Big East Break-Up Thread (Merged)

[SLUMedBilliken15]

If the A10 expands to 21 teams, they should rename the conference, "A-Beast"

[SLUMedBilliken15]

If the A10 expands to 21 teams, they should rename the conference, "A-Beast"

[brianstl]

There will not be a 21 team A10.

[showthebill]

Would the A10 be able to renegotiate for a higher $ amount from the TV deals with additional high profile teams? That would be the big hang up in that scenario.

MU, DePaul, GTown aren't giving up 800k+ a year to play Fordham instead of Tulane.

Also I don't see a benefit for the BE7 in trading a game with Tulane for Fordham.

I think overall there are more bottom feeders in big east than a-10. The TV money will come, but...

Bottom line is getting teams in the tournament and Big East keeps losing bids while the A-10 keeps adding them. The real issue is if they dissolve will they be able to get into post-season play.

[showthebill]

21 team league is also an interesting dynamic because suddenly Temple is on the outside looking in. Is there a provision in their exit/entrance agreement if something like this happens

[ARon]

21 team league is also an interesting dynamic because suddenly Temple is on the outside looking in. Is there a provision in their exit/entrance agreement if something like this happens

Since they are already a voting member of the Big East they an stop the basketball only schools from having the votes the dissolve vs just leaving. That has big $$ and branding implications.

[ARon]

If the A10 expands to 21 teams, they should rename the conference, "A-Beast"

Someone on Twitter has suggested "A-Infinity"

[DeSmetBilliken]

There will not be a 21 team A10.

I agree. My guess is if this happened, some of the existing A-10 schools would move elsewhere. Could probably get the number down to 16 or 18. A 21 team conference would have 3 Philly schools(already have that), 2 NYC schools (3 if you throw in Seton Hall in New Jersey), 2 DC schools, 2 Rhode Island schools, plus the 2 Richmond schools and the Xavier/Dayton area. That's a bit of redundancy, and a few teams might consider a conference that is a better fit.

[ARon]

I agree. My guess is if this happened, some of the existing A-10 schools would move elsewhere. Could probably get the number down to 16 or 18. A 21 team conference would have 3 Philly schools(already have that), 2 NYC schools (3 if you throw in Seton Hall in New Jersey), 2 DC schools, 2 Rhode Island schools, plus the 2 Richmond schools and the Xavier/Dayton area. That's a bit of redundancy, and a few teams might consider a conference that is a better fit.

I would assume that all current A10 members would WANT to stay. But you have to think Fordham, Lasalle, and St. Bonnie would be asked to justify their inclusion before long.

URI might not feel like a good fit either.

SLU and Dusquene would probably be safe due to the TV markets we bring.

[cgeldmacher]

Here's an update article that talks about the A-10 being prepared to accept the seven basketball Big East schools.

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/8736716/atlantic-10-open-adding-big-east-basketball-schools-creating-21-team-conference-source

The articles are similar, but this one is from the point of view of the A-10.

Can we officially call the A-10 vs. Missouri Valley debate over and pronounce the Missouri Valley side the losers? I think it has been over for years, but a combination of the 7 Big East schools and the A-10 would be the final seven nails in the coffin of that argument.

[slufanskip]

Here's an update article that talks about the A-10 being prepared to accept the seven basketball Big East schools.

http://espn.go.com/m...nference-source

The articles are similar, but this one is from the point of view of the A-10.

Can we officially call the A-10 vs. Missouri Valley debate over and pronounce the Missouri Valley side the losers? I think it has been over for years, but a combination of the 7 Big East schools and the A-10 would be the final seven nails in the coffin of that argument.

No. It doesn't have to make sense for some people to argue it.

[jbizzle09]

No. It doesn't have to make sense for some people to argue it.

Bingo.

[wgstl]

I know this will piss everyone here off, but someone brought the idea of all this, SLU X dayton and butler go to the MVC, the dukes bonnies and fordham to the america east conf, and the remaining BE basketball only schools to the a10. it will never happen, BUT THATS the only way I would ever want to go to the MVC..

