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OT: Midtown Development


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18 minutes ago, cheeseman said:

How do you know the land is cheap - I would think any land of this scale being sold for this kind of purpose would bring a good dollar.

When I say relatively cheap, I'm speaking relative to other key large sites in Midtown.  The price will be good, but not nearly what it would be if the site was north of I-64 closer to CORTEX.  I'm sure they wanted the site at Grand/Chouteau, but the university wants something more transformational there, plus the land price would be much higher than the site at Chouteau/Compton.

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2 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

Fair enough. I was just surprised, but I haven't been fully keeping up with everything developing in the area.

I think it's mostly about not wanting to cannibalize their West County location with another one in St. Charles, and also the Metro East not having enough population to support one.  So try and draw from both sides of the river with a centrally located one that has good highway access and visibility.

The bigger story here may be about the university's willingness to divest many of its land holdings.  Definitely a change in policy from the prior regime.  

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22 minutes ago, SShoe said:

When I say relatively cheap, I'm speaking relative to other key large sites in Midtown.  The price will be good, but not nearly what it would be if the site was north of I-64 closer to CORTEX.  I'm sure they wanted the site at Grand/Chouteau, but the university wants something more transformational there, plus the land price would be much higher than the site at Chouteau/Compton.

When I originally heard about the project, I thought it was at Grand/Chouteau and that seems like a much better spot. But it probably be way more expensive like you said

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18 hours ago, billikenfan05 said:

I don't get it. Seems like an odd location in my mind. Maybe @Box and Woncan put this in perspective for me.

Probably a similar calculus to why IKEA is there: centrally located, easy highway access, and a tolerable drive for a large percentage of the metro population. 

Looks like it'll be a short walk down Compton from the 'fetz. Could be a good pre/post-game option. 

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i've only played top golf once.   i think it is stupid.   it sure isnt golf.   i say it is all about non golfers having a day hitting balls with some sort of competition value at a very expensive cost.   i wont go back.  

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2 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

i've only played top golf once.   i think it is stupid.   it sure isnt golf.   i say it is all about non golfers having a day hitting balls with some sort of competition value at a very expensive cost.   i wont go back.  

damn Roy, tell us how you really feel.

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25 minutes ago, NoCoBillsFan said:

When I originally heard about the project, I thought it was at Grand/Chouteau and that seems like a much better spot. But it probably be way more expensive like you said

The apartment building with the Target store will be close to Grand and Chouteau, just north of Captain D's.  And it sounds like more development is planned for that area as well.

The Compton location seems pretty good to me.  Topgolf is cool, but they're definitely not much to look at.  The only other Topgolf I've seen (outside of the one in Chesterfield), was in Nashville, which is in kind of a similar area.

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2 hours ago, Slu let the dogs out? said:

What this area really needs is a Total Access Urgent Care. 

My wife works there.

Not going to happen.

Company is awesome but...

They just forced out their founder/CEO who expanded way too quickly. There is not enough health care workers to staff their current locations. They have had to board up several or use them as training sites.

Former CEO personally owns the land which house some of the locations so there is a lengthy lawsuit pending which will for the time being preclude any further expansion.

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3 hours ago, thetorch said:

My wife works there.

Not going to happen.

Company is awesome but...

They just forced out their founder/CEO who expanded way too quickly. There is not enough health care workers to staff their current locations. They have had to board up several or use them as training sites.

Former CEO personally owns the land which house some of the locations so there is a lengthy lawsuit pending which will for the time being preclude any further expansion.

I will say I never heard anything but good things from people who’ve gone to one.

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8 hours ago, billiken_roy said:

i've only played top golf once.   i think it is stupid.   it sure isnt golf.   i say it is all about non golfers having a day hitting balls with some sort of competition value at a very expensive cost.   i wont go back.  

It’s all about an approachable experience for businesses having “team building” outings. Just like the westport social-esque concept coming to The Armory or the mini-golf bar going in The Foundry.

In that respect, placing it right between Clayton and downtown makes a lot of sense.

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Been to the Top Golf in Scottsdale, AZ.  Essentially, they are all the same.  They've taken the driving range concept and added scoring.  Plus food and beverage service in your little cubicle.  And you don't have to be a killer hitter to win ---- there are scoring pits just over the ledge and popping one in the center bull's eye with a nine iron or wedge will score you plenty of points.  

I didn't pay for it so I don't know the real expense of it all.  I did beat my son-in-law the former MLBer.  He kept hitting his driver OVER the fence ala Mike Trout.  If you don't hit their gizmos, you don't score.  He's a freak.  When we played the Eagle  Mountain  Course https://eaglemtn.com/course-layout/ he drove the 345 yard 17th green from the gold tees (tips).  He can crush a golf ball, just not sure where its going to go.

A Top Golf outing is more like a bachelor party event or social outing.  I'm not going there to work on my tee etiquette.

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10 hours ago, billiken_roy said:

i've only played top golf once.   i think it is stupid.   it sure isnt golf.   i say it is all about non golfers having a day hitting balls with some sort of competition value at a very expensive cost.   i wont go back.  

It would be a shame for a dying game to have some sort of accessible entry point….

