a boss.

This win streak is amazing.

These seniors are going to go down as one of our best classes ever.

We might make some noise in the Tournament.

Back-to-back A10 titles!

And:

Uh, do you think Crews might be mismanaging minutes by overplaying the seniors down the stretch? They're starting to look exhausted...

That ratio would be completely fair, too.

Simply making 100% positive comments no matter what would be to ignore much of what's going on. Doing the same with negative comments, well, those people usually end up on my Ignore list. I'm just not sure how a rational observer could be pleased with the overall picture right now.

I'm neither pleased nor unhappy about the present performance. I'm familiar with what our present weaknesses are, I know there are no quick fixes and the team's record is about what I thought it would be at this point. I predicted 16-15 before the season started and this is basically what a 16-15 team looks like. If we had a current record of say, 7-1, that would be consistent with a 22 win team not a 16-15 one.
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I guess I shouldn't speak for all of the "negative" crowd, but the main theme of the complaints isn't so much that the overall talent is poor. It's that the roster is constructed poorly. Even Crews seemed to address that with his "ingredients/recipe" comment in the most recent P-D article. And giving him the benefit of a doubt, he did bring in a "true" point guard type and a "true" big with the two open roster spots he filled this year. Unfortunately one of them got hurt.

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While I have my complaining about a player time during games, I do understand that this is not really the players issue. If they are struggling on the court and having trouble being coached then it is primarily the coach's problem since he recruited them. They would not be here if he had not signed them. Now, the players do have the responsibility to try to get better and to listen to the coach but once again, the coach should have known if a kid is coachable or not through his due diligence during the recruiting process. Ultimately, the coach is responsible and the buck stops there. So while I might get upset with a bone head play by a player my real unhappiness is with the coach who has trouble building the program for whatever the reason.

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I'm neither pleased nor unhappy about the present performance. I'm familiar with what our present weaknesses are, I know there are no quick fixes and the team's record is about what I thought it would be at this point. I predicted 16-15 before the season started and this is basically what a 16-15 team looks like. If we had a current record of say, 7-1, that would be consistent with a 22 win team not a 16-15 one.

I would agree with the neither-pleased-nor-displeased statement right now, but my expectations were admittedly very low heading into this season based on what I saw last season. I had us at 5-3 right now, with a loss against UNF instead of Morehead. I knew that 4-game stretch would be the first gauntlet and we'd probably win just 1, and that's what happened - just in a different order.

I'm still not sure if I would peg this as a 22-win team even with a 7-1 record. That would mean we had one good win, either WSU or Louisville, and one respectable loss. This is a weak schedule, and not all 7-1 teams are created equal. Which is why this 5-3 team doesn't look like a 16-15 team to me, either.

We were 6-4 on this date last year with one game where we looked good start to finish (@ Indiana State), a couple big losses to good teams (Wichita State and Mississippi State), a couple head-scratching losses (SDSU and Texas A&M-Corpus Christi), and some buy wins. It's been more or less the same pattern so far this season.

We have a few more winnable home games before going on the road (K-State) and starting the A10 season away (Rhode Island). The interesting thing is going to be how this team deals with adversity; things snowballed last year in the conference season.

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As a longer term fan than almost anyone on this board I would suggest that there are about 8 posters who are constantly negative no matter what happens, even if the team plays better. No one knows better than me that we have been up and down in our play. It is those constantly negative posters who have put this board to sleep. Why would anyone want to say anything positive when they know they will just be attacked?

A post like this is basically just begging for more negative posts. Posting something positive about the team would have drawn a lot less negative posts than your post did. Also, someone disagreeing with you is not an attack.

The way to stop the negative posts is to perform well and to look like some actual thought went into the game plan.

Exhibit A: The board after the North Florida game. Just about everyone was posting positive things and no one was "attacked".

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It is those constantly negative posters who have put this board to sleep.

I think it is the team that has put the fan base and this board to sleep. In that sense, the board is a good representation of the general attitude of the fan base. There really is a lack of interest in the program and it has nothing to do with the negativity of many on this message board, I think most fans are fairly negative about the program. At least a year ago we could discuss Tatum, now there is nothing.

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I continue to struggle with this perception of "negative" posters.

While my posting content has gone down I would say I am close to the most negative. Who have I attacked?

I've been attacked on more than one occasion. The "positve" posters have been the ones on the offensive. Yet they also say they are contantly being attacked.

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I continue to struggle with this perception of "negative" posters.

While my posting content has gone down I would say I am close to the most negative. Who have I attacked?

