Ten least affordable colleges

[brianstl]

http://money.cnn.com/galleries/2011/pf/college/1106/gallery.10_least_affordable_colleges/10.html

[SpartanBilliken]

http://money.cnn.com/galleries/2011/pf/college/1106/gallery.10_least_affordable_colleges/10.html

Not sure what DUMBASS at CNN published this or who at the Department of Education is citing, but every single one of these statistics is incorrect. I work in the Undergraduate Admission office at SLU, and the only thing there that is correct is our location in St. Louis.

[bk18]

Not sure what DUMBASS at CNN published this or who at the Department of Education is citing, but every single one of these statistics is incorrect. I work in the Undergraduate Admission office at SLU, and the only thing there that is correct is our location in St. Louis.

Yeah what does Net Cost mean? The percent of students that pay $31,255 or more after tuition, books, fees, housing has to be small at SLU. Clearly this D.A. went to an affordable state school.

[SShoe]

Yeah what does Net Cost mean? The percent of students that pay $31,255 or more after tuition, books, fees, housing has to be small at SLU. Clearly this D.A. went to an affordable state school.

This is what it said...

(1)Net Price after Scholarships and Grant Aid, 2008-09

Note: Average net price is generated by subtracting the average amount of federal, state/local government, or institutional grant or scholarship aid from the total cost of attendance. Total cost of attendance is the sum of published tuition and required fees (lower of in-district or in-state, where applicable), books and supplies, and the weighted average for room and board and other expenses.

[NH]

Looking at four of those schools what's up.

But honestly, I don't see how Fordham or SLU is on here. They both give really good scholarship money.

[SpartanBilliken]

This is what it said...

(1)Net Price after Scholarships and Grant Aid, 2008-09

Note: Average net price is generated by subtracting the average amount of federal, state/local government, or institutional grant or scholarship aid from the total cost of attendance. Total cost of attendance is the sum of published tuition and required fees (lower of in-district or in-state, where applicable), books and supplies, and the weighted average for room and board and other expenses.

Tuition, room and board, and fees at SLU is approximately $43,500 right now. Add in books, and it's roughly $44,500. The average financial aid package for incoming freshman is $27,805. I'd say the Net Price is quite a bit less than what was quoted on CNN. I know I'm not factoring in transfer students and international, but domestic students make up an overwhelming majority of each class.

[billikendave]

Tuition, room and board, and fees at SLU is approximately $43,500 right now. Add in books, and it's roughly $44,500. The average financial aid package for incoming freshman is $27,805. I'd say the Net Price is quite a bit less than what was quoted on CNN. I know I'm not factoring in transfer students and international, but domestic students make up an overwhelming majority of each class.

so i understand what you are saying is that the average incoming freshman gets $27,805 in scholarship or grants? This means money that eventually does not have to be repaid. This does not include stafford loans, not private loans secured through the university. That seems really high. Its great, if accurate, though.

[b.hayes]

Tuition, room and board, and fees at SLU is approximately $43,500 right now. Add in books, and it's roughly $44,500. The average financial aid package for incoming freshman is $27,805. I'd say the Net Price is quite a bit less than what was quoted on CNN. I know I'm not factoring in transfer students and international, but domestic students make up an overwhelming majority of each class.

No, what I think you are missing is that the financial aid package figure certainly must include student loans. That is the only way the average financial aid package for all students could be anywhere near $27,805. Loans aren't free money, so they shouldn't reduce the "net cost" of attending SLU. You can't take that out of the cost just because it is paid after the degree is received; it's still owed and is still a cost of attending the school. If you took your numbers over 4 years, the out of pocket cost to attend SLU would be $62,780. Not a chance.

I just logged in and checked out the total of the checks written to SLU for my undergraduate degree. (I don't recommend doing that to anyone. What a depressing sight.) Over my 3.5 years, with both academic and athletic scholarship money coming in, the remaining balance was over 90k. With a full fourth year it would have been over $100k. That's 26k per full year at SLU out of pocket. Less than the $31k from CNN, but much much higher than the $15,695 per year you are suggesting.

[Clock_Tower]

Tuition, room and board, and fees at SLU is approximately $43,500 right now. Add in books, and it's roughly $44,500. The average financial aid package for incoming freshman is $27,805. I'd say the Net Price is quite a bit less than what was quoted on CNN. I know I'm not factoring in transfer students and international, but domestic students make up an overwhelming majority of each class.