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All the Top Golf's I played at (Greenville, SC, Myrtle Beach and the 2 in Atlanta area were suburban except the one in Vegas which part of the MGM). I been by the one in Nashville and Birmingham, AL and both of those seem to be in a urban area. 

It's a lot fun and a nice night out if you go with a large group that has at least minimal golf skill. You do try to hit the targets. Any night I went, we always reserved a bay in advance because they can get crowded. They all have several bars that are sports bars that have a full dinner and/or lunch menu. 

Will it sell in Mid-town St Louis? I don't know. I always felt it was kind of a sunbelt activity even with the bays having heat or AC.

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11 hours ago, MusicCityBilliken said:

All the Top Golf's I played at (Greenville, SC, Myrtle Beach and the 2 in Atlanta area were suburban except the one in Vegas which part of the MGM). I been by the one in Nashville and Birmingham, AL and both of those seem to be in a urban area. 

It's a lot fun and a nice night out if you go with a large group that has at least minimal golf skill. You do try to hit the targets. Any night I went, we always reserved a bay in advance because they can get crowded. They all have several bars that are sports bars that have a full dinner and/or lunch menu. 

Will it sell in Mid-town St Louis? I don't know. I always felt it was kind of a sunbelt activity even with the bays having heat or AC.

Well it must in Chesterfield or else they wouldn't being opening another one in the region.

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23 minutes ago, cheeseman said:

Well it must in Chesterfield or else they wouldn't being opening another one in the region.

I didn't know they had one Chesterfield. Your right, must be popular if St Louis can support 2 of them. I did notice they are international with several in the UK. Also in Dubai, Australia & Mexico.

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23 hours ago, billiken_roy said:

i've only played top golf once.   i think it is stupid.   it sure isnt golf.   i say it is all about non golfers having a day hitting balls with some sort of competition value at a very expensive cost.   i wont go back.  

It is what it is.

A bar with a driving range.

It’s pretty much a Dave and Busters only with golf involved.

I’d much rather go play 18 on a nice day but I find TopGolf more enjoyable than than a driving range.

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On 12/3/2021 at 10:12 AM, billiken_roy said:

i've only played top golf once.   i think it is stupid.   it sure isnt golf.   i say it is all about non golfers having a day hitting balls with some sort of competition value at a very expensive cost.   i wont go back.  

Roy, I agree with @dlarry and consider TopGolf like a more fun driving range with a bar. It’s an expensive driving range where you can keep score. But I go there a lot with my family during the holidays, and it’s the type of thing that my stepmom and sister (who have never played a round of golf in their lives) can still enjoy. There are days where they have “all you can play” play for like $25. But if you’re just looking to hit some balls and work on your swing, TopGolf probably isn’t where you want to go. I enjoy going there with family, but I just consider it kinda separate from playing 18 or even working on my swing at the range.

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1 hour ago, Reinert310 said:

Roy, I agree with @dlarry and consider TopGolf like a more fun driving range with a bar. It’s an expensive driving range where you can keep score. But I go there a lot with my family during the holidays, and it’s the type of thing that my stepmom and sister (who have never played a round of golf in their lives) can still enjoy. There are days where they have “all you can play” play for like $25. But if you’re just looking to hit some balls and work on your swing, TopGolf probably isn’t where you want to go. I enjoy going there with family, but I just consider it kinda separate from playing 18 or even working on my swing at the range.

good info. my 23 year old daughter no golfer went there when nannying & her pledges & her had a blast.

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I drive past the Chesterfield location M-F and other than at 745AM it is never not hosting good numbers. So many networking, happy hour, charity, and fundraising events held there that I have been a part of or at least been aware of, and I myself have gone multiple times for date night or with friends. 

Any development that can serve as an answer to the damned question "What is there to do in St. Louis?" is good development and this is certainly just that. 

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On 12/4/2021 at 11:17 AM, Reinert310 said:

Roy, I agree with @dlarry and consider TopGolf like a more fun driving range with a bar. It’s an expensive driving range where you can keep score. But I go there a lot with my family during the holidays, and it’s the type of thing that my stepmom and sister (who have never played a round of golf in their lives) can still enjoy. There are days where they have “all you can play” play for like $25. But if you’re just looking to hit some balls and work on your swing, TopGolf probably isn’t where you want to go. I enjoy going there with family, but I just consider it kinda separate from playing 18 or even working on my swing at the range.

Top Golf is to golf as to indoor soccer is to traditional soccer. 

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On 12/4/2021 at 11:17 AM, Reinert310 said:

Roy, I agree with @dlarry and consider TopGolf like a more fun driving range with a bar. It’s an expensive driving range where you can keep score. But I go there a lot with my family during the holidays, and it’s the type of thing that my stepmom and sister (who have never played a round of golf in their lives) can still enjoy. There are days where they have “all you can play” play for like $25. But if you’re just looking to hit some balls and work on your swing, TopGolf probably isn’t where you want to go. I enjoy going there with family, but I just consider it kinda separate from playing 18 or even working on my swing at the range.

Exactly. It’s 100% separate. I take my golf game really seriously (college athlete nbd) and I would never in a million years bring my own sticks to topgolf.

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