I've been attacked on more than one occasion. The "positve" posters have been the ones on the offensive. Yet they also say they are contantly being attacked.

The negative camp is made up of fans who are devastated by what they see from the program. They've looked into their crystal ball and determined that there's absolutely no hope for any aspect of the program and there must be a change — particularly the athletics director and head coach — and the sooner, the better. Anything that delays a change (short of an unlikely post-season bid) is an awful thing.

The positive camp is made up of fans who are disappointed by what they see from this team. However, they believe they see signs of promise from the players and the coaches and hold out hope that things will improve by the end of this season and/or next season. They want to allow things to play out, rather than predicting a single-digit-win season. Should there be less than 10-12 wins this season, then a change would seem reasonably justifiable, but the season isn't over.

As with most dichotomies, there's a spectrum. Some are more extreme, and some are closer to the middle. I'm not sure what defines the middle ground in this case. I don't know that any posters are being "attacked," though their positions might be. What's really being "attacked" is the product we're being asked to accept and support. And this program deserves the criticism it's taking, but the time for assessing or evaluating what's next comes at the end of the season, not in the middle of it. But by no means should fans not be allowed in this forum to express their views regarding "their" team, whether devastated or disappointed. (I assume no fan of SLU men's basketball is pleased or content; if so, sanity comes into question.)

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Thicks, I would look at the dichotomy you describe from a different point of view. There are those that panic when results are not as expected or desired and lash out, or go out witch hunting to assign blame for what they are seeing that upsets them. On the other hand there are those that can take a certain amount of upsetting results without lashing out and looking to assign blame. I think the key factor that determines what group you are in is your personality, what you call in your post "their crystal balls." Some people lash out and assign blame, others are more tolerant towards bad results. It is a matter of your personality, who you are and how you look at things. Regardless of how you analyze this issue, this blog has become a highly polarized forum.

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As a longer term fan than almost anyone on this board I would suggest that there are about 8 posters who are constantly negative no matter what happens, even if the team plays better. No one knows better than me that we have been up and down in our play. It is those constantly negative posters who have put this board to sleep. Why would anyone want to say anything positive when they know they will just be attacked?

+1,000,000,000,000,000,000

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Nice string of posts from ChosenOne to thicks.

Old guy.. I, and others, have, "taken a CERTAIN AMOUNT of upsetting results without lashing out or assigning blame."

I have since reached my certain amount, with Coach Crews, and probably reached it at some point during conference play last season. If that wasn't when, it was certainly during the Morehead St. drubbing, at home, after being briefly suckered back in again

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I agree. A lot of longtime posters (pre-Majerus) seemed to have disappeared this year. I cannot imagine it is due to the product on the floor because they have seen worse.

I apologize that some of us are not used to your (apparently) insanely low standards. And even if you've seen worse, why would you be fine with squandering the only golden age of the program, so quickly?

But give us some time, we'll get there

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I apologize that some of us are not used to your (apparently) insanely low standards. And even if you've seen worse, why would you be fine with squandering the only golden age of the program, so quickly?

But give us some time, we'll get there

They're mentally weak. Just like this team. Boom. Roasted.

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I agree. A lot of longtime posters (pre-Majerus) seemed to have disappeared this year. I cannot imagine it is due to the product on the floor because they have seen worse.

Yes. That is the nature of Boards like this. A vocal minority (or possibly majority) shouts down good posters who get tired and simply stop posting.

What's really funny is that posters think that their posts on Boards like this truly have an impact either way on big decisions such as making a coaching change. What's even worse is to actually think that our program would be better off by firing Jim Crews mid season and having an assistant coach finish the year. Reality: Cheryl Levick couldn't sell bricks at the rate of $500 or $750 and we still cannot get more than 4 k or 5 k to a game.

Instead, the truth of the matter is that SLU desperately did need a guy like Fr. Biondi - a bricks and mortar guy who tore down building and razed eyesores, and replaced surface lots with dorms, classrooms and garages.while turning SLU into a modern, urban campus while building an impressive endowment to help for years to come. At the same time, he was horrible for athletics while clashing with our best 2 coaches of the modern era -- Spoon and Majerus. Unless and until SLU takes college sports seriously with true support for its programs up and and down the line, neither the Big East nor any top head coach will be interested in SLU. Until I see a President take an active interest in sports, in general, and men's basketball, in particular, and until I see boosters willing to get their check books outs, things will not get better here. Have things gotten much worse over the last 3 years? Yes. Can things get even worse than now? Yes as well.

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