Sure is a silly way to price the cost of service: private education. Remember when a private school set a price and then charged that price to all/nearly all the students? Sure, the "top" student got an academic scholarship and the truly needy student got money to attend but when 90% of the 13,000 plus student body gets assistance, there is a real problem. Now, it's let's make a deal depending on what you income is, if you saved money or not, if you come from a certain part of the country, what your academics are... In short, how much can SLU (and the other private schools also) get not only from the student/family but also from the federal government or anyone else. Kinda makes used car salesmen, and new car salesmen who must go back to the back room, look honorable and upright!!

Sorry Skip and other car salesmen/women for the comparison to private school presidents and admission/enrollment departments everywhere!!

[jimbofive]

I don't debate that SLU is a rapejob. Private colleges and some state schools in general are rapejobs. It's getting ridiculous. I had a great scholarship package and still ended up owing about 30K after four years. Not insurmountable, and I don't regret it. But I'll bet there are dozens of schools out there that are way better at wallet raping than SLU.

I'd almost be inclined to let my kids go to a community college or cheap state school for two years and then go to school internationally somewhere. Would make them stand out more for a lot less and be a really amazing cultural experience. Would suck not to see them nearly as often, but I'll bet an international flight or two per year is small beans compared to the difference in tuition and housing with some domestic rapejobs.

Glad I was able to use rapejob three times there. Ok, now four.

[SpartanBilliken]

No, what I think you are missing is that the financial aid package figure certainly must include student loans. That is the only way the average financial aid package for all students could be anywhere near $27,805. Loans aren't free money, so they shouldn't reduce the "net cost" of attending SLU. You can't take that out of the cost just because it is paid after the degree is received; it's still owed and is still a cost of attending the school. If you took your numbers over 4 years, the out of pocket cost to attend SLU would be $62,780. Not a chance.

I just logged in and checked out the total of the checks written to SLU for my undergraduate degree. (I don't recommend doing that to anyone. What a depressing sight.) Over my 3.5 years, with both academic and athletic scholarship money coming in, the remaining balance was over 90k. With a full fourth year it would have been over $100k. That's 26k per full year at SLU out of pocket. Less than the $31k from CNN, but much much higher than the $15,695 per year you are suggesting.

It does include federal stafford and/or perkins loans. Student loans are inevitable for a private education these days.

[SpartanBilliken]

It does include federal stafford and/or perkins loans. Student loans are inevitable for a private education these days.

but basically, I think we both agree that the facts/figures are off - just maybe not on what the actual amount might be.

[JMM28]

It does include federal stafford and/or perkins loans. Student loans are inevitable for a private education these days.

Loans are not free money. If they are, let me know and I will cancel my check I just sent.

[Bobby Metzinger]

Loans are not free money. If they are, let me know and I will cancel my check I just sent.

SAY WHAAAA?!!

[b.hayes]

It does include federal stafford and/or perkins loans. Student loans are inevitable for a private education these days.

Which is fine, and a fair figure, but you're not comparing apples to apples with "DUMBASS" CNN.

[bk18]

Time to switch to Fox News if you haven't already. Right Metz?

[SpartanBilliken]

Which is fine, and a fair figure, but you're not comparing apples to apples with "DUMBASS" CNN.

my mistake. i misread and thought loans were included in the report. MY Bad.

and yes - CNN is a DUMBASS for posting this article. Even look at the comments on the page itself - no one agrees with this report.

Regardless, getting back to the point, SLU is not nearly close to the top 10 least affordable colleges.

[billikendave]

Which is fine, and a fair figure, but you're not comparing apples to apples with "DUMBASS" CNN.

+1

Using your figure of $44,500 per year with CNN/Dept of Education seems to suggest that real cost is $31K per year. This means that the average scholarship/grant is $10K to 13K. That is certainly reasonable numbers. That means an average SLU student's (4 years) would cost in real dollars in the range of $124,000 for an undergraduate degree. That number is dumbfounding, staggering and unsustainable.

[b.hayes]

my mistake. i misread and thought loans were included in the report. MY Bad.

and yes - CNN is a DUMBASS for posting this article. Even look at the comments on the page itself - no one agrees with this report.

Regardless, getting back to the point, SLU is not nearly close to the top 10 least affordable colleges.

I would tend to agree with you there. But, if that is your qualm, your issue isn't with CNN. It's with a combination of the Department of Education, Congress, and however they compiled their statistics for the College Affordability and Transparency Center.