[MB73]

I know this will piss everyone here off, but someone brought the idea of all this, SLU X dayton and butler go to the MVC, the dukes bonnies and fordham to the america east conf, and the remaining BE basketball only schools to the a10. it will never happen, BUT THATS the only way I would ever want to go to the MVC..

That would be the best way to go for sure, but highly unlikely.

[Box and Won]

I know this will piss everyone here off, but someone brought the idea of all this, SLU X dayton and butler go to the MVC, the dukes bonnies and fordham to the america east conf, and the remaining BE basketball only schools to the a10. it will never happen, BUT THATS the only way I would ever want to go to the MVC..

That actually doesn't sound terrible.

[Clock_Tower]

Another interesting dynamic would be Xavier and Dayton. Would they think twice about adding Dayton considering Xavier would already cover the Cincy market.

If they only add 3 teams I think we are SOL but if they add 5, I think we will be in good shape

This happened before -- with The Great Midwest Conference -- and both UD and X were left sitting outside the gate. SLU was just so happy to be in a confernce with Marquette and DePaul that SLU didn't/couldn't do anything to help these schools which have become our new and biggest rivals.

This time around, though, any new conference will NOT be driven by the football schools like with The Great Midwest. Cincy will NOT be any new conference with the basketball only schools so keeping X and UD out this time makes no sense. Also, the basketball only schools know that football killed both The Great Midwest/Conf USA as well as the Big East, and will not keep making these same mistakes -- unless it is lucrative to do so. This time around, I just don't see the money.

Frankly, two (2) very nice conferences could be made using the remaining the Big East basketball schools, the A10 schools and even the better Valley schools. Would sure like to see two (2) good non-BCS/football conferences formed (with us being part of one) and then maybe a third such conference consisting of the West Coast/Moutain schools. 3 to 4 strong non-football/BCS conferences would go a long way toward keeping the eventual four (4) BCS mega-conferences in check - at least with respect to basketball.

[jbizzle09]

That actually doesn't sound terrible.

But, as MB said, highly unlikely. Just can't see X and Dayton moving to the MVC, especially if there is an option to join with the basketball-only BE schools. It makes sense geographically and creates a very good basketball conference, but just can't see all 4 schools being on board with the idea.

[billiken_roy]

clock's closer to the likely final outcome imo. take the 7 BE schools and the A-10 schools then divide into two conferences/divisions by geography/current strength.

you could make two nice 11 team conferences.

one thing i think deserves mention. considering slu is right in the middle of this thing, doug woolard seems to deserve some credit for long term vision. had we been stuck in the mvc no way we are in the middle of this right now. i thank god that didnt happen.

[brianstl]

One of the rumors making the rounds now is that Cincy, UConn, USF, and Temple would stay for now at least in the no football Big East and find a place to park their football programs. Like the previous Temple in the MAC for football arrangment. The other schools that were going to join the Big East would be told sorry. Then, the Big East would add five more basketball only schools to get to sixteen. The belief is that conference set up would get more money from the networks and allow the confernce a couple years to rebuild it's rep in basketball with the newer members becoming higher profile.

[cgeldmacher]

I know it is fun and sounds like a nice idea to divide up the remaining Big East schools with the A-10 schools and MVC, but its not realistic. Georgetown is not going to go along with a plan where they trade Marquette and DePaul for St. Bonaventure and Fordam. Marquette is not going to want to lose Georgetown, and its presence on the east coast for recruiting, to join a league with Bradley and Northern Iowa just because it makes geographic sense to those of us on this site.

The fact is none of the recent conference realignment moves make sense geographically. The changes occur because they make sense monetarily. This explains West Virginia in the Big-12 and Boise State in the Big East. We need to realize that if SLU can fall into a situation where we end up in a 21 team league with Georgetown, DePaul, Marquette, Xavier, Dayton, Butler, and VCU (among other preferables), we should throw a huge party. It's no where near a done deal, but lets just pray that it happens rather than worrying about trying to get into a conference with Creighton.

As far as I'm concerned, the Missouri Valley is and should be on the outside looking in. Luckily, it seems we may end up being on the inside looking out. Before we rush to jump into a league with Creighton, remember that the hot team in the MVC changes every other year. Remember when it was Missouri State, for awhile it was SIU-C, then it was Wichita State. I don't hear anyone clamoring to drag SIU-C into our new conference. Give it a few years and Creighton will be Indiana State again.