I don't know why I'm defending CNN today, but saying an editor there is a dumbass for posting a relevant news story that links directly to the database (that has extensive information detailing exactly the figures reported) only makes one person look like a dumbass, and it isn't the editor. I've seen the comments on the story, most of them are other people who didn't actually read or understand the story and are commenting on the high tuitions, not net prices. No one commenting agrees with the report because no one commenting took five minutes to figure out what they were talking about before they gave their uninformed opinion.

Here is the link to SLU's page, which almost certainly reports information they gathered from a report filled out by someone who works at SLU, perhaps even in your office. Here is where the data came from :

"The lists were generated using data collected by the National Center for Education Statistics (NCES) through the Integrated Postsecondary Education Data System (IPEDS). IPEDS is a mandatory data collection for institutions that participate in or are applicants for participation in any federal student financial aid program authorized by Title IV of the Higher Education Act of 1965, as amended (20 USC 1094, Section 487(a)(17) and 34 CFR 668.14((19))."

[SpartanBilliken]

I would tend to agree with you there. But, if that is your qualm, your issue isn't with CNN. It's with a combination of the Department of Education, Congress, and however they compiled their statistics for the College Affordability and Transparency Center.

I don't know why I'm defending CNN today, but saying an editor there is a dumbass for posting a relevant news story that links directly to the database (that has extensive information detailing exactly the figures reported) only makes one person look like a dumbass, and it isn't the editor. I've seen the comments on the story, most of them are other people who didn't actually read or understand the story and are commenting on the high tuitions, not net prices. No one commenting agrees with the report because no one commenting took five minutes to figure out what they were talking about before they gave their uninformed opinion.

Here is the link to SLU's page, which almost certainly reports information they gathered from a report filled out by someone who works at SLU, perhaps even in your office. Here is where the data came from :

"The lists were generated using data collected by the National Center for Education Statistics (NCES) through the Integrated Postsecondary Education Data System (IPEDS). IPEDS is a mandatory data collection for institutions that participate in or are applicants for participation in any federal student financial aid program authorized by Title IV of the Higher Education Act of 1965, as amended (20 USC 1094, Section 487(a)(17) and 34 CFR 668.14((19))."

and unfortunately, incorrect data on the website regarding the amount of students at SLU. Total Undergrad enrollment at SLU right now is 8100 students. Total enrollment (undergrad, grad, med, law, etc.) is just over 13,000.

might skew that data a little bit.

as I see it, there are a lot of ways to play around with this data. Do I agree that SLU is expensive? yes - it should be. We're ranked in the top 100 schools in the nation by US News and World Report. And Fiske's Guide to College Education ranks SLU among the top 25 best buy schools in the nation. Do I regret paying as much as I did to attend this university? Hell no. Do I regret having to pay back student loans? Hell no.

and just putting up one statistic that says SLU is expensive without putting together all relevant data just to create a headline is poor reporting.

[waldo027]

the only thing there that is correct is our location in St. Louis.

They got the name of the school right, Saint Louis University. Not St. Louis University, or University of St. Louis, or anything like that.

[bk18]

I think the only way the net cost is 31,255 is when you consider all the Chinese students who pay full tuition. That is probably about 10% of our undergraduate body.

If you do the math and if 10% of your student body is paying $49,990, (http://nces.ed.gov/collegenavigator/?id=179159#netprc) then the rest of your student body pays on average $26,256 in net costs.

That's not bad considering that implies only having to pay $8992 for tuition on average for the other 90%. They assumed you'd be paying $17,334 for room, board, books, fees. Which is very inflated.

[cheeseman]

Not sure what this is all about. Hard to believe that there were no Ivy League schools on the list or was that because they attract students from family backgrounds who can afford to pay the freight - I wonder. Now, is SLU cheap no - what the article did not say was if you got your money/cost from the school. This means little unless you put all the necessary other stuff in context. Did I ever think SLU was a bargain no - that would be why my two kids did not attend for undergrad. My son did get his PhD from SLU but he got paid to do research and got his education as part of the deal. My daughter got her MBA from DePaul which was a better bargain then U of Chicago or Northwestern where she lived. My point simply is this ranking means nothing since for those who were worried about the money already knew it was not cheap to go there.

[bonwich]

I never thought SLU was in any way expensive when I went there.

[Franchise_08]

Wow, tuition is 30k? Glad I got out when it was only 25.