[MB73]

I know it is fun and sounds like a nice idea to divide up the remaining Big East schools with the A-10 schools and MVC, but its not realistic. Georgetown is not going to go along with a plan where they trade Marquette and DePaul for St. Bonaventure and Fordam. Marquette is not going to want to lose Georgetown, and its presence on the east coast for recruiting, to join a league with Bradley and Northern Iowa just because it makes geographic sense to those of us on this site.

As far as I'm concerned, the Missouri Valley is and should be on the outside looking in. Luckily, it seems we may end up being on the inside looking out. Before we rush to jump into a league with Creighton, remember that the hot team in the MVC changes every other year. Remember when it was Missouri State, for awhile it was SIU-C, then it was Wichita State. I don't hear anyone clamoring to drag SIU-C into our new conference. Give it a few years and Creighton will be Indiana State again.

That happens a lot in mid major conferences... Good coaches come, get a program going, then leave for top 6 / BCS type conferences.

A-10? GW was top notch a while ago, now ca-ca, and so on...

[slu72]

This has all come about because of TV Markets, read TV Money. Big 10 wanted the DC market, c'mon over MD. Wanted the NYC market, C'mon over Rutgers. The biggest thing we've got going for us here is the STL market is no 21 in the US. That said, we've still got to show these guys we can fill a 10k arena and we won't be an annual doormat. If RM was still with us, we'd be a shoo in. That's why the next hire has got to be a good one. One that says, we're serious about hoops.

[cgeldmacher]

This has all come about because of TV Markets, read TV Money. Big 10 wanted the DC market, c'mon over MD. Wanted the NYC market, C'mon over Rutgers. The biggest thing we've got going for us here is the STL market is no 21 in the US. That said, we've still got to show these guys we can fill a 10k arena and we won't be an annual doormat. If RM was still with us, we'd be a shoo in. That's why the next hire has got to be a good one. One that says, we're serious about hoops.

Totally agree. However, it's somewhat of a Catch 22. The better coach we have, the better chance of us getting into the top level conference, but getting into a top level conference will help us get a better coach. It will be interesting to see what happens first. If we have to hire the coach first, you're totally right, there will be a lot riding on it.

[billiken_roy]

I know it is fun and sounds like a nice idea to divide up the remaining Big East schools with the A-10 schools and MVC, but its not realistic. Georgetown is not going to go along with a plan where they trade Marquette and DePaul for St. Bonaventure and Fordam. Marquette is not going to want to lose Georgetown, and its presence on the east coast for recruiting, to join a league with Bradley and Northern Iowa just because it makes geographic sense to those of us on this site.

The fact is none of the recent conference realignment moves make sense geographically. The changes occur because they make sense monetarily. This explains West Virginia in the Big-12 and Boise State in the Big East. We need to realize that if SLU can fall into a situation where we end up in a 21 team league with Georgetown, DePaul, Marquette, Xavier, Dayton, Butler, and VCU (among other preferables), we should throw a huge party. It's no where near a done deal, but lets just pray that it happens rather than worrying about trying to get into a conference with Creighton.

As far as I'm concerned, the Missouri Valley is and should be on the outside looking in. Luckily, it seems we may end up being on the inside looking out. Before we rush to jump into a league with Creighton, remember that the hot team in the MVC changes every other year. Remember when it was Missouri State, for awhile it was SIU-C, then it was Wichita State. I don't hear anyone clamoring to drag SIU-C into our new conference. Give it a few years and Creighton will be Indiana State again.

no way we should get involved with the mvc beyond stealing creighton if that helps the cause. they have absolutely nothing else to bring to the table imo.

[JMM28]

Give it a few years and Creighton will be Indiana State again.

Uninformed. Creighton will continue to be a player just as they have been since 1998 or so. They have a great fan base, a great arena that seats 17k+, a mid sized market, and they are the only game in town. I would take Creighton in a conference in a heartbeat. The rest of the Valley, not